Date   

SCHOENDORF #general

Fritz Neubauer
 

H. Baldwin wrote:

"My great-grandmother's maiden name is shown as SCHOHNDORF
on her New York City marriage certificate.
The family here has spelled it both SCHOENDORF and SCHONDORF.
Aside >from her signature on the certificate,
I've never seen it spelled with the "H" anywhere else.
Is this a common German spelling, or does anyone have any thoughts?
She was >from Hungary."

Orthography does not rule names. In many cases place names
or surnames date >from times when the orthography
of a particular language had not yet been normalised
into a specific version. That is why i.e. in German
you have the name variations between MAIER, MAYER, MEIER, MEYER
etc. were in modern orthographie there would only be -ei-.

The long o sound in German can actually be spelled
-o- (as in Ton), -oh- (as in Mohn) or even -oe- (as in Soest,
but sometimes the umlaut ö is converted into -oe- as well.
So all the various spellings in your mail are possibilities:
Schondorf, Schöndorf (with umlaut), Schoendorf, Schohndorf, Schoehndorf etc.

There are actually three entries for Schöndorf (with umlaut)
in the contemporary German zip code book:
54316, 07924 and 99427 which is therefore the most likely candidate version.

With kind regards

Fritz Neubauer, North Germany


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen SCHOENDORF #general

Fritz Neubauer
 

H. Baldwin wrote:

"My great-grandmother's maiden name is shown as SCHOHNDORF
on her New York City marriage certificate.
The family here has spelled it both SCHOENDORF and SCHONDORF.
Aside >from her signature on the certificate,
I've never seen it spelled with the "H" anywhere else.
Is this a common German spelling, or does anyone have any thoughts?
She was >from Hungary."

Orthography does not rule names. In many cases place names
or surnames date >from times when the orthography
of a particular language had not yet been normalised
into a specific version. That is why i.e. in German
you have the name variations between MAIER, MAYER, MEIER, MEYER
etc. were in modern orthographie there would only be -ei-.

The long o sound in German can actually be spelled
-o- (as in Ton), -oh- (as in Mohn) or even -oe- (as in Soest,
but sometimes the umlaut ö is converted into -oe- as well.
So all the various spellings in your mail are possibilities:
Schondorf, Schöndorf (with umlaut), Schoendorf, Schohndorf, Schoehndorf etc.

There are actually three entries for Schöndorf (with umlaut)
in the contemporary German zip code book:
54316, 07924 and 99427 which is therefore the most likely candidate version.

With kind regards

Fritz Neubauer, North Germany


Help in Minnesota #general

Nigel Wilson <wilsonettes@...>
 

Idal & Marie (Mary) NADLER arrived in the US
in 1905 in their mid 20's.

They went to Hennepin County Minnesota, where their death records
show up as 1921 and 1927.

Who were their children/relatives?.

If anyone has knowledge of NADLER >from Hennepin county
or other counties in Minnesota
I would dearly love to hear >from you.

The family originally came >from Botosani - Rumania.

Thanking you, please reply privately.

Patricia Wilson (Israel)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Help in Minnesota #general

Nigel Wilson <wilsonettes@...>
 

Idal & Marie (Mary) NADLER arrived in the US
in 1905 in their mid 20's.

They went to Hennepin County Minnesota, where their death records
show up as 1921 and 1927.

Who were their children/relatives?.

If anyone has knowledge of NADLER >from Hennepin county
or other counties in Minnesota
I would dearly love to hear >from you.

The family originally came >from Botosani - Rumania.

Thanking you, please reply privately.

Patricia Wilson (Israel)


Help in New York #general

Nigel Wilson <wilsonettes@...>
 

Alter NADLER arived in New York in 1906 with a wife Chawe
and children Sure, Gitel,Rufke,Moise, Itchil, Ester and Selig.

In 1920 he enters again with more children,
Yrzela Chezlda, Rebecca and Moritz. In 1920 his name is now
Alter NADLER.and he is going to his son-in-law Steimberg in E 175th St.
Bronx, NY. Did he marry twice? Town Alter was originally born in was
BOTOSANI in Romania.

