Date   

Re: Hebrew acronym #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 7/28/2003 8:06:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net writes:

<< I came across a book, printed in Warsaw in 1877 that has the following
Hebrew acronym stamped on the inside cover:

(>from right to left) Shin Vav Bet

it is followed by the word (again >from right to left) Pay Vav Daled Kuf
Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit
>>

Are you sure it's an acronym? Hebrew and yiddish aceonyms are marked with
a doubl-quote, " between the penultimate and the last letters.

I do not recognize the above as acronyms. OK, I'll correct that: Shin
Vav"Bet is an acronym for Shochet U-Bodek, "ritual slaughterer and
examiner" (of the slaughtered animal to see if it is fit to be certified
as kosher. The three-letter combination became a noun, Shub, to denote
the profession, and hence also a family name. The double-quote is not
required when the acronym is a name. I have not come across Shub as a
first name; neither Kaganoff nor Beider ("Given Names") list it.

"Pay Vav Daled Kuf Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit" is awfully long for an
acronym, and I can't attach any meaning to it. I would guess it's a
family name, Pudkami'en, which is likely to be Slavic in origin.

Presumably then the book belonged to a person surnamed Pudkami'en, who was
either a kosher slaughterer, or who had the uncommon first name Shub.

Michael Bernet, New York


Re: Hebrew acronym #general

Ida & Joseph Schwarcz <idayosef@...>
 

Podkamien is a town in Galicia. Shub stands for shohet u-vodek, ritual
slaughterer and kashrut inspector.
ida Selavan Schwarcz
Arad, Israel

-----Original Message-----
From: Moshe Goldwaser [mailto:mauh2o@worldnet.att.net]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 1:22 PM
To: JewishGen Discussion Group
Subject: Hebrew acronym

I came across a book, printed in Warsaw in 1877 that has the following
Hebrew acronym stamped on the inside cover:

(>from right to left) Shin Vav Bet

it is followed by the word (again >from right to left) Pay Vav Daled Kuf
Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit

Can anyone tell me what the above stands for. Just above this line a
person's name is written (Aaron Cwi BINSZTOK).

Thank you all

Moshe Goldwaser
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net >>>


Re: Hebrew acronym #general

Alexander Sharon
 

"Moshe Goldwaser" wrote


I came across a book, printed in Warsaw in 1877 that has the following
Hebrew acronym stamped on the inside cover:

(>from right to left) Shin Vav Bet

it is followed by the word (again >from right to left) Pay Vav Daled Kuf
Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit

Can anyone tell me what the above stands for. Just above this line a
person's name is written (Aaron Cwi BINSZTOK).

Thank you all

Moshe Goldwaser
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net
I'm not certain what the first (short) acronym is for, but the second is
the name of the Eastern Galician town: Podkamien.

Alexander Sharon
Calgary


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Hebrew acronym #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 7/28/2003 8:06:43 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net writes:

<< I came across a book, printed in Warsaw in 1877 that has the following
Hebrew acronym stamped on the inside cover:

(>from right to left) Shin Vav Bet

it is followed by the word (again >from right to left) Pay Vav Daled Kuf
Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit
>>

Are you sure it's an acronym? Hebrew and yiddish aceonyms are marked with
a doubl-quote, " between the penultimate and the last letters.

I do not recognize the above as acronyms. OK, I'll correct that: Shin
Vav"Bet is an acronym for Shochet U-Bodek, "ritual slaughterer and
examiner" (of the slaughtered animal to see if it is fit to be certified
as kosher. The three-letter combination became a noun, Shub, to denote
the profession, and hence also a family name. The double-quote is not
required when the acronym is a name. I have not come across Shub as a
first name; neither Kaganoff nor Beider ("Given Names") list it.

"Pay Vav Daled Kuf Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit" is awfully long for an
acronym, and I can't attach any meaning to it. I would guess it's a
family name, Pudkami'en, which is likely to be Slavic in origin.

Presumably then the book belonged to a person surnamed Pudkami'en, who was
either a kosher slaughterer, or who had the uncommon first name Shub.

Michael Bernet, New York


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen RE: Hebrew acronym #general

Ida & Joseph Schwarcz <idayosef@...>
 

Podkamien is a town in Galicia. Shub stands for shohet u-vodek, ritual
slaughterer and kashrut inspector.
ida Selavan Schwarcz
Arad, Israel

-----Original Message-----
From: Moshe Goldwaser [mailto:mauh2o@worldnet.att.net]
Sent: Monday, July 28, 2003 1:22 PM
To: JewishGen Discussion Group
Subject: Hebrew acronym

I came across a book, printed in Warsaw in 1877 that has the following
Hebrew acronym stamped on the inside cover:

(>from right to left) Shin Vav Bet

it is followed by the word (again >from right to left) Pay Vav Daled Kuf
Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit

Can anyone tell me what the above stands for. Just above this line a
person's name is written (Aaron Cwi BINSZTOK).

