Date   

Patronka (?) #austria-czech

Yohanan
 

I have received >from the Survivors Registry of the USA Holocaust
Memorial Museum, >from the ITS records, for the first time ever,
information regarding the disappearing of Johann LOFFLER during
1942 >from Bratislava.

They found a deportation card with his name, transported
on 4/6/1942, where it is written:
Lager: Bratislava - Patronka.

Any of the researchers have an idea what / where is Patronka?
I looked at the JG Disscussion Group archive and JG ShtetleSeeker
but found nothing. Is the date or the name Patronka indicate which
camp he was sent to?

Thanks for your help,
Yohanan Loeffler
Melbourne Australia


Austria-Czech SIG #Austria-Czech Patronka (?) #austria-czech

Yohanan
 

I have received >from the Survivors Registry of the USA Holocaust
Memorial Museum, >from the ITS records, for the first time ever,
information regarding the disappearing of Johann LOFFLER during
1942 >from Bratislava.

They found a deportation card with his name, transported
on 4/6/1942, where it is written:
Lager: Bratislava - Patronka.

Any of the researchers have an idea what / where is Patronka?
I looked at the JG Disscussion Group archive and JG ShtetleSeeker
but found nothing. Is the date or the name Patronka indicate which
camp he was sent to?

Thanks for your help,
Yohanan Loeffler
Melbourne Australia


Seeking death record of MORGENSTERN in Radkersburg, Austria #austria-czech

d pfalzer <d_pfalzer@...>
 

I am trying to find out how to obtain a death record
from 1914 Radkersburg, Austria for Rudolph
Morgenstern. I have the exact date of death >from a
secondary record in his hometown near Murska Sobota.

If I understand correctly, Radkersburg is a district
of Austria rather than a town -- do I need more than
that to obtain the record?

Could somebody point me in the right direction?

[I am sending this to both the Hungarian SIG and the
Austrian SIG because I am not at all clear which is
the appropriate one.]

Denise Pfalzer
Tampa, Florida, USA


Austria-Czech SIG #Austria-Czech Seeking death record of MORGENSTERN in Radkersburg, Austria #austria-czech

d pfalzer <d_pfalzer@...>
 

I am trying to find out how to obtain a death record
from 1914 Radkersburg, Austria for Rudolph
Morgenstern. I have the exact date of death >from a
secondary record in his hometown near Murska Sobota.

If I understand correctly, Radkersburg is a district
of Austria rather than a town -- do I need more than
that to obtain the record?

Could somebody point me in the right direction?

[I am sending this to both the Hungarian SIG and the
Austrian SIG because I am not at all clear which is
the appropriate one.]

Denise Pfalzer
Tampa, Florida, USA


HTML volunteers needed for the ShtetLinks Project #austria-czech

Susana Leistner Bloch
 

We have received messages >from people who have significant material
about their ancestral town/shtetl and would like to create a webpage
dedicated to the Jewish community that once lived there. Unfortunately
they do not have the necessary HTML skills to create a webpage.

Our webpages are Cyberspace Yizkor Books. Just as the former residents
and survivors of a shtetl took it upon themselves to record all they
could remember and publish a Yizkor Book in memory of the Jewish
community that once lived there, so we, the next generation, should
make sure that whatever we have, every little bit of information that
sheds light on the lives of our people, is recorded and preserved.
The people who published Yizkor Books usually were in contact with
others living in the same town or country. Contact with their landsmen
in other countries was difficult. To us, in the 21st century, there
are no limitations. Cyberspace has opened up the world to us.

What is the time commitment? After the initial design of the webpage
maintenance is not too time consuming: just occasionally adding new
material and fixing broken links. ShtetLinks will provide, if
requested, a template to be used as a "guide" to creating a webpage
and we will guide you through the process.

If you have the necessary skills we urge you to volunteer and help
someone create a webpage dedicated to a shtetl/town, and in this way
honour and memorialize the Jewish community that once lived there with
a most valuable resource for future generations of their descendants.

Susana Leistner Bloch, Coordinator
JewishGen ShtetLinks Project


Austria-Czech SIG #Austria-Czech HTML volunteers needed for the ShtetLinks Project #austria-czech

Susana Leistner Bloch
 

We have received messages >from people who have significant material
about their ancestral town/shtetl and would like to create a webpage
dedicated to the Jewish community that once lived there. Unfortunately
they do not have the necessary HTML skills to create a webpage.

