Date   

GYULA equals.....? #hungary

jcl me <jamgai@...>
 

hello, all

can/will someone please advise me as to what the first name GYULA
would translate to in English?

thanks, in advance

Jeffrey Leeds
sherman oaks, ca
USA


Re: 1848 Census of the Jews -- puzzles #hungary

tom klein <h-sig@...>
 

in hungarian, the family name is always given first, just as if it were an adjective. LISAUER would be the family name and Simon the given name. likewise, BERNAT (a fairly common male given name at the time) should be his wife's maiden name, and Borbala (the hungarian version of Barbara) is a common female given name. no mystery there at all.

likewise, the children's names are not unusual (except that the usual hungarian spelling is Jo'zsef, rather than the hebrew Joszef).

the terms "neje", "gyermekei", and "veje" are all possessives, meaning "his wife", "his children", and "his son in law".

and, of course, his son in law's family name is given as TIRK, given name Bernat, which is only unusual because it happened to be the same as his mother in law's maiden name.

i'm sure that jews used patronymics before surnames were instituted, but i would expect them to use their hebrew names in that case, rather than a very secular name like Bernat. (note that some of their given names are clearly non-biblical, such as Borbala, Terezia, and Bernat, which is typical for the period after the emancipation.)


....... tom klein, toronto

Marian Brown <brownm@peoplepc.com> wrote:

Dear All,

I need some help or at least some educated guesses.

The following is a the exact list of family members >from the 1848 census
of Bodolo, Hungary -- now Budulov, Slovakia:

Lisauer, Simon
Neje: Bernat Borbala
Gyermekei:
Lisauer, Joszef
Jacob
Abraham
Terezia
Nani/Hani
Veje: Tirk Bernat

I understand that Bernat Borbala is the wife of Simon Lisauer, but how
do I interpret her name? Borbala, daughter of Bernat?

I understand that the next five names are their children.

As to Tirk Bernat, I understand that "Veje" means brother-in-law. Would
he be the brother-in-law of Simon Lissauer and perhaps a brother of
Bernat Borbala?

Or would he be a brother-in-law of the children and perhaps married to
Nani/Hani?

Also, how do I interpret his hame? Tirk son of Bernat or would Tirk be
the surname and Bernat the given name?

Thanks for helping!

Marian Brown
Cincinnati, OH


Hungary SIG #Hungary GYULA equals.....? #hungary

jcl me <jamgai@...>
 

hello, all

can/will someone please advise me as to what the first name GYULA
would translate to in English?

thanks, in advance

Jeffrey Leeds
sherman oaks, ca
USA


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: 1848 Census of the Jews -- puzzles #hungary

tom klein <h-sig@...>
 

in hungarian, the family name is always given first, just as if it were an adjective. LISAUER would be the family name and Simon the given name. likewise, BERNAT (a fairly common male given name at the time) should be his wife's maiden name, and Borbala (the hungarian version of Barbara) is a common female given name. no mystery there at all.

likewise, the children's names are not unusual (except that the usual hungarian spelling is Jo'zsef, rather than the hebrew Joszef).

the terms "neje", "gyermekei", and "veje" are all possessives, meaning "his wife", "his children", and "his son in law".

and, of course, his son in law's family name is given as TIRK, given name Bernat, which is only unusual because it happened to be the same as his mother in law's maiden name.

i'm sure that jews used patronymics before surnames were instituted, but i would expect them to use their hebrew names in that case, rather than a very secular name like Bernat. (note that some of their given names are clearly non-biblical, such as Borbala, Terezia, and Bernat, which is typical for the period after the emancipation.)


....... tom klein, toronto

Marian Brown <brownm@peoplepc.com> wrote:

Dear All,

I need some help or at least some educated guesses.

The following is a the exact list of family members >from the 1848 census
of Bodolo, Hungary -- now Budulov, Slovakia:

Lisauer, Simon
Neje: Bernat Borbala
Gyermekei:
Lisauer, Joszef
Jacob
Abraham
Terezia
Nani/Hani
Veje: Tirk Bernat

I understand that Bernat Borbala is the wife of Simon Lisauer, but how
do I interpret her name? Borbala, daughter of Bernat?

I understand that the next five names are their children.

As to Tirk Bernat, I understand that "Veje" means brother-in-law. Would
he be the brother-in-law of Simon Lissauer and perhaps a brother of
Bernat Borbala?

Or would he be a brother-in-law of the children and perhaps married to
Nani/Hani?