Thank you all

Moshe Goldwaser
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net >>>


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Hebrew acronym #general

Alexander Sharon
 

"Moshe Goldwaser" wrote


I came across a book, printed in Warsaw in 1877 that has the following
Hebrew acronym stamped on the inside cover:

(>from right to left) Shin Vav Bet

it is followed by the word (again >from right to left) Pay Vav Daled Kuf
Aleph Mem Yud Ayin Nunsofit

Can anyone tell me what the above stands for. Just above this line a
person's name is written (Aaron Cwi BINSZTOK).

Thank you all

Moshe Goldwaser
mauh2o@worldnet.att.net
I'm not certain what the first (short) acronym is for, but the second is
the name of the Eastern Galician town: Podkamien.

Alexander Sharon
Calgary


Re: Cousin marriages #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 7/28/2003 1:55:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
marie@mjacobus.freeserve.co.uk writes:


The last chapter of Numbers read in Synagogues yesterday ,dealt in part
with the Law relating to dispersion of family property following the
marriages of daughters to men of other tribes. The divine command was that
although daughters were free to choose a partner they would inherit only
if they married within the tribe. The daughters in the family raising the
question then married first cousins.
==Not necessarily. The pohrase is they were married to "livney dodeyhe"--
sons of a "dod." In Biblical Hebrew, "dod" is a close relative or, as in
the Song of Songs, "ani ledodi vedodi li" (I am my beloved's and my
beloved is mine) a lover. It is only in modern Hebrew that dod usually
means "uncle" (female dodah), and that a cousin is ben/bat dod/dodah. But
Tzelafchad's daughters married their kinsmen, not necessarily their
cousins.

This interests me particularly since cousin marriages were prevalent in my
Polish family. So much so that having traced my ancestry back to early
19th C I found that instead of the normal 16 I had only 10 different
individual great-great-grandparents. Furthermore I discovered that many
marriages occurred within a very small circle of families almost
certainly linked by distant cousinship. The tradition continues even
after immigration as family groups >from the same town formed
associations and benevolent societies for welfare and burial.
==That is indeed so. Cousin marriages are not forbidden in Jewish law
(Lev. ch 18) and a man may even marry his brother/sister's daughter (but
not his aunt). I do not understand why Americans (and Christians in
general) view cousin marriages as incestuous. The practice was common
among Jews for many centuries. If it has decreased in recent years I
would assume that it reflects the greater opportunity to meet a
bride/groom thanks to greater mobility and better communications.

Naturally, village Jews would tend to marry someone >from a relatively
close village, and inevitably almost everybody was somehow related to
everyone else.
What is also common is multiple marriages between siblings: the brother
of my mother's mother married the sister of my mother's father. On my
father's side, three siblings in the Goldschmidt family married three
siblings in the Gutenstein family.

In part, marrying one's child off to a cousin meant that one knew
everything about the other family's social, moral, health and wealth
qualities. It also ensured descendants who would work in the family
business, inherit the business, and like Tzelafchad's daughter, keep
everything in the family.

This was especially important among the socially prominent, the wealthy,
and the Jewish community leaders. My Goldschmidt and Gutenstein ancestors
were all three--and it wouldn't surprise me if they themselves were cousin.

A cousin of one of my cousins married her cousin in the 1950s. They were
afraid of possible genetic diseases and agreed beforehand never to have
children.
I understand (but I'm very willing to be corrected by someone more
knowledgable) that geneticists today hold the danger of genetic diseases
from a cousin marriage is not significantly higher than a marriage outside
the family, if proper genetic screening is conducted.

As for immigrants >from the same family or region forming social support
organization, this is only logical. The first intrepid emigrants >from
Inderheimsdorf would send back a report: "Come join us. This is a great
country. You can get work where I work/work for me in my store." So other
family members emigrated--to the very same location. A group of Jews >from
the same region in Europe frequently ended up in the same state or county
or town as the pioneer emigrants >from that region and naturally they
worked together to create copies of the important institutions in their
old home: synagogues, burial societies, charities for the destitute, the
sick, the widowed, and those about to set up a home as newlyweds. And when
chosing partners for their children, they often chose one >from within the
new community in the new world, or sent back home for the child of a
cousin or of a neighbor. In the 19th century, many small towns
in America were home to one extended family >from the European hometown,
Cincinnatti as home to Jews >from Franconia is a case in point.

