Date   

Re: Unusual Marriage Record Problem #general

Sally Bruckheimer <sallybru@...>
 

What a strange situation! I'm glad to hear that you found the court records
that explain the lack of marriage record.

I would think that the information you want would be in the 1926 records -
the application for the license was filed with the information on it
(parents' names, etc) and that is what you want. If the rabbi did not
return the document or the document was lost, I don't think they would have
thrown out the record of the application. It might not have been included
in a marriage index made in 1926 (as the indexer would have thought that the
marriage never actually took place), so you might need to search the actual
applications, if possible.

If you cannot search the actual records, you might have to settle for the
1935 version.

If you are not near NYC, you might write to the Municipal Archives,
including the information >from the court records that you have. Perhaps
Bruce or someone else there would know what is possible.

Sally Bruckheimer
Chatham, NJ

">from recently uncovered documents, it appears that the record of the=20
marriage, held in the Bronx at the Jacob H. Schiff Center on February 7,
1926 was somehow either *lost* or *not* filed with the Bronx City Clerk by
the Rabbi immediately after the marriage."


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Unusual Marriage Record Problem #general

Sally Bruckheimer <sallybru@...>
 

What a strange situation! I'm glad to hear that you found the court records
that explain the lack of marriage record.

I would think that the information you want would be in the 1926 records -
the application for the license was filed with the information on it
(parents' names, etc) and that is what you want. If the rabbi did not
return the document or the document was lost, I don't think they would have
thrown out the record of the application. It might not have been included
in a marriage index made in 1926 (as the indexer would have thought that the
marriage never actually took place), so you might need to search the actual
applications, if possible.

If you cannot search the actual records, you might have to settle for the
1935 version.

If you are not near NYC, you might write to the Municipal Archives,
including the information >from the court records that you have. Perhaps
Bruce or someone else there would know what is possible.

Sally Bruckheimer
Chatham, NJ

">from recently uncovered documents, it appears that the record of the=20
marriage, held in the Bronx at the Jacob H. Schiff Center on February 7,
1926 was somehow either *lost* or *not* filed with the Bronx City Clerk by
the Rabbi immediately after the marriage."


Re: given name BOBOL #general

Mathilde Tagger <tagger@...>
 

Dear Sonia,

You wrote:
My grandmother's given name was BOBOL.
She was >from Poland. What is the source of this name? Is it nickname?
------>
Bobol derives >from the given name Boba of Slavic origin and that means
'grandmother'.
The affectionate Yiddish ending "le" has been added.
The vowel A was often deformed under slavic/yiddish influence and became O.
from Bobole to Bobol the distance is indeed insignificant.
Shalom,
Mathilde Tagger
Israel Genealogical Society
Jerusalem Branch
Visit: www.isragen.org.il


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: given name BOBOL #general

Mathilde Tagger <tagger@...>
 

Dear Sonia,

You wrote:
My grandmother's given name was BOBOL.
She was >from Poland. What is the source of this name? Is it nickname?
------>
Bobol derives >from the given name Boba of Slavic origin and that means
'grandmother'.
The affectionate Yiddish ending "le" has been added.
The vowel A was often deformed under slavic/yiddish influence and became O.
from Bobole to Bobol the distance is indeed insignificant.
Shalom,
Mathilde Tagger
Israel Genealogical Society
Jerusalem Branch
Visit: www.isragen.org.il


given name BOBOL #general

Abramovich <abramovc@...>
 

Dear Genners,

My grandmother's given name was BOBOL.
She was >from Poland. What is the source of this name? Is it nickname?

Sonia Abramovich
Mevaseret Zion
Israel

researching: KLEINSCHNEIDER (Kamenets Litowski, Grodno, Belarus)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen given name BOBOL #general

Abramovich <abramovc@...>
 

Dear Genners,

My grandmother's given name was BOBOL.
She was >from Poland. What is the source of this name? Is it nickname?