Also, how do I interpret his hame? Tirk son of Bernat or would Tirk be
the surname and Bernat the given name?

Thanks for helping!

Marian Brown
Cincinnati, OH


1848 Census question #hungary

peter bakos <pgbakos@...>
 

Hello,

The question of Hungarian names usually comes up when we tend to forget that
in Hungarian usage the family name is always given first.

Bernat means Bernard and is not an uncommon family name. In fact, a great
many Hungarians have family names which could be given names, which adds to
the confusion. How somebody of Jewish ancestry ended up with such a name is
also open to speculation which one of our more learned colleagues will
answer, I am sure.

Peter Bakos
Budapest
PODVINECZ, ROSENBERG/RACZ/RONAI, MOSCOVICS etc.


The Lisauers #hungary

Bela Mihalik <mihalikbela@...>
 

Dear Marian,

The Bernat is the surname of Lisauer Simon's wife, Borbala. Tirk Bernat=20
is their son-in-law, surname is Tirk, givenname is Bernat. But actually=20
there isn't any proof, how is he their son-in-law, because Lisauer Simon=20
had two daughter: Terezia and Hani. So you need more research that=20
which daughter's husband was Bernat.=20

Best regards,
Bela Vilmos Mihalik,
Budapest, Hungary


Hungary SIG #Hungary 1848 Census question #hungary

peter bakos <pgbakos@...>
 

Hello,

The question of Hungarian names usually comes up when we tend to forget that
in Hungarian usage the family name is always given first.

Bernat means Bernard and is not an uncommon family name. In fact, a great
many Hungarians have family names which could be given names, which adds to
the confusion. How somebody of Jewish ancestry ended up with such a name is
also open to speculation which one of our more learned colleagues will
answer, I am sure.

Peter Bakos
Budapest
PODVINECZ, ROSENBERG/RACZ/RONAI, MOSCOVICS etc.


Hungary SIG #Hungary The Lisauers #hungary

Bela Mihalik <mihalikbela@...>
 

Dear Marian,

The Bernat is the surname of Lisauer Simon's wife, Borbala. Tirk Bernat=20
is their son-in-law, surname is Tirk, givenname is Bernat. But actually=20
there isn't any proof, how is he their son-in-law, because Lisauer Simon=20
had two daughter: Terezia and Hani. So you need more research that=20
which daughter's husband was Bernat.=20

Best regards,
Bela Vilmos Mihalik,
Budapest, Hungary


USA Form 505 Annotation on Passenger Manifest - Clarification #general

Jeanne Gold <twig@...>
 

Based on emails I've been getting regarding my original post about the Certificate
of Arrival, I thought it worthwhile to clarify something I have (re)learned about
the Form 505 annotation found on passenger manifests.

The district number found in the annotation refers to the district office of the
INS (now USCIS) where the Form 505 application was filed.

It may or may not refer to the district court where the petition for naturalization
was filed.

In looking through some very old emails, I found one >from Richard Gelbke, Archives
Specialist at the New York NARA archives, dated 02 Apr 1998.

I quote: "The annotation 2-799967 10-11-40 on the passenger manifest indicates that
Mr. Goldglied filed for citizenship and on October 11, 1940, the Immigration and
Naturalization Service verified his arrival and issued a Certificate of Arrival
(2-799967) to the Court where he had applied."

In this case the information directly corresponded to his petition for
naturalization and it was indeed in district court in NY. Yet, Mr. Gelbke reported
"We examined the indexes to these records and were unable to locate information
relating to the naturalization of a Leib Goldglied."

In an email >from Rebcca Warlow, Archives Specialist >from the Mid-Atlantic NARA,
dated 03/31/2000, regarding another immigrant I was researching, she clarified
that the "505" referred to a form filed requesting a certificate of arrival and
that the district number usually refered to the district court, but not always. If
the person resided in another state and the local offices had not been able to
verify the passenger arrival, then the 505 Form was sent to the INS district most
likely to have the passenger's information. In which case, the district number had
no bearing on the court in which the ancestor made the petition, but only the INS
district office where the C of A was issued.

In conclusion, although Fannie Greenberg's annotation contained the 2 for Southern
NY district, refered to a Form 505 application and was issued in 1942, I am
reasonably certain she was in CA sometime between 1936-1942. Family members, living
at the time, said she never left CA and lost touch with her about the time I was
born (late 1950's).

