Date   

Re: On the Ethics and Morals of Genealogy #general

Genealicej@...
 

In a message dated 29/7/00 12:10:21 am, cweinstein@jewishgen.org writes:

<< I guess the best observation I can add to what was already covered in my
post (which, in turn, came directly >from the National Genealogical
Society web site) is follow the golden rule. "Don't do unto others that
which is hateful to you." Amusing stories and anecdotes about dear old
tante Feige are one thing; the fact that Uncle Max spent ten years at
Leavenworth for embezzling is quite another. If you are going to put up
a web page or publish a book with your family history, unless it is
truly necessary to the story, derogatory information is not in keeping
with Jewish morality and ethics. >>

There is a group of people in the UK who claim Richard III, the notorious
hunchback King to whom the murder of his two nephews in the Tower of
London is attributed, was innocent - a maligned and defamed name.

How do we know anything is true, whatever has gone down in the annals
of history and the legal verdict? Who know what is history and what
is politics equally in "history" and in families? And what is genealogy
about?

I have made a previous point about the professional issues surrounding
broadcast and published biographies where it is known families object to
the portrayals. This becomes more muddled when "star" actors are
identified with the parts they play and these assumptions have been
incorporated into biographies.

We read and see personal details of famous people often still living on
TV, in books and now on the web all the time. This all creates employment
for PR specialists worldwide!

When individuals who have not sought fame become involved in the media
spotlight for the first time, they often start objecting to newspaper
reporters and reports for the first time - even though they have read and
enjoyed media reports in the past. I am not judging or criticising them for
it. They are trying to protect themselves, as anyone would. But such
publication is a fact of life.

Chuck WEINSTEIN wisely puts in the words, "unless it is truly necessary
to the story". Putting on my hat as a family researcher, I am using genealogy
for a specific purpose - to discover new relatives and their descendants,
not to circulate gossip which may or may not be "true" or accurate.

Ancestors may have criminal convictions. I do not know whether they
were guilty or innocent. Ancestors may have been placed in mental
institutions. I do not know whether they were mentally ill or
whether they were put there for other reasons. But I already know
these "stories" and want to find out fresh information.

"Onkel Max's" criminal conviction at least is established in the public domain
- that's the most one can say - and we know "he spent ten years at
Leavenworth
for embezzling' while judgements on the laughter value of "amusing anecdotes"
about his wife Tante Feige are in the eye and ear of the man - and woman -
beholding and listening to them.

Sure, we have to make personal decisions about whether to publish (and the
key word is publish) on the web and what will be the repercussions on
individual lives. But these issues are coming up because the line between
personal and public is increasingly blurred. At one time in Britain
at least, there was never any talk about "privacy" and the press. The only
criteria was whether something was accurate or inaccurate.

Now so many people have tools of a trade. A camera, a computer without
being professionals. Anyone can take a photo of a celebrity and sell it to
the
media. Anybody can publish a website. Whether we like it or not, tabloid
newspapers, book publishers, professional documentary makers and
little 'ol amateur genealogists are facing the same issues, whether or
not money is involved. I have posted this e-mail for publication by
Jewishgen, as well as sending it privately to Chuck WEINSTEIN.

I have a couple of family histories written by a distant relative (not
Jewish) who, in my opinion, has struck the happiest medium possible
in writing about the family. The histories are jam-packed with
information and written in a sentimental, slightly flowery, but fairly
bland fashion. I do not know whether this is all a deliberate stylistic ploy
but it effectively distances both the reader and writer >from the work.

Every so often he inserts words to the effect, "Who are we to
judge people's lives, whether their actions were right or wrong, who
are we to know the full circumstances, motivations. We only know
what is recorded". For "amateurs" publishing personal histories,
it is not only about the facts themselves but, as for professional
writers, the art of narration, the narrative voice. As an Irish
professional comic Frank CARSON says, "It's the way you tell 'em".

To quote >from another Irishman Oscar WILDE "The Truth is never pure
and never simple". Of course when I quote this anecdote attributed to
WILDE, I am aware of another anecdote. WILDE telling the American
painter James WHISTLER in alleged admiration and envy, "I wish
I had said that" and receiving the reply, "You will, Oscar, you will ...".

