Date   

Re: HURDUS surname #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 99-03-16 23:30:06 EST, mickp@sysdeco.co.uk writes:

My mother's maiden name was HURDUS and I have traced this line back to
about the late 18th century in Yorkshire and Lancashire in England.
There were only 8 HURDUS families in 1881 in the two counties. I am
desperately trying to discover the origin of this rare surname. Someone
has suggested to me that the name is of Jewish origins (Hebrew for Herod)
. . . .HURDAS, HURDES, HURDIS

==Horodos is, indeed, the Hebrew name for the king known as Herod in
English. He was imposed on the Jews by the Romans and was not exactly
loved or admired, even though he rebuilt a magnificent Sanctuary in Jerusalem and many other outstanding edifices throughout the land. I would say it would be most unlikely that a Jew would take that name; I
found no mention of any name like Hurdus it in the index of the Jewish
Encyclopedia.

Does anyone recognise or know of a likely Jewish meaning for this name.
Is it a common Jewish name/word ? Could it be derived >from a Jewish word ?

==It appears to have no connection with either Hebrew or Yiddish. It may be
an adaptation of a relatively more popular Jewish name, such as Hoddes, or
even Horowitz. It might also be an erroneous back-formation >from the
Russian-Jewish surname, Gordis (Russian, not having the H sound, generally
replaced it with G)

You are probably right in suggesting that the various spellings may be
variants in one large family. There's no way of proving, >from name alone,
that your mother's folk were Jewish or were not Jewish. Here are some ways
of finding out more:

* Where in Yorks and Lancs did they live; Jewish immigrants tended to
work and live in the larger cities, Leeds, Manchester, Oldham, Huddersfield, etc
* Where were they buried? a Jewish cemetery?
* Where were they married, by whom, and to whom?
* Are they listed in parish records? In the Jewish community records? in
local Jewish newspapers.

==If you don't have a family tradition that they were Jewish, and there are
no indicators that they might have been, I'd suggest not investing too much
of your time on the assumption that maybe, maybe they were.

==On the other hand, "Jewish" names being often so difficult to categorize,
I wouldn't be totally surprised if you got a "Hello! long-lost cousin"
response >from someone on the list. You could also check the Jewishgen.org
archives and its family finder database. You never know . . . .

Michael Bernet, New York

BERNET, BERNAERTH, etc, JONDORF: Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg
FRENSDORFF/FRENZDORF:Frensdorf, Hamburg, Hanover
BAMBERGER: ancestors of the Wurzburger Rov, Bamberg villages
WOLFF, Aron: Pfungstadt/Fkfrt, Babette GOLDSCHMIDT: Homburg/Fkfrt;
KONIGSHOFER: Welbhausen, Konigshofen, Furth
WOLFF, Sali: b Fkfrt ca 1860, d Rot'dam or victim of Dr. Petiot,Paris) 1942

MODERATOR NOTE: The JewishGen Family Finder (JGFF) is the first
place one should look when searching a surname. You can access
it directly >from our homepage at http://www.jewishgen.org
By the way: JGFF has 1 entry for the name HURDUS!


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: HURDUS surname #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 99-03-16 23:30:06 EST, mickp@sysdeco.co.uk writes:

My mother's maiden name was HURDUS and I have traced this line back to
about the late 18th century in Yorkshire and Lancashire in England.
There were only 8 HURDUS families in 1881 in the two counties. I am
desperately trying to discover the origin of this rare surname. Someone
has suggested to me that the name is of Jewish origins (Hebrew for Herod)
. . . .HURDAS, HURDES, HURDIS

==Horodos is, indeed, the Hebrew name for the king known as Herod in
English. He was imposed on the Jews by the Romans and was not exactly
loved or admired, even though he rebuilt a magnificent Sanctuary in Jerusalem and many other outstanding edifices throughout the land. I would say it would be most unlikely that a Jew would take that name; I
found no mention of any name like Hurdus it in the index of the Jewish
Encyclopedia.

