Date   

Re: Jewish Id Card - Shoah related #general

Ann Rabinowitz <annrab@...>
 

Whilst I cannot read either the Hungarian or Russian in which this ID Card
is printed, I do know that the Russians occupied Hungary in October, 1944.
This appears to be an ID Card issued on December 24, 1944, to Pal Kovaces.
The left side is in Hungarian and the right side is in Russian.

This ID Card may not have been for a Jewish person at all. During December,
1944, Germans in Szeged were rounded up for deportation and this may have
been an ID Card for one of those individuals or for a non-Jewish Hungarian
citizen of Szeged.

Ann Rabinowitz
annrab@...


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen RE: Jewish Id Card - Shoah related #general

Ann Rabinowitz <annrab@...>
 

Whilst I cannot read either the Hungarian or Russian in which this ID Card
is printed, I do know that the Russians occupied Hungary in October, 1944.
This appears to be an ID Card issued on December 24, 1944, to Pal Kovaces.
The left side is in Hungarian and the right side is in Russian.

This ID Card may not have been for a Jewish person at all. During December,
1944, Germans in Szeged were rounded up for deportation and this may have
been an ID Card for one of those individuals or for a non-Jewish Hungarian
citizen of Szeged.

Ann Rabinowitz
annrab@...


surname PHILLYSS #general

Adrian Freedman
 

Dear Colleagues
In the 1910 U S census for family HERZBERG living in San Fransisco,
there is an elderly gentleman staying with them by the name "Abraham
PHILLYSS"

In your opinion is PHILLYSS a recognized Jewish (or non Jewish)
Surname or could it have been transcribed incorrectly?

As far as I am aware the origin of the HERZBERG family is Lithuanian
and the Maiden Name of the Wife was SCHMULIAN

I am enclosing an extract >from the census document

Household Gender Age
Bernard Herzberg M 42y
Spouse Fannie Herzberg F 40y
Child Samuel A Herzberg M 18y
Abraham Phillyss M 76y

Sincerely

Adrian Freedman
SCHMULIAN DWOLATZKY, Zagare
BLUM FREEDMAN FREEMAN Dublin


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen surname PHILLYSS #general

Adrian Freedman
 

Dear Colleagues
In the 1910 U S census for family HERZBERG living in San Fransisco,
there is an elderly gentleman staying with them by the name "Abraham
PHILLYSS"

In your opinion is PHILLYSS a recognized Jewish (or non Jewish)
Surname or could it have been transcribed incorrectly?

As far as I am aware the origin of the HERZBERG family is Lithuanian
and the Maiden Name of the Wife was SCHMULIAN

I am enclosing an extract >from the census document

Household Gender Age
Bernard Herzberg M 42y
Spouse Fannie Herzberg F 40y
Child Samuel A Herzberg M 18y
Abraham Phillyss M 76y

Sincerely

Adrian Freedman
SCHMULIAN DWOLATZKY, Zagare
BLUM FREEDMAN FREEMAN Dublin


Rav Schlesinger and Rabbi Teichtal HY"D #rabbinic

Bernard Weill
 

Would like to know what the relationship between Rabbi Teichtal (author of Aim
Habonim Semaicha) and Rabbi Yechezkel Schlesinger of Topolcany was. Were they
brothers-in-law? The sefer Aim Habonim Semaicha mentions the relationship
however I did not understand it.

Bernard Weill
Researching on Weill in Topolcany


Rabbinic Genealogy SIG #Rabbinic Rav Schlesinger and Rabbi Teichtal HY"D #rabbinic

Bernard Weill
 

Would like to know what the relationship between Rabbi Teichtal (author of Aim
Habonim Semaicha) and Rabbi Yechezkel Schlesinger of Topolcany was. Were they
brothers-in-law? The sefer Aim Habonim Semaicha mentions the relationship
however I did not understand it.

Bernard Weill
Researching on Weill in Topolcany


Re: UCHITEL #rabbinic

Rosalind
 

I used to know a female dr, Dr Utchitel.
I understand that it means teacher.This is what I remember her telling me.
She was a Russian immigrant to Israel about 10 years ago.
Ros Romem

----- Original Message -----

From: Merrill Weber <merrilleweber@...>
Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 18:41:00 -0800 (PST)

My wife's family, named UCHITEL, originated in Brailov, Podolsky
Guberniya, in Ukraine. We recently listened to a recording of her
grandfather >from the early 1970s, and he reported that his ancestors
took the name Uchitel because the name means "rabbi" in Russian and
they were descended >from a line of rabbis and preachers. I have not
been able to find any history of rabbis named Uchitel and I wonder
whether anyone else has any thoughts about this.


