Date   

Re: Question about Religious vs. Civil Marriages in New York #general

A. E. Jordan
 

From: Risa.Becker@gfk.com
"Was it common at that time in NYC to have a religious marriage prior to a
civil ceremony? And if so, why. didn't the religious ceremony count legally?"

First I would ask did you check the actual 1906 certificate? Some times the
index is wrong on the dates. Also read the certificate to see if it shows
that the report was delayed ... it should say when and where the marriage
took place.

It would not be common for a civil ceremony to be performed after the
religious one in New York City in 1905/1906. Maybe the 1905 or earlier
ceremony was not in New York -- or even the USA --- and for some reason the
couple felt they needed to document the marriage on paper in New York in 1906.

What we more typically find is a civil ceremony first months earlier and it
seems like the family or whatever then convinces the couple that they needed
to redo it with a religious ceremony. You can tell because the first one is
usually at the Municipal Building and performed by the City Clerk or Deputy
Clerk. I recently saw one (not Jewish) where the first marriage was performed
by a local elected official of some notoriety and a few months later they got
married in the church.

Allan Jordan


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Question about Religious vs. Civil Marriages in New York #general

A. E. Jordan
 

From: Risa.Becker@gfk.com
"Was it common at that time in NYC to have a religious marriage prior to a
civil ceremony? And if so, why. didn't the religious ceremony count legally?"

First I would ask did you check the actual 1906 certificate? Some times the
index is wrong on the dates. Also read the certificate to see if it shows
that the report was delayed ... it should say when and where the marriage
took place.

It would not be common for a civil ceremony to be performed after the
religious one in New York City in 1905/1906. Maybe the 1905 or earlier
ceremony was not in New York -- or even the USA --- and for some reason the
couple felt they needed to document the marriage on paper in New York in 1906.

What we more typically find is a civil ceremony first months earlier and it
seems like the family or whatever then convinces the couple that they needed
to redo it with a religious ceremony. You can tell because the first one is
usually at the Municipal Building and performed by the City Clerk or Deputy
Clerk. I recently saw one (not Jewish) where the first marriage was performed
by a local elected official of some notoriety and a few months later they got
married in the church.

Allan Jordan


Re: Different birthdates #general

A. E. Jordan
 

From: Rose Feldman:
"...when my mother said, don't put the year of birth on my tombstone. My
parents had a plot reserved near by. I asked why, and she answered -
how would it look if two sisters had the same year of birth..."

Generally my rule of thumb is to use the dates/ages that come >from the
earliest documents like births or census when they were infants. Parents
had less motivation to change the date of a 2 or 4 year old on the
census versus by the time they got to 15 and also could not remember
exactly when the child was born. But in general the census is not a
very reliable source of age.

Women also had a amazing talent of aging only 5 or 7 years between 10
year census intervals! I can not tell you how many times I have seen
that happen as you follow the paper trail ... even when the husband
ages a full 10 years.

Then to match Rose's story above .... one of my cousins told me how at
her mother's funeral one of my great aunts took her aside and told he
"Your mother was older than she said. You need to take two years off
her birth date because otherwise it will mess up with her sisters when
they die and are buried next to her." All the sisters had been deducing
two or three or four years I found on their records .... but I did not
have the heart to tell the cousin who was telling me this that her mother
according to the birth certificate I had found was still two years older
... the woman had cut a total of four off her age and the sisters only
told her about two of the years!

Allan Jordan


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Different birthdates #general

A. E. Jordan
 

From: Rose Feldman:
"...when my mother said, don't put the year of birth on my tombstone. My
parents had a plot reserved near by. I asked why, and she answered -
how would it look if two sisters had the same year of birth..."

Generally my rule of thumb is to use the dates/ages that come >from the
earliest documents like births or census when they were infants. Parents
had less motivation to change the date of a 2 or 4 year old on the
census versus by the time they got to 15 and also could not remember
exactly when the child was born. But in general the census is not a
very reliable source of age.

Women also had a amazing talent of aging only 5 or 7 years between 10
year census intervals! I can not tell you how many times I have seen
that happen as you follow the paper trail ... even when the husband
ages a full 10 years.