Does anyone recognise or know of a likely Jewish meaning for this name.
Is it a common Jewish name/word ? Could it be derived >from a Jewish word ?

==It appears to have no connection with either Hebrew or Yiddish. It may be
an adaptation of a relatively more popular Jewish name, such as Hoddes, or
even Horowitz. It might also be an erroneous back-formation >from the
Russian-Jewish surname, Gordis (Russian, not having the H sound, generally
replaced it with G)

You are probably right in suggesting that the various spellings may be
variants in one large family. There's no way of proving, >from name alone,
that your mother's folk were Jewish or were not Jewish. Here are some ways
of finding out more:

* Where in Yorks and Lancs did they live; Jewish immigrants tended to
work and live in the larger cities, Leeds, Manchester, Oldham, Huddersfield, etc
* Where were they buried? a Jewish cemetery?
* Where were they married, by whom, and to whom?
* Are they listed in parish records? In the Jewish community records? in
local Jewish newspapers.

==If you don't have a family tradition that they were Jewish, and there are
no indicators that they might have been, I'd suggest not investing too much
of your time on the assumption that maybe, maybe they were.

==On the other hand, "Jewish" names being often so difficult to categorize,
I wouldn't be totally surprised if you got a "Hello! long-lost cousin"
response >from someone on the list. You could also check the Jewishgen.org
archives and its family finder database. You never know . . . .

Michael Bernet, New York

BERNET, BERNAERTH, etc, JONDORF: Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg
FRENSDORFF/FRENZDORF:Frensdorf, Hamburg, Hanover
BAMBERGER: ancestors of the Wurzburger Rov, Bamberg villages
WOLFF, Aron: Pfungstadt/Fkfrt, Babette GOLDSCHMIDT: Homburg/Fkfrt;
KONIGSHOFER: Welbhausen, Konigshofen, Furth
WOLFF, Sali: b Fkfrt ca 1860, d Rot'dam or victim of Dr. Petiot,Paris) 1942

MODERATOR NOTE: The JewishGen Family Finder (JGFF) is the first
place one should look when searching a surname. You can access
it directly >from our homepage at http://www.jewishgen.org
By the way: JGFF has 1 entry for the name HURDUS!


GUZMAN, GERMAN from Mozyr - Need Yiddish Translation #belarus

LenyG@...
 

Hello to everyone!
I am researching GUZMAN and GERMAN families. My paternal grand-grandfather
Moyshe-Mordhe GUZMAN and his wife Broha GERMAN (she was >from Mozyr, Belarus)
had the following children: Abram-Leyb (my grandfather), Sender, Pinkhus,
Aron-Girsh, Basheva, Rahil, and Isaak-Chaim. They all were born in 1882-1901
in Narovlya, Belarus. All men had their last name GUZMAN, and two girls
accepted their mother's last name GERMAN. In 1920-s Moyshe-Mordhe, Broha and
Basheva with her husband (last name HARRIS) moved to Chicago. Family lost
contact with them in the late 1930-s. Recently, I received a copy of their
picture >from Moscow (our Moscow relatives received this picture >from Chicago
in 1931). There are several lines in Yiddish on the back of this photo, and
two lines in Russian. Although I can read Russian (the lines stated "July 17,
1930, Chicago"), I cannot read Yiddish. Can somebody help me with this
translation? I have it in *.jpg format, but I can easily convert it to any
other format. I would appreciate your help very much.

Leonid GUZMAN,
Baltimore, MD
lenyg@aol.com

Also looking for: SHATSMAN, GIRZHEL, GORELIK, PRUZHANSKY, TOMBAK, TOLPIN
(Narovlya, Mozyr - Belarus; Gritsev, Lubar, Kiev - Ukraine; Bendery - Moldova;
Riga - Latvia; Moscow - Russia)


Belarus SIG #Belarus GUZMAN, GERMAN from Mozyr - Need Yiddish Translation #belarus

LenyG@...
 