Our webpages are Cyberspace Yizkor Books. Just as the former residents
and survivors of a shtetl took it upon themselves to record all they
could remember and publish a Yizkor Book in memory of the Jewish
community that once lived there, so we, the next generation, should
make sure that whatever we have, every little bit of information that
sheds light on the lives of our people, is recorded and preserved.
The people who published Yizkor Books usually were in contact with
others living in the same town or country. Contact with their landsmen
in other countries was difficult. To us, in the 21st century, there
are no limitations. Cyberspace has opened up the world to us.

What is the time commitment? After the initial design of the webpage
maintenance is not too time consuming: just occasionally adding new
material and fixing broken links. ShtetLinks will provide, if
requested, a template to be used as a "guide" to creating a webpage
and we will guide you through the process.

If you have the necessary skills we urge you to volunteer and help
someone create a webpage dedicated to a shtetl/town, and in this way
honour and memorialize the Jewish community that once lived there with
a most valuable resource for future generations of their descendants.

Susana Leistner Bloch, Coordinator
JewishGen ShtetLinks Project


Zelechover #general

mark
 

Dear genners. I got an information that there was or still is a community of those
who lived in Zelechov, Poland. Maybe somebody knows how to contact these people?
Wajsenberg Mark
Israel
mark306@bezeqint.net


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Zelechover #general

mark
 

Dear genners. I got an information that there was or still is a community of those
who lived in Zelechov, Poland. Maybe somebody knows how to contact these people?
Wajsenberg Mark
Israel
mark306@bezeqint.net


HTML volunteers needed for the ShtetLinks Project #unitedkingdom

Susana Leistner Bloch
 

We have received messages >from people who have significant material
about their ancestral town/shtetl and would like to create a webpage
dedicated to the Jewish community that once lived there. Unfortunately
they do not have the necessary HTML skills to create a webpage.

Our webpages are Cyberspace Yizkor Books. Just as the former residents
and survivors of a shtetl took it upon themselves to record all they
could remember and publish a Yizkor Book in memory of the Jewish
community that once lived there, so we, the next generation, should
make sure that whatever we have, every little bit of information that
sheds light on the lives of our people, is recorded and preserved.
The people who published Yizkor Books usually were in contact with
others living in the same town or country. Contact with their landsmen
in other countries was difficult. To us, in the 21st century, there
are no limitations. Cyberspace has opened up the world to us.

What is the time commitment? After the initial design of the webpage
maintenance is not too time consuming: just occasionally adding new
material and fixing broken links. ShtetLinks will provide, if
requested, a template to be used as a "guide" to creating a webpage
and we will guide you through the process.

If you have the necessary skills we urge you to volunteer and help
someone create a webpage dedicated to a shtetl/town, and in this way
honour and memorialize the Jewish community that once lived there with
a most valuable resource for future generations of their descendants.

Susana Leistner Bloch, Coordinator
JewishGen ShtetLinks Project


JCR-UK SIG #UnitedKingdom HTML volunteers needed for the ShtetLinks Project #unitedkingdom

Susana Leistner Bloch
 

We have received messages >from people who have significant material
about their ancestral town/shtetl and would like to create a webpage
dedicated to the Jewish community that once lived there. Unfortunately
they do not have the necessary HTML skills to create a webpage.

Our webpages are Cyberspace Yizkor Books. Just as the former residents
and survivors of a shtetl took it upon themselves to record all they
could remember and publish a Yizkor Book in memory of the Jewish
community that once lived there, so we, the next generation, should
make sure that whatever we have, every little bit of information that
sheds light on the lives of our people, is recorded and preserved.
The people who published Yizkor Books usually were in contact with
others living in the same town or country. Contact with their landsmen
in other countries was difficult. To us, in the 21st century, there
are no limitations. Cyberspace has opened up the world to us.

What is the time commitment? After the initial design of the webpage
maintenance is not too time consuming: just occasionally adding new
material and fixing broken links. ShtetLinks will provide, if
requested, a template to be used as a "guide" to creating a webpage
and we will guide you through the process.

If you have the necessary skills we urge you to volunteer and help
someone create a webpage dedicated to a shtetl/town, and in this way
honour and memorialize the Jewish community that once lived there with
a most valuable resource for future generations of their descendants.