Of course history may not have recorded whether it
was actually "WHISTLER's Mother" who made the original quip ...

These are all issues which will run and run. Ironically it does
become an intensely personal decision with public repercussions
whether to publish and or not to publish and how to frame a
narrative. And an intensely personal decision whether or not
to be offended.

Alice Josephs
Loughton
Essex
UK


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: On the Ethics and Morals of Genealogy #general

Genealicej@...
 

In a message dated 29/7/00 12:10:21 am, cweinstein@jewishgen.org writes:

<< I guess the best observation I can add to what was already covered in my
post (which, in turn, came directly >from the National Genealogical
Society web site) is follow the golden rule. "Don't do unto others that
which is hateful to you." Amusing stories and anecdotes about dear old
tante Feige are one thing; the fact that Uncle Max spent ten years at
Leavenworth for embezzling is quite another. If you are going to put up
a web page or publish a book with your family history, unless it is
truly necessary to the story, derogatory information is not in keeping
with Jewish morality and ethics. >>

There is a group of people in the UK who claim Richard III, the notorious
hunchback King to whom the murder of his two nephews in the Tower of
London is attributed, was innocent - a maligned and defamed name.

How do we know anything is true, whatever has gone down in the annals
of history and the legal verdict? Who know what is history and what
is politics equally in "history" and in families? And what is genealogy
about?

I have made a previous point about the professional issues surrounding
broadcast and published biographies where it is known families object to
the portrayals. This becomes more muddled when "star" actors are
identified with the parts they play and these assumptions have been
incorporated into biographies.

We read and see personal details of famous people often still living on
TV, in books and now on the web all the time. This all creates employment
for PR specialists worldwide!

When individuals who have not sought fame become involved in the media
spotlight for the first time, they often start objecting to newspaper
reporters and reports for the first time - even though they have read and
enjoyed media reports in the past. I am not judging or criticising them for
it. They are trying to protect themselves, as anyone would. But such
publication is a fact of life.

Chuck WEINSTEIN wisely puts in the words, "unless it is truly necessary
to the story". Putting on my hat as a family researcher, I am using genealogy
for a specific purpose - to discover new relatives and their descendants,
not to circulate gossip which may or may not be "true" or accurate.

Ancestors may have criminal convictions. I do not know whether they
were guilty or innocent. Ancestors may have been placed in mental
institutions. I do not know whether they were mentally ill or
whether they were put there for other reasons. But I already know
these "stories" and want to find out fresh information.

"Onkel Max's" criminal conviction at least is established in the public domain
- that's the most one can say - and we know "he spent ten years at
Leavenworth
for embezzling' while judgements on the laughter value of "amusing anecdotes"
about his wife Tante Feige are in the eye and ear of the man - and woman -
beholding and listening to them.

Sure, we have to make personal decisions about whether to publish (and the
key word is publish) on the web and what will be the repercussions on
individual lives. But these issues are coming up because the line between
personal and public is increasingly blurred. At one time in Britain
at least, there was never any talk about "privacy" and the press. The only
criteria was whether something was accurate or inaccurate.

Now so many people have tools of a trade. A camera, a computer without
being professionals. Anyone can take a photo of a celebrity and sell it to
the
media. Anybody can publish a website. Whether we like it or not, tabloid
newspapers, book publishers, professional documentary makers and
little 'ol amateur genealogists are facing the same issues, whether or
not money is involved. I have posted this e-mail for publication by
Jewishgen, as well as sending it privately to Chuck WEINSTEIN.

I have a couple of family histories written by a distant relative (not
Jewish) who, in my opinion, has struck the happiest medium possible
in writing about the family. The histories are jam-packed with
information and written in a sentimental, slightly flowery, but fairly
bland fashion. I do not know whether this is all a deliberate stylistic ploy
but it effectively distances both the reader and writer >from the work.

