Date   

My son Shmuel Eliyohu hy"d #rabbinic

Perets Mett <p.mett@...>
 

I would like to take this opportunity of thanking all those who sent
me and my family messages of comfort during the shiva following the
murder of our son Shmuel Eliyohu hy"d.

May we all merit to receive only good tidings on future.

Perets Mett


Rabbinic Genealogy SIG #Rabbinic My son Shmuel Eliyohu hy"d #rabbinic

Perets Mett <p.mett@...>
 

I would like to take this opportunity of thanking all those who sent
me and my family messages of comfort during the shiva following the
murder of our son Shmuel Eliyohu hy"d.

May we all merit to receive only good tidings on future.

Perets Mett


Double forenames, the MaHRSHaL and the name Schneur #rabbinic

Mr L Reich <lreich@...>
 

Until about the 15th Century a single Hebrew forename was the
accepted practice amongst Ashkenazi Jewry. I have often wondered why
and how the current custom of double and multiple Hebrew forenames
arose.

Recently I came across a passage in the talmudic commentary "Yam
shell shlomo" (Gittin 4:26)for which I will now give a rough
translation. This piece is of interest to genealogists on several
counts. This Hebrew work is by the 16th Century Rabbi and Rosh
Yeshiva, R' Shlomo Luria of Lublin, a.k.a. as the MaHRSHaL, one of
whose reponsa (No. 29) is a keystone in rabbinical genealogy.

Quote: "... I heard >from Moshe Lorch that when he got divorced (and
needed to write a Get with the correct names) he appeared before the
MaHRiL (famous 15th Century halachist). He (Lorch) told the MaHRiL
that his father was nicknamed Zalman, but had the Hebrew name of
Shemariah. The MaHRiL was puzzled, since Zalman and Shemariah don't
normally go together. "Maybe your father had another name such as
Shlomo or Yekusiel, which often go together with the nickname
Zalman?"

The MaHRiL arranged for two researchers to travel to the cemetery in
Magenca (Mainz) where Lorch's ancestors were buried. They discovered
the gravestone of Lorch's father's father's father. This also bore
the names of Zalman and Shemaria. Satisfied with the evidence, the
MaHRiL arranged the Get.

The MaHRiL was asked why does a single Jewish nickname (Shem
Ha'Laaz) often have several Hebrew counterparts? For instance for
the nickname Zalman, one finds Yekusiel, Meshulam, Shemaria, etc.?
He answered as follows. "Certainly, strictly speaking, there is a
one to one relationship between nicknames and Hebrew names. But
sometimes a man and his wife disagree about naming a child; each one
wanting a name >from their own ancestry. Occasionally, a compromise
is reached by one side getting the Hebrew name and the other the
nickname.

The MaHRSHaL adds the following. "And I, the small one, know that my
grandfather (z'kayni), R' Menachem Tzion, whose father was called
Meir, and whose father-in-law was called Uri, had a son and the same
argument arose.

The solution was to call the baby Schneur, meaning "two lights",
since both Meir and Uri are connected with light..."

Incidentally, the earlier and later sections surrounding this
excerpt >from the Yam shel Shlomo are a mine of information about
Hebrew nicknames.

Leslie Reich


Rabbinic Genealogy SIG #Rabbinic Double forenames, the MaHRSHaL and the name Schneur #rabbinic

Mr L Reich <lreich@...>
 

Until about the 15th Century a single Hebrew forename was the
accepted practice amongst Ashkenazi Jewry. I have often wondered why
and how the current custom of double and multiple Hebrew forenames
arose.

Recently I came across a passage in the talmudic commentary "Yam
shell shlomo" (Gittin 4:26)for which I will now give a rough
translation. This piece is of interest to genealogists on several
counts. This Hebrew work is by the 16th Century Rabbi and Rosh
Yeshiva, R' Shlomo Luria of Lublin, a.k.a. as the MaHRSHaL, one of
whose reponsa (No. 29) is a keystone in rabbinical genealogy.

