Date   
BELINFANTE #general

Dov & Varda <yknow@...>
 

There is a family in the Jewish Quarter of the Old City who are known to be
related to Harry B. They pronounce their surname: Belafont, though I believe
they spell it Belafonte. The black Anglo Jewish community in Jerusalem is
pretty small, so if one has any connection to any of these families (we do),
you see them all at weddings and other occassions. I know that the daughters
of this family say that Harry Belafonte is their uncle, so I assume he's
their father's brother.

Varda Epstein
Efrat
Israel

JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen BELINFANTE #general

Dov & Varda <yknow@...>
 

There is a family in the Jewish Quarter of the Old City who are known to be
related to Harry B. They pronounce their surname: Belafont, though I believe
they spell it Belafonte. The black Anglo Jewish community in Jerusalem is
pretty small, so if one has any connection to any of these families (we do),
you see them all at weddings and other occassions. I know that the daughters
of this family say that Harry Belafonte is their uncle, so I assume he's
their father's brother.

Varda Epstein
Efrat
Israel

Re: Phantom relatives #ukraine

Howard Fink <know_how@...>
 

GeoestherL@... wrote:

I wanted to share with our members an experience
I have had when searching the Ellis Island records, and to see if
others have had a similar experience.
I have found duplicate listings for two of my father's siblings.
One aunt was listed as entering with her children using her married
name; I found her again listed at a different WITH my grandmother using
my aunt's single name. I later found an uncle listed once as entering
with other relatives on the same manifest. Recently I found him listed
alone coming in >from a different port and at a different time; this last
manifest showed my grandmother's name as where he lived in Russia, and
my grandfather's name as the person he was to meet in New York. I have
to assume that at least in my family the names of family members were
used to bring other people into the US.

George Liss

Keep in mind that the Ellis Island records are NOT immigration records!
They are simply travel records. People could and often would travel
back and forth to visit the "old country" or relatives after coming to
the United States. They may even travel back to help bring other family
members with them on another trip. You may find the same person several
times - this does not mean they immigrated several times, just that
they "crossed the border" again. (Imagine some future person examining
today's border crossing records >from Canada to the U.S.) Just because
there are no records of people outbound >from the U.S. does not mean
that they did not also travel in that direction. This also means that
when you "find" someone in the Ellis island records you don't really
know that you have found the FIRST occurrence of their travel; just one
case of it.

Howard Fink
know_How@...

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Re: Phantom relatives #ukraine

Howard Fink <know_how@...>
 

GeoestherL@... wrote:

I wanted to share with our members an experience
I have had when searching the Ellis Island records, and to see if
others have had a similar experience.
I have found duplicate listings for two of my father's siblings.
One aunt was listed as entering with her children using her married
name; I found her again listed at a different WITH my grandmother using
my aunt's single name. I later found an uncle listed once as entering
with other relatives on the same manifest. Recently I found him listed
alone coming in >from a different port and at a different time; this last
manifest showed my grandmother's name as where he lived in Russia, and
my grandfather's name as the person he was to meet in New York. I have
to assume that at least in my family the names of family members were
used to bring other people into the US.

George Liss

Keep in mind that the Ellis Island records are NOT immigration records!
They are simply travel records. People could and often would travel
back and forth to visit the "old country" or relatives after coming to
the United States. They may even travel back to help bring other family
members with them on another trip. You may find the same person several
times - this does not mean they immigrated several times, just that
they "crossed the border" again. (Imagine some future person examining
today's border crossing records >from Canada to the U.S.) Just because
there are no records of people outbound >from the U.S. does not mean
that they did not also travel in that direction. This also means that
when you "find" someone in the Ellis island records you don't really
know that you have found the FIRST occurrence of their travel; just one
case of it.

Howard Fink
know_How@...

Re: Central Islip and causes of death #general

Ira Leviton
 

To Gene and All,

As far as I know, Central Islip was always a psychiatric hospital.
However, I suppose that in earlier years, before nursing homes were big
business, people with senile dementia/Alzheimer's disease, or other
illnesses that no longer result in institutionalization in a "mental
hospital" may have resided -- and died there.