Sonia Abramovich
Mevaseret Zion
Israel

researching: KLEINSCHNEIDER (Kamenets Litowski, Grodno, Belarus)


Looking For Friends From Roxbury Massachusetts #general

stephen field
 

I am looking for friends and neighbors
that lived on Walnut Ave, Iffley Rd, and
Montebello Rd, near Eggelston Square,
and Seaver Street, during the 40's, 50's,
and 60's.
Please contact me at me E mail address:
stemarfie@yahoo.com
Thank you.
Stephen Field


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Looking For Friends From Roxbury Massachusetts #general

stephen field
 

I am looking for friends and neighbors
that lived on Walnut Ave, Iffley Rd, and
Montebello Rd, near Eggelston Square,
and Seaver Street, during the 40's, 50's,
and 60's.
Please contact me at me E mail address:
stemarfie@yahoo.com
Thank you.
Stephen Field


Re: red hair - blue eyes #general

ben.forman <ben.forman@...>
 

There seems to be some attempt to justify whether jews
"should" have red hair/blue eyes or not. This is a genealogy
discussion list and as such i'd like to just point out the
following. The Jewish people inhabit the world, and the
world is full of people who come in all different shapes,
sizes and colours.
It only takes one intermarriage to introduce a whole set of
"non-jewish" genes into a "jewish" genepool. BUT a jewish
and non-jewish genepool are identical anyway they just
contain different percentages of genes expressed. Given that
the jewish diaspora is 2-2500 years old it is hardly
surprising that our genes our expressed in increasingly
similar ratios to our local populations.
As a final note I'd like to tell you about a couple of
examples which prove the futility of this email thread. My
friend who's husband has a father who was a jewish syrian
trader who traded as far as the edge of mongolia and who had
a son with a local woman. The son obviously has a
combination of orientaly expressed genes and arab expressed
genes.
My fiancee has a friend who's father is a palestinian
refugee who went to yugoslavia he married a local woman, his
daughter has blonde hair and blue eyes. Surely an example of
something that must have happened many times over during
ashkenazi history.
And finally myself. I was fortunate enough to have a
chromosome test last year which approximately identifies
where my oldest male (fathers side) and female (mothers
side) ancestors originated. The answer was approximately N
African Berber (male) and Bulgaria/Turkey (Female). My most
recent ancestors are all eastern european. I have dark hair,
skin and eyes, my sister has blonde hair blue eyes and fair
skin - yes we have the same parents.

It has been an interesting thread, and it only proves that
we're all cousins after all, everyone will have something of
everyone if you search back far enough in your family tree -
and that is what we're all trying to do.

Ben
...
Ben Forman

----- Original Message Follows -----
From: TamarDC < t.duke.cohan@rcn.com >

The bible states that Kind David had red
hair. I don't know if this was true, but it does suggest
that at the time, red hair was both known and unusual
(otherwise, it would not have been noteworthy). This
suggests to me that Jews have a history of having red hair
long before the unpleasant events suggested previously.
MODERATOR NOTE: Genetic issues and further discussion of DNA testing should
take place at the DNA (Genealogy by Genetics) mailing list, located at:
http://www.jewishgen.org/dna/


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: red hair - blue eyes #general

ben.forman <ben.forman@...>
 

There seems to be some attempt to justify whether jews
"should" have red hair/blue eyes or not. This is a genealogy
discussion list and as such i'd like to just point out the
following. The Jewish people inhabit the world, and the
world is full of people who come in all different shapes,
sizes and colours.
It only takes one intermarriage to introduce a whole set of
"non-jewish" genes into a "jewish" genepool. BUT a jewish
and non-jewish genepool are identical anyway they just
contain different percentages of genes expressed. Given that
the jewish diaspora is 2-2500 years old it is hardly
surprising that our genes our expressed in increasingly
similar ratios to our local populations.
As a final note I'd like to tell you about a couple of
examples which prove the futility of this email thread. My
friend who's husband has a father who was a jewish syrian
trader who traded as far as the edge of mongolia and who had
a son with a local woman. The son obviously has a
combination of orientaly expressed genes and arab expressed
genes.
My fiancee has a friend who's father is a palestinian
refugee who went to yugoslavia he married a local woman, his
daughter has blonde hair and blue eyes. Surely an example of
something that must have happened many times over during
ashkenazi history.
And finally myself. I was fortunate enough to have a
chromosome test last year which approximately identifies
where my oldest male (fathers side) and female (mothers
side) ancestors originated. The answer was approximately N
African Berber (male) and Bulgaria/Turkey (Female). My most
recent ancestors are all eastern european. I have dark hair,
skin and eyes, my sister has blonde hair blue eyes and fair
skin - yes we have the same parents.

It has been an interesting thread, and it only proves that
we're all cousins after all, everyone will have something of
everyone if you search back far enough in your family tree -
and that is what we're all trying to do.