Susana Leistner Bloch, Coordinator
JewishGen ShtetLinks Project


HTML volunteers needed for the ShtetLinks Project #poland #warsaw

Susana Leistner Bloch
 

We have received messages >from people who have significant material
about their ancestral town/shtetl and would like to create a webpage
dedicated to the Jewish community that once lived there. Unfortunately
they do not have the necessary HTML skills to create a webpage.

Our webpages are Cyberspace Yizkor Books. Just as the former residents
and survivors of a shtetl took it upon themselves to record all they
could remember and publish a Yizkor Book in memory of the Jewish
community that once lived there, so we, the next generation, should
make sure that whatever we have, every little bit of information that
sheds light on the lives of our people, is recorded and preserved.
The people who published Yizkor Books usually were in contact with
others living in the same town or country. Contact with their landsmen
in other countries was difficult. To us, in the 21st century, there
are no limitations. Cyberspace has opened up the world to us.

What is the time commitment? After the initial design of the webpage
maintenance is not too time consuming: just occasionally adding new
material and fixing broken links. ShtetLinks will provide, if
requested, a template to be used as a "guide" to creating a webpage
and we will guide you through the process.

If you have the necessary skills we urge you to volunteer and help
someone create a webpage dedicated to a shtetl/town, and in this way
honour and memorialize the Jewish community that once lived there with
a most valuable resource for future generations of their descendants.

Susana Leistner Bloch, Coordinator
JewishGen ShtetLinks Project


Warszawa Research Group #Warsaw #Poland HTML volunteers needed for the ShtetLinks Project #poland #warsaw

Susana Leistner Bloch
 

We have received messages >from people who have significant material
about their ancestral town/shtetl and would like to create a webpage
dedicated to the Jewish community that once lived there. Unfortunately
they do not have the necessary HTML skills to create a webpage.

Our webpages are Cyberspace Yizkor Books. Just as the former residents
and survivors of a shtetl took it upon themselves to record all they
could remember and publish a Yizkor Book in memory of the Jewish
community that once lived there, so we, the next generation, should
make sure that whatever we have, every little bit of information that
sheds light on the lives of our people, is recorded and preserved.
The people who published Yizkor Books usually were in contact with
others living in the same town or country. Contact with their landsmen
in other countries was difficult. To us, in the 21st century, there
are no limitations. Cyberspace has opened up the world to us.

What is the time commitment? After the initial design of the webpage
maintenance is not too time consuming: just occasionally adding new
material and fixing broken links. ShtetLinks will provide, if
requested, a template to be used as a "guide" to creating a webpage
and we will guide you through the process.

If you have the necessary skills we urge you to volunteer and help
someone create a webpage dedicated to a shtetl/town, and in this way
honour and memorialize the Jewish community that once lived there with
a most valuable resource for future generations of their descendants.

Susana Leistner Bloch, Coordinator
JewishGen ShtetLinks Project


SZCZUCZYNER / SZCZECINER #poland #warsaw

Avraham Y. K. <435.gavea@...>
 

Looking for info on the family Szejdel Hendl Szczuczyner z"l and her
sister Malka Dwojra Szczuczyner z"l.
They are likely to have been born in the 1840s generation. The former
married to Yaakov Itzchak (Jacob Icek) Kano z"l, in Wiskit. The latter
is said to have been born in Warszaw and married to Dawid Hersz
Horchstein z"l, also born in Warszaw.

I see an entry on JRI for Szejna Handel SZCZECINER, born in 1846,
microfilm 730208, >from Wyszogrod, Plock Gubernia / Warszawa Province.

This is very likely to be her, I wonder if anyone can give lead me to
anything else about her.