Is there anyone out there connected to this seemingly large family?

Please respond privately.

Thank you.

Patricia Wilson (Israel)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Help in New York #general

Nigel Wilson <wilsonettes@...>
 

Alter NADLER arived in New York in 1906 with a wife Chawe
and children Sure, Gitel,Rufke,Moise, Itchil, Ester and Selig.

In 1920 he enters again with more children,
Yrzela Chezlda, Rebecca and Moritz. In 1920 his name is now
Alter NADLER.and he is going to his son-in-law Steimberg in E 175th St.
Bronx, NY. Did he marry twice? Town Alter was originally born in was
BOTOSANI in Romania.

Is there anyone out there connected to this seemingly large family?

Please respond privately.

Thank you.

Patricia Wilson (Israel)


Immigration from Austria #ukraine

hsolomon
 

My mother of blessed memory was an immigrant >from Sambor near Lvov. She
came to America in 1916 at age six. I grew up thinking that my mother was
from Austria. That is what she always told me. When she was in her mid
eighties I found a book, THE STHETEL FINDER. I found Sambor and for the
first time I realized where it was that of course was the Ukraine.

In a somewhat jesting way I told my mother she was not >from Austria, but
from Austro-Hungary and now that is the Ukraine. In a split instant my
mother responded to me, "I am not a Russian." My mom grew up in Chicago
and then in her early twenties after marrying my father moved to the
Mississippi Delta. In all my life I had never heard this thought or
anything like it >from my mother or anyone in her family.

Draw your own conclusion.

Herman Solomon


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Immigration from Austria #ukraine

hsolomon
 

My mother of blessed memory was an immigrant >from Sambor near Lvov. She
came to America in 1916 at age six. I grew up thinking that my mother was
from Austria. That is what she always told me. When she was in her mid
eighties I found a book, THE STHETEL FINDER. I found Sambor and for the
first time I realized where it was that of course was the Ukraine.

In a somewhat jesting way I told my mother she was not >from Austria, but
from Austro-Hungary and now that is the Ukraine. In a split instant my
mother responded to me, "I am not a Russian." My mom grew up in Chicago
and then in her early twenties after marrying my father moved to the
Mississippi Delta. In all my life I had never heard this thought or
anything like it >from my mother or anyone in her family.

Draw your own conclusion.

Herman Solomon


Polish Hungarian Jews #ukraine

elaine cohen <elaineco@...>
 

Hello,

This is in response to Valerie Bergin's recent question:

"What about Jews who claimed to be Hungarian? Some of my relatives came
from Sambor, now in Poland and claim to be of Hungarian origin."
I have been working on my various family trees, one of which is Hungarian.
My understanding is that there were very few Jews in Hungary before 1800.
Most Jews in Hungary moved into those areas >from Poland/Galicia. The
wandering Jew, of course.

Elaine Cohen, Los Angeles


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Polish Hungarian Jews #ukraine

elaine cohen <elaineco@...>
 

Hello,

This is in response to Valerie Bergin's recent question:

"What about Jews who claimed to be Hungarian? Some of my relatives came
from Sambor, now in Poland and claim to be of Hungarian origin."
I have been working on my various family trees, one of which is Hungarian.
My understanding is that there were very few Jews in Hungary before 1800.
Most Jews in Hungary moved into those areas >from Poland/Galicia. The
wandering Jew, of course.

Elaine Cohen, Los Angeles


Re: ukraine digest: June 23, 2002 #ukraine

Miriam Solon <msolon@...>
 

Subject: Re: Jews moving to Austria
From: "mikeand val" <mikebergin@earthlink.net>

What about Jews who claimed to be Hungarian? Some of my relatives came
from Sambor, now in Poland and claim to be of Hungarian origin.
Heh, my uncle was born in Sambor and said he was >from Vienna, so he
moved there in his mind, anyway. /;)

Galitzianer were notorious for this sort of state shifting. My father,
who is not Galitzianer politely referred to them as hillbillies. He has
his own issues. His father was born in Ukraine and his mother in
Belarus, but by golly, they were Russian. My mother is Galitzianer and
proud of it. It just happens that her part of Galicia wound up in
Ukraine, for now, anyway.