Jeanne Gold
Albany, OR, USA
www.digging4roots.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen USA Form 505 Annotation on Passenger Manifest - Clarification #general

Jeanne Gold <twig@...>
 

Based on emails I've been getting regarding my original post about the Certificate
of Arrival, I thought it worthwhile to clarify something I have (re)learned about
the Form 505 annotation found on passenger manifests.

The district number found in the annotation refers to the district office of the
INS (now USCIS) where the Form 505 application was filed.

It may or may not refer to the district court where the petition for naturalization
was filed.

In looking through some very old emails, I found one >from Richard Gelbke, Archives
Specialist at the New York NARA archives, dated 02 Apr 1998.

I quote: "The annotation 2-799967 10-11-40 on the passenger manifest indicates that
Mr. Goldglied filed for citizenship and on October 11, 1940, the Immigration and
Naturalization Service verified his arrival and issued a Certificate of Arrival
(2-799967) to the Court where he had applied."

In this case the information directly corresponded to his petition for
naturalization and it was indeed in district court in NY. Yet, Mr. Gelbke reported
"We examined the indexes to these records and were unable to locate information
relating to the naturalization of a Leib Goldglied."

In an email >from Rebcca Warlow, Archives Specialist >from the Mid-Atlantic NARA,
dated 03/31/2000, regarding another immigrant I was researching, she clarified
that the "505" referred to a form filed requesting a certificate of arrival and
that the district number usually refered to the district court, but not always. If
the person resided in another state and the local offices had not been able to
verify the passenger arrival, then the 505 Form was sent to the INS district most
likely to have the passenger's information. In which case, the district number had
no bearing on the court in which the ancestor made the petition, but only the INS
district office where the C of A was issued.

In conclusion, although Fannie Greenberg's annotation contained the 2 for Southern
NY district, refered to a Form 505 application and was issued in 1942, I am
reasonably certain she was in CA sometime between 1936-1942. Family members, living
at the time, said she never left CA and lost touch with her about the time I was
born (late 1950's).

Jeanne Gold
Albany, OR, USA
www.digging4roots.com


Announcing Zarnow, Poland BMD Indexes for 1874 to 1902 #general

Gloria Berkenstat Freund
 

Dear Zarnow Researchers,

Jewish Records Indexing Poland (JRI-Poland) is happy to announce that the indexing
of the birth, marriage and death records for Zarnow for the years 1874 to 1902 has
been completed and these indices are now available to Zarnow Project Supporters.

The earlier Zarnow records >from 1808 to 1873 were microfilmed by the LDS and still
need to be indexed as part of the JRI-Poland Shtetl COOP project. Please contact
me if you are interested in volunteering for this project.

Zarnow is located at 51-15N 20-11E, 77 miles (124 kilometers) SSW of Warsaw, 46 miles
74 kilometers) SE of Lodz and about 54 miles (87 kilometers) NE of Czestochowa.

There are a total of 3254 surnames (with spelling variations) in the Zarnow
database including the following surnames (in alphabetical order with spelling
variations combined) that have the greatest frequency in the 1874-1902 database:

ABRAMOWICZ 18, BIRENCWEJG 32, CECOWSKI 17, CHMELNICKI 31, DLUZNOWSKI 42,
DRZYMALKOWSKI 27, DUTKEWICZ 34, EDELSZTEJN 25, FALK 27, FELDBAUM 16, FUKS 36,
GELNEWSKI 49, GOLDBERG 56, GOLDCHAMER 24, GRYNBERG 22, JAKUBOWICZ 32, JURKEWICZ 53,
KAC 54, KLAJNBERG 16, KOZENECKI 17, KOZLOWSKI 97, KRAUZ 21, KUSZER 72, LEJZEROWICZ
29, LEWIN 17, LIPLING 19, LUFTMAN 25, MARKOWICZ 17, MENDZYGURSKI 43, MILSTAJN 25,
MLYNARSKI 18, MOSZKOWICZ 40, ORENBUCH 17, PILCHOWSKI 18, PINUSEWICZ 29, ROJT 20,
ROLNICKI 90, ROZENBERG, ROZENBLAT 19, ROZENCWEJG 53, SKURNICKI 18, SOKOLOWSKI 23,
SPIRYTUS 25, SWIRCZ 17, SZAJEWICZ 38, SZWARCBERG 40, TARKA 22, WELGOWSKI 28,
WERSZHOWSKI 29, WIJERZCHOWSKI 31, WODOWSKI 28.

A list of all surnames appearing in the Zarnow indices is now online
at: http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/psa/zarnow_surn.htm

For more information about this file, please e-mail me at glory1@rcn.com.