Quote: "... I heard >from Moshe Lorch that when he got divorced (and
needed to write a Get with the correct names) he appeared before the
MaHRiL (famous 15th Century halachist). He (Lorch) told the MaHRiL
that his father was nicknamed Zalman, but had the Hebrew name of
Shemariah. The MaHRiL was puzzled, since Zalman and Shemariah don't
normally go together. "Maybe your father had another name such as
Shlomo or Yekusiel, which often go together with the nickname
Zalman?"

The MaHRiL arranged for two researchers to travel to the cemetery in
Magenca (Mainz) where Lorch's ancestors were buried. They discovered
the gravestone of Lorch's father's father's father. This also bore
the names of Zalman and Shemaria. Satisfied with the evidence, the
MaHRiL arranged the Get.

The MaHRiL was asked why does a single Jewish nickname (Shem
Ha'Laaz) often have several Hebrew counterparts? For instance for
the nickname Zalman, one finds Yekusiel, Meshulam, Shemaria, etc.?
He answered as follows. "Certainly, strictly speaking, there is a
one to one relationship between nicknames and Hebrew names. But
sometimes a man and his wife disagree about naming a child; each one
wanting a name >from their own ancestry. Occasionally, a compromise
is reached by one side getting the Hebrew name and the other the
nickname.

The MaHRSHaL adds the following. "And I, the small one, know that my
grandfather (z'kayni), R' Menachem Tzion, whose father was called
Meir, and whose father-in-law was called Uri, had a son and the same
argument arose.

The solution was to call the baby Schneur, meaning "two lights",
since both Meir and Uri are connected with light..."

Incidentally, the earlier and later sections surrounding this
excerpt >from the Yam shel Shlomo are a mine of information about
Hebrew nicknames.

Leslie Reich


Re: BLOCH or BLIOKH #general

Jules Levin
 

At 01:46 AM 9/5/2005, Stan Goodman wrote:

The "I" that is confusing you is a consequence of a "soft sign"
following the "L" in the Russian. This character has no sound of its
own, but only modifies the sound of the "L". Another transliterator
might well have ignored it, sparing you the confusion.
There is no "soft sign" in the Russian spelling of this word. The
letters 'IO' represent a single letter, which in normal spelling
is simply E, and in school/dictionary spelling would have an 'umlaut'
sign--two dots side-by-side--over it. Moreover, if there were a soft
sign there, it would have a 'sound of its own'. Compare the nickname
Leva (L'ova) and the word bel'ye (bel'yo), 'laundry' spelled with
L + soft sign + E with umlaut. There is a clear difference in
pronunciation. In this case the soft sign represents the sound yod.
Had another transliterator ignored this and written Bloch, he would be
failing to distinguish between two different Russian spellings, which
could lead to errors down the road...
Incidently, I answered this woman's query directly about 5 minutes after
it was sent. No need to send it to Jewishgen...
Jules Levin
Los Angeles


Re: Naturalization Questions #general

Nick <tulse04-news@...>
 

Just a note -- Many folks born in Eastern Europe during the late 1800s
did not know their birthdates. Unlike today, there was no requirement to
use it, and many came here with only a vague understanding of their exact
date of birth. My grandfather thought he was 2 years younger until he sent
for his Polish birth record; the new birthdate proved him not a minor at
the time his father naturalized. I have his letter to INS, apologizing for
voting for 40 years even though he was a non-citizen.
I can't understand this. For instance, a boy or his family would presumbably
know when his Hebrew birth date, in order that he should know when he was 13
in order to be called up in shul (ie his barmitzvah) >from when he would have
to lay tephilin etc.

Nick Landau
London, UK

COHNREICH (Anklam, Germany Krajenka, Poland) ATLAS (Wielkie Oczy (near
Lvov/Lemberg), Poland)
WECHSLER(Schwabach, Germany) KOHN (Wallerstein and Kleinerdlingen,Germany)
LANDAU/FREDKIN(Gomel, Mogilev, Belarus)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: BLOCH or BLIOKH #general

Jules Levin
 

At 01:46 AM 9/5/2005, Stan Goodman wrote:

The "I" that is confusing you is a consequence of a "soft sign"
following the "L" in the Russian. This character has no sound of its
own, but only modifies the sound of the "L". Another transliterator
might well have ignored it, sparing you the confusion.
There is no "soft sign" in the Russian spelling of this word. The
letters 'IO' represent a single letter, which in normal spelling
is simply E, and in school/dictionary spelling would have an 'umlaut'
sign--two dots side-by-side--over it. Moreover, if there were a soft
sign there, it would have a 'sound of its own'. Compare the nickname
Leva (L'ova) and the word bel'ye (bel'yo), 'laundry' spelled with
L + soft sign + E with umlaut. There is a clear difference in
pronunciation. In this case the soft sign represents the sound yod.
Had another transliterator ignored this and written Bloch, he would be
failing to distinguish between two different Russian spellings, which
could lead to errors down the road...
Incidently, I answered this woman's query directly about 5 minutes after
it was sent. No need to send it to Jewishgen...
Jules Levin
Los Angeles


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Naturalization Questions #general

Nick <tulse04-news@...>
 

Just a note -- Many folks born in Eastern Europe during the late 1800s
did not know their birthdates. Unlike today, there was no requirement to
use it, and many came here with only a vague understanding of their exact
date of birth. My grandfather thought he was 2 years younger until he sent
for his Polish birth record; the new birthdate proved him not a minor at
the time his father naturalized. I have his letter to INS, apologizing for
voting for 40 years even though he was a non-citizen.
I can't understand this. For instance, a boy or his family would presumbably
know when his Hebrew birth date, in order that he should know when he was 13
in order to be called up in shul (ie his barmitzvah) >from when he would have
to lay tephilin etc.

Nick Landau
London, UK

COHNREICH (Anklam, Germany Krajenka, Poland) ATLAS (Wielkie Oczy (near
Lvov/Lemberg), Poland)
WECHSLER(Schwabach, Germany) KOHN (Wallerstein and Kleinerdlingen,Germany)
LANDAU/FREDKIN(Gomel, Mogilev, Belarus)


Seeking HAAS Family #romania

Henry <henry@...>
 

Hi All,

I am trying to located descendents of Zusman (Sigmond) HAAS B. 1841 and his
wife Leah (Roza) SCHWARCZ B. 1847 >from Sarospatak, Hungary. They got married
on Dec. 11, 1866. Some or all family members immigrated to the USA. They had
7 children that I know of.

Tini HAAS b. 1867 married to Herman FELDMESSER
Terezia (Rezi) HAAS b. 1870 married to Solomon GRUN
Aser HAAS 1847 - 1877
Marton HAAS b. 1876
Betti HAAS 1880 - 1954 married Zvi Herman Hersch SCHWEIGER
Szali HAAS b. 1882
Pepi HAAS b. 1884

Thank You

Henry Schwartz

MODERATOR NOTE: Please enter all family names in capital letters,
and include your place of residence with your signature.
Thank you! Moderator on Duty


Romania SIG #Romania Seeking HAAS Family #romania

Henry <henry@...>
 

Hi All,

I am trying to located descendents of Zusman (Sigmond) HAAS B. 1841 and his
wife Leah (Roza) SCHWARCZ B. 1847 >from Sarospatak, Hungary. They got married
on Dec. 11, 1866. Some or all family members immigrated to the USA. They had
7 children that I know of.

Tini HAAS b. 1867 married to Herman FELDMESSER
Terezia (Rezi) HAAS b. 1870 married to Solomon GRUN
Aser HAAS 1847 - 1877
Marton HAAS b. 1876
Betti HAAS 1880 - 1954 married Zvi Herman Hersch SCHWEIGER
Szali HAAS b. 1882
Pepi HAAS b. 1884

Thank You

Henry Schwartz

MODERATOR NOTE: Please enter all family names in capital letters,
and include your place of residence with your signature.
Thank you! Moderator on Duty


Re: Ashkenazic Rabbinic Council, Jerusalem #rabbinic

ben-ari <yrcdi@...>
 

On 2005.09.03, Mark Weinberg <m_weinberg@verizon.net> wrote:

Family legend has it that my ggggf Israel Joseph WEINBERG was Chief
Rabbi of Jerusalem in the 1870s. I believe he was an Ashkenazic
Jew, born in Polish Russia.
I've been researching for a few months now and have not been able
to find any reference to my ggggf in historical documents [...]
What you were told may have been wishful thinking. I had an
experience several years ago when I was contacted by an individual
in Paris who asked me to research his ancestor who was a rabbi in
Jerusalem in the late 1800s and who, according to this person, was
on the Bet-Din of Rav Shmuel Salanter the Chief Rabbi of Jerusalem.
(I may be mixed up on whether it was Israel or Shmuel).