Neither one of them is terribly interested in genealogy.

Miriam Solon

searching ALTENBERG (Lublin, Stary Sambor), BECK (Stary Sambor), REICH
(Stary Sambor), LEWEN (Lublin), SLONIMSKY (Nikolaev), SLABODNIK
(Petrikov), BYK (Stary Sambor)
visit my cousins' genealogy pages at altenberg.com


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Re: ukraine digest: June 23, 2002 #ukraine

Miriam Solon <msolon@...>
 

Subject: Re: Jews moving to Austria
From: "mikeand val" <mikebergin@earthlink.net>

What about Jews who claimed to be Hungarian? Some of my relatives came
from Sambor, now in Poland and claim to be of Hungarian origin.
Heh, my uncle was born in Sambor and said he was >from Vienna, so he
moved there in his mind, anyway. /;)

Galitzianer were notorious for this sort of state shifting. My father,
who is not Galitzianer politely referred to them as hillbillies. He has
his own issues. His father was born in Ukraine and his mother in
Belarus, but by golly, they were Russian. My mother is Galitzianer and
proud of it. It just happens that her part of Galicia wound up in
Ukraine, for now, anyway.

Neither one of them is terribly interested in genealogy.

Miriam Solon

searching ALTENBERG (Lublin, Stary Sambor), BECK (Stary Sambor), REICH
(Stary Sambor), LEWEN (Lublin), SLONIMSKY (Nikolaev), SLABODNIK
(Petrikov), BYK (Stary Sambor)
visit my cousins' genealogy pages at altenberg.com


Re: District of Stanislau #galicia

Alexander Sharon
 

Joyce Eastman wrote:

Perhaps my original posting was not clear or not worded properly.

What I wanted to know is if it was possible for Sucha (now Sucha Beskidzka
or Biala (now Bielsko-Biala)both now in Poland, to have been considered at
one time part of Ivano-Frankovsk since they were born in the "District of
Stanislau" in the 1800's. My research has reached a dead end - particular
with the SCHEIER name.

I know that Stanislau is now called Ivano-Frankovsk and is in the Ukraine.

Am I wrong to be searching there for relatives?

Thanks for any help you can offer.

Joyce
Researching: SCHEIER - Bielsko-Biala & possibly Ivano-Frankovsk
RUFEISEN - Sucha Beskidzka & possibly Ivano-Frankovsk
Joyce,

Sucha Beskidzka in Wadowice region is separated
from Stanislawow in Eastern Galicia
(currently known as Ivano-Frankivsk) by 240 miles.

What you are looking for is place a bit closer to Sucha.

And there appear to be two matching neighboring
villages known as Stanislaw Gorny and
Stanislaw Dolny (Upper and Lower Stanislaw)
in Wadowice district Krakow Province, some 12 to 13 miles
North >from Sucha Beskidzka @ 49o44' 19o36'.

Their respective coordinates are: 49o55' 19o38' and 49o54' 19o38'

Both places are not listed in the known Jewish gazetteers. You can see
description of both places in 1929 Poland Business Directory.

Stanislaw Dolny appears to be a larger one with 1136 residents
(1921 census data) and better developed commerce activities
than the Upper neighbor.

I could recognize only one Jewish name: K.BOBER, tavern owner

Stanislaw Gorny, had 818 residents and no Jewish names listed.

Hope this help

Alexander Sharon
Calgary, Alberta


Re: ishbitz #general

Alexander Sharon
 

"Jean Perkin" <jean@jperkin.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in


A friend has asked me to find her father's shtetl. All she knows that in
Yiddish it was called 'Ishbitz', and was sometimes in Poland sometime
Russia.

I presumed >from this it was probably in the Belarus area, and on
Map Quest I found an Izbishiche 49.6 miles N of Minsk.
Try as I can, I can find nothing about this shtetl anywhere -
is there anyone who could perhaps help?

Thank you

Jean Perkin
UK
Jean,

It appears to be town Izbica, Poland.