It has persisted to this day. The German Jews who settled in the
Washington Heights area of Manhattan in the 1930/40s, or in Asbury Park
NJ, the Israelis, iranians, Bokharan, Yemenite etc. Jews who settle close
together where they can pray in the home-town style, buy hometown foods at
the Kosher Deli--and find spouses for their children. The same happened in
England with the German Jews in the 1930s who settled in close-knit groups
in different areas of London and the UK in general--mostly without any
prior organization, just the desire to have neighbors who spoke the old
language and faced the same problems.

Michael Bernet, New York


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Cousin marriages #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 7/28/2003 1:55:22 PM Eastern Daylight Time,
marie@mjacobus.freeserve.co.uk writes:


The last chapter of Numbers read in Synagogues yesterday ,dealt in part
with the Law relating to dispersion of family property following the
marriages of daughters to men of other tribes. The divine command was that
although daughters were free to choose a partner they would inherit only
if they married within the tribe. The daughters in the family raising the
question then married first cousins.
==Not necessarily. The pohrase is they were married to "livney dodeyhe"--
sons of a "dod." In Biblical Hebrew, "dod" is a close relative or, as in
the Song of Songs, "ani ledodi vedodi li" (I am my beloved's and my
beloved is mine) a lover. It is only in modern Hebrew that dod usually
means "uncle" (female dodah), and that a cousin is ben/bat dod/dodah. But
Tzelafchad's daughters married their kinsmen, not necessarily their
cousins.

This interests me particularly since cousin marriages were prevalent in my
Polish family. So much so that having traced my ancestry back to early
19th C I found that instead of the normal 16 I had only 10 different
individual great-great-grandparents. Furthermore I discovered that many
marriages occurred within a very small circle of families almost
certainly linked by distant cousinship. The tradition continues even
after immigration as family groups >from the same town formed
associations and benevolent societies for welfare and burial.
==That is indeed so. Cousin marriages are not forbidden in Jewish law
(Lev. ch 18) and a man may even marry his brother/sister's daughter (but
not his aunt). I do not understand why Americans (and Christians in
general) view cousin marriages as incestuous. The practice was common
among Jews for many centuries. If it has decreased in recent years I
would assume that it reflects the greater opportunity to meet a
bride/groom thanks to greater mobility and better communications.

Naturally, village Jews would tend to marry someone >from a relatively
close village, and inevitably almost everybody was somehow related to
everyone else.
What is also common is multiple marriages between siblings: the brother
of my mother's mother married the sister of my mother's father. On my
father's side, three siblings in the Goldschmidt family married three
siblings in the Gutenstein family.

In part, marrying one's child off to a cousin meant that one knew
everything about the other family's social, moral, health and wealth
qualities. It also ensured descendants who would work in the family
business, inherit the business, and like Tzelafchad's daughter, keep
everything in the family.

This was especially important among the socially prominent, the wealthy,
and the Jewish community leaders. My Goldschmidt and Gutenstein ancestors
were all three--and it wouldn't surprise me if they themselves were cousin.

A cousin of one of my cousins married her cousin in the 1950s. They were
afraid of possible genetic diseases and agreed beforehand never to have
children.
I understand (but I'm very willing to be corrected by someone more
knowledgable) that geneticists today hold the danger of genetic diseases
from a cousin marriage is not significantly higher than a marriage outside
the family, if proper genetic screening is conducted.

As for immigrants >from the same family or region forming social support
organization, this is only logical. The first intrepid emigrants >from
Inderheimsdorf would send back a report: "Come join us. This is a great
country. You can get work where I work/work for me in my store." So other
family members emigrated--to the very same location. A group of Jews >from
the same region in Europe frequently ended up in the same state or county
or town as the pioneer emigrants >from that region and naturally they
worked together to create copies of the important institutions in their
old home: synagogues, burial societies, charities for the destitute, the
sick, the widowed, and those about to set up a home as newlyweds. And when
chosing partners for their children, they often chose one >from within the
new community in the new world, or sent back home for the child of a
cousin or of a neighbor. In the 19th century, many small towns
in America were home to one extended family >from the European hometown,
Cincinnatti as home to Jews >from Franconia is a case in point.

