Date   

Re: The SEGAL name and Levites #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 7:23:47 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
chaikin@... writes:

<< The "guild" of the Levis, was actually a virtual guild, people who kept
the tradition of being Levis, and got ready to serve in the new coming
temple, right after the entry of the Messiah.
The Messiah was on his way, and almost appeared in gaps of about hundred
years, but it turned to be fake, or better, none.
The crusaders made a lot of harm to the Jewish communities of Europe, but
>from the other hand the desire and belief that the Messiah is coming soon,
increased...
So the Levies started getting ready and called their "guild" SEGAL.
>>

==All very nice, but I know of no tradition that the Levites suddenly
organized themselves into a guild or anything else. Two Levi'im can not
even be called to the Torah in succession, and the only place I know where
two or more Levi'im (as Levi'im) could be found adjacant was when washing
the hands of the Kohanim before the latter mounted the Dukhan to pronounce
the threefold blessing. In the Rhineland, that would have averaged between
seven and eight times a year.

==Unless they were hiding >from the Kohanim or the tax authorities, there
was no reason for Levis to give their "guild" a new name. Levi'im was an
adequate name.

Michael Bernet, New York


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: The SEGAL name and Levites #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 7:23:47 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
chaikin@... writes:

<< The "guild" of the Levis, was actually a virtual guild, people who kept
the tradition of being Levis, and got ready to serve in the new coming
temple, right after the entry of the Messiah.
The Messiah was on his way, and almost appeared in gaps of about hundred
years, but it turned to be fake, or better, none.
The crusaders made a lot of harm to the Jewish communities of Europe, but
>from the other hand the desire and belief that the Messiah is coming soon,
increased...
So the Levies started getting ready and called their "guild" SEGAL.
>>

==All very nice, but I know of no tradition that the Levites suddenly
organized themselves into a guild or anything else. Two Levi'im can not
even be called to the Torah in succession, and the only place I know where
two or more Levi'im (as Levi'im) could be found adjacant was when washing
the hands of the Kohanim before the latter mounted the Dukhan to pronounce
the threefold blessing. In the Rhineland, that would have averaged between
seven and eight times a year.

==Unless they were hiding >from the Kohanim or the tax authorities, there
was no reason for Levis to give their "guild" a new name. Levi'im was an
adequate name.

Michael Bernet, New York


Re: Deportation of Danish Jews, and the Swedes #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 7:22:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
N.Landau@... (Nick Landau) writes:

<< The following webpage is entitled "The Rescue of Danish Jews" >from the
US Holocaust Memorial Museum

http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Holocaust/denmark.html

It says that it was Danish officials who put pressure on the Germans about
these Jews. All but 51 of them were saved.

==I don't for one moment doubt that. The danish were brave and
determined. It is obvious, however, that the Swedes were also part of the
negotiations and agreed to admit the Jews >from Theresienstadt.

Michael Bernet, New York


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Deportation of Danish Jews, and the Swedes #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 7:22:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
N.Landau@... (Nick Landau) writes:

<< The following webpage is entitled "The Rescue of Danish Jews" >from the
US Holocaust Memorial Museum

http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Holocaust/denmark.html

It says that it was Danish officials who put pressure on the Germans about
these Jews. All but 51 of them were saved.

==I don't for one moment doubt that. The danish were brave and
determined. It is obvious, however, that the Swedes were also part of the
negotiations and agreed to admit the Jews >from Theresienstadt.

Michael Bernet, New York


Re: Meaning of Menke #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 9:29:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
carjim@... writes:

<< Fannie KAHN'S tombstone says widow of Menke KAHN. Her husband's name
was Marx KAHN. Is Menke a dimunitive form of Marx?
Carole Early >>

==No, Menke is derived, like Mendel, >from the Hebrew and Biblical name,
Menachem. Menke itself has no meaning but Menachem means "he comforts" or
"consoler."