However, more importantly, and again speaking as a physician, not as an
amateur genealogist, the cause of death on a death certificate very
frequently has absolutely nothing to do with the real cause of death. The
same goes for coexistent medical conditions, especially if they were
unrelated to do with the death. It is often simpler -- for the physician
-- to write terms such as "cardiac arrest", "myocardial infarction",
"congestive heart failure", or "atherosclerotic heart disease" as a cause
of death or an underlying condition, because they are acceptable causes of
death, and the death certificate will not have to be redone. But
perfectly lethal diseases, for instance infections like "pneumonia",
"sepsis", "gangrene", as well as other illnesses, are not accepted as
causes of death because they require certain qualifiers such as "lobar
pneumonia", the name of the bacteria causing the illness, which may not be
known at the time of death or by the physician completing the form.

There is no lecture in medical school or residency on how to properly
complete a death certificate. Physicians often learn how to do it, in
several minutes, when their first patient of their internship dies, from
somebody else a whole year older than they are. Doing it once saves time,
and I'm sure that there are physicians whose patients always die of the
same illness. There are other death certificate rules -- in New York,
black ink only, no crossing out, and no abbreviations (not even AIDS,
which has to be spelled out). But most physicians never learn what
illnesses their state permits to cause death. It's very easy for me to
see how a person could have a chronic disease (medical, psychiatric, even
cancer) yet simply die of congestive heart failure.

Especially if only a "generic" cause of death appears, death
certificates can't be used to establish a cause of death (for genealogical
or medical purposes), although other information on it may certainly be
very useful.

Oh, and I almost forgot to mention, sometimes physicians don't even
know why a person dies. My aunt died in her sleep at age 100. I'll bet
anybody the $5 cost of obtaining her death certificate that Florida didn't
permit her to die of "old age".

Ira Leviton, M.D.
New York, N.Y.


--- shiller@... wrote:

In my research, I came across a man (the great grandfather of a close
friend) who died of heart disease while a long term care patient at the
Central Islip State Hospital on Long Island. His death certificate
mentions nothing about mental illness.

Was Central Islip State Hospital only for psychiatric patients, or was
it a general hospital with a wing for long term psychiatric care
patients?

Thanks,

Gene Shiller
Denver, CO.

Searching SUSAL / SUSSEL / SUSEL #general

Jeff & Mel Osrin <jeffosri@...>
 

Hi All ,


I am searching all Susal , Sussel , Susel >from Milejczyce Poland , Hawaii/
Philadelphia USA and Mosselbay/ Oudtshoorn South Africa . Any leads will be
very helpful .

Thank you in advance

Jeff Osrin
Cape Town
South Africa
searching : Oscherowitz in Belarus, South Africa and USA

JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Central Islip and causes of death #general

Ira Leviton
 

To Gene and All,

As far as I know, Central Islip was always a psychiatric hospital.
However, I suppose that in earlier years, before nursing homes were big
business, people with senile dementia/Alzheimer's disease, or other
illnesses that no longer result in institutionalization in a "mental
hospital" may have resided -- and died there.

However, more importantly, and again speaking as a physician, not as an
amateur genealogist, the cause of death on a death certificate very
frequently has absolutely nothing to do with the real cause of death. The
same goes for coexistent medical conditions, especially if they were
unrelated to do with the death. It is often simpler -- for the physician
-- to write terms such as "cardiac arrest", "myocardial infarction",
"congestive heart failure", or "atherosclerotic heart disease" as a cause
of death or an underlying condition, because they are acceptable causes of
death, and the death certificate will not have to be redone. But
perfectly lethal diseases, for instance infections like "pneumonia",
"sepsis", "gangrene", as well as other illnesses, are not accepted as
causes of death because they require certain qualifiers such as "lobar
pneumonia", the name of the bacteria causing the illness, which may not be
known at the time of death or by the physician completing the form.

There is no lecture in medical school or residency on how to properly
complete a death certificate. Physicians often learn how to do it, in
several minutes, when their first patient of their internship dies, from
somebody else a whole year older than they are. Doing it once saves time,
and I'm sure that there are physicians whose patients always die of the
same illness. There are other death certificate rules -- in New York,
black ink only, no crossing out, and no abbreviations (not even AIDS,
which has to be spelled out). But most physicians never learn what
illnesses their state permits to cause death. It's very easy for me to
see how a person could have a chronic disease (medical, psychiatric, even
cancer) yet simply die of congestive heart failure.