Then to match Rose's story above .... one of my cousins told me how at
her mother's funeral one of my great aunts took her aside and told he
"Your mother was older than she said. You need to take two years off
her birth date because otherwise it will mess up with her sisters when
they die and are buried next to her." All the sisters had been deducing
two or three or four years I found on their records .... but I did not
have the heart to tell the cousin who was telling me this that her mother
according to the birth certificate I had found was still two years older
... the woman had cut a total of four off her age and the sisters only
told her about two of the years!

Allan Jordan


Re: Question about Religious vs. Civil Marriages in New York #general

Shelley Mitchell
 

Risa Becker writes: "Was it common at that time in NYC to have a religious
marriage prior to a civil ceremony?"

When did they arrive in the US? Usually the issue is a foreign issue. In
Europe, many Jewish children were considered "illegitimate" because their
parents only had a religious ceremony. It's possible that when they arrived,
they either hadn't had a civil marriage or the civil marriage was just
recorded later. I'm pretty sure that once you have a religious marriage in
NYC, the officiator records the marriage with the local government office.

Shelley Mitchell
Searching most in Kolomea, Monastryska, Buczacz, and Radautz - TERNER, TOPF,
KONIGSBERG/KINIGSBERG, SCHONFELD, SCHWARZFELD, GOLDSCHEIN, GLASER.
Searching in Dubasari - MICHALOWSKTY.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Question about Religious vs. Civil Marriages in New York #general

Shelley Mitchell
 

Risa Becker writes: "Was it common at that time in NYC to have a religious
marriage prior to a civil ceremony?"

When did they arrive in the US? Usually the issue is a foreign issue. In
Europe, many Jewish children were considered "illegitimate" because their
parents only had a religious ceremony. It's possible that when they arrived,
they either hadn't had a civil marriage or the civil marriage was just
recorded later. I'm pretty sure that once you have a religious marriage in
NYC, the officiator records the marriage with the local government office.

Shelley Mitchell
Searching most in Kolomea, Monastryska, Buczacz, and Radautz - TERNER, TOPF,
KONIGSBERG/KINIGSBERG, SCHONFELD, SCHWARZFELD, GOLDSCHEIN, GLASER.
Searching in Dubasari - MICHALOWSKTY.


Russian Language Assistance #ukraine

Rochelle Gershenow
 

Back in 2011 I discovered a Page of Testimony for an Aba Khaikin in Priluki
in the Yad Vashem database. The address for his daughter, the submitter of
the testimony, was in Dnepropetrovsk. At the time I needed some help with
the address as I wished to send a letter. I sent an email to Ukraine SIG
and/or Jewish Gen Discussion List asking for assistance. A gentleman who
read my email contacted me and, not only helped with the address but also
helped me translate the letter into Russian, which was sent in August 2011.
It is now almost five years later and I just received an email >from a family
member of the woman to whom I wrote. Unfortunately, because of a computer
crash I no longer have the name nor the contact information of the person
who helped me. If this person reads this email, I would appreciate it if he
would contact me directly.

Rochelle Gershenow
Connecticut, USA

Searching: AGINSKY (Belarus); BERG (Galicia); CHAIKIN (Homyel, Belarus;
Priluki, Ukraine); COHEN (Galicia); FRUSHTICK (Galicia); GERIS/GERRISH
(Vitebsk GuberyniaBelarus/Latvia); GERSHONOWITZ (Lithuania; USA); LANGDORF
(Galicia); LUBINSKY (Lithuania); MERRIN (Belarus); PODNOS (Lithuania);
PURINSON/PURINZON (Priluki,Ukraine; Argentina; Brazil; Israel; USA);
SLONIMSKY/SLONIM (Minsk, Belarus; USA); SONDEK/SUNDOCK/SUNDACK (Janavole,
Borkhovo, Rezekne, and Ludza, Latvia; USA); SOKOLOVSKY (Priluki, Ukraine);
VILENSKY (Ukraine)


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Russian Language Assistance #ukraine

Rochelle Gershenow
 

Back in 2011 I discovered a Page of Testimony for an Aba Khaikin in Priluki
in the Yad Vashem database. The address for his daughter, the submitter of
the testimony, was in Dnepropetrovsk. At the time I needed some help with
the address as I wished to send a letter. I sent an email to Ukraine SIG
and/or Jewish Gen Discussion List asking for assistance. A gentleman who
read my email contacted me and, not only helped with the address but also
helped me translate the letter into Russian, which was sent in August 2011.
It is now almost five years later and I just received an email >from a family
member of the woman to whom I wrote. Unfortunately, because of a computer
crash I no longer have the name nor the contact information of the person
who helped me. If this person reads this email, I would appreciate it if he
would contact me directly.