European Jews adopted (or had bestowed on them) "non-Jewish" supplementary
names, especially in the 19th and 20th centuries, to ease their dealings
in the world-at-large. They were free, more or less to choose any name,
but usually chose one with the same initial. More commonly Marc, Marcus,
Marks etc. were names adopted by Jews named Mordechai

Michael Bernet, New York


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Meaning of Menke #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 9:29:53 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
carjim@... writes:

<< Fannie KAHN'S tombstone says widow of Menke KAHN. Her husband's name
was Marx KAHN. Is Menke a dimunitive form of Marx?
Carole Early >>

==No, Menke is derived, like Mendel, >from the Hebrew and Biblical name,
Menachem. Menke itself has no meaning but Menachem means "he comforts" or
"consoler."

European Jews adopted (or had bestowed on them) "non-Jewish" supplementary
names, especially in the 19th and 20th centuries, to ease their dealings
in the world-at-large. They were free, more or less to choose any name,
but usually chose one with the same initial. More commonly Marc, Marcus,
Marks etc. were names adopted by Jews named Mordechai

Michael Bernet, New York


Re: Searching "SEGAL" #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 7:47:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
jls@... writes:

<< Within my family, we are all "Levitic S*g*l's", but on my charts,
there are at least four different spellings.

==Spellings and transliterations were not exactly immutable before the
advent of the Linotype and the typewriter. But don't blame the Ellis
Island clerk; the stories that they changed names has been shown (see
jewishgen archives) to be an urban myth.

While I've never heard it anywhere else, my father claimed that Segal,
rather than an acronym, was "treasure" as in "am segula".

==a neat thought. My dictionary translates segulah as "treasured
possession, speciality, accomplishment, qualification, characteristic
[singular]." "segel" translates as "cadre, corpus, staff." However, as
you pointed out, it is essentially a drash, and there is no evidence at
the time of its first used to denote a Levi, that it was believed to
denote anything but "sgan Leiyah"

Michael Bernet, New York


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Searching "SEGAL" #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 7:47:00 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
jls@... writes:

<< Within my family, we are all "Levitic S*g*l's", but on my charts,
there are at least four different spellings.

==Spellings and transliterations were not exactly immutable before the
advent of the Linotype and the typewriter. But don't blame the Ellis
Island clerk; the stories that they changed names has been shown (see
jewishgen archives) to be an urban myth.

While I've never heard it anywhere else, my father claimed that Segal,
rather than an acronym, was "treasure" as in "am segula".

==a neat thought. My dictionary translates segulah as "treasured
possession, speciality, accomplishment, qualification, characteristic
[singular]." "segel" translates as "cadre, corpus, staff." However, as
you pointed out, it is essentially a drash, and there is no evidence at
the time of its first used to denote a Levi, that it was believed to
denote anything but "sgan Leiyah"

Michael Bernet, New York


Re: Kudos to GerSig #germany

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 shanghai1@... writes:

" a new, German, book, titled "Exil Shanghai 1938-1947: Juedisches Leben
in der Emigration" by Georg Armbruester, Michael Kohlstruck and Sonja
Muehlberger, Editors ("Hrsg."). "

=="Hrsg" is a German abbreviation for Herausgeber, one who "puts"
or "gives" forth [something]. In other words, "der Herausgeber" is "the
publisher."

Langenscheidt's German-English dictionary does give a secondary meaning
of editor. I mention this because we have to determine >from the context
whether this is the publisher (>from whom we can order copies) or the
editor (whom we can bless or curse as the case may be).

In this context it looks fairly safe to believe that here this
is "editors."

==hrsg, all lower case, is the verb, "herausgegeben"--published, or
edited, as the case may be.

That was a very touching story of how you discovered you schoolmate from
half a century and half a world away. Keep at it genealogists--these sort
of things will happen also for you, eventually.

Michael Bernet, New York


German SIG #Germany Re: Kudos to GerSig #germany

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 8/4/2003 shanghai1@... writes:

" a new, German, book, titled "Exil Shanghai 1938-1947: Juedisches Leben
in der Emigration" by Georg Armbruester, Michael Kohlstruck and Sonja
Muehlberger, Editors ("Hrsg."). "

=="Hrsg" is a German abbreviation for Herausgeber, one who "puts"
or "gives" forth [something]. In other words, "der Herausgeber" is "the
publisher."