Every so often he inserts words to the effect, "Who are we to
judge people's lives, whether their actions were right or wrong, who
are we to know the full circumstances, motivations. We only know
what is recorded". For "amateurs" publishing personal histories,
it is not only about the facts themselves but, as for professional
writers, the art of narration, the narrative voice. As an Irish
professional comic Frank CARSON says, "It's the way you tell 'em".

To quote >from another Irishman Oscar WILDE "The Truth is never pure
and never simple". Of course when I quote this anecdote attributed to
WILDE, I am aware of another anecdote. WILDE telling the American
painter James WHISTLER in alleged admiration and envy, "I wish
I had said that" and receiving the reply, "You will, Oscar, you will ...".

Of course history may not have recorded whether it
was actually "WHISTLER's Mother" who made the original quip ...

These are all issues which will run and run. Ironically it does
become an intensely personal decision with public repercussions
whether to publish and or not to publish and how to frame a
narrative. And an intensely personal decision whether or not
to be offended.

Alice Josephs
Loughton
Essex
UK


"Paranoid," an Unkind Word #general

Steve Axelrath <saxelrat@...>
 

I am sad to see that some who contribute to the JewishGen
Discussion Group use the word "paranoid" to describe those who are
fearful of possible negative consequences of having their family
information accessible to all through the Internet. Used by the lay
person, "paranoid" is an unkind word which pejoratively describes
someone one thinks is excessively fearful. Using "paranoid" shifts ones
disagreement towards the personality of the "paranoid" person, rather
than focusing on his ideas with which one disagrees.
"Paranoid" is not only an unkind word, it is typically inaccurate.
We all have different life experiences, and so we --legitimately-- have
different fears. I've friends who have been raped whose fears are very
different >from mine. Are they "paranoid"? Would we call a holocaust
survivor who was afraid to share his family's information on the
Internet "paranoid," or would we say his fear is very understandable?
How many non-"paranoid" Jews stayed in Europe and were slaughtered while
their "paranoid" neighbors fled and lived? How different contemporary
Jewish life would be had all of the 6,000,000 been "paranoid."
Unless you're talking about truly mentally ill people, calling
someone "paranoid" merely says that his fears are different >from yours,
and so you've chosen to believe that there's something wrong with him.
I do understand that family data spread over the Internet will be
accessible to all. I do know that we will all have to learn to live
with that risk. But it is unkind and inaccurate to unthinkingly label
people who are afraid of something which does not frighten us=85
"paranoid."

Steve Axelrath
Littleton, Colorado


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen "Paranoid," an Unkind Word #general

Steve Axelrath <saxelrat@...>
 

I am sad to see that some who contribute to the JewishGen
Discussion Group use the word "paranoid" to describe those who are
fearful of possible negative consequences of having their family
information accessible to all through the Internet. Used by the lay
person, "paranoid" is an unkind word which pejoratively describes
someone one thinks is excessively fearful. Using "paranoid" shifts ones
disagreement towards the personality of the "paranoid" person, rather
than focusing on his ideas with which one disagrees.
"Paranoid" is not only an unkind word, it is typically inaccurate.
We all have different life experiences, and so we --legitimately-- have
different fears. I've friends who have been raped whose fears are very
different >from mine. Are they "paranoid"? Would we call a holocaust
survivor who was afraid to share his family's information on the
Internet "paranoid," or would we say his fear is very understandable?
How many non-"paranoid" Jews stayed in Europe and were slaughtered while
their "paranoid" neighbors fled and lived? How different contemporary
Jewish life would be had all of the 6,000,000 been "paranoid."
Unless you're talking about truly mentally ill people, calling
someone "paranoid" merely says that his fears are different >from yours,
and so you've chosen to believe that there's something wrong with him.
I do understand that family data spread over the Internet will be
accessible to all. I do know that we will all have to learn to live
with that risk. But it is unkind and inaccurate to unthinkingly label
people who are afraid of something which does not frighten us=85
"paranoid."