There are actually two Izbica, one is known as Izbica Kujawska
and the other as just Izbica in Lublin region.

There are 79 entries for Izbica connection listed in JGFF database

http://www.jewishgen.org/jgff/

Alexander Sharon
Calgary, Canada


Kuf, Mem, Pay, Lamed? = Kumpl, Gimpel, Gomprecht, Gombertz . . . . #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 6/23/2002 9:06:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net writes:

<<
How would you spell/pronounce the name that is spelled in Hebrew/Yiddish
letters >from right to left, as Kuf, Mem, Pay, Lamed? Is it Kempl? Is this
a first name or a family name. It appears in the Radom, Poland Yizkor Book.
>>
==As early as 1206, Jews in Germany are recorded as using the German name
Gumprecht. This (German) name soon became fully accepted as a name among
Jews, and as a kinnuy. It took on various forms including Gompertz. Gimpl
and Kumpl (Beider cites Kumpl in a 1568 source in Prague). According for
Beider the name in its various forms served as a kinnuy for Ephraim and
Mordechai, and also Aaron and Uri (please don't ask me why).

Michael Bernet, New York <mBernet@aol.com>
WOLFF (Pfungstadt, Frankfurt/M, Koenigsberg, Amsterdam, N.Carolina); BERNET,
BERNERT, JONDORF(Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg); FEUCHTWANGER
(Schwabach, Hagenbach & Fuerth); KONIGSHOFER (anywhere); BERG, WOLF(F),
(Demmelsdorf & Zeckendorf); Shim`on GUTENSTEIN (Bad Homburg ca 1760);
FRENSDORF/ER (anywhere); MAINZER (Lorsch); anyone in Ermreuth or Floss;
GOLDSCHMIDT (B. Homburg, Hessdorf). ALTMANN (Silesia); TIMMENDORFER


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: District of Stanislau #general

Alexander Sharon
 

Joyce Eastman wrote:

Perhaps my original posting was not clear or not worded properly.

What I wanted to know is if it was possible for Sucha (now Sucha Beskidzka
or Biala (now Bielsko-Biala)both now in Poland, to have been considered at
one time part of Ivano-Frankovsk since they were born in the "District of
Stanislau" in the 1800's. My research has reached a dead end - particular
with the SCHEIER name.

I know that Stanislau is now called Ivano-Frankovsk and is in the Ukraine.

Am I wrong to be searching there for relatives?

Thanks for any help you can offer.

Joyce
Researching: SCHEIER - Bielsko-Biala & possibly Ivano-Frankovsk
RUFEISEN - Sucha Beskidzka & possibly Ivano-Frankovsk
Joyce,

Sucha Beskidzka in Wadowice region is separated
from Stanislawow in Eastern Galicia
(currently known as Ivano-Frankivsk) by 240 miles.

What you are looking for is place a bit closer to Sucha.

And there appear to be two matching neighboring
villages known as Stanislaw Gorny and
Stanislaw Dolny (Upper and Lower Stanislaw)
in Wadowice district Krakow Province, some 12 to 13 miles
North >from Sucha Beskidzka @ 49o44' 19o36'.

Their respective coordinates are: 49o55' 19o38' and 49o54' 19o38'

Both places are not listed in the known Jewish gazetteers. You can see
description of both places in 1929 Poland Business Directory.

Stanislaw Dolny appears to be a larger one with 1136 residents
(1921 census data) and better developed commerce activities
than the Upper neighbor.

I could recognize only one Jewish name: K.BOBER, tavern owner

Stanislaw Gorny, had 818 residents and no Jewish names listed.

Hope this help

Alexander Sharon
Calgary, Alberta


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: ishbitz #general

Alexander Sharon
 

"Jean Perkin" <jean@jperkin.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in


A friend has asked me to find her father's shtetl. All she knows that in
Yiddish it was called 'Ishbitz', and was sometimes in Poland sometime
Russia.

I presumed >from this it was probably in the Belarus area, and on
Map Quest I found an Izbishiche 49.6 miles N of Minsk.
Try as I can, I can find nothing about this shtetl anywhere -
is there anyone who could perhaps help?