Rochelle Gershenow
Connecticut, USA

Searching: AGINSKY (Belarus); BERG (Galicia); CHAIKIN (Homyel, Belarus;
Priluki, Ukraine); COHEN (Galicia); FRUSHTICK (Galicia); GERIS/GERRISH
(Vitebsk GuberyniaBelarus/Latvia); GERSHONOWITZ (Lithuania; USA); LANGDORF
(Galicia); LUBINSKY (Lithuania); MERRIN (Belarus); PODNOS (Lithuania);
PURINSON/PURINZON (Priluki,Ukraine; Argentina; Brazil; Israel; USA);
SLONIMSKY/SLONIM (Minsk, Belarus; USA); SONDEK/SUNDOCK/SUNDACK (Janavole,
Borkhovo, Rezekne, and Ludza, Latvia; USA); SOKOLOVSKY (Priluki, Ukraine);
VILENSKY (Ukraine)


The Conference Hotel is Almost Fully Booked #belarus

Chuck Weinstein <cmw521@...>
 

The Seattle Sheraton Hotel has booked all of the available rooms for the
Conference and has only a handful of deluxe rooms left. They are pricing
the deluxe rooms at $239 for Conference attendees. These rooms are
available at other times for $379 per night. Once these rooms are booked,
there will be no more room at the Conference Hotel.

We have made arrangements with the Hyatt Olive 8 hotel, about 4 blocks from
the Sheraton, for a limited number of rooms at $289 per night. Given that
the Conference coincides with the height of the tourism season, and there
are no other major hotels downtown with rooms available, this was the best
we could do. The Hyatt will give that rate to Conference attendees who use
the following link: https://aws.passkey.com/event/15080205/owner/69782/home.
The website is being updated to reflect that information.

As you can tell, Seattle is the place to be, August 7-12. Make your plans
to attend the Conference and reserve your space if you have not already done
so. And if you have not reserved your meals or banquet tickets, you should
do so soon before they sell out. Most of our computer labs have been
waitlisted, and we are arranging to add additional labs. We will not be
able to do that with the meals.

See you in Seattle!

Chuck Weinstein
Co-chair
36th Annual IAJGS Conference on Jewish Genealogy
August 7-12, 2016, Seattle WA
chuck@iajgs2016.org
www.iajgs2016.org
Like our Facebook Page at https://www.facebook.com/IAJGSConference?fref=ts


Belarus SIG #Belarus The Conference Hotel is Almost Fully Booked #belarus

Chuck Weinstein <cmw521@...>
 

The Seattle Sheraton Hotel has booked all of the available rooms for the
Conference and has only a handful of deluxe rooms left. They are pricing
the deluxe rooms at $239 for Conference attendees. These rooms are
available at other times for $379 per night. Once these rooms are booked,
there will be no more room at the Conference Hotel.

We have made arrangements with the Hyatt Olive 8 hotel, about 4 blocks from
the Sheraton, for a limited number of rooms at $289 per night. Given that
the Conference coincides with the height of the tourism season, and there
are no other major hotels downtown with rooms available, this was the best
we could do. The Hyatt will give that rate to Conference attendees who use
the following link: https://aws.passkey.com/event/15080205/owner/69782/home.
The website is being updated to reflect that information.

As you can tell, Seattle is the place to be, August 7-12. Make your plans
to attend the Conference and reserve your space if you have not already done
so. And if you have not reserved your meals or banquet tickets, you should
do so soon before they sell out. Most of our computer labs have been
waitlisted, and we are arranging to add additional labs. We will not be
able to do that with the meals.

See you in Seattle!

Chuck Weinstein
Co-chair
36th Annual IAJGS Conference on Jewish Genealogy
August 7-12, 2016, Seattle WA
chuck@iajgs2016.org
www.iajgs2016.org
Like our Facebook Page at https://www.facebook.com/IAJGSConference?fref=ts


Questions regarding last International Survivors' Conference and Nazi commanders Skarzysko #general

Malka
 

Hello Genders,

Does anybody know when was the last International Survivors' Conference that
was held in Tel Aviv, Israel? (6/1981?)

