Date   

Re: meanings of first names from europe #germany

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 6/13/2004 chaikin@bezeqint.net writes:
Verde. The closest Hebrew name is Varda [female], which is the Hebrew for Lily.

Actually, there seems to be a little confusion here. Shoshannah in "popular"
Hebrew was long understood to be rose. It is not so, Shoshannat Hasharon is
the "Lily" not the "rose" of Sharon.

**The correct Hebrew name for rose is vered (pl. vradim). That is a common
girl's name now, and the correct translation of the names Rosa, Rosie etc.

** [MODERATOR NOTE: When making a statement that the opinion of another member
is not completely correct and that another version of the "truth" is more correct,
GerSig would prefer that the critic provide sources for the statement.

If he can provide no source, he (or she) should make it clear that the statement
is personal opinion.

Thus, the sentence above should read: * In my opinion, the correct Hebrew name for
rose is vered (pl. vradim).* This comment is written for ALL GerSig members, not
only the writer of this message. My comment is inserted here because this writer
happened to provide a good illustration of how this rule should be applied. END]

The female Vered or Vardah name were, to the best of my knowledge, created in
Israel in the early 20th century; I could not find it among Beider's first names.

Michael Bernet, New York mbernet@aol.com


German SIG #Germany Re: meanings of first names from europe #germany

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 6/13/2004 chaikin@bezeqint.net writes:
Verde. The closest Hebrew name is Varda [female], which is the Hebrew for Lily.

Actually, there seems to be a little confusion here. Shoshannah in "popular"
Hebrew was long understood to be rose. It is not so, Shoshannat Hasharon is
the "Lily" not the "rose" of Sharon.

**The correct Hebrew name for rose is vered (pl. vradim). That is a common
girl's name now, and the correct translation of the names Rosa, Rosie etc.

** [MODERATOR NOTE: When making a statement that the opinion of another member
is not completely correct and that another version of the "truth" is more correct,
GerSig would prefer that the critic provide sources for the statement.

If he can provide no source, he (or she) should make it clear that the statement
is personal opinion.

Thus, the sentence above should read: * In my opinion, the correct Hebrew name for
rose is vered (pl. vradim).* This comment is written for ALL GerSig members, not
only the writer of this message. My comment is inserted here because this writer
happened to provide a good illustration of how this rule should be applied. END]

The female Vered or Vardah name were, to the best of my knowledge, created in
Israel in the early 20th century; I could not find it among Beider's first names.

Michael Bernet, New York mbernet@aol.com


Re: More on Basch/Boas family of Graetz, Prussia (1830's) #germany

chaikin <chaikin@...>
 

Shimon (Steven) Frais wrote:
The consensus of opinion is that he was a
BASCH, even though he wrote his name with a "Samach" at the end.

=In his recent note he wrote also:

It anyone is familiar with Hebrew spelling, this signature is written
"beit", "aleph" (with a "T" shape vowel under the aleph), "aleph" (with a
hyphen shaped vowel under this letter), "samech".

=The "T" shape is the Hebrew punctuation "kamatz", and a hyphen shaped vowel
under this letter is called "patach".
A "kamatz" under the aleph is definitely the pronunciation O !
A "patach" under the aleph is definitely the pronunciation A !
Therefore, [in my opinion] BO-AS (or BO-AZ), and in no way BAS !

Best regards, Udi Cain, near Jerusalem.


German SIG #Germany Re: More on Basch/Boas family of Graetz, Prussia (1830's) #germany

chaikin <chaikin@...>
 

Shimon (Steven) Frais wrote:
The consensus of opinion is that he was a
BASCH, even though he wrote his name with a "Samach" at the end.

=In his recent note he wrote also:

It anyone is familiar with Hebrew spelling, this signature is written
"beit", "aleph" (with a "T" shape vowel under the aleph), "aleph" (with a
hyphen shaped vowel under this letter), "samech".