Langenscheidt's German-English dictionary does give a secondary meaning
of editor. I mention this because we have to determine >from the context
whether this is the publisher (>from whom we can order copies) or the
editor (whom we can bless or curse as the case may be).

In this context it looks fairly safe to believe that here this
is "editors."

==hrsg, all lower case, is the verb, "herausgegeben"--published, or
edited, as the case may be.

That was a very touching story of how you discovered you schoolmate from
half a century and half a world away. Keep at it genealogists--these sort
of things will happen also for you, eventually.

Michael Bernet, New York


Stammbaum magazine #germany

Peter Zimmer <Zimmer-Luedinghausen@...>
 

Hi,
I am trying to order latest edition of "Stammbaum" but don't seem to be
very successful. Can anybody tell me what to do? Thank you,

Peter Zimmer Muenster Germany

MODERATOR NOTE: The latest edition of "Stammbaum" has not yet been sent
to subscribers. The following is >from the Stammbaum home page at:

http://www.jewishgen.org/stammbaum/

"Back issues:
Individual issues: US$ 10.00, international US$ 12.00
All back issues (17 items: 1-19): US$ 160.00, international US$ 170.00
Checks should be made payable to "Leo Baeck Institute". Send all
correspondence regarding Stammbaum to:

Stammbaum
Leo Baeck Institute
4th Floor
15 W 16th St
New York, NY 10011
e-mail: kfranklin@... "


German SIG #Germany Stammbaum magazine #germany

Peter Zimmer <Zimmer-Luedinghausen@...>
 

Hi,
I am trying to order latest edition of "Stammbaum" but don't seem to be
very successful. Can anybody tell me what to do? Thank you,

Peter Zimmer Muenster Germany

MODERATOR NOTE: The latest edition of "Stammbaum" has not yet been sent
to subscribers. The following is >from the Stammbaum home page at:

http://www.jewishgen.org/stammbaum/

"Back issues:
Individual issues: US$ 10.00, international US$ 12.00
All back issues (17 items: 1-19): US$ 160.00, international US$ 170.00
Checks should be made payable to "Leo Baeck Institute". Send all
correspondence regarding Stammbaum to:

Stammbaum
Leo Baeck Institute
4th Floor
15 W 16th St
New York, NY 10011
e-mail: kfranklin@... "


special thanks #general

Sara Lynns
 

to Genealogy Forum of Oregon
if any of you are having difficulty in making progress
with your family research, I recommend the Genealogy
Forum.

I attended this group last week
asked questions at the roundtable

they made suggestions like:
searching for neighbors on the census records
of LERNER family

WWI draft registration search for my paternal
grandfather
I did not consider that, as he was about 35 years of
age in 1917/18.

I also want to thank JGSO (in Oregon) for their help
and support.

I've not given up!

Hang in there
Jackie Lerner-Aderman


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen special thanks #general

Sara Lynns
 

to Genealogy Forum of Oregon
if any of you are having difficulty in making progress
with your family research, I recommend the Genealogy
Forum.

I attended this group last week
asked questions at the roundtable

they made suggestions like:
searching for neighbors on the census records
of LERNER family

WWI draft registration search for my paternal
grandfather
I did not consider that, as he was about 35 years of
age in 1917/18.

I also want to thank JGSO (in Oregon) for their help
and support.

I've not given up!

Hang in there
Jackie Lerner-Aderman


Trying to locate a town in Russia (1915) #general

Dixie Halber <dhalber@...>
 

Genners,
I am trying to locate the town that my husband's greatgrandfather, Yankiel
(Jacob) Rechter, is from. Here's the information we have, perhaps someone
can help us unravel the mystery.

He arrived at the port of Philadelphia in 1910. The manifest listed his
city of birth as Szranetz Russia and last residence as Valetchish. He
listed his father as the relative in Russia in the town of Moloczok
(possibly, it was hard to make out on the manifest and I neglected to copy
it). On his naturalization papers (which I do have a copy of) also list
the cities as Szranetz and Valetchish.