Especially if only a "generic" cause of death appears, death
certificates can't be used to establish a cause of death (for genealogical
or medical purposes), although other information on it may certainly be
very useful.

Oh, and I almost forgot to mention, sometimes physicians don't even
know why a person dies. My aunt died in her sleep at age 100. I'll bet
anybody the $5 cost of obtaining her death certificate that Florida didn't
permit her to die of "old age".

Ira Leviton, M.D.
New York, N.Y.


--- shiller@... wrote:

In my research, I came across a man (the great grandfather of a close
friend) who died of heart disease while a long term care patient at the
Central Islip State Hospital on Long Island. His death certificate
mentions nothing about mental illness.

Was Central Islip State Hospital only for psychiatric patients, or was
it a general hospital with a wing for long term psychiatric care
patients?

Thanks,

Gene Shiller
Denver, CO.

JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Searching SUSAL / SUSSEL / SUSEL #general

Jeff & Mel Osrin <jeffosri@...>
 

Hi All ,


I am searching all Susal , Sussel , Susel >from Milejczyce Poland , Hawaii/
Philadelphia USA and Mosselbay/ Oudtshoorn South Africa . Any leads will be
very helpful .

Thank you in advance

Jeff Osrin
Cape Town
South Africa
searching : Oscherowitz in Belarus, South Africa and USA

PLAIN TEXT MESSAGES #ukraine

Ukraine Moderator...
 

Dear Genners,

It is both disturbing and frustrating to reject many of the posts
to our list because they have been sent in a format other than
PLAIN TEXT. We cannot even edit these posts because it would then
produce a "blank" e-mail to over 1200 members. Today I had
to reject 5 posts because they were sent in Multipart/MIME -
Multipart/Alternative or HTML. The information you send is
VERY important to all of us, so PLEASE - check the settings on
your e-mail programs and set them to PLAIN TEXT ONLY.

There are so many different e-mail programs in use, we have written
an InfoFile and suggest you refer to it for help.

http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles/PlainText.html

If the solution is not found there, you will need to contact your
Internet Service Provider (ISP) for assistance, or if you are using
an e-mailer different than the one provided by your ISP, review the
manual or communicate with tech support for the e-mail program you are
using.

Once you have learned how to set your program to plain text, we would
appreciate it if you would add this information to the InfoFile in order
to assist others. Please send the step by step instructions you have
been given to support@... and it will be added to the file.

Thank you for your cooperation,
Your Moderators

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine PLAIN TEXT MESSAGES #ukraine

Ukraine Moderator...
 

Dear Genners,

It is both disturbing and frustrating to reject many of the posts
to our list because they have been sent in a format other than
PLAIN TEXT. We cannot even edit these posts because it would then
produce a "blank" e-mail to over 1200 members. Today I had
to reject 5 posts because they were sent in Multipart/MIME -
Multipart/Alternative or HTML. The information you send is
VERY important to all of us, so PLEASE - check the settings on
your e-mail programs and set them to PLAIN TEXT ONLY.

There are so many different e-mail programs in use, we have written
an InfoFile and suggest you refer to it for help.

http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles/PlainText.html

If the solution is not found there, you will need to contact your
Internet Service Provider (ISP) for assistance, or if you are using
an e-mailer different than the one provided by your ISP, review the
manual or communicate with tech support for the e-mail program you are
using.

Once you have learned how to set your program to plain text, we would
appreciate it if you would add this information to the InfoFile in order
to assist others. Please send the step by step instructions you have
been given to support@... and it will be added to the file.

Thank you for your cooperation,
Your Moderators

Thank you for pointing out the wonderful resources of JewishGen #general

Sara <esterbrook@...>
 

Dear Ms. Paulin and other's who have done great work...

When I read your reply to my initial inquiry, I had not taken the time to
view in detail the jewishgen info files or the faq section of same. I have
just now begun my research and am overwhelmed with the wealth of information
and suggestions that already exist right before my eyes. I guess I just
needed some guidance on how to begin and reading your recommendations as
amazed me. The amount of information that is available is simply mind
boggling.