Thank you in advance,
Avraham Yehoshua Kahana,
Rio de Janeiro,
Brazil

Seeking:
Poland (Zychlin, Wiskitki, Warszawa), Lithuania/Belarus/surroundings:
KANO (KAHANA), SZCZUCZYNIER, SOCHACZEWSKI, SKROBEK, TZUKERKORN,
HORCHSTEIN, RAIDZWILLER

Romania, Moldova (Chisinau[Kishinev], Calarasi[Kalarash]):
GIVERTS, ROSEMARIN, FRAIMAN

Ukraine (Sokiryany[Secureni], Ozeve[Ojeva], Briceva[Brischev]):
SCHECHTMAN, TSIPERSTEIN, BERENSTEIN, KOIFMAN, TRACHTENBERG, VAISENBERG, BARAFF

Remote connections, still of my interest:
Romania, Ukraine:
BRANDT, SHOIKHET, GUN, LAZAROVITZ


More on SZCZUCZYNER / SZCZECINER #poland #warsaw

Avraham Y. K. <435.gavea@...>
 

Interestingly enough, I'm not sure if I was aware of the following before, but:

There is one entry for Malka Dwojra z"l in the same Plock Gubernia /
Warszawa Province (records in Fond 106 in Warszawa Archive Pultusk
Branch), this time for Przasnysz. It's a death record and it states
she died in 1878. Could be.

SZCZUCINER Icek Majer 1867 D 65

Also, there's another death record, >from the same archive, for Icek
Majer z"l , stating he died on 1867. Malka Dwojra had a son named Icek
Majer born in 1866.

SZCZUCINER Malka Dwojra 1878 D 72


Again, please advise if any additional info is at your hands.

Thank you in advance,
Avraham Yehoshua Kahana,
Rio de Janeiro,
Brazil

Seeking:
Poland (Zychlin, Wiskitki, Warszawa), Lithuania/Belarus/surroundings:
KANO (KAHANA), SZCZUCZYNIER, SOCHACZEWSKI, SKROBEK, TZUKERKORN,
HORCHSTEIN, RAIDZWILLER

Romania, Moldova (Chisinau[Kishinev], Calarasi[Kalarash]):
GIVERTS, ROSEMARIN, FRAIMAN

Ukraine (Sokiryany[Secureni], Ozeve[Ojeva], Briceva[Brischev]):
SCHECHTMAN, TSIPERSTEIN, BERENSTEIN, KOIFMAN, TRACHTENBERG, VAISENBERG, BARAFF

Remote connections, still of my interest:
Romania, Ukraine:
BRANDT, SHOIKHET, GUN, LAZAROVITZ


Warszawa Research Group #Warsaw #Poland SZCZUCZYNER / SZCZECINER #poland #warsaw

Avraham Y. K. <435.gavea@...>
 

Looking for info on the family Szejdel Hendl Szczuczyner z"l and her
sister Malka Dwojra Szczuczyner z"l.
They are likely to have been born in the 1840s generation. The former
married to Yaakov Itzchak (Jacob Icek) Kano z"l, in Wiskit. The latter
is said to have been born in Warszaw and married to Dawid Hersz
Horchstein z"l, also born in Warszaw.

I see an entry on JRI for Szejna Handel SZCZECINER, born in 1846,
microfilm 730208, >from Wyszogrod, Plock Gubernia / Warszawa Province.

This is very likely to be her, I wonder if anyone can give lead me to
anything else about her.

Thank you in advance,
Avraham Yehoshua Kahana,
Rio de Janeiro,
Brazil

Seeking:
Poland (Zychlin, Wiskitki, Warszawa), Lithuania/Belarus/surroundings:
KANO (KAHANA), SZCZUCZYNIER, SOCHACZEWSKI, SKROBEK, TZUKERKORN,
HORCHSTEIN, RAIDZWILLER

Romania, Moldova (Chisinau[Kishinev], Calarasi[Kalarash]):
GIVERTS, ROSEMARIN, FRAIMAN

Ukraine (Sokiryany[Secureni], Ozeve[Ojeva], Briceva[Brischev]):
SCHECHTMAN, TSIPERSTEIN, BERENSTEIN, KOIFMAN, TRACHTENBERG, VAISENBERG, BARAFF

Remote connections, still of my interest:
Romania, Ukraine:
BRANDT, SHOIKHET, GUN, LAZAROVITZ


Warszawa Research Group #Warsaw #Poland More on SZCZUCZYNER / SZCZECINER #warsaw #poland

Avraham Y. K. <435.gavea@...>
 

Interestingly enough, I'm not sure if I was aware of the following before, but:

There is one entry for Malka Dwojra z"l in the same Plock Gubernia /
Warszawa Province (records in Fond 106 in Warszawa Archive Pultusk
Branch), this time for Przasnysz. It's a death record and it states
she died in 1878. Could be.