Steve Axelrath
Littleton, Colorado


Ethical Standards #latvia

Arlene Beare <arl@...>
 

Crosspost >from Jewishgen
Subject: Standards We Should _All_ Adhere To
From: Chuck Weinstein <cweinstein@jewishgen.org>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000

The following is reprinted with permission and reflects the minimum
standards we should all adhere as family researchers.
Genealogical Standards and Guidelines
Standards For Sharing Information With Others
Recommended by the National Genealogical Society
Conscious of the fact that sharing information or data with others,
whether through speech, documents or electronic media, is essential to
family history research and that it needs continuing support and
encouragement, responsible family historians consistently respect the
restrictions on sharing information that arise >from the rights of
another as an author, originator or compiler; as a living private
person;
or as a party to a mutual agreement;
observe meticulously the legal rights of copyright owners, copying or
distributing any part of their works only with their permission, or to
the limited extent specifically allowed under the law's "fair use"
exceptions;
identify the sources for all ideas, information and data >from others,
and the form in which they were received, recognizing that the
unattributed use of another's intellectual work is plagiarism;
respect the authorship rights of senders of letters, electronic mail and
data files, forwarding or disseminating them further only with the
sender's permission;
inform people who provide information about their families as to the
ways it may be used, observing any conditions they impose and respecting
any reservations they may express regarding the use of particular items;
require some evidence of consent before assuming that living people are
agreeable to further sharing of information about themselves;
convey personal identifying information about living people--like age,
home address, occupation or activities--only in ways that those
concerned
have expressly agreed to;
recognize that legal rights of privacy may limit the extent to which
information >from publicly available sources may be further used,
disseminated or published;
communicate no information to others that is known to be false, or
without making reasonable efforts to determine its truth, particularly
information that may be derogatory;
are sensitive to the hurt that revelations of criminal, immoral, bizarre
or irresponsible behavior may bring to family members.

(C) Copyright 2000 by National Genealogical Society. Permission is
granted to copy or publish this material provided it is reproduced in
its
entirety, including this notice.

Arlene Beare
President Latvia SIG


Latvia SIG #Latvia Ethical Standards #latvia

Arlene Beare <arl@...>
 

Crosspost >from Jewishgen
Subject: Standards We Should _All_ Adhere To
From: Chuck Weinstein <cweinstein@jewishgen.org>
Date: Tue, 25 Jul 2000

The following is reprinted with permission and reflects the minimum
standards we should all adhere as family researchers.
Genealogical Standards and Guidelines
Standards For Sharing Information With Others
Recommended by the National Genealogical Society
Conscious of the fact that sharing information or data with others,
whether through speech, documents or electronic media, is essential to
family history research and that it needs continuing support and
encouragement, responsible family historians consistently respect the
restrictions on sharing information that arise >from the rights of
another as an author, originator or compiler; as a living private
person;
or as a party to a mutual agreement;
observe meticulously the legal rights of copyright owners, copying or
distributing any part of their works only with their permission, or to
the limited extent specifically allowed under the law's "fair use"
exceptions;
identify the sources for all ideas, information and data >from others,
and the form in which they were received, recognizing that the
unattributed use of another's intellectual work is plagiarism;
respect the authorship rights of senders of letters, electronic mail and
data files, forwarding or disseminating them further only with the
sender's permission;
inform people who provide information about their families as to the
ways it may be used, observing any conditions they impose and respecting
any reservations they may express regarding the use of particular items;
require some evidence of consent before assuming that living people are
agreeable to further sharing of information about themselves;
convey personal identifying information about living people--like age,
home address, occupation or activities--only in ways that those
concerned
have expressly agreed to;
recognize that legal rights of privacy may limit the extent to which
information >from publicly available sources may be further used,
disseminated or published;
communicate no information to others that is known to be false, or
without making reasonable efforts to determine its truth, particularly
information that may be derogatory;
are sensitive to the hurt that revelations of criminal, immoral, bizarre
or irresponsible behavior may bring to family members.

(C) Copyright 2000 by National Genealogical Society. Permission is
granted to copy or publish this material provided it is reproduced in
its
entirety, including this notice.

Arlene Beare
President Latvia SIG


Ethics in Jewish Genealogy & Family History #general

Kitnick1@...
 