Thank you for pointing this out to me and I will definitely be reading the
InfoFiles in great detail. I have a lot of reading to do!!! LOL

Thank you for taking the time to respond.

Sincerely,

Sara R. Rice
Palos Verdes, CA U.S.A.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gladys Paulin"

All,
There are no records of Canadian Border Crossings before 1895.

The belief that the St. Albans lists are the only source is erroneous.

In the past few years, more Canadian border crossing records for other
ports of entry (land ports) have been microfilmed and are available
through the National Archives < http://www.archives.gov >. They are
listed in the genealogy section of the Research Room on that site.

This web site also provides excellent information about these and other
immigration records. Further information is available in the InfoFiles
on JewishGen and in the JewishGen FAQ:
< http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles > and
< http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles/faq.html >.

Please make use of these sources before asking more questions. Lots
of volunteers have worked hard for many years to provide extensive
information to the new as well as the experienced researcher.
Please use the site and thank all those who have done so much work
for you.

Gladys

Gladys Friedman Paulin
Winter Springs, FL

JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Thank you for pointing out the wonderful resources of JewishGen #general

Sara <esterbrook@...>
 

Dear Ms. Paulin and other's who have done great work...

When I read your reply to my initial inquiry, I had not taken the time to
view in detail the jewishgen info files or the faq section of same. I have
just now begun my research and am overwhelmed with the wealth of information
and suggestions that already exist right before my eyes. I guess I just
needed some guidance on how to begin and reading your recommendations as
amazed me. The amount of information that is available is simply mind
boggling.

Thank you for pointing this out to me and I will definitely be reading the
InfoFiles in great detail. I have a lot of reading to do!!! LOL

Thank you for taking the time to respond.

Sincerely,

Sara R. Rice
Palos Verdes, CA U.S.A.

----- Original Message -----
From: "Gladys Paulin"

All,
There are no records of Canadian Border Crossings before 1895.

The belief that the St. Albans lists are the only source is erroneous.

In the past few years, more Canadian border crossing records for other
ports of entry (land ports) have been microfilmed and are available
through the National Archives < http://www.archives.gov >. They are
listed in the genealogy section of the Research Room on that site.

This web site also provides excellent information about these and other
immigration records. Further information is available in the InfoFiles
on JewishGen and in the JewishGen FAQ:
< http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles > and
< http://www.jewishgen.org/InfoFiles/faq.html >.

Please make use of these sources before asking more questions. Lots
of volunteers have worked hard for many years to provide extensive
information to the new as well as the experienced researcher.
Please use the site and thank all those who have done so much work
for you.

Gladys

Gladys Friedman Paulin
Winter Springs, FL

Re: Recognize Russ/Germ doc? VM2100 #ukraine

gedalia@...
 

Debbie,

With regard to your question, this appears to be permission for your g/f
to travel so many miles >from the border into Russia, and return.

...welcher die Reise nach Russland bis (illegible, off of screen: ______)
Meilen von der Grenze und zurück gestattet ist.

Here's a rough German translation of your grandfather's travel document
with the original German first, and the English translation following:

Legitimations-Schein gültig auf 28 Tage.

Identity card valid for 28 days.

Vorzeiger dieses, der deutsche Reichsangehörige
(Russischestaatsangehörige) ______________________ (signature) aus
______________________ (line filled in handwriting) wird hiermit als
bekannte und unverdächtige Person legitimirt, welcher die Reise nach
Russland bis (illegible, off of screen: ______) Meilen von der Grenze und
zurück gestattet ist.

The bearer of this pass, a Russian national, (signature) >from (town or
province of Mr. Hauptman), known to be beyond suspicion, is hereby
permitted to travel to Russia up to _____ miles >from the border, and
return.

Beuthen O/S , den _14_ten _September_, 19__?

Die Polizei-Verwaltung.

The Police Administration.

L.S. (Circular Seal) (top part) THE POLICE
ADMINISTRATION. (Signature next to seal)

(bottom part) CHIEF TOWN OF DISTRICT, BEUTHEN O.S.