Gloria Berkenstat Freund
Piotrkow Trybunalski PSA Archive Coordinator
New York, NY


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Announcing Zarnow, Poland BMD Indexes for 1874 to 1902 #general

Gloria Berkenstat Freund
 

Dear Zarnow Researchers,

Jewish Records Indexing Poland (JRI-Poland) is happy to announce that the indexing
of the birth, marriage and death records for Zarnow for the years 1874 to 1902 has
been completed and these indices are now available to Zarnow Project Supporters.

The earlier Zarnow records >from 1808 to 1873 were microfilmed by the LDS and still
need to be indexed as part of the JRI-Poland Shtetl COOP project. Please contact
me if you are interested in volunteering for this project.

Zarnow is located at 51-15N 20-11E, 77 miles (124 kilometers) SSW of Warsaw, 46 miles
74 kilometers) SE of Lodz and about 54 miles (87 kilometers) NE of Czestochowa.

There are a total of 3254 surnames (with spelling variations) in the Zarnow
database including the following surnames (in alphabetical order with spelling
variations combined) that have the greatest frequency in the 1874-1902 database:

ABRAMOWICZ 18, BIRENCWEJG 32, CECOWSKI 17, CHMELNICKI 31, DLUZNOWSKI 42,
DRZYMALKOWSKI 27, DUTKEWICZ 34, EDELSZTEJN 25, FALK 27, FELDBAUM 16, FUKS 36,
GELNEWSKI 49, GOLDBERG 56, GOLDCHAMER 24, GRYNBERG 22, JAKUBOWICZ 32, JURKEWICZ 53,
KAC 54, KLAJNBERG 16, KOZENECKI 17, KOZLOWSKI 97, KRAUZ 21, KUSZER 72, LEJZEROWICZ
29, LEWIN 17, LIPLING 19, LUFTMAN 25, MARKOWICZ 17, MENDZYGURSKI 43, MILSTAJN 25,
MLYNARSKI 18, MOSZKOWICZ 40, ORENBUCH 17, PILCHOWSKI 18, PINUSEWICZ 29, ROJT 20,
ROLNICKI 90, ROZENBERG, ROZENBLAT 19, ROZENCWEJG 53, SKURNICKI 18, SOKOLOWSKI 23,
SPIRYTUS 25, SWIRCZ 17, SZAJEWICZ 38, SZWARCBERG 40, TARKA 22, WELGOWSKI 28,
WERSZHOWSKI 29, WIJERZCHOWSKI 31, WODOWSKI 28.

A list of all surnames appearing in the Zarnow indices is now online
at: http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/psa/zarnow_surn.htm

For more information about this file, please e-mail me at glory1@rcn.com.

Gloria Berkenstat Freund
Piotrkow Trybunalski PSA Archive Coordinator
New York, NY


Records/Archives for Essex #unitedkingdom

Lorna Kay <lorna.kay@...>
 

Message >from Essex Records Office:

Following the closure of our Colchester branch at the end
of March, we will begin the process of transferring
documents currently held at Colchester to Chelmsford.

Unfortunately, it is not possible to move such a large quantity
of material into our strongrooms and still maintain our usual
level of public service. In order to minimise the disruption
to the overall service we will therefore close the Wharf
Road Record Office Searchroom for the week of Tuesday
10th to Saturday 14th April. We apologise sincerely for any
inconvenience this may cause you.

We will be open for the rest of April (excluding Good Friday
and Easter Monday), and expect to be able to provide a full
service. However, if you plan to visit us during that month
you are advised to check beforehand, in case there are
difficulties with the items that you wish to see.

Once re-opened we shall be on our way to providing a
better service overall - by making all records about Essex,
including Colchester and Tendring, available in one place.


Thank you.
Jennifer Butler
Principal Archivist

Essex Record Office
Wharf Road
Chelmsford
Essex
CM2 6YT

01245 244604


Re: jcr-uk digest: March 20, 2007 #unitedkingdom

Adele Lester <alester@...>
 

"JCR-UK SIG" <jcr-uk@lyris.jewishgen.org> writes:
The A-Z of Regency London shows both Marmaduke Court and Marmaduke Street
in
approx the area you mention. The A-Z of Victorian London has neither. If
no one comes up with Place you may like me to scan these.
Dear Hazel: The responses have shown me maps that I've not really been
able to read! If it's
not too much trouble to scan in the above, I'd really appreciate.
Many thanks!
Adele


JCR-UK SIG #UnitedKingdom Records/Archives for Essex #unitedkingdom

Lorna Kay <lorna.kay@...>
 

Message >from Essex Records Office:

Following the closure of our Colchester branch at the end
of March, we will begin the process of transferring
documents currently held at Colchester to Chelmsford.