Does anybody know the name of one of the Nazi commanders at the Skarzysko
forced labor camp? In Hebrew it reads as 'Infling' but I found no such name
among the lists of names that I looked up.

Feel free to e-mail me at Malkachos@gmail.com.

Many thanks,
Malka Chosnek

MODERATOR NOTE: Please respond privately.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Questions regarding last International Survivors' Conference and Nazi commanders Skarzysko #general

Malka
 

Hello Genders,

Does anybody know when was the last International Survivors' Conference that
was held in Tel Aviv, Israel? (6/1981?)

Does anybody know the name of one of the Nazi commanders at the Skarzysko
forced labor camp? In Hebrew it reads as 'Infling' but I found no such name
among the lists of names that I looked up.

Feel free to e-mail me at Malkachos@gmail.com.

Many thanks,
Malka Chosnek

MODERATOR NOTE: Please respond privately.


Re: Minsk, Mozyr, Belarus info #general

Martha Forsyth
 

I have identified three HOFSTEIN clans >from the Minsk, Mozyr - Belarus
area. I know through a 23 and Me test they are all related. However,
all records I search seem to stop just at the point, about the early
1800s, that I need to look at to find the common ancestor(s) for all
three groups. I tried to contact those cities directly and all I get
is Russian emails I can't read. Any help, short of paying a fortune to
a researcher, is appreciated.

Eric Hofstein
Have you tried Google Translate on the emails? Also, www.translate.ru
is good for Russian.

Martha Schecter Forsyth


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Minsk, Mozyr, Belarus info #general

Martha Forsyth
 

I have identified three HOFSTEIN clans >from the Minsk, Mozyr - Belarus
area. I know through a 23 and Me test they are all related. However,
all records I search seem to stop just at the point, about the early
1800s, that I need to look at to find the common ancestor(s) for all
three groups. I tried to contact those cities directly and all I get
is Russian emails I can't read. Any help, short of paying a fortune to
a researcher, is appreciated.

Eric Hofstein
Have you tried Google Translate on the emails? Also, www.translate.ru
is good for Russian.

Martha Schecter Forsyth


David B. Hoffman z"l #general

esjoachim@...
 

It is with a very heavy heart that I let you know of the death of David B.
Hoffman on Tuesday, May 24 in Los Angeles, CA.

David was a co-founder, past president, past vice president and past
secretary of LitvakSIG. He also had been on the board of JGSLA and an editor
of their journal Roots-Key.

David and his wife Sonia founded the Jewish Family History Foundation which
acquired and translated the 18th century poll tax lists for the Grand Duchy
of Lithuania.

Professionally, David had been a clinical psychologist.

Graveside services will be Sunday, May 29 at 3 P.M. at the Mt. Sinai
Cemetery - Hollywood Hills, Los Angeles, California.

Our sincere condolences go to his wife Sonia and his large family around the
world. May his memory be a blessing.

Eden Joachim
Past President, LitvakSIG


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen David B. Hoffman z"l #general

esjoachim@...
 

It is with a very heavy heart that I let you know of the death of David B.
Hoffman on Tuesday, May 24 in Los Angeles, CA.

David was a co-founder, past president, past vice president and past
secretary of LitvakSIG. He also had been on the board of JGSLA and an editor
of their journal Roots-Key.

David and his wife Sonia founded the Jewish Family History Foundation which
acquired and translated the 18th century poll tax lists for the Grand Duchy
of Lithuania.

Professionally, David had been a clinical psychologist.

Graveside services will be Sunday, May 29 at 3 P.M. at the Mt. Sinai
Cemetery - Hollywood Hills, Los Angeles, California.

Our sincere condolences go to his wife Sonia and his large family around the
world. May his memory be a blessing.

Eden Joachim
Past President, LitvakSIG


NY Immigration Film Scans: New Utility #general

Joel Weintraub
 

Hi Group,

I'm going to tell you how to possibly get better manifest images >from the
New York immigration films. I'll concentrate on Ellis Island (1892-1924
heydays) but it pertains to other years and film series. The source
material, the manifest of ship arrivals, were destroyed decades ago.