Ben
...
Ben Forman

----- Original Message Follows -----
From: TamarDC < t.duke.cohan@rcn.com >

The bible states that Kind David had red
hair. I don't know if this was true, but it does suggest
that at the time, red hair was both known and unusual
(otherwise, it would not have been noteworthy). This
suggests to me that Jews have a history of having red hair
long before the unpleasant events suggested previously.
MODERATOR NOTE: Genetic issues and further discussion of DNA testing should
take place at the DNA (Genealogy by Genetics) mailing list, located at:
http://www.jewishgen.org/dna/


Hannah Joseph #unitedkingdom

GRAHAM LEWIS
 

I have obtained a certified copy of the death certificate of HANNAH JOSEPH
which gives the following details:

Date of death : 9 April 1856
Name: Hannah Joseph
Age: 43
Occupation: Wife of David Joseph, a jeweller
Informant: Tobias Joseph
Registration district: Sunderland

This HANNAH is not the one I was looking for.
If anyone would like this certificate, please let me know and I will gladly
post it to you (no charge).

Graham Lewis
London


JCR-UK SIG #UnitedKingdom Hannah Joseph #unitedkingdom

GRAHAM LEWIS
 

I have obtained a certified copy of the death certificate of HANNAH JOSEPH
which gives the following details:

Date of death : 9 April 1856
Name: Hannah Joseph
Age: 43
Occupation: Wife of David Joseph, a jeweller
Informant: Tobias Joseph
Registration district: Sunderland

This HANNAH is not the one I was looking for.
If anyone would like this certificate, please let me know and I will gladly
post it to you (no charge).

Graham Lewis
London


Re: Red hair & blue eyes #general

Al Yellon <me@...>
 

shirleyb@ix.netcom.com (Shirley) wrote:

My father's side of the family is >from a single shetl in the Ukraine
(Smela). Blue eyes and blond or red hair is predominant. >from the
research I've been able to do so far it looks like three families
narrowed the gene pool by intermarrying repeatedly.
This may be a cause of many such incidents. My grandmother and grandfather
were first cousins once removed.

Both my mother and father had blond hair and blue eyes, as do I. My wife has
brown hair and brown eyes. I have a brown-haired, brown-eyed son and a blond-
haired, brown-eyed daughter.

Perhaps the blue eyes will skip a generation, though I won't know for a while
-- my eldest is still only 12!

To contact me use the following: itghtfr02 (at) sneakemail (dot) com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Red hair & blue eyes #general

Al Yellon <me@...>
 

shirleyb@ix.netcom.com (Shirley) wrote:

My father's side of the family is >from a single shetl in the Ukraine
(Smela). Blue eyes and blond or red hair is predominant. >from the
research I've been able to do so far it looks like three families
narrowed the gene pool by intermarrying repeatedly.
This may be a cause of many such incidents. My grandmother and grandfather
were first cousins once removed.

Both my mother and father had blond hair and blue eyes, as do I. My wife has
brown hair and brown eyes. I have a brown-haired, brown-eyed son and a blond-
haired, brown-eyed daughter.

Perhaps the blue eyes will skip a generation, though I won't know for a while
-- my eldest is still only 12!

To contact me use the following: itghtfr02 (at) sneakemail (dot) com


red hair, blue eyes and rape #general

Ellie Weld <ellieweld@...>
 

I have come late to this discussion, but I find it most intriguing. My
mother was one of five children, four girls and a boy. She and my uncle
were fair-skinned, blond and blue-eyed. Two of her sisters had reddish
auburn hair and brown eyes, while the other sister was dark-haired and
dark-eyed. I have no idea what my maternal grandparents' colouring was,
but they had emigrated >from Hungary and Poland.

This had always seemed perfectly unexceptional to me, until a few years ago
the husband of one of my aunts told me (half-joking, half serious) that he
believed a female ancestor must have been raped by a Cossack, and that that
accounted for the colouring of his late wife and her siblings. Although I
don't really believe this story, there is a part of me that wonders about
it. Am I perhaps not Jewish after all?

Ellie Weld
Twickenham, Mddx, England

Searching for: ABRAHAMS (England, South Africa), ROSENZWEIG (Poland,
Sweden), LANDESMAN (Hungary/Slovakia), RUBINSTEIN (Lithuania)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen red hair, blue eyes and rape #general

Ellie Weld <ellieweld@...>
 

I have come late to this discussion, but I find it most intriguing. My
mother was one of five children, four girls and a boy. She and my uncle
were fair-skinned, blond and blue-eyed. Two of her sisters had reddish
auburn hair and brown eyes, while the other sister was dark-haired and
dark-eyed. I have no idea what my maternal grandparents' colouring was,
but they had emigrated >from Hungary and Poland.