Hello to everyone!
I am researching GUZMAN and GERMAN families. My paternal grand-grandfather
Moyshe-Mordhe GUZMAN and his wife Broha GERMAN (she was >from Mozyr, Belarus)
had the following children: Abram-Leyb (my grandfather), Sender, Pinkhus,
Aron-Girsh, Basheva, Rahil, and Isaak-Chaim. They all were born in 1882-1901
in Narovlya, Belarus. All men had their last name GUZMAN, and two girls
accepted their mother's last name GERMAN. In 1920-s Moyshe-Mordhe, Broha and
Basheva with her husband (last name HARRIS) moved to Chicago. Family lost
contact with them in the late 1930-s. Recently, I received a copy of their
picture >from Moscow (our Moscow relatives received this picture >from Chicago
in 1931). There are several lines in Yiddish on the back of this photo, and
two lines in Russian. Although I can read Russian (the lines stated "July 17,
1930, Chicago"), I cannot read Yiddish. Can somebody help me with this
translation? I have it in *.jpg format, but I can easily convert it to any
other format. I would appreciate your help very much.

Leonid GUZMAN,
Baltimore, MD
lenyg@aol.com

Also looking for: SHATSMAN, GIRZHEL, GORELIK, PRUZHANSKY, TOMBAK, TOLPIN
(Narovlya, Mozyr - Belarus; Gritsev, Lubar, Kiev - Ukraine; Bendery - Moldova;
Riga - Latvia; Moscow - Russia)


Re: keidan digest: March 16, 1999 #lithuania

BetteJoy@...
 

Shalom Friends:

As I am about to write to the Vilnius and Kausnas archives, it occurred to me
that one of you may have the answer. Are records for VISTYTIS/VISHTINEZ among
their holdings?

Many thanks for your courtesy,
Betty Provizer Starkman, Michigan
BetteJoy@aol.com


Keidan Jews #Keidan #Lithuania Re: keidan digest: March 16, 1999 #lithuania

BetteJoy@...
 

Shalom Friends:

As I am about to write to the Vilnius and Kausnas archives, it occurred to me
that one of you may have the answer. Are records for VISTYTIS/VISHTINEZ among
their holdings?

Many thanks for your courtesy,
Betty Provizer Starkman, Michigan
BetteJoy@aol.com


BECHER(BECKER) RABINOWITZ #general

RobiBerns <robiberns@...>
 

Seeking Information on my maternal grandfather's family Mathis BECHER
(BECKER) >from Koloyna Yackolev, Belaruss and my parternal grandparents
Yisrael Labe RABINOWITZ who lived in Skaudville, Lithuania and came to
Baltimore,Maryland about 1907 and his wife Bas Sheva (maiden name
FRIEDMAN). A portion of her family emigrated to Israel and used the name
Ish Shalom.
Leon Robins
RobiBerns@aol.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen BECHER(BECKER) RABINOWITZ #general

RobiBerns <robiberns@...>
 

Seeking Information on my maternal grandfather's family Mathis BECHER
(BECKER) >from Koloyna Yackolev, Belaruss and my parternal grandparents
Yisrael Labe RABINOWITZ who lived in Skaudville, Lithuania and came to
Baltimore,Maryland about 1907 and his wife Bas Sheva (maiden name
FRIEDMAN). A portion of her family emigrated to Israel and used the name
Ish Shalom.
Leon Robins
RobiBerns@aol.com


Tours #general

STRAUSS <bertrand.strauss@...>
 

My Grandmother Anaos Aron died at age of 71 on Aug 30, 1942, at 15 bis Rue
de la Ripublique, Tours, I. & L., France, under custody of the Police of
the "Ligne de Dimarcation".

Can it be found what Administative Service was housed there and then?