The Ellis Island original manifests were filmed in 1943 and 1944 and
destroyed in 1948. Ellisisland.org digitized these National Archives
manifest films at least 16 years ago. You may have gotten your Ellis Island
manifest copies by a screen capture >from the Ellis Island site or >from the
Morse One-Step ship lists (http://www.stevemorse.org/ellis/boat.html) which
uses the ellisisland.org material. The major subscription service has
enhanced immigration film scans.

Within the last few years, the FamilySearch library has undertaken a massive
program to digitize their film collection and put it online. That includes
the National Archives ship manifest films for New York. I would expect that
their scanning equipment and computer programs are much more advanced than
what happened 16 plus years ago, and their final manifest image should
reflect that with better contrast, and resolution. They have digitized all
the Ellis Island manifests and put them on their FamilySearch website, but
getting to the scans on their website isn't always easy.

Thus I want to tell you that Steve Morse and the One-Step site now has a new
utility that will provide a direct link to the FamilySearch Ellis Island
images. It's called the "All NY Ship Lists (1820-1957)“ (familysearch). To
go directly to the new utility try:
http://www.stevemorse.org/ellis/boatfs.html
Read the caveat, and be aware there is going to be a time lag when the
utility asks FamilySearch for the scan information.

I suggest you try the new site with one of your previously gotten, washed
out, difficult to read New York manifest to see if there is an improvement
on the information you can discern >from the scanned page.

See you in Seattle!

Joel Weintraub Dana Point, CA

MODERATOR NOTE: The full name of the utility is "Ship Lists: Searching for
Ships in the All New York Microfilms in One Step (familysearch.org)."


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen NY Immigration Film Scans: New Utility #general

Joel Weintraub
 

Hi Group,

I'm going to tell you how to possibly get better manifest images >from the
New York immigration films. I'll concentrate on Ellis Island (1892-1924
heydays) but it pertains to other years and film series. The source
material, the manifest of ship arrivals, were destroyed decades ago.

The Ellis Island original manifests were filmed in 1943 and 1944 and
destroyed in 1948. Ellisisland.org digitized these National Archives
manifest films at least 16 years ago. You may have gotten your Ellis Island
manifest copies by a screen capture >from the Ellis Island site or >from the
Morse One-Step ship lists (http://www.stevemorse.org/ellis/boat.html) which
uses the ellisisland.org material. The major subscription service has
enhanced immigration film scans.

Within the last few years, the FamilySearch library has undertaken a massive
program to digitize their film collection and put it online. That includes
the National Archives ship manifest films for New York. I would expect that
their scanning equipment and computer programs are much more advanced than
what happened 16 plus years ago, and their final manifest image should
reflect that with better contrast, and resolution. They have digitized all
the Ellis Island manifests and put them on their FamilySearch website, but
getting to the scans on their website isn't always easy.

Thus I want to tell you that Steve Morse and the One-Step site now has a new
utility that will provide a direct link to the FamilySearch Ellis Island
images. It's called the "All NY Ship Lists (1820-1957)“ (familysearch). To
go directly to the new utility try:
http://www.stevemorse.org/ellis/boatfs.html
Read the caveat, and be aware there is going to be a time lag when the
utility asks FamilySearch for the scan information.

I suggest you try the new site with one of your previously gotten, washed
out, difficult to read New York manifest to see if there is an improvement
on the information you can discern >from the scanned page.

See you in Seattle!

Joel Weintraub Dana Point, CA

MODERATOR NOTE: The full name of the utility is "Ship Lists: Searching for
Ships in the All New York Microfilms in One Step (familysearch.org)."


Search for HOLLAENDER family #hungary

davidlewin@...
 

Can you possibly help me please?

I would like to find the family of Sidonie HOLLANDER (HOLLAENDER) who, in 1950,
lived at Budapest,XII Menyet Ut 11

Her maiden name was KORETZ

Can you help me at all with that please?

Thank you and be well

David Lewin
London

Moderator: Off-list responses, please.


Hungary SIG #Hungary Search for HOLLAENDER family #hungary

davidlewin@...
 

Can you possibly help me please?

I would like to find the family of Sidonie HOLLANDER (HOLLAENDER) who, in 1950,
lived at Budapest,XII Menyet Ut 11

Her maiden name was KORETZ

Can you help me at all with that please?

Thank you and be well

David Lewin
London

Moderator: Off-list responses, please.

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