In reply to Chuck Weinstein <cweinstein@jewishgen.org>
The late Rabbi Malcolm Stern, author of The Ten Commandments for
Genealogists, wrote in his 9th Commandment: "Thou Shalt respect the
sensitivities of the living in whatever you record but tell the truth about
the
dead." The case regarding Uncle Max spending ten years in prison can
be looked at in several ways. Is Uncle Max still alive? Would the
"sensitivities" of Uncle Max's relatives be hurt by the public disclosure
of his past? Aside >from Rabbi Stern's commandment - would the disclosure
of the information continue to punish Max and/or his memory for a crime
that he paid for? If he's alive, should he continue to suffer >from his
earlier actions? If he's deceased, isn't his slate of worldly actions
wiped clean by his death? I presented an "Ethics" session at the
International Seminar in New York in 1999, and will be conducting one
in London in 2001. Please send me any case studies you have to add
to my collection of actual and hypothetical cases... Confidentially will be
respected. Steve Kitnick
kitnick1@aol.com
familytreemaker.com/users/k/i/t/Steven-J-Kitnick/index.html


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Ethics in Jewish Genealogy & Family History #general

Kitnick1@...
 

In reply to Chuck Weinstein <cweinstein@jewishgen.org>
The late Rabbi Malcolm Stern, author of The Ten Commandments for
Genealogists, wrote in his 9th Commandment: "Thou Shalt respect the
sensitivities of the living in whatever you record but tell the truth about
the
dead." The case regarding Uncle Max spending ten years in prison can
be looked at in several ways. Is Uncle Max still alive? Would the
"sensitivities" of Uncle Max's relatives be hurt by the public disclosure
of his past? Aside >from Rabbi Stern's commandment - would the disclosure
of the information continue to punish Max and/or his memory for a crime
that he paid for? If he's alive, should he continue to suffer >from his
earlier actions? If he's deceased, isn't his slate of worldly actions
wiped clean by his death? I presented an "Ethics" session at the
International Seminar in New York in 1999, and will be conducting one
in London in 2001. Please send me any case studies you have to add
to my collection of actual and hypothetical cases... Confidentially will be
respected. Steve Kitnick
kitnick1@aol.com
familytreemaker.com/users/k/i/t/Steven-J-Kitnick/index.html


Immigration Visa Information #general

Adelle Gloger
 

Dear JewishGen Community,

A while ago someone posted a message about looking at letters and
documents, putting them away, and then re-reading at a later date and making
discoveries that had been missed earlier. Well, that just happened to me.

I was reviewing passenger lists that I had received >from NARA over a year
ago. On my grandfather's manifest >from March 1925 there is a section that does
not appear on any of the earlier (dates) manifests I have received.

The 'heading' is "Immigration Visa". The columns are #34--Date; #35--Place
of Issuance; and #36--Number. I would assume that on Dec.31,1924 visa #____
was issued in Warsaw. He was born in Grymalow, Austria/Galicia, but when he
arrived after WW1 it was Grymalow, Poland. Does this mean that perhaps the
Archives in Warsaw would have the record of the visa issued to him ? If so,
what information could I expect to find ?

Why would the visa have been issued in Warsaw when Lemberg/Lvov was closer
to Tarnapol which was his "last permanent residence"? This new discovery seems
to have raised a number of questions for me.

Thank you for any information you might provide.

Adelle Weintraub Gloger
Shaker Hts., Ohio
agloger@aol.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Immigration Visa Information #general

Adelle Gloger
 

Dear JewishGen Community,

A while ago someone posted a message about looking at letters and
documents, putting them away, and then re-reading at a later date and making
discoveries that had been missed earlier. Well, that just happened to me.

I was reviewing passenger lists that I had received >from NARA over a year
ago. On my grandfather's manifest >from March 1925 there is a section that does
not appear on any of the earlier (dates) manifests I have received.