Notice: Illegal use of an identity card is punishable under § 363 (or §
868?) of the Reich’s Criminal Code, subject to (illegible—imprisonment?)
or a fine of up to 150 marks. (Obviously, this is a paraphrase of above
paragraph which is substantially longer in original German.)

ON RIGHT SIDE OF DOCUMENT:

Signalement des Inhabers:

Identifying characteristics of the bearer of pass:

1. Wuchs: gross klein
1. Weight (not big or small)

2. Augen: braun
2. Brown eyes

3. Haare: braun
3. Brown hair

4. Gesicht: länglich oval gewöhnlich

4. Normal looking face (not long or round)

5. Mund: gross klein gewöhnlich

5. Normal looking mouth (not big or small)

6. Nase: gross klein gewöhnlich

6. Normal looking nose (not big or small)

7. Alter: (illegible)

7. Age (illegible)

If you have any other questions, please let me know.

Charles Millman
Harrisburg, PA
gedalia@...

Researching:
CHERNER, GANSKY and KOLKER, Olgopol, Romanovka and Bershad, Ukraine;
MILMED, MILMAN, MILLMAN, Wachnovka, Kiyev, Ukraine and Varnifka, Russia;
Philadelphia, PA, Buffalo, NY and Vineland, NJ;
ROSENBLUM, Philadelphia, PA, Buffalo, NY and Vineland, NJ;
WALDMAN, Rovno, Volyn, Ukraine.

Original Message
Debbie Pomerance wrote in part:
Hi List -

"My GF Michail (sp?) HAUPTMAN emigrated >from Radomsko,
Poland (south of Lodz) in 1904. This document is half in German and
half in Russian.
Is it a travel doc? Permission to cross Germany? Can there be
additional meaningful facts to be gleaned >from it? Is it worth my
while to get it translated, or is it boilerplate? Is the boilerplate
important?"

dpomeran@...
Debbie Pomerance

Moderator's Note: Even though Debbie's question appears to pertain to
Radomsko (not a Ukrainian town), I took the liberty of approving Mr.
Millman's very thorough translation on the off-chance that one of our
members may have come across a similar type document.

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine RE:Recognize Russ/Germ doc? VM2100 #ukraine

gedalia@...
 

Debbie,

With regard to your question, this appears to be permission for your g/f
to travel so many miles >from the border into Russia, and return.

...welcher die Reise nach Russland bis (illegible, off of screen: ______)
Meilen von der Grenze und zurück gestattet ist.

Here's a rough German translation of your grandfather's travel document
with the original German first, and the English translation following:

Legitimations-Schein gültig auf 28 Tage.

Identity card valid for 28 days.

Vorzeiger dieses, der deutsche Reichsangehörige
(Russischestaatsangehörige) ______________________ (signature) aus
______________________ (line filled in handwriting) wird hiermit als
bekannte und unverdächtige Person legitimirt, welcher die Reise nach
Russland bis (illegible, off of screen: ______) Meilen von der Grenze und
zurück gestattet ist.

The bearer of this pass, a Russian national, (signature) >from (town or
province of Mr. Hauptman), known to be beyond suspicion, is hereby
permitted to travel to Russia up to _____ miles >from the border, and
return.

Beuthen O/S , den _14_ten _September_, 19__?

Die Polizei-Verwaltung.

The Police Administration.

L.S. (Circular Seal) (top part) THE POLICE
ADMINISTRATION. (Signature next to seal)

(bottom part) CHIEF TOWN OF DISTRICT, BEUTHEN O.S.

Notice: Illegal use of an identity card is punishable under § 363 (or §
868?) of the Reich’s Criminal Code, subject to (illegible—imprisonment?)
or a fine of up to 150 marks. (Obviously, this is a paraphrase of above
paragraph which is substantially longer in original German.)

ON RIGHT SIDE OF DOCUMENT:

Signalement des Inhabers:

Identifying characteristics of the bearer of pass:

1. Wuchs: gross klein
1. Weight (not big or small)

2. Augen: braun
2. Brown eyes

3. Haare: braun
3. Brown hair

4. Gesicht: länglich oval gewöhnlich

4. Normal looking face (not long or round)

5. Mund: gross klein gewöhnlich

5. Normal looking mouth (not big or small)

6. Nase: gross klein gewöhnlich

6. Normal looking nose (not big or small)

7. Alter: (illegible)

7. Age (illegible)

If you have any other questions, please let me know.