SZCZUCINER Icek Majer 1867 D 65

Also, there's another death record, >from the same archive, for Icek
Majer z"l , stating he died on 1867. Malka Dwojra had a son named Icek
Majer born in 1866.

SZCZUCINER Malka Dwojra 1878 D 72


Again, please advise if any additional info is at your hands.

Thank you in advance,
Avraham Yehoshua Kahana,
Rio de Janeiro,
Brazil

Seeking:
Poland (Zychlin, Wiskitki, Warszawa), Lithuania/Belarus/surroundings:
KANO (KAHANA), SZCZUCZYNIER, SOCHACZEWSKI, SKROBEK, TZUKERKORN,
HORCHSTEIN, RAIDZWILLER

Romania, Moldova (Chisinau[Kishinev], Calarasi[Kalarash]):
GIVERTS, ROSEMARIN, FRAIMAN

Ukraine (Sokiryany[Secureni], Ozeve[Ojeva], Briceva[Brischev]):
SCHECHTMAN, TSIPERSTEIN, BERENSTEIN, KOIFMAN, TRACHTENBERG, VAISENBERG, BARAFF

Remote connections, still of my interest:
Romania, Ukraine:
BRANDT, SHOIKHET, GUN, LAZAROVITZ


Translation Request re. Gerlai Arnold #hungary

Vivian Kahn
 

Thanks to everyone who offered translations of the material I posted.
The consensus is that the entry states that GERLAI Arnold Gusztav
supervised publication of the professional bibliography of the
technical literature on the Hungarian forestry industry (including
hunting and lumber industries) >from the start until 1934.

This doesn't conflict (or confirm) information I found that GERLAI
Arnold, who was living in Debrecen in 1945, was an official or civil
servant of some kind and had a son Tamas b. Budapest 1937 and was
previously married to Margit REINER b. Budszentmihaly 1903 who was
presumed murdered at Auschwitz.

Is it possible to locate Budapest birth records recording his marriage
in about 1949 to Piroska MARKUS VERO, the mother of my second cousin
Mariska? In 1945 they were living at the same address in Debrecen. I know that Piroska's second husband had a son. Could this be more that a coincidence?

Vivian Kahn, Oakland, CA
vkahn@kmort.com
http://web.mac.com/lmort/Vivian_Kahn_Family_Website/Home_Page.html


Researching:
ADLER/Sighet, Giulesti, Rom. (Maramarossziget, Gyulafalva, Hun.)
BAL/BERKOVICS/BERKOWITZ/ROTH/Orasu Nou, Rom. (Ujvaros,
Hung.); Seini, Rom. (Szinervaralja, Hun), Vamfalu, Hung. (Vama, Rom.)
FERBER/Sajoszentpeter, Hun, Netanya, Israel
FRIEDMAN/Sighet, Oradea, Satu Mare, Rom.
GROSZ/Orasu Nou, Rom., Szatmar megye, Hung.
GRUNVALD/Humenne, Slov.
KAHAN/Sighet, Rom.(Maramarossziget, Hun)
KOHN/Zebegnyo, Tarnoka, Zemplen, Hun. ,(Zbehnov, Trnvka, Slov.),
Cleveland
KORNIS/Miskolc, Hung.
LEFKOVICS/Zemplen megye, Hung.
MARKUS/Sepsiszentgyorgy, Hung. (Sfante Gheorghu, Rom)
MOSKOVITS/MOSKOWITZ/MOSS, Ostrov (Kisozstro), Sobrance, Michalovce,
Cleveland
NEUMANN/Sobrance, Michalovce, Kereszt (Kristy, Slov.)
POLACSEK/Sobrance
ROSENBLUM/Oradea, Satu Mare, Rom.
ROSENBERG/Ungvar (Uzhorod, Ukr.)
ROTH/Ujvaros, Hun. (Orasu Nou, Rom.
SIMKO/Kosice
VERO, WEISBERGER/Debrecen, Nyirbator
SEGAL/ZEGAL/Sziget (Sighet, Rom)
ZICHERMAN/Sobrance


Hungary SIG #Hungary Translation Request re. Gerlai Arnold #hungary

Vivian Kahn
 

Thanks to everyone who offered translations of the material I posted.
The consensus is that the entry states that GERLAI Arnold Gusztav
supervised publication of the professional bibliography of the
technical literature on the Hungarian forestry industry (including
hunting and lumber industries) >from the start until 1934.