Rabbinic Genealogy SIG #Rabbinic Re: UCHITEL #rabbinic

Rosalind
 

I used to know a female dr, Dr Utchitel.
I understand that it means teacher.This is what I remember her telling me.
She was a Russian immigrant to Israel about 10 years ago.
Ros Romem

----- Original Message -----

From: Merrill Weber <merrilleweber@...>
Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 18:41:00 -0800 (PST)

My wife's family, named UCHITEL, originated in Brailov, Podolsky
Guberniya, in Ukraine. We recently listened to a recording of her
grandfather >from the early 1970s, and he reported that his ancestors
took the name Uchitel because the name means "rabbi" in Russian and
they were descended >from a line of rabbis and preachers. I have not
been able to find any history of rabbis named Uchitel and I wonder
whether anyone else has any thoughts about this.


Questionable relationship given for destination listed on manifest #general

Howard Margol
 

The various shipping lines had agents who prepared their passengers for
entry into the USA. They emphasized that coming to a relative in the USA
would make it less likely they would be refused entry if they were coming to
the USA with no relative living there, and no visible means of support. There
were exceptions, of course, but it was thought that a relative would
support the arriving immigrants and the immigrants would not end up being
supported by the government.

A husband and father would be a much closer relative than a cousin or a
friend. No attempt was made to check on the claimed relationship. It is
possible the immigrants in question were related or just someone doing a favor
to an immigrant >from their home town.

Further research is needed in order to find out the facts or true
relationship.

Howard Margol
Atlanta, Georgia

From: Shoshana Kahan <lilishoshana@...>
Does anyone have experience with a passenger record that incorrectly
states the relationship between the passenger and the person he/she
lists as his destination?


Latvia, Riga search #general

Al Katznelson
 

Hi all!
After getting report >from Latvian state historical archives I would
like to get some extra info (I feel there is a bit). Would like to get
ideas(privatelly) how to hire a genealogist in Riga, Latvia for
further search. Anybody with any expirience would be greatly
appreciated. Pls, drop a line if you will have anything to say.
TIA,
Al Katznelson,
Moscow, RF


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Questionable relationship given for destination listed on manifest #general

Howard Margol
 

The various shipping lines had agents who prepared their passengers for
entry into the USA. They emphasized that coming to a relative in the USA
would make it less likely they would be refused entry if they were coming to
the USA with no relative living there, and no visible means of support. There
were exceptions, of course, but it was thought that a relative would
support the arriving immigrants and the immigrants would not end up being
supported by the government.

A husband and father would be a much closer relative than a cousin or a
friend. No attempt was made to check on the claimed relationship. It is
possible the immigrants in question were related or just someone doing a favor
to an immigrant >from their home town.

Further research is needed in order to find out the facts or true
relationship.

Howard Margol
Atlanta, Georgia

From: Shoshana Kahan <lilishoshana@...>
Does anyone have experience with a passenger record that incorrectly
states the relationship between the passenger and the person he/she
lists as his destination?


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Latvia, Riga search #general

Al Katznelson
 

Hi all!
After getting report >from Latvian state historical archives I would
like to get some extra info (I feel there is a bit). Would like to get
ideas(privatelly) how to hire a genealogist in Riga, Latvia for
further search. Anybody with any expirience would be greatly
appreciated. Pls, drop a line if you will have anything to say.
TIA,
Al Katznelson,
Moscow, RF


Gravestone photos from New Montefiore Cemetery, NY state; finding a grave in the database despite surname misspelling #general

Linda Mar <lindarosemar@...>
 

Dear Genners,

I am requesting a photo of two (or three) burial stones located in
the New Montefiore Cemetery at 1180 Wellwood Ave. - West Babylon, NY
(Nassau County, New York state).

I have the locations of the graves thanks to the new online Montefiore
database - and thanks to Steve Lasky for alerting us to it, and am
assuming that there are stones to find.

Two of the deceased are husband and wife and are buried in adjacent
graves, so this may mean only one stone. The other stone is in a
different section.

BTW - the name of the husband was misindexed - four-letter surname
(Taub) was indexed as "Taum" and the path or row # was missing >from
his entry. But because his age and date of death matched other
information that I had obtained, I was certain it was him. In
addition, his wife was buried in what looked like a possibly-adjacent
grave. A call to the cemetery office confirmed my guesses. Steve
Lasky is right: we need to use every bit of information at our
disposal. I found his entry by searching for him by his first name
only plus month and year of death >from the Social Security Death
Index.