Charles Millman
Harrisburg, PA
gedalia@...

Researching:
CHERNER, GANSKY and KOLKER, Olgopol, Romanovka and Bershad, Ukraine;
MILMED, MILMAN, MILLMAN, Wachnovka, Kiyev, Ukraine and Varnifka, Russia;
Philadelphia, PA, Buffalo, NY and Vineland, NJ;
ROSENBLUM, Philadelphia, PA, Buffalo, NY and Vineland, NJ;
WALDMAN, Rovno, Volyn, Ukraine.

Original Message
Debbie Pomerance wrote in part:
Hi List -

"My GF Michail (sp?) HAUPTMAN emigrated >from Radomsko,
Poland (south of Lodz) in 1904. This document is half in German and
half in Russian.
Is it a travel doc? Permission to cross Germany? Can there be
additional meaningful facts to be gleaned >from it? Is it worth my
while to get it translated, or is it boilerplate? Is the boilerplate
important?"

dpomeran@...
Debbie Pomerance

Moderator's Note: Even though Debbie's question appears to pertain to
Radomsko (not a Ukrainian town), I took the liberty of approving Mr.
Millman's very thorough translation on the off-chance that one of our
members may have come across a similar type document.

Hamburg List & Yiddish given name #ukraine

Flo Elman
 

Two aunts sailed on the same ship with their families. The Hamburg List no
longer shows the manifests, but does say whether they were with family, &
the year of birth. Can anyone tell me how the ship numbers were assigned? Is
it possible that passengers #99681 & #96759 could have been on the same
ship??


I don't have the married name of this aunt, but her given name was Molya
(pronounced "Maya" by the family). Could her Yiddish name have been Malke?
If someone is knowledgeable about names, are there any other possibilities
for her Yiddish name?

Thanks in advance,
Florence Nerenberg Elman
haflo@...

ELMAN (originally >from Romania) researching: GOTLIBOVICH/ GOTLIBOWITZ/
GOTLIEB - Korosten, Zhitomir, Ukraine; STIRBERG/ ZAIDMAN - Khotin; WAISMAN -
Romania; SURIS/ SURES - Odessa, Ukraine; WEISSBEIN/ VAJSBEJN - Odessa,
Ukraine; SASLAWSKY - Argentina; ZILBERBERG/ SILBERBERG - Ushitsa, Podolia,
Ukraine; KATSOVITCH - Ilya, Minsk & Vileyka

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Hamburg List & Yiddish given name #ukraine

Flo Elman
 

Two aunts sailed on the same ship with their families. The Hamburg List no
longer shows the manifests, but does say whether they were with family, &
the year of birth. Can anyone tell me how the ship numbers were assigned? Is
it possible that passengers #99681 & #96759 could have been on the same
ship??


I don't have the married name of this aunt, but her given name was Molya
(pronounced "Maya" by the family). Could her Yiddish name have been Malke?
If someone is knowledgeable about names, are there any other possibilities
for her Yiddish name?

Thanks in advance,
Florence Nerenberg Elman
haflo@...

ELMAN (originally >from Romania) researching: GOTLIBOVICH/ GOTLIBOWITZ/
GOTLIEB - Korosten, Zhitomir, Ukraine; STIRBERG/ ZAIDMAN - Khotin; WAISMAN -
Romania; SURIS/ SURES - Odessa, Ukraine; WEISSBEIN/ VAJSBEJN - Odessa,
Ukraine; SASLAWSKY - Argentina; ZILBERBERG/ SILBERBERG - Ushitsa, Podolia,
Ukraine; KATSOVITCH - Ilya, Minsk & Vileyka

1890s birth certificate #ukraine

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
 

I am about to embark on what should be a difficult project: An attempt to
get several birth certificates for members of my family who were born in
Proskurov, Ukraine and Zaslav, Ukraine in the 1890s.