On the 1920 Philadelphia census he is listed as being >from Russia. In the
1930 census, it says he is >from Poland. Presumably this is because the
area he was >from was then under the ruling of Poland.

I have checked ShtetlSeeker and can find no exact match and the soundex
matches are too numerous to even begin. I have poured over a 1915 map of
Poland and Russia and can't find anything that seems likely. Has anyone
ever heard of this place? There isn't much information on this side of the
family and I'm having trouble narrowing down where it might be.

Dixie Halber
dhalber@...
Researching: HALBER, RECHTER, BRING, WIDRO, PHILLIPS, TAUBER


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Trying to locate a town in Russia (1915) #general

Dixie Halber <dhalber@...>
 

Genners,
I am trying to locate the town that my husband's greatgrandfather, Yankiel
(Jacob) Rechter, is from. Here's the information we have, perhaps someone
can help us unravel the mystery.

He arrived at the port of Philadelphia in 1910. The manifest listed his
city of birth as Szranetz Russia and last residence as Valetchish. He
listed his father as the relative in Russia in the town of Moloczok
(possibly, it was hard to make out on the manifest and I neglected to copy
it). On his naturalization papers (which I do have a copy of) also list
the cities as Szranetz and Valetchish.

On the 1920 Philadelphia census he is listed as being >from Russia. In the
1930 census, it says he is >from Poland. Presumably this is because the
area he was >from was then under the ruling of Poland.

I have checked ShtetlSeeker and can find no exact match and the soundex
matches are too numerous to even begin. I have poured over a 1915 map of
Poland and Russia and can't find anything that seems likely. Has anyone
ever heard of this place? There isn't much information on this side of the
family and I'm having trouble narrowing down where it might be.

Dixie Halber
dhalber@...
Researching: HALBER, RECHTER, BRING, WIDRO, PHILLIPS, TAUBER


NUSBAUM family #general

Sara Lynns
 

I'm looking for Sam OR Nathan NUSBAUM (or descendants)
Sam born 1899 or thereabouts) Nathan born 1867
lived in the Bronx as of 1930 census.

please respond privately
saralynn7@...

Jackie Lerner-Aderman
Portland, OR


Re: Certel #general

Roger Lustig <trovato@...>
 

Dear Israel:
If the 'C' is to be pronounced like the TZ in Tzaddik, then what you
have is a form of Zaertel, a diminutive of Zart, meaning "tender." In
the records I have (>from Upper Silesia), the name appears several times;
sometimes along with Sara, sometimes simply as the Hebrew name. Some
women named Charlotte had Zaertel as their "Hebrew" names; over half the
Charlottes were Sara. So Sara isn't unlikely; but Zartel or Zertel
showed up on tombstones too.

Best,
Roger Lustig
Princeton, NJ

Can anyone tell me the root of the female name Certel? Is it a form of
Sarah? We have two Certel born near Tarnopol in the 1890's.

Israel Pickholtz


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen NUSBAUM family #general

Sara Lynns
 

I'm looking for Sam OR Nathan NUSBAUM (or descendants)
Sam born 1899 or thereabouts) Nathan born 1867
lived in the Bronx as of 1930 census.

please respond privately
saralynn7@...

Jackie Lerner-Aderman
Portland, OR


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Certel #general

Roger Lustig <trovato@...>
 

Dear Israel:
If the 'C' is to be pronounced like the TZ in Tzaddik, then what you
have is a form of Zaertel, a diminutive of Zart, meaning "tender." In
the records I have (>from Upper Silesia), the name appears several times;
sometimes along with Sara, sometimes simply as the Hebrew name. Some
women named Charlotte had Zaertel as their "Hebrew" names; over half the
Charlottes were Sara. So Sara isn't unlikely; but Zartel or Zertel
showed up on tombstones too.

Best,
Roger Lustig
Princeton, NJ

Can anyone tell me the root of the female name Certel? Is it a form of
Sarah? We have two Certel born near Tarnopol in the 1890's.

Israel Pickholtz