Bertrand Strauss


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Tours #general

STRAUSS <bertrand.strauss@...>
 

My Grandmother Anaos Aron died at age of 71 on Aug 30, 1942, at 15 bis Rue
de la Ripublique, Tours, I. & L., France, under custody of the Police of
the "Ligne de Dimarcation".

Can it be found what Administative Service was housed there and then?


Bertrand Strauss


ALTOONA, PENNSYLVANIA - WWII MILITARY #general

LASSER3 <LASSER3@...>
 

Shalom Haverim:

My father-in-law (may he live to be 120!) recently shared with me a copy
of a November 10, 1943, Armistice Day programme which honored Jewish men
and women in military service >from the Altoona, Blair Co., Pennsylvania
area. This programme includes 4 columns of names on a 8 1/2 x 11 page
of local-area military personnel, some who were already deceased at the
time of the event.

If you are researching families in that area and time, please contact me
with your surnames. I am willing to send a copy of the programme to
interested parties. Plus I am interested in building a database from
the names with family connections indicated.

Sincerely,
Martha Eisenberg Lasser
Diamond Bar, California
lasser3@prodigy.net

Researching:
GLASSER/LESSER/LASSER-Lithuania->South Africa, Baltimore, Duluth,
Chicago, Holidaysburg and Altoona, Pennsylvania, England, Australia
SHAPIRO-Lithuania->Holidaysburg and Altoona, Pennsylvania
EISENBERG-Warsaw->Israel, New York, Chicago, Buenos Aires & California
FEIL-Hrubieszow, Poland->Chicago, Caracas, Venezuela
SCHAFFER, SEGAL-Romania(?)->Chicago


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen ALTOONA, PENNSYLVANIA - WWII MILITARY #general

LASSER3 <LASSER3@...>
 

Shalom Haverim:

My father-in-law (may he live to be 120!) recently shared with me a copy
of a November 10, 1943, Armistice Day programme which honored Jewish men
and women in military service >from the Altoona, Blair Co., Pennsylvania
area. This programme includes 4 columns of names on a 8 1/2 x 11 page
of local-area military personnel, some who were already deceased at the
time of the event.

If you are researching families in that area and time, please contact me
with your surnames. I am willing to send a copy of the programme to
interested parties. Plus I am interested in building a database from
the names with family connections indicated.

Sincerely,
Martha Eisenberg Lasser
Diamond Bar, California
lasser3@prodigy.net

Researching:
GLASSER/LESSER/LASSER-Lithuania->South Africa, Baltimore, Duluth,
Chicago, Holidaysburg and Altoona, Pennsylvania, England, Australia
SHAPIRO-Lithuania->Holidaysburg and Altoona, Pennsylvania
EISENBERG-Warsaw->Israel, New York, Chicago, Buenos Aires & California
FEIL-Hrubieszow, Poland->Chicago, Caracas, Venezuela
SCHAFFER, SEGAL-Romania(?)->Chicago


Re: Jechiel #hungary

SMorrisRN@...
 

How about Ezekial or Zeke? Steve Morris


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Jechiel #hungary

SMorrisRN@...
 

How about Ezekial or Zeke? Steve Morris


Dubeschorszag #hungary

Mark F. Tritsch <tritsch@...>
 

In the death register for Presov/Eperies, I found for Bela Tritsch the
following entry: "Szuletesi helye: Dubeschorszag". I assume this is
telling me the place of origin of the deceased. The u and the a in the
name of the place are accented. Does anyone know where Dubeschorszag
was?

Thanks in advance. By the way, many thanks also to Marc Polster for
supplying us with the information about Gedhtree!

Mark Tritsch

mod.- If the word was spelled Duteschorszag or Duetschorszag it would likely be Germany (orszag refers to and means a country). However, if the "b" and the first "D" were transposed it would read Budeschorszag which would literally mean Country of Foul Odor or the Foul Smelling Country. Hopefully, you'll get a more serious (but not necessarily funnier) answer >from our native Hungarian speakers.