I have two questions:

1. Has anyone had any success in getting birth certificates >from the late
1800s or early 1900s in Ukraine?

2. Does anyone have a copy of such a document--or know what type of
information is included in these documents?

I am trying to figure out if I should even bother trying to get this type
of document!

Dan
Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
Professor of Music / Wittenberg University / Springfield, Ohio USA
Ukraine: OBERMAN-HOBERMAN-GUBERMAN, LISS, SOBLE-SOBEL, STEIN, AXMAN
http://www.kazez.com/~dan/guberman-lis.html
http://www.kazez.com/~dan/oberman/

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine 1890s birth certificate #ukraine

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
 

I am about to embark on what should be a difficult project: An attempt to
get several birth certificates for members of my family who were born in
Proskurov, Ukraine and Zaslav, Ukraine in the 1890s.

I have two questions:

1. Has anyone had any success in getting birth certificates >from the late
1800s or early 1900s in Ukraine?

2. Does anyone have a copy of such a document--or know what type of
information is included in these documents?

I am trying to figure out if I should even bother trying to get this type
of document!

Dan
Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
Professor of Music / Wittenberg University / Springfield, Ohio USA
Ukraine: OBERMAN-HOBERMAN-GUBERMAN, LISS, SOBLE-SOBEL, STEIN, AXMAN
http://www.kazez.com/~dan/guberman-lis.html
http://www.kazez.com/~dan/oberman/

Re: Polish "census books" #poland

Pamela Weisberger <pweisberger@...>
 

Dear Sue-

Regarding the Polish "census books" you mention, I can only speak for my
experience in one town: Czestochowa. In the Czestochowa Archives they still
have the "Book of Residents" which covers the years 1880-1930, and appears
to have been updated as people moved away, got married or died. These can
prove to be a goldmine of new information for any researcher!

In the case of this town's books, there was a searchable index by surname,
which provided a book number where the family was listed with more detailed
information, including names of all the people living at one address, date
of birth, parents' names, occupation, and a "comments" section. I
discovered that the "true" name of my grandmother (known as Henrietta) was
originally "Jacheta" and that she had a sister Chana, no one ever knew
about. And I found my great-grandfather, living with several brothers (all
of whom emigrated to the United States) along with one, heretofore unknown,
brother. In the "comments" section, I found an entry for one family member
stating that, based on a letter sent to the mayor's office, he had renounced
his Polish citizenship and become a United States citizen. Of course, by
1929 all but one of the brothers had emigrated, but their information was
never entered and I don't know why this one sibling bothered to notify the
town.

It is certainly worth a try to contact the archive or town hall in the place
you are researching (or hiring a private resarcher) to ask about these books
and to request a written extract of information or a digital photocopy.
(The Czestochowa book was too large to be xeroxed.) In addition to finding
you own family, the surname search may provide links to other family members
living in the same place and might uncover relatives you never knew about,
who stayed behind in Poland. This may lead you to addition Holocaust-era
research to determing the fate of those relatives, and their families, who
did not come to the United States.

Good luck!

Pamela Weisberger
Santa Monica, CA
pweisberger@...

Researching: BESSER, OBERMAN, RUTKOWSKI, ICZKOW in Czestochowa & Przyrow


From: SBSeales@...
Reply-To: SBSeales@...
To: "JRI-Poland" <jri-pl@...>
Subject: [jri-pl] Polish "census books"
Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 22:33:18 -0500

My grandfather, who was born in Odessa, was issued a passport based on
the "census books" of the city of Wegrow, Poland in 1906. This was
apparently still the family's official place of residence even after over
twenty years and two generations living in Odessa. The passport was issued
by the City Hall of Wegrow.
Have any of these census books survived for towns in Poland?

Sue Seales
researching:
ROSENTHAL/Wegrow,Poland and Odessa
BLUSZTEJN/Zareby Koscielne,Poland
ZELIONY/Bershad,Ukraine ZELONY,ZELENY/Paris and Chicago
ROZINSKY/Balta,Ukraine BOYARSKY/Mosty,Grodno
FREEDMAN/Sidlova,Lith. ROZENBLAT,Odessa

Visit the JRI-Poland web site at http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/
Post messages to <jri-pl@...>

Jewish Records Indexing - Poland, Inc. is an independent non-profit U.S.
tax-exempt organization and is hosted by JewishGen.