=The "T" shape is the Hebrew punctuation "kamatz", and a hyphen shaped vowel
under this letter is called "patach".
A "kamatz" under the aleph is definitely the pronunciation O !
A "patach" under the aleph is definitely the pronunciation A !
Therefore, [in my opinion] BO-AS (or BO-AZ), and in no way BAS !

Best regards, Udi Cain, near Jerusalem.


Medical advice #germany

Yekkey@...
 

Cape Verde is not a part of Senegal. It is a group of islands off the coast
of Senegal and an independent republic. I know this because I live in one of
the largest Cape Verdean enclaves in North America, New Bedford, Massachusetts.

Many of my patients are Cape Verdean. They speak an interesting dialect of
Portuguese, (I do not wish to get into the discussion of whether it is a
separate language) and many light candles on Friday nights.

Most scholars agree that "vered" and "shoshana" meant lily and/or rose.
However, which meant which is still up for grabs.

Most Jewish onamasticians disagree with Kaganoff about "Falk." They think it
is a diminutive for Raphael, not a kinui for Joshua.

Dan Nussbaum New Bedford, Massachusetts


German SIG #Germany Medical advice #germany

Yekkey@...
 

Cape Verde is not a part of Senegal. It is a group of islands off the coast
of Senegal and an independent republic. I know this because I live in one of
the largest Cape Verdean enclaves in North America, New Bedford, Massachusetts.

Many of my patients are Cape Verdean. They speak an interesting dialect of
Portuguese, (I do not wish to get into the discussion of whether it is a
separate language) and many light candles on Friday nights.

Most scholars agree that "vered" and "shoshana" meant lily and/or rose.
However, which meant which is still up for grabs.

Most Jewish onamasticians disagree with Kaganoff about "Falk." They think it
is a diminutive for Raphael, not a kinui for Joshua.

Dan Nussbaum New Bedford, Massachusetts


Re: meanings of first names from europe #germany

Eve Richardson <erchrdsn@...>
 

I see that Beryl is described by listers as a "male" name, used for "bear"
or the Hebrew Dov. My father had a sister named Beryl; beryl is a type of
stone which includes aquamarines and emeralds.

Eve Richardson, Toronto, Canada erchrdsn@pathcom.com


German SIG #Germany Re: meanings of first names from europe #germany

Eve Richardson <erchrdsn@...>
 

I see that Beryl is described by listers as a "male" name, used for "bear"
or the Hebrew Dov. My father had a sister named Beryl; beryl is a type of
stone which includes aquamarines and emeralds.

Eve Richardson, Toronto, Canada erchrdsn@pathcom.com


Re: Broedling #germany

Andreas Schwab <andreas.schwab@...>
 

Broedling (Brodling) a spelling variant of Broetling (Brotling, o-umlaut)

According to Adelung:
http://mdz.bib-bvb.de:80/digbib/lexika/adelung/
@Generic__CollectionView;cs=default;ts=default

Broetling is a servant or an employee, somebody who obtains his bread
(Brot) >from his employer (Brotherr).

In the Leutershausen Matrikel, my G-g-grandfather Aron ROSENFELD is
listed as a "Broedling der Gemeinde" (Employee of the Kehillah).

Actually, he was the Chairman of the Kehillah. Another "Broedling" was
the teacher and cantor Loew Samuel SUTRO.

Andreas Schwab, Montreal, Canada <andreas.schwab@mcgill.ca>


German SIG #Germany Re: Broedling #germany

Andreas Schwab <andreas.schwab@...>
 

Broedling (Brodling) a spelling variant of Broetling (Brotling, o-umlaut)

According to Adelung:
http://mdz.bib-bvb.de:80/digbib/lexika/adelung/
@Generic__CollectionView;cs=default;ts=default

Broetling is a servant or an employee, somebody who obtains his bread
(Brot) >from his employer (Brotherr).

In the Leutershausen Matrikel, my G-g-grandfather Aron ROSENFELD is
listed as a "Broedling der Gemeinde" (Employee of the Kehillah).

Actually, he was the Chairman of the Kehillah. Another "Broedling" was
the teacher and cantor Loew Samuel SUTRO.