The 'heading' is "Immigration Visa". The columns are #34--Date; #35--Place
of Issuance; and #36--Number. I would assume that on Dec.31,1924 visa #____
was issued in Warsaw. He was born in Grymalow, Austria/Galicia, but when he
arrived after WW1 it was Grymalow, Poland. Does this mean that perhaps the
Archives in Warsaw would have the record of the visa issued to him ? If so,
what information could I expect to find ?

Why would the visa have been issued in Warsaw when Lemberg/Lvov was closer
to Tarnapol which was his "last permanent residence"? This new discovery seems
to have raised a number of questions for me.

Thank you for any information you might provide.

Adelle Weintraub Gloger
Shaker Hts., Ohio
agloger@aol.com


Pinchas Slonim #general

AIChernoff@...
 

Hello all:
Some months ago I was led to this four volume Hebrew and Yiddish set of books
on Slonim by a number of people on this network. I was able to find a copy
at the Holocaust Museum in Washington and was allowed to Xerox a number of
pages of the text. Volume 1 deals with many historical events in the history
of the town as it relates to Jewish life in the city. I have read through
some of this material focused on the years >from about 1770 to 1890 and it is
a fascinating account of Jewish life in the area. There are many poignant
stories, many heartbreaking comments and events, some humorous happenings,
etc. In addition, there are many, many references to Rabbis, teachers,
merchants, and to fights among the various factions of the city. But most
of all, I found the many quasi genealogical references very interesting and
of potential importance to any one with a Slonim connection.
All of the above is meant to indicate that if any one is interested in
further details about what I have at hand, please contact me at
aichernoff@aol.com I do not, however, have a
translation to send.

Amoz Chernoff

Seeking information on:
CHERNICHOVSKY, TSCHERNICH(K)OVSKY, CHERNOFF: Minsk, Tzirin, Lodz, Slonim,
Belarus
FEINSTEIN: Slonim
MARGOLIN, GELBIN: Minsk, Vilna, Belarus
HAUSCHNER, FISCHER, FISHER: Breslau (Wrotzlov), Obernick, Ratibor (Ratzibor),
Silesia


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Pinchas Slonim #general

AIChernoff@...
 

Hello all:
Some months ago I was led to this four volume Hebrew and Yiddish set of books
on Slonim by a number of people on this network. I was able to find a copy
at the Holocaust Museum in Washington and was allowed to Xerox a number of
pages of the text. Volume 1 deals with many historical events in the history
of the town as it relates to Jewish life in the city. I have read through
some of this material focused on the years >from about 1770 to 1890 and it is
a fascinating account of Jewish life in the area. There are many poignant
stories, many heartbreaking comments and events, some humorous happenings,
etc. In addition, there are many, many references to Rabbis, teachers,
merchants, and to fights among the various factions of the city. But most
of all, I found the many quasi genealogical references very interesting and
of potential importance to any one with a Slonim connection.
All of the above is meant to indicate that if any one is interested in
further details about what I have at hand, please contact me at
aichernoff@aol.com I do not, however, have a
translation to send.

Amoz Chernoff

Seeking information on:
CHERNICHOVSKY, TSCHERNICH(K)OVSKY, CHERNOFF: Minsk, Tzirin, Lodz, Slonim,
Belarus
FEINSTEIN: Slonim
MARGOLIN, GELBIN: Minsk, Vilna, Belarus
HAUSCHNER, FISCHER, FISHER: Breslau (Wrotzlov), Obernick, Ratibor (Ratzibor),
Silesia


A "watcher". #general

Rica Goldberg
 

Dear Sherry

My guess is that a"watcher" noted in burial papers supplied by the Beth Din,
is someone who sits with the body >from the time of death until the time of
the procedure prior to burial.

In Jewish law, a body has never to be left alone until burial as described
above. When my mother passed away in a hospital room a few years ago, my
husband, son, late brother-in-law and my nephew took it in turn to "sit" with
the body. My husband also did this together with a list of people, for a
friend of ours who (prematurely) passed away.