If you can help, please contact me first for the references (and to
avoid duplication of effort). Your help would be much appreciated.
And needless to say with holidays approaching - no rush.

Many thanks,

Linda Rose Mar
Sunnyvale, California

Researching CHIRURG (>from Lithuania); SCHNIT(ZER) (>from Lithuania
or nearby); KLOSS/KLASS (>from Obeliai, Lithuania); COMRAS (>from
Lithuania); ROSENBERG (>from Oleksandria, near Rivne, Ukraine);
DORFMAN (>from Rivne, Ukraine)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Gravestone photos from New Montefiore Cemetery, NY state; finding a grave in the database despite surname misspelling #general

Linda Mar <lindarosemar@...>
 

Dear Genners,

I am requesting a photo of two (or three) burial stones located in
the New Montefiore Cemetery at 1180 Wellwood Ave. - West Babylon, NY
(Nassau County, New York state).

I have the locations of the graves thanks to the new online Montefiore
database - and thanks to Steve Lasky for alerting us to it, and am
assuming that there are stones to find.

Two of the deceased are husband and wife and are buried in adjacent
graves, so this may mean only one stone. The other stone is in a
different section.

BTW - the name of the husband was misindexed - four-letter surname
(Taub) was indexed as "Taum" and the path or row # was missing >from
his entry. But because his age and date of death matched other
information that I had obtained, I was certain it was him. In
addition, his wife was buried in what looked like a possibly-adjacent
grave. A call to the cemetery office confirmed my guesses. Steve
Lasky is right: we need to use every bit of information at our
disposal. I found his entry by searching for him by his first name
only plus month and year of death >from the Social Security Death
Index.

If you can help, please contact me first for the references (and to
avoid duplication of effort). Your help would be much appreciated.
And needless to say with holidays approaching - no rush.

Many thanks,

Linda Rose Mar
Sunnyvale, California

Researching CHIRURG (>from Lithuania); SCHNIT(ZER) (>from Lithuania
or nearby); KLOSS/KLASS (>from Obeliai, Lithuania); COMRAS (>from
Lithuania); ROSENBERG (>from Oleksandria, near Rivne, Ukraine);
DORFMAN (>from Rivne, Ukraine)


Re: Children assuming the surname of the mother #galicia

Mark Halpern <willie46@...>
 

I operated the JRI-Poland AGAD ordering system for a number of
years and have seen thousands of Galician records covering the
period >from early 1800s through 1905 as well as some later records.
In my experience with these Galician records, the recording of the
information was anything but consistent. The information varied
from town to town, >from period to period, and >from registrar to
registrar (in the same town).

I am sure that Stephen recognized some kind of trend in the death
records that he saw for children. However, I do not think any
conclusions can be drawn >from this data. I think that the age of the
child had nothing to do with whether the child carried his/her
mother's or father's surname.

I am sure you will find many examples of children's death records
where the parents did not have a civil marriage where the father's
surname was used. Also, you will find many examples of children's
death records where the parents did have a civil marriage and still
the mother's surname was used.

What I am suggesting is that the recording of a surname on a child's
birth or death record is not enough evidence to determine whether
or not his/her parents had a civil marriage before the birth.

Mark Halpern
AGAD Archive Coordinator
JRI-Poland

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen Weinstein" <stephenweinstein@...>

I do not think the determination of what name to use for children
was strictly a matter of whether the parents were married
correctly. The age of the children seems to have been a part of it.
In looking at death records for one location, I noticed that
children who died very young (between birth and the age of 4)
were listed with their mother's maiden name, even if their
surviving siblings had already been listed on birth records with
their father's last name.


Re: questionable relationship on manifest #general

Shoshana Kahan <lilishoshana@...>
 

Thanks again to everyone who wrote to me concerning my post about the
passenger record for someone who stated she was the wife of my
GGUncle, though it seemed he had to be married to someone else.
People shared several interesting stories of female ancestors who felt
compelled to claim a closer relationship with the male meeting her
than actually existed, stating she was a spouse or a daughter of
someone who was actually a brother or an uncle or a cousin. This
sometimes caused lasting confusion amongst the descendants. In my
case, I was very lucky: someone suggested that I check the detention
list of the manifest to see just who really did meet her at the dock.
Though it occurred to me that whoever met her might just have extended
the fiction that he was whoever she had claimed he was on the
manifest, in fact the detention list had a different name -- the name
of her actual husband. Lucky me! I am so glad to have that mystery
solved!

Once again, I learned so much more than I could have anticipated from
all of the responses I received!