Thank you

Jean Perkin
UK
Jean,

It appears to be town Izbica, Poland.

There are actually two Izbica, one is known as Izbica Kujawska
and the other as just Izbica in Lublin region.

There are 79 entries for Izbica connection listed in JGFF database

http://www.jewishgen.org/jgff/

Alexander Sharon
Calgary, Canada


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Kuf, Mem, Pay, Lamed? = Kumpl, Gimpel, Gomprecht, Gombertz . . . . #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 6/23/2002 9:06:12 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net writes:

<<
How would you spell/pronounce the name that is spelled in Hebrew/Yiddish
letters >from right to left, as Kuf, Mem, Pay, Lamed? Is it Kempl? Is this
a first name or a family name. It appears in the Radom, Poland Yizkor Book.
>>
==As early as 1206, Jews in Germany are recorded as using the German name
Gumprecht. This (German) name soon became fully accepted as a name among
Jews, and as a kinnuy. It took on various forms including Gompertz. Gimpl
and Kumpl (Beider cites Kumpl in a 1568 source in Prague). According for
Beider the name in its various forms served as a kinnuy for Ephraim and
Mordechai, and also Aaron and Uri (please don't ask me why).

Michael Bernet, New York <mBernet@aol.com>
WOLFF (Pfungstadt, Frankfurt/M, Koenigsberg, Amsterdam, N.Carolina); BERNET,
BERNERT, JONDORF(Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg); FEUCHTWANGER
(Schwabach, Hagenbach & Fuerth); KONIGSHOFER (anywhere); BERG, WOLF(F),
(Demmelsdorf & Zeckendorf); Shim`on GUTENSTEIN (Bad Homburg ca 1760);
FRENSDORF/ER (anywhere); MAINZER (Lorsch); anyone in Ermreuth or Floss;
GOLDSCHMIDT (B. Homburg, Hessdorf). ALTMANN (Silesia); TIMMENDORFER


Names: Gedalia, Aran #general

Myra and Peter Waddell <mpwaddell@...>
 

Dear Genners,

In a prayerbook belonging to my Grandmother, are hand-written forenames of
her Father's Father - Gedalia - and her Mother's Father - Aran. Since I
haven't heard of either of these names before, can someone please confirm
for me that I have decipered her writing correctly and, also, let me have
any other information about these names (if there is anything else to know
about them!). My Grandmother was French but I have no idea where her
parents or grandparents came from.

Thanks.
Myra (South Australia)

Researching - BEREJINSKI/BEREJANSKY, Vilnius, Lithuania; BORKOVSKY, Riga,
Latvia and Berne, Switzerland; DZIALOSZYNSKI, Lowicz, Poland; GOLDENBERG,
Paris, France; OUZNER/OSNER, Khotin/Chotin, Ukraine/Romania; OUZNER/OSNER,
Kishinev, Moldova; SAMUELS, Berne, Switzerland, Chicago, Ill, New York, NY
and Johannesburg, South Africa.

MODERATOR'S NOTE:
Private responses please


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Names: Gedalia, Aran #general

Myra and Peter Waddell <mpwaddell@...>
 

Dear Genners,

In a prayerbook belonging to my Grandmother, are hand-written forenames of
her Father's Father - Gedalia - and her Mother's Father - Aran. Since I
haven't heard of either of these names before, can someone please confirm
for me that I have decipered her writing correctly and, also, let me have
any other information about these names (if there is anything else to know
about them!). My Grandmother was French but I have no idea where her
parents or grandparents came from.

Thanks.
Myra (South Australia)

Researching - BEREJINSKI/BEREJANSKY, Vilnius, Lithuania; BORKOVSKY, Riga,
Latvia and Berne, Switzerland; DZIALOSZYNSKI, Lowicz, Poland; GOLDENBERG,
Paris, France; OUZNER/OSNER, Khotin/Chotin, Ukraine/Romania; OUZNER/OSNER,
Kishinev, Moldova; SAMUELS, Berne, Switzerland, Chicago, Ill, New York, NY
and Johannesburg, South Africa.

MODERATOR'S NOTE:
Private responses please