Rica B Goldberg
Manchester, England

Still researching

1)KAMINSKY (KAMENSHCHIK) >from Yanova ( Jonava) nr Kovno, Lithuania
2)DIAMOND (possibly DIMONT or DIAMONT) >from Kovno, Lithuania; 3) Newman,
Emannuel, Rachel & Esther LEVY and their parents Chana & Yehuda LEV >from
KROSNIEWICE in Poland;4)Isaac & Rebecca COHEN-a tailor and tailoress
from Poland;5)Chaim and Rebecca ESTRY- a glazier >from Poland;
6)GOLDBERG (possibly SCHELENGER/SCHLUZITSIL) >from Kovno,Lithuania 7)BERLINSKY >from ??


Re: Names -- Mordecha #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 7/28/00 10:44:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
jerry@vms.huji.ac.il writes:

<<
Now, for Poland, the following four Hebrew double names are known to me
at present:

Mordechai Gumpel, Mordechai Gumplein, Mordechai Gumplin, Mordechai
Gumprecht

It may be that the name Gimpel should also be included in this list (it
seems close to the name Gumpel and may be a variation), or in the one
for the single Hebrew name Mordechai, but I do not at present have any
hard data to support this. My guess for now would be that there is
also a Hebrew double name for Gimpel for Poland; if this is the case,
then his ancestor >from Lomza may have had the Hebrew double name
"Mordechai Gimpel" >>

Gimpel (and variants) and Gompertz (and variants) are both derived >from an
Old German name, Gundbert. Kaganoff states that since the 14th century this
name has been coupled with both Mordecai and Ephraim--but, tantalizingly,
gives no explanation. So, why?

Michael Bernet, New York


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen A "watcher". #general

Rica Goldberg
 

Dear Sherry

My guess is that a"watcher" noted in burial papers supplied by the Beth Din,
is someone who sits with the body >from the time of death until the time of
the procedure prior to burial.

In Jewish law, a body has never to be left alone until burial as described
above. When my mother passed away in a hospital room a few years ago, my
husband, son, late brother-in-law and my nephew took it in turn to "sit" with
the body. My husband also did this together with a list of people, for a
friend of ours who (prematurely) passed away.

Rica B Goldberg
Manchester, England

Still researching

1)KAMINSKY (KAMENSHCHIK) >from Yanova ( Jonava) nr Kovno, Lithuania
2)DIAMOND (possibly DIMONT or DIAMONT) >from Kovno, Lithuania; 3) Newman,
Emannuel, Rachel & Esther LEVY and their parents Chana & Yehuda LEV >from
KROSNIEWICE in Poland;4)Isaac & Rebecca COHEN-a tailor and tailoress
from Poland;5)Chaim and Rebecca ESTRY- a glazier >from Poland;
6)GOLDBERG (possibly SCHELENGER/SCHLUZITSIL) >from Kovno,Lithuania 7)BERLINSKY >from ??


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Names -- Mordecha #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 7/28/00 10:44:27 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
jerry@vms.huji.ac.il writes:

<<
Now, for Poland, the following four Hebrew double names are known to me
at present:

Mordechai Gumpel, Mordechai Gumplein, Mordechai Gumplin, Mordechai
Gumprecht

It may be that the name Gimpel should also be included in this list (it
seems close to the name Gumpel and may be a variation), or in the one
for the single Hebrew name Mordechai, but I do not at present have any
hard data to support this. My guess for now would be that there is
also a Hebrew double name for Gimpel for Poland; if this is the case,
then his ancestor >from Lomza may have had the Hebrew double name
"Mordechai Gimpel" >>

Gimpel (and variants) and Gompertz (and variants) are both derived >from an
Old German name, Gundbert. Kaganoff states that since the 14th century this
name has been coupled with both Mordecai and Ephraim--but, tantalizingly,
gives no explanation. So, why?