It has persisted to this day. The German Jews who settled in the
Washington Heights area of Manhattan in the 1930/40s, or in Asbury Park
NJ, the Israelis, iranians, Bokharan, Yemenite etc. Jews who settle close
together where they can pray in the home-town style, buy hometown foods at
the Kosher Deli--and find spouses for their children. The same happened in
England with the German Jews in the 1930s who settled in close-knit groups
in different areas of London and the UK in general--mostly without any
prior organization, just the desire to have neighbors who spoke the old
language and faced the same problems.

Michael Bernet, New York


Re: We Remember Jewish Bialystok #general

Lalita Claff <lalita@...>
 

I too would like to add my congratulations.
It's breathtaking and very, very moving.
Liora Claff

"Mark Halpern" wrote

It gives me great pleasure to announce the creation of a website
to honor and memorialize the Jews of Bialystok. The website can
be found at http://www.zchor.org/bialystok/bialystok.htm.
Congratulations to Ada, Tomek, Tilford and Mark for this great work!

Alexander Sharon
Calgary


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Fwd: Re: We Remember Jewish Bialystok #general

Lalita Claff <lalita@...>
 

I too would like to add my congratulations.
It's breathtaking and very, very moving.
Liora Claff

"Mark Halpern" wrote

It gives me great pleasure to announce the creation of a website
to honor and memorialize the Jews of Bialystok. The website can
be found at http://www.zchor.org/bialystok/bialystok.htm.
Congratulations to Ada, Tomek, Tilford and Mark for this great work!

Alexander Sharon
Calgary


1939 German census #germany

Frank, Steven <Steven.Frank@...>
 

The museum just received a copy of the 1939 Census the week prior to the
conference. I helped arrange for the computerized version and chatted with
Henry Mayer, the chief archivist, at the conference about it. He found out
from Peter that the database had just come in and was on a special PC drive
at the museum. I'm sure it is only available through the museum at this
time. I don't know if it will be put online. For that you will need to
check with the museum. There probably are the same privacy issues that crop
up with any sharing of such information.

Steve Frank Bethesda, MD steven.frank@em.doe.gov


Tvira Reponses Thank You #general

budblaher@...
 

I wish to thank all those many responses to my quest for locating the
birthplace "Tvira, Russia" that was listed on the U.S. naturalization
papers of the father of my friend and also the friend of my father. I now
have many avenues to investigate. With 2 locations, Tver located
northwest of Moscow will be easy because of the size of the city and
Tverai in Lithuania will be difficult because of its small size. The
Ukraine is a long shot.
Of course, my primary search is the last residence, Perm, Russia, where
Lazor HASKIN and my father grew up. However, the likelihood that more than
one HASKIN family moved to Perm is not very good. There are too many
other good locations between Tverai, or Tver, that was their eastward
destination.

Thanks again.

Morris Blaher
Apopka, Florida USA
budblaher@earthlink.net


German SIG #Germany 1939 German census #germany

Frank, Steven <Steven.Frank@...>
 

The museum just received a copy of the 1939 Census the week prior to the
conference. I helped arrange for the computerized version and chatted with
Henry Mayer, the chief archivist, at the conference about it. He found out
from Peter that the database had just come in and was on a special PC drive
at the museum. I'm sure it is only available through the museum at this
time. I don't know if it will be put online. For that you will need to
check with the museum. There probably are the same privacy issues that crop
up with any sharing of such information.

Steve Frank Bethesda, MD steven.frank@em.doe.gov


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Tvira Reponses Thank You #general

budblaher@...
 

I wish to thank all those many responses to my quest for locating the
birthplace "Tvira, Russia" that was listed on the U.S. naturalization
papers of the father of my friend and also the friend of my father. I now
have many avenues to investigate. With 2 locations, Tver located
northwest of Moscow will be easy because of the size of the city and
Tverai in Lithuania will be difficult because of its small size. The
Ukraine is a long shot.
Of course, my primary search is the last residence, Perm, Russia, where
Lazor HASKIN and my father grew up. However, the likelihood that more than
one HASKIN family moved to Perm is not very good. There are too many
other good locations between Tverai, or Tver, that was their eastward
destination.

Thanks again.

Morris Blaher
Apopka, Florida USA
budblaher@earthlink.net


Karlsruhe death certificate #germany

nancy scholem <nkfisch@...>
 

I have a picture of my great grandfather's grave in Karlsruhe:

Salomon WESTHEIMER 15 September 1855 to 2 August 1936.