This had always seemed perfectly unexceptional to me, until a few years ago
the husband of one of my aunts told me (half-joking, half serious) that he
believed a female ancestor must have been raped by a Cossack, and that that
accounted for the colouring of his late wife and her siblings. Although I
don't really believe this story, there is a part of me that wonders about
it. Am I perhaps not Jewish after all?

Ellie Weld
Twickenham, Mddx, England

Searching for: ABRAHAMS (England, South Africa), ROSENZWEIG (Poland,
Sweden), LANDESMAN (Hungary/Slovakia), RUBINSTEIN (Lithuania)


Re: warszawa telephone directory at the Library of Congress #warsaw #poland

Sarah LM Christiansen <SarahLMC@...>
 

Are there any search guides to this directory ?

Sarah L. M. Christiansen
Reserarching: ANK(I)ER, BIGOS, FRUM or FROM, GELBFISH, KARMEL(EK),
PASSENSTEIN, PERLSTADT (any spelling), SZPILBAUM and WAGNER >from Warsaw

Subject: Re: [warszawa]
From: "Nicole BERLINE" <nberline@club-internet.fr>
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:49:15 +0100
X-Message-Number: 3

Serge,
An interesting source for inhabitants of pre-war Warsaw and suburbs is
the
1938-1939 Warsaw telephone directory,
Spis abonentow warszawskiej sieci telefonow Polskiej Akcyjnej Spolki
Telefonicznej i rzadowej warsz. sieci okregowej
online at the Library of Congress
http://www.loc.gov/rr/european/pdir/poldir.html
I did not find any HUBERMAN in Otwock, ( part II of the directory) but
there
are some in Warszawa- Praga ( part I) .
I did not find WAJNFLASZ either. Of course your family may not have had
the
telephone, although surprisingly many families did.
I found several exemples where the abonment was in the name of the
wife's
parents...
Good luck. Off the list we can correspond in french.
Nicole BERLINE , Paris
ROTENSZTEJN ROCHMAN RAKOWER Warsaw
TREIVAS StPetersburg OGUS Kowno BERLIN Derechin Slonim


Warszawa Research Group #Warsaw #Poland RE: warszawa telephone directory at the Library of Congress #warsaw #poland

Sarah LM Christiansen <SarahLMC@...>
 

Are there any search guides to this directory ?

Sarah L. M. Christiansen
Reserarching: ANK(I)ER, BIGOS, FRUM or FROM, GELBFISH, KARMEL(EK),
PASSENSTEIN, PERLSTADT (any spelling), SZPILBAUM and WAGNER >from Warsaw

Subject: Re: [warszawa]
From: "Nicole BERLINE" <nberline@club-internet.fr>
Date: Mon, 7 Feb 2005 20:49:15 +0100
X-Message-Number: 3

Serge,
An interesting source for inhabitants of pre-war Warsaw and suburbs is
the
1938-1939 Warsaw telephone directory,
Spis abonentow warszawskiej sieci telefonow Polskiej Akcyjnej Spolki
Telefonicznej i rzadowej warsz. sieci okregowej
online at the Library of Congress
http://www.loc.gov/rr/european/pdir/poldir.html
I did not find any HUBERMAN in Otwock, ( part II of the directory) but
there
are some in Warszawa- Praga ( part I) .
I did not find WAJNFLASZ either. Of course your family may not have had
the
telephone, although surprisingly many families did.
I found several exemples where the abonment was in the name of the
wife's
parents...
Good luck. Off the list we can correspond in french.
Nicole BERLINE , Paris
ROTENSZTEJN ROCHMAN RAKOWER Warsaw
TREIVAS StPetersburg OGUS Kowno BERLIN Derechin Slonim


Genealogy and Mixed Marriage #general

Beryl. B <balden@...>
 

I posed a very relevant, important message re
"Genealogy and Mixed Marriage" and have been
following the replies over the past few days.

I have to admit that I am shocked at some of the
reaction of which I will not go into detail. Everything
that has until now been written has fully covered the
subject.

I hope the Moderator will now decide to close this
thread.

Beryl Baleson
Israel.


Looking for Martin Eagle #general

arie meir
 

Hi to all of you

If somebody knows how I can reach Martin Eagle (I hope the name is
pronounced correctly ), who was a survivor >from Przemysl please contact me

Arieh Mayer

Haifa Israel

MODERATOR NOTE: Please reply privately.