JRI-Poland indexing initiatives are funded by your contributions. To support
JRI-Poland and its many individual projects - such as indexing of records
from your ancestral town - please send your checks - marked with the town
name or project for which the money is being donated - to:
Jewish Records Indexing - Poland, c/o Sheila Salo, Treasurer,5607 Greenleaf
Rd., Cheverly, MD20785 or pay by Visa or MasterCard at:
<http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/visa.htm>

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JRI Poland #Poland Re: Polish "census books" #poland

Pamela Weisberger <pweisberger@...>
 

Dear Sue-

Regarding the Polish "census books" you mention, I can only speak for my
experience in one town: Czestochowa. In the Czestochowa Archives they still
have the "Book of Residents" which covers the years 1880-1930, and appears
to have been updated as people moved away, got married or died. These can
prove to be a goldmine of new information for any researcher!

In the case of this town's books, there was a searchable index by surname,
which provided a book number where the family was listed with more detailed
information, including names of all the people living at one address, date
of birth, parents' names, occupation, and a "comments" section. I
discovered that the "true" name of my grandmother (known as Henrietta) was
originally "Jacheta" and that she had a sister Chana, no one ever knew
about. And I found my great-grandfather, living with several brothers (all
of whom emigrated to the United States) along with one, heretofore unknown,
brother. In the "comments" section, I found an entry for one family member
stating that, based on a letter sent to the mayor's office, he had renounced
his Polish citizenship and become a United States citizen. Of course, by
1929 all but one of the brothers had emigrated, but their information was
never entered and I don't know why this one sibling bothered to notify the
town.

It is certainly worth a try to contact the archive or town hall in the place
you are researching (or hiring a private resarcher) to ask about these books
and to request a written extract of information or a digital photocopy.
(The Czestochowa book was too large to be xeroxed.) In addition to finding
you own family, the surname search may provide links to other family members
living in the same place and might uncover relatives you never knew about,
who stayed behind in Poland. This may lead you to addition Holocaust-era
research to determing the fate of those relatives, and their families, who
did not come to the United States.

Good luck!

Pamela Weisberger
Santa Monica, CA
pweisberger@...

Researching: BESSER, OBERMAN, RUTKOWSKI, ICZKOW in Czestochowa & Przyrow


From: SBSeales@...
Reply-To: SBSeales@...
To: "JRI-Poland" <jri-pl@...>
Subject: [jri-pl] Polish "census books"
Date: Wed, 29 Jan 2003 22:33:18 -0500

My grandfather, who was born in Odessa, was issued a passport based on
the "census books" of the city of Wegrow, Poland in 1906. This was
apparently still the family's official place of residence even after over
twenty years and two generations living in Odessa. The passport was issued
by the City Hall of Wegrow.
Have any of these census books survived for towns in Poland?

Sue Seales
researching:
ROSENTHAL/Wegrow,Poland and Odessa
BLUSZTEJN/Zareby Koscielne,Poland
ZELIONY/Bershad,Ukraine ZELONY,ZELENY/Paris and Chicago
ROZINSKY/Balta,Ukraine BOYARSKY/Mosty,Grodno
FREEDMAN/Sidlova,Lith. ROZENBLAT,Odessa

Visit the JRI-Poland web site at http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/
Post messages to <jri-pl@...>

Jewish Records Indexing - Poland, Inc. is an independent non-profit U.S.
tax-exempt organization and is hosted by JewishGen.

JRI-Poland indexing initiatives are funded by your contributions. To support
JRI-Poland and its many individual projects - such as indexing of records
from your ancestral town - please send your checks - marked with the town
name or project for which the money is being donated - to:
Jewish Records Indexing - Poland, c/o Sheila Salo, Treasurer,5607 Greenleaf
Rd., Cheverly, MD20785 or pay by Visa or MasterCard at:
<http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/visa.htm>

---
You are currently subscribed to jri-pl as: [pweisberger@...]
To unsubscribe send email to $subst('Email.Unsub')


_________________________________________________________________
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