I have no idea where he was born, but know it was not Karlsruhe. What is
the best way for me to get his death certificate and thereby possibly
learning his place of birth and his parent's names? Many thanks!

Nancy Scholem New York nkfisch@optonline.net


German SIG #Germany Karlsruhe death certificate #germany

nancy scholem <nkfisch@...>
 

I have a picture of my great grandfather's grave in Karlsruhe:

Salomon WESTHEIMER 15 September 1855 to 2 August 1936.

I have no idea where he was born, but know it was not Karlsruhe. What is
the best way for me to get his death certificate and thereby possibly
learning his place of birth and his parent's names? Many thanks!

Nancy Scholem New York nkfisch@optonline.net


GERNGROSS / ERDMANN #germany

Stephanie Gray <sealed@...>
 

Recently I have come across the names of my g-grandmother's parents in her
Marriage Certificate to Alfred BERNHEIMER. According to my grandmother,
the parents had passed away around when my g-grandmother was was 4 years
old. I am having trouble reading what the actual copy says, but with what I
can decipher, I now have some more information.

Parents: Abraham GERNGROSS and Saly ERDMANN
Death: around 1893
All 4 children Herman, Leo, Rosa, and Fanny (my g-grandmother) were sent to
different relatives. The children were born in Nuremburg.

Would anybody have any information to impart? Or can anyone lead me in a
direction where I could find out more information about Nuremburg and
finding records there? Unfortunately I don't know any German.

I have placed the scanned copy of the marriage certificate at:

http://jjgray.home.mindspring.com/stephanie/FannyAlfredMarriage.htm

Thank you for all of your help,

Stephanie Gray Apex, NC sealed@mindspring.com


Istanbul Microfilming #general

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
 

I am pleased to announce that the Chief Rabbinate's Office in Istanbul has
completed an expanded project of microfilming: they have just finished
microfilming the complete set of Istanbul marriage registers--both
Sephardic and Ashkenazi. In all, this includes more than 3000 pages of
records!

Istanbul marriage records have two parts: index books and full registers.
Note that in the search engine below (based on the marriage index books)
the column marked "Reference" refers to the page and line number in the
original marriage register books.

http://www.asfonline.org/portal/genealogy/turkey/

Dan Kazez

Daniel Kazez < dkazez@wittenberg.edu >
Springfield, Ohio USA
KAZEZ-KAZES, ALHADEF-ELHADEF, FRESKO-FRESCO, HABIB, DEVIDAS-DE VIDAS
http://userpages.wittenberg.edu/dkazez/dk/elh-kaz-fre.html


German SIG #Germany GERNGROSS / ERDMANN #germany

Stephanie Gray <sealed@...>
 

Recently I have come across the names of my g-grandmother's parents in her
Marriage Certificate to Alfred BERNHEIMER. According to my grandmother,
the parents had passed away around when my g-grandmother was was 4 years
old. I am having trouble reading what the actual copy says, but with what I
can decipher, I now have some more information.

Parents: Abraham GERNGROSS and Saly ERDMANN
Death: around 1893
All 4 children Herman, Leo, Rosa, and Fanny (my g-grandmother) were sent to
different relatives. The children were born in Nuremburg.

Would anybody have any information to impart? Or can anyone lead me in a
direction where I could find out more information about Nuremburg and
finding records there? Unfortunately I don't know any German.

I have placed the scanned copy of the marriage certificate at:

http://jjgray.home.mindspring.com/stephanie/FannyAlfredMarriage.htm

Thank you for all of your help,

Stephanie Gray Apex, NC sealed@mindspring.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Istanbul Microfilming #general

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
 

I am pleased to announce that the Chief Rabbinate's Office in Istanbul has
completed an expanded project of microfilming: they have just finished
microfilming the complete set of Istanbul marriage registers--both
Sephardic and Ashkenazi. In all, this includes more than 3000 pages of
records!

Istanbul marriage records have two parts: index books and full registers.
Note that in the search engine below (based on the marriage index books)
the column marked "Reference" refers to the page and line number in the
original marriage register books.

http://www.asfonline.org/portal/genealogy/turkey/

Dan Kazez

Daniel Kazez < dkazez@wittenberg.edu >
Springfield, Ohio USA
KAZEZ-KAZES, ALHADEF-ELHADEF, FRESKO-FRESCO, HABIB, DEVIDAS-DE VIDAS
http://userpages.wittenberg.edu/dkazez/dk/elh-kaz-fre.html