Re: Jews outside the Pale of Settlement #ukraine

Doug Cohen

My family, as well, came >from the same area -- Olyka, about 15 km from
Lutsk. They described themselves as Russian, which they distinguished from
Polish, Lithuanian, or Galician.
There is an interesting book, Beyond the Pale, by Ben Nathans, which talks
about the process by which there was a selective integration of certain Jews
into interior Russia. I guess I'm saying that her knowledge of Russian
doesn't prove that they lived outside the Pale; by the end of the 19th
century, Jews, including girls, had dramatically increased their education
levels. But there were Jews who moved beyond the Pale, although after 1882,
the May Laws forced a great many of them back to the Pale. But after 1917,
many things changed.

Doug Cohen
Lexington, MA
Sarasota, FL

-----Original Message-----
From: Hana Abdul-Haq [mailto:abdulhaq.hana@...]
Sent: Thursday, January 30, 2014 2:48 PM
To: Ukraine SIG
Subject: [ukraine] Jews outside the Pale of Settlement

I recently got in contact with somebody who knew my family and he told me
something extremely surprising. He said that at some point my
great-grandmother and her family lived in Saratov which is in inland Russia
and outside the Pale.

This would explain a lot of things I haven't been able to understand about
my family like the fact that my great-grandmother spoke and wrote a lot in
Russian. She was born in Lutsk and I assumed women >from the shtetl were
never really that educated so I thought it was strange. She always said with
a lot of pride that she came >from Russia. I thought she meant the Russian
Empire. I never imagined she meant Russia proper. She also had a lot of
Russian silver spoons and forks with very nice decorations. I assumed these
things would have been available everywhere in the Empire but now I'm
wondering if such items were really available in Lutsk or maybe she brought
them with her >from Saratov.

My question is: what were Jews doing outside the Pale? As far as I knew,
they were forbidden to reside outside of it. Were there any exceptions to
this rule? Also, does anyone know anything about the Jewish community in
Saratov? And if it's possible to get in contact with anyone there? I assume
it never was a huge community.

Thanks for any information.

Timisoara - Romania

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