Unfortunately, it is not possible to move such a large quantity
of material into our strongrooms and still maintain our usual
level of public service. In order to minimise the disruption
to the overall service we will therefore close the Wharf
Road Record Office Searchroom for the week of Tuesday
10th to Saturday 14th April. We apologise sincerely for any
inconvenience this may cause you.

We will be open for the rest of April (excluding Good Friday
and Easter Monday), and expect to be able to provide a full
service. However, if you plan to visit us during that month
you are advised to check beforehand, in case there are
difficulties with the items that you wish to see.

Once re-opened we shall be on our way to providing a
better service overall - by making all records about Essex,
including Colchester and Tendring, available in one place.


Thank you.
Jennifer Butler
Principal Archivist

Essex Record Office
Wharf Road
Chelmsford
Essex
CM2 6YT

01245 244604


JCR-UK SIG #UnitedKingdom Re: jcr-uk digest: March 20, 2007 #unitedkingdom

Adele Lester <alester@...>
 

"JCR-UK SIG" <jcr-uk@lyris.jewishgen.org> writes:
The A-Z of Regency London shows both Marmaduke Court and Marmaduke Street
in
approx the area you mention. The A-Z of Victorian London has neither. If
no one comes up with Place you may like me to scan these.
Dear Hazel: The responses have shown me maps that I've not really been
able to read! If it's
not too much trouble to scan in the above, I'd really appreciate.
Many thanks!
Adele


Re: Alexandre ARON #france

r r <rrover27@...>
 

Id lie to thank all the mebers who to their time to share their
information with me.
I should make note, that many members pointed out that Rabbi ARON was
from FEGERSHEIM.
The one essentinal point of my research is to assertain the correct
given name for the daughter of rabbi ARON. Her french name was
charlotte. I was hoping to be able to tell >from the grave what her
hebrew name would be but i couldent read it. Was anybody able to make
it out?
What would the common hebrew name for "charlotte" be?

Thank you

Robert Rover
New York, USA


Seeking information about nobleman ?SKINETSKI? from Rzeszow area #galicia

Beth Sommer <bethfsommer@...>
 

I have been told that my MGGM, Frymet FELD GREHER, who lived in
the Rzeszow area, worked as a purchasing agent for a nobleman. I
have been trying to find out his exact name and about his family.
His name was pronounced something like Yadviga Skinetski or
Skenitski. His father was a general. I would like to know how his
name is spelled and would appreciate any other information any of
you can offer.

I would appreciate your help. You may respond privately.

Thank you.

Beth Fagin Sommer
Philadelphia, PA

Researching FEIGIN/FAGIN(Voronezh>NY), STAROSELSKY(Voronezh>NY),
LEIBNER(Nowy Zmigrod>NY), GREHER/GREIER/FELD(Rzeszow/Tyczyn>NY,NJ)


French SIG #France Re: Alexandre ARON #france

r r <rrover27@...>
 

Id lie to thank all the mebers who to their time to share their
information with me.
I should make note, that many members pointed out that Rabbi ARON was
from FEGERSHEIM.
The one essentinal point of my research is to assertain the correct
given name for the daughter of rabbi ARON. Her french name was
charlotte. I was hoping to be able to tell >from the grave what her
hebrew name would be but i couldent read it. Was anybody able to make
it out?
What would the common hebrew name for "charlotte" be?

Thank you

Robert Rover
New York, USA


Gesher Galicia SIG #Galicia Seeking information about nobleman ?SKINETSKI? from Rzeszow area #galicia

Beth Sommer <bethfsommer@...>
 

I have been told that my MGGM, Frymet FELD GREHER, who lived in
the Rzeszow area, worked as a purchasing agent for a nobleman. I
have been trying to find out his exact name and about his family.
His name was pronounced something like Yadviga Skinetski or
Skenitski. His father was a general. I would like to know how his
name is spelled and would appreciate any other information any of
you can offer.

I would appreciate your help. You may respond privately.

Thank you.

Beth Fagin Sommer
Philadelphia, PA

Researching FEIGIN/FAGIN(Voronezh>NY), STAROSELSKY(Voronezh>NY),
LEIBNER(Nowy Zmigrod>NY), GREHER/GREIER/FELD(Rzeszow/Tyczyn>NY,NJ)