This doesn't conflict (or confirm) information I found that GERLAI
Arnold, who was living in Debrecen in 1945, was an official or civil
servant of some kind and had a son Tamas b. Budapest 1937 and was
previously married to Margit REINER b. Budszentmihaly 1903 who was
presumed murdered at Auschwitz.

Is it possible to locate Budapest birth records recording his marriage
in about 1949 to Piroska MARKUS VERO, the mother of my second cousin
Mariska? In 1945 they were living at the same address in Debrecen. I know that Piroska's second husband had a son. Could this be more that a coincidence?

Vivian Kahn, Oakland, CA
vkahn@kmort.com
http://web.mac.com/lmort/Vivian_Kahn_Family_Website/Home_Page.html


Researching:
ADLER/Sighet, Giulesti, Rom. (Maramarossziget, Gyulafalva, Hun.)
BAL/BERKOVICS/BERKOWITZ/ROTH/Orasu Nou, Rom. (Ujvaros,
Hung.); Seini, Rom. (Szinervaralja, Hun), Vamfalu, Hung. (Vama, Rom.)
FERBER/Sajoszentpeter, Hun, Netanya, Israel
FRIEDMAN/Sighet, Oradea, Satu Mare, Rom.
GROSZ/Orasu Nou, Rom., Szatmar megye, Hung.
GRUNVALD/Humenne, Slov.
KAHAN/Sighet, Rom.(Maramarossziget, Hun)
KOHN/Zebegnyo, Tarnoka, Zemplen, Hun. ,(Zbehnov, Trnvka, Slov.),
Cleveland
KORNIS/Miskolc, Hung.
LEFKOVICS/Zemplen megye, Hung.
MARKUS/Sepsiszentgyorgy, Hung. (Sfante Gheorghu, Rom)
MOSKOVITS/MOSKOWITZ/MOSS, Ostrov (Kisozstro), Sobrance, Michalovce,
Cleveland
NEUMANN/Sobrance, Michalovce, Kereszt (Kristy, Slov.)
POLACSEK/Sobrance
ROSENBLUM/Oradea, Satu Mare, Rom.
ROSENBERG/Ungvar (Uzhorod, Ukr.)
ROTH/Ujvaros, Hun. (Orasu Nou, Rom.
SIMKO/Kosice
VERO, WEISBERGER/Debrecen, Nyirbator
SEGAL/ZEGAL/Sziget (Sighet, Rom)
ZICHERMAN/Sobrance


Jewish Cemetary Pictures Sidon, Lebanon #general

Ben Forman <ben.forman@...>
 

Hi Genners

I just found this website about the Jewish community of Lebanon
http://thejewsoflebanon.org/me/index.php Which has some pictures taken in the
Jewish cemetary in Sidon http://thejewsoflebanon.org/me/?m200711
There is a story acocmpanying it http://thejewsoflebanon.org/me/?p221

Hope they are useful

Ben
Ben Forman
Manchester UK

searching: BERNSTEIN/WEINER: Ylakai/Skuodas,Lithuania; CAHN/WOLF: Koeln/Bruhl;
FURMAN: Kaluszyn; GEVER: Daugavpils/Dvinsk, Latvia; SAWADY: Zavadi,Posen;
STILLMAN: Pilica/Czestechowa; ZEYDER/ZEIDER: Kursan, Lithuania


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Jewish Cemetary Pictures Sidon, Lebanon #general

Ben Forman <ben.forman@...>
 

Hi Genners

I just found this website about the Jewish community of Lebanon
http://thejewsoflebanon.org/me/index.php Which has some pictures taken in the
Jewish cemetary in Sidon http://thejewsoflebanon.org/me/?m200711
There is a story acocmpanying it http://thejewsoflebanon.org/me/?p221

Hope they are useful

Ben
Ben Forman
Manchester UK

searching: BERNSTEIN/WEINER: Ylakai/Skuodas,Lithuania; CAHN/WOLF: Koeln/Bruhl;
FURMAN: Kaluszyn; GEVER: Daugavpils/Dvinsk, Latvia; SAWADY: Zavadi,Posen;
STILLMAN: Pilica/Czestechowa; ZEYDER/ZEIDER: Kursan, Lithuania