In short, after an extensive search in the national library in
Jerusalem, I found that the ancestor was a sofer sta"m (religious
scribe), had lived in Jerusalem at the time of Rav Salant, and had
to leave Jerusalem under unpleasant circumstances. The father of
this ancestor seems also to have been a rabbi (or atleast referred
to as such by one of the Hebrew newspapers of the time).

One of the leads you can check is with the Chevra Kaddisha of
Jerusalem (start with the Klali) and see if they have a registry on
him. You need his Hebrew name and his father's name and approx.
date of birth.

Yoni Ben-Ari
Efrat, Israel


Rabbinic Genealogy SIG #Rabbinic Re: Ashkenazic Rabbinic Council, Jerusalem #rabbinic

ben-ari <yrcdi@...>
 

On 2005.09.03, Mark Weinberg <m_weinberg@verizon.net> wrote:

Family legend has it that my ggggf Israel Joseph WEINBERG was Chief
Rabbi of Jerusalem in the 1870s. I believe he was an Ashkenazic
Jew, born in Polish Russia.
I've been researching for a few months now and have not been able
to find any reference to my ggggf in historical documents [...]
What you were told may have been wishful thinking. I had an
experience several years ago when I was contacted by an individual
in Paris who asked me to research his ancestor who was a rabbi in
Jerusalem in the late 1800s and who, according to this person, was
on the Bet-Din of Rav Shmuel Salanter the Chief Rabbi of Jerusalem.
(I may be mixed up on whether it was Israel or Shmuel).

In short, after an extensive search in the national library in
Jerusalem, I found that the ancestor was a sofer sta"m (religious
scribe), had lived in Jerusalem at the time of Rav Salant, and had
to leave Jerusalem under unpleasant circumstances. The father of
this ancestor seems also to have been a rabbi (or atleast referred
to as such by one of the Hebrew newspapers of the time).

One of the leads you can check is with the Chevra Kaddisha of
Jerusalem (start with the Klali) and see if they have a registry on
him. You need his Hebrew name and his father's name and approx.
date of birth.

Yoni Ben-Ari
Efrat, Israel


LEFKOVICS/LEFKOVITS/Slovakia #hungary

Vivian Kahn
 

I recently learned of my great-great-grandparents Anna LEFKOVICS and
Izak (Benjamin Yitzhak haKohen) KOHN. They probably lived in what is
now eastern Slovakia, possibly near Michalovce (Nagymihaly) in Zemplen
or Sobrance (Szobrancz) in Ung megye. Their daughter Sara (Sali), my
great-grandmother, was born in 1846 and married Markus (Mordechai,
Marek) MOSKOVITS whose family lived in Szobrancz and Ungvar. In the
Michalovce cemetery I also found a grave for Ruchel (Roza) MOSKOVITS
(1832-1918) daughter of Yosef LEFKOVITS. She might have been my
great-grandmother's cousin. Please get in touch if any of these names
sound familiar.

Vivian Kahn, Oakland, CA
vkahn@kmort.com


TRANSLATION PLEASE #hungary

B. Frederics <picturethisfilm@...>
 

Hi Siggers,

I'm hoping to confirm a relationship to an Abraham Czeisler, whose name =
I
found on a Budapest muster roll. There is a brief note written but I =
can't
read it. I'm hoping some kind soul will tell me what it says so I can =
see if
it gives me additional clues. It is posted on Viewmate VM6801.

Thanks in advance.

Regards,
Bonnie Frederics
Tucson, AZ
picturethisfilm@email.com
Seeking: ZEISLER/CZEISLER; LOWY; UNGAR. GROEDEL; WEINER; ERNST/ECSEDI =
(Eger,
DiosGyor, Kazincz, Ga'cs, Marmarross, Budapest, Szolnok; Szentes; =
Kapolna;
Tarnamera, Ujfalu; Vacs)


Seeking HAAS Family #hungary

Henry <henry@...>
 

Hi All,

I am trying to located descendents of Zusman (Sigmond) Haas B. 1841 and his
wife Leah (Roza) Schwarcz B. 1847 >from Sarospatak, Hungary. They got married
on Dec. 11, 1866. Some or all family members immigrated to the USA. They had
7 children that I know of.