Hungary SIG #Hungary Dubeschorszag #hungary

Mark F. Tritsch <tritsch@...>
 

In the death register for Presov/Eperies, I found for Bela Tritsch the
following entry: "Szuletesi helye: Dubeschorszag". I assume this is
telling me the place of origin of the deceased. The u and the a in the
name of the place are accented. Does anyone know where Dubeschorszag
was?

Thanks in advance. By the way, many thanks also to Marc Polster for
supplying us with the information about Gedhtree!

Mark Tritsch

mod.- If the word was spelled Duteschorszag or Duetschorszag it would likely be Germany (orszag refers to and means a country). However, if the "b" and the first "D" were transposed it would read Budeschorszag which would literally mean Country of Foul Odor or the Foul Smelling Country. Hopefully, you'll get a more serious (but not necessarily funnier) answer >from our native Hungarian speakers.


Re Czar's army #general

malkajef@...
 

Vcharny@aol.com wrote:

->In 1903 to the Russian Army drafted people born between Oct.1 1881 and
->Oct.1 1882 In Minsk gubernia more than 850 Jews avoided draft in 1903
->(and -officials found out about it). For Minsk gubernia that supplied
->Russian Army with total numbers of draftees about 10,000 yearly (Jews
->and non-Jews) it would seem quite noticeable. ........

What about a Jew who was already in the army in Vitebst and in 1903/4
deserted and came to the US (Dec 1904). Where would one find the Russian
military records about such a person?

Jeff Malka
malkajef@orthohelp.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re Czar's army #general

malkajef@...
 

Vcharny@aol.com wrote:

->In 1903 to the Russian Army drafted people born between Oct.1 1881 and
->Oct.1 1882 In Minsk gubernia more than 850 Jews avoided draft in 1903
->(and -officials found out about it). For Minsk gubernia that supplied
->Russian Army with total numbers of draftees about 10,000 yearly (Jews
->and non-Jews) it would seem quite noticeable. ........

What about a Jew who was already in the army in Vitebst and in 1903/4
deserted and came to the US (Dec 1904). Where would one find the Russian
military records about such a person?

Jeff Malka
malkajef@orthohelp.com


Belarus SIG #Belarus Re: Rabbis in Belarus #belarus

kudish <kudish@...>
 

Evelyn Doberstein wrote:
My question to the group is : Does anyone know of a book , or list of
Rabbis in Belarus, covering the time-period 1850-1920?

Dear Evelyn
I am holding a book LATTER DAY LEADERS SAGES AND SCHOLARS, it is a
bibliographical Index. I was trying to find both of your ancestors by their
surname or first name. The result is none. If you know the town they lived
I'll be able to tell you who was the Rabbi there at that time. They probably
were not associated with the major synagogue and that is why they are not
mentioned there. But if you know the town and I find the Rabbi you'll have a
chance to continue your search through some other sources.
Irene

kudish@netcom.ca

Looking for Libkind (Gorky, Vitebsk, Mogilev, Ekaterinoslav)


Re: Rabbis in Belarus #belarus

kudish <kudish@...>
 

Evelyn Doberstein wrote:
My question to the group is : Does anyone know of a book , or list of
Rabbis in Belarus, covering the time-period 1850-1920?

Dear Evelyn
I am holding a book LATTER DAY LEADERS SAGES AND SCHOLARS, it is a
bibliographical Index. I was trying to find both of your ancestors by their
surname or first name. The result is none. If you know the town they lived
I'll be able to tell you who was the Rabbi there at that time. They probably
were not associated with the major synagogue and that is why they are not
mentioned there. But if you know the town and I find the Rabbi you'll have a
chance to continue your search through some other sources.
Irene

kudish@netcom.ca

Looking for Libkind (Gorky, Vitebsk, Mogilev, Ekaterinoslav)