Shoshana Kahan


Gesher Galicia SIG #Galicia Re: Children assuming the surname of the mother #galicia

Mark Halpern <willie46@...>
 

I operated the JRI-Poland AGAD ordering system for a number of
years and have seen thousands of Galician records covering the
period >from early 1800s through 1905 as well as some later records.
In my experience with these Galician records, the recording of the
information was anything but consistent. The information varied
from town to town, >from period to period, and >from registrar to
registrar (in the same town).

I am sure that Stephen recognized some kind of trend in the death
records that he saw for children. However, I do not think any
conclusions can be drawn >from this data. I think that the age of the
child had nothing to do with whether the child carried his/her
mother's or father's surname.

I am sure you will find many examples of children's death records
where the parents did not have a civil marriage where the father's
surname was used. Also, you will find many examples of children's
death records where the parents did have a civil marriage and still
the mother's surname was used.

What I am suggesting is that the recording of a surname on a child's
birth or death record is not enough evidence to determine whether
or not his/her parents had a civil marriage before the birth.

Mark Halpern
AGAD Archive Coordinator
JRI-Poland

----- Original Message -----
From: "Stephen Weinstein" <stephenweinstein@...>

I do not think the determination of what name to use for children
was strictly a matter of whether the parents were married
correctly. The age of the children seems to have been a part of it.
In looking at death records for one location, I noticed that
children who died very young (between birth and the age of 4)
were listed with their mother's maiden name, even if their
surviving siblings had already been listed on birth records with
their father's last name.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: questionable relationship on manifest #general

Shoshana Kahan <lilishoshana@...>
 

Thanks again to everyone who wrote to me concerning my post about the
passenger record for someone who stated she was the wife of my
GGUncle, though it seemed he had to be married to someone else.
People shared several interesting stories of female ancestors who felt
compelled to claim a closer relationship with the male meeting her
than actually existed, stating she was a spouse or a daughter of
someone who was actually a brother or an uncle or a cousin. This
sometimes caused lasting confusion amongst the descendants. In my
case, I was very lucky: someone suggested that I check the detention
list of the manifest to see just who really did meet her at the dock.
Though it occurred to me that whoever met her might just have extended
the fiction that he was whoever she had claimed he was on the
manifest, in fact the detention list had a different name -- the name
of her actual husband. Lucky me! I am so glad to have that mystery
solved!

Once again, I learned so much more than I could have anticipated from
all of the responses I received!

Shoshana Kahan


EFRON (EPHRON, AFFRON, etc.) One name study draft on internet #general

Jim Yarin
 

If you have a genealogical interest or connection to any family with the
name EFRON, EFFRON, EPHRON, AFFRON, the Jewish HEFFRONs, etc., have a look
at my Google Site page:

https://sites.google.com/site/efronfamilyhistory/

Here you will find my one-name study of EFRON (and variants) families,
although still in draft form. I have created family trees and genealogical
information for every family that bears this name. It took me more than 15
years to get this far.

The information is presented in two formats: 1. Volumes I and II look at the
earliest generations, with discussions about the origins of each family and
analysis of how they might or might not connect with other branches, and 2.
Volume III has computer-generated descendent charts showing all known
relatives, right up to the current generations (if known) and an index that
encompasses all families.

Volume IV of the genealogy contains appendixes with all references
identified in Volumes I and II.

Finally, Volume V contains the original source documents which generated
many of the entries in the Appendixes.

I have many things left to do, but now that I have this draft on the
internet, I can work with others easily to improve the content and form of
this material.

Jim Yarin
Acton, MA, USA


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen EFRON (EPHRON, AFFRON, etc.) One name study draft on internet #general

Jim Yarin
 

If you have a genealogical interest or connection to any family with the
name EFRON, EFFRON, EPHRON, AFFRON, the Jewish HEFFRONs, etc., have a look
at my Google Site page:

https://sites.google.com/site/efronfamilyhistory/

Here you will find my one-name study of EFRON (and variants) families,
although still in draft form. I have created family trees and genealogical
information for every family that bears this name. It took me more than 15
years to get this far.

The information is presented in two formats: 1. Volumes I and II look at the
earliest generations, with discussions about the origins of each family and
analysis of how they might or might not connect with other branches, and 2.
Volume III has computer-generated descendent charts showing all known
relatives, right up to the current generations (if known) and an index that
encompasses all families.

Volume IV of the genealogy contains appendixes with all references
identified in Volumes I and II.

Finally, Volume V contains the original source documents which generated
many of the entries in the Appendixes.

I have many things left to do, but now that I have this draft on the
internet, I can work with others easily to improve the content and form of
this material.

Jim Yarin
Acton, MA, USA