Tini Haas b. 1867 married to Herman Feldmessner
Terezia (Rezi) Haas b. 1870 married to Solomon Grun
Aser Haas 1847 - 1877
Marton Haas b. 1876
Betti Haas 1880 - 1954 married Zvi Herman Hersch Schweiger
Szali Haas b. 1882
Pepi Haas b. 1884

Thank You

Henry Schwartz


Hungary SIG #Hungary LEFKOVICS/LEFKOVITS/Slovakia #hungary

Vivian Kahn
 

I recently learned of my great-great-grandparents Anna LEFKOVICS and
Izak (Benjamin Yitzhak haKohen) KOHN. They probably lived in what is
now eastern Slovakia, possibly near Michalovce (Nagymihaly) in Zemplen
or Sobrance (Szobrancz) in Ung megye. Their daughter Sara (Sali), my
great-grandmother, was born in 1846 and married Markus (Mordechai,
Marek) MOSKOVITS whose family lived in Szobrancz and Ungvar. In the
Michalovce cemetery I also found a grave for Ruchel (Roza) MOSKOVITS
(1832-1918) daughter of Yosef LEFKOVITS. She might have been my
great-grandmother's cousin. Please get in touch if any of these names
sound familiar.

Vivian Kahn, Oakland, CA
vkahn@kmort.com


Hungary SIG #Hungary TRANSLATION PLEASE #hungary

B. Frederics <picturethisfilm@...>
 

Hi Siggers,

I'm hoping to confirm a relationship to an Abraham Czeisler, whose name =
I
found on a Budapest muster roll. There is a brief note written but I =
can't
read it. I'm hoping some kind soul will tell me what it says so I can =
see if
it gives me additional clues. It is posted on Viewmate VM6801.

Thanks in advance.

Regards,
Bonnie Frederics
Tucson, AZ
picturethisfilm@email.com
Seeking: ZEISLER/CZEISLER; LOWY; UNGAR. GROEDEL; WEINER; ERNST/ECSEDI =
(Eger,
DiosGyor, Kazincz, Ga'cs, Marmarross, Budapest, Szolnok; Szentes; =
Kapolna;
Tarnamera, Ujfalu; Vacs)


Hungary SIG #Hungary Seeking HAAS Family #hungary

Henry <henry@...>
 

Hi All,

I am trying to located descendents of Zusman (Sigmond) Haas B. 1841 and his
wife Leah (Roza) Schwarcz B. 1847 >from Sarospatak, Hungary. They got married
on Dec. 11, 1866. Some or all family members immigrated to the USA. They had
7 children that I know of.

Tini Haas b. 1867 married to Herman Feldmessner
Terezia (Rezi) Haas b. 1870 married to Solomon Grun
Aser Haas 1847 - 1877
Marton Haas b. 1876
Betti Haas 1880 - 1954 married Zvi Herman Hersch Schweiger
Szali Haas b. 1882
Pepi Haas b. 1884

Thank You

Henry Schwartz


BLOCH or BLIOKH #general

Irene K. <impromptus2002@...>
 

"Are Bliokh and Bloch spellings used to transliterate
the same name, so that these could be the same
person? "

The family name BLOKH, the last letter is "X" in
Russian could be spelled as BLOCH (old translation
rules). BLIOKH is rather unusual spelling.
I think the best is to write to the translator or
project coordinator and to ask for original record, if
possible.

Irene Kudish
Tel-Aviv, Israel


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen BLOCH or BLIOKH #general

Irene K. <impromptus2002@...>
 

"Are Bliokh and Bloch spellings used to transliterate
the same name, so that these could be the same
person? "

The family name BLOKH, the last letter is "X" in
Russian could be spelled as BLOCH (old translation
rules). BLIOKH is rather unusual spelling.
I think the best is to write to the translator or
project coordinator and to ask for original record, if
possible.

Irene Kudish
Tel-Aviv, Israel