Michael Bernet, New York


Kentucky Derby and Emil Herz #general

Rakoff125
 

For those interested these are good links for pursuing information about
links to horseracing , the Derby, and owners like Emil Herz. There are
museums in Lexington, KY dedicated to horses that might also have the
specific information. Good luck!

http://horseracing.about.com/sports/horseracing

http://www.wildhorsefeathers.com/favlinks.htm

Linda Rakoff
Newton, MA

ASCHNER-Assakurte, Hradiste, Bratislava, Budapest ,Nyitra, Kosice, Spisska
Nova Ves, Wien; BRETTSCHNEIDER, Galicia; BUCHWALD- Wien, Budapest, GELBERG
Galati; GOLDMAN(N), LANGER -Kosice, Spisska Nova Ves, Bolyar; Presov;
LOW'Y-Hradiste, Spisska Nova Ves; KOOPER, LISSAUER-Losonc, Miskolz; KOHN,
STINGL: Wien, Bratislava MELTZER, PERLBINDER, LADENHEIM-- Horodenka,
Galicia; POLATSECK-Kosice; RAKOFF-Kelce, Russia RIESENBERG- Horodenka,
Kasperowicz, Zaleschicki


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Kentucky Derby and Emil Herz #general

Rakoff125
 

For those interested these are good links for pursuing information about
links to horseracing , the Derby, and owners like Emil Herz. There are
museums in Lexington, KY dedicated to horses that might also have the
specific information. Good luck!

http://horseracing.about.com/sports/horseracing

http://www.wildhorsefeathers.com/favlinks.htm

Linda Rakoff
Newton, MA

ASCHNER-Assakurte, Hradiste, Bratislava, Budapest ,Nyitra, Kosice, Spisska
Nova Ves, Wien; BRETTSCHNEIDER, Galicia; BUCHWALD- Wien, Budapest, GELBERG
Galati; GOLDMAN(N), LANGER -Kosice, Spisska Nova Ves, Bolyar; Presov;
LOW'Y-Hradiste, Spisska Nova Ves; KOOPER, LISSAUER-Losonc, Miskolz; KOHN,
STINGL: Wien, Bratislava MELTZER, PERLBINDER, LADENHEIM-- Horodenka,
Galicia; POLATSECK-Kosice; RAKOFF-Kelce, Russia RIESENBERG- Horodenka,
Kasperowicz, Zaleschicki


Re: Helysegnevmutato (Place names) - Slovakia (and previous Hunga #hungary

Leslie Gyi <leslie@...>
 

That "Old" would be Hungarian Names, e.g. Bratislava was Pozsony, =
Hungarian
Capital during the Turkish rule in Hungary.

Leslie Gyi
Merrimack, NH
leslie@businessengine.com
Lgyi@hotmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: Margarita Lacko [mailto:uzidog@post1.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 27, 2000 12:58 AM
To: Hungarian SIG
Subject: Helysegnevmutato (Place names) - Slovakia=20


Looking for information on Dunajska Streda (Dunaszerdahely), Slovakia, =
I
came across this Web Page >from the Forum Institute for Social Studies:

http://www.foruminst.sk/pub/juh87-nev.html

It's a list of old and new Slovakian place names =
(Helys=E9gn=E9vmutat=F3). The list is part of a book called "Szlov=E1kiai magyar n=E9prajzi = bibliogr=E1fia (1987--1988)", written by JUH=C1SZ L. Ilona. http://www.foruminst.sk/pers/juhasz.html

There are two more bibliographies for 1989--1990 and for 1991--1992.
Sadly, I can't read any of the languages (it's in Hungarian, Slovak and
German).

Another useful page might be the following, called "Cities and villages =
of Slovakia" http://share.geocities.com/SoHo/2687/sk.html
It mentions the cities without diacritics, with diacritics, =
pronunciation and it's district.


Turkish "Nationality Papers" #general

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
 

I have found a copy of the Turkish "Nationality Papers" for
my grandfather. A few words are in Turkish (as you might
imagine!). Can someone help me translate a few lines of
these papers?

Thanks!

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@mail.wittenberg.edu> / Springfield, Ohio USA
Poland: TALMAN, ENGLANDER, BRODA, JURKIEWICZ, STRAUSBERG, KIFER, CZAPNIK
Ukraine: OBERMAN, LISS Turkey: KAZEZ, FRESKO, ALHADEF
http://userpages.wittenberg.edu/dkazez/dk/elh-kaz-fre.html