Andreas Schwab, Montreal, Canada <andreas.schwab@mcgill.ca>


Re: BASCH #germany

Ury Link
 

Dear Genners,
Iets van Straten give in his book "Jewish Surnames in Amsterdam", Bennekom
2002 on page 157 the name of a family with the acronym name B"Sj (Bet - Shin)
what is Brile Slijper waht mean a optician. Also he said that it can be
Brile Socher what mean some one who deal in glasses.

Paul Levy in his book "Les noms des Israelites en France", Paris 1960 on page 106
give his explanation to the name BASCH as a name that is comparble with the name
BASS . Under the name BASS he said that this name is comparble with (BASCH),
CANTOR and SINGER.

Eliezer Rabinowich in his article in "Reshumot" (a chronicle ) , Devir
publishing, Tel Aviv 1927 on page 310 give a explanation to the name BASCH
that it is a acronym of B"Sh (Bet - Shin) and it mean Bat Sheva. Bat Sheva
is a Biblicale women given name.

Meir Heilperin in his book " Ha-Notrikon, Ha-Simanim Ve-Hakinuim" Darom
publishing,Jerusalem 1930 on page 53 said the same as Rabinowich that the
name BASCH is a acronym of B"S (Bet - Shin) and it mean Bat Sheva and the
origin of this family are >from Prague. By the way, Alexander Beider in his
book "Jewish Surnames in Prague", Avotaynu 1995 on page 30 give only the
name BASS as a bass-viol or contrabass but not as BASCH.
But Mr Beider give the acronym B"S (Bet - Shin) as Bier-Schenk like the
same what Mrs. Gutman do in a letter >from today to the digest.

William Stern in "Udim zeitschrift der Rabbinerkonferenz in der
Bundesrepublik Deutschland", Frankfurt am Main 1973 on page 132 give the
explanation that the family name BASCH is a acronym of B"S (Bet - Shin) and
it mean Ben Shimeon or BRASCH = Ben Rabi Shimeon.

I think that it is enough explanation for the name BASCH as a acronym. We can get
more explanation for the acronym B"S like Ben Shemuel, Ben Shabtai, Ben Shimson,
Ben Shlomo etc.......

My favorite explanation is that BASCH is a cantor, but this is only my opinion.
All the books that I mentioned are in my home so I have the information directly
from the books. Best regards.
Ury Link Amsterdam Holland


German SIG #Germany Re: BASCH #germany

Ury Link
 

Dear Genners,
Iets van Straten give in his book "Jewish Surnames in Amsterdam", Bennekom
2002 on page 157 the name of a family with the acronym name B"Sj (Bet - Shin)
what is Brile Slijper waht mean a optician. Also he said that it can be
Brile Socher what mean some one who deal in glasses.

Paul Levy in his book "Les noms des Israelites en France", Paris 1960 on page 106
give his explanation to the name BASCH as a name that is comparble with the name
BASS . Under the name BASS he said that this name is comparble with (BASCH),
CANTOR and SINGER.

Eliezer Rabinowich in his article in "Reshumot" (a chronicle ) , Devir
publishing, Tel Aviv 1927 on page 310 give a explanation to the name BASCH
that it is a acronym of B"Sh (Bet - Shin) and it mean Bat Sheva. Bat Sheva
is a Biblicale women given name.

Meir Heilperin in his book " Ha-Notrikon, Ha-Simanim Ve-Hakinuim" Darom
publishing,Jerusalem 1930 on page 53 said the same as Rabinowich that the
name BASCH is a acronym of B"S (Bet - Shin) and it mean Bat Sheva and the
origin of this family are >from Prague. By the way, Alexander Beider in his
book "Jewish Surnames in Prague", Avotaynu 1995 on page 30 give only the
name BASS as a bass-viol or contrabass but not as BASCH.
But Mr Beider give the acronym B"S (Bet - Shin) as Bier-Schenk like the
same what Mrs. Gutman do in a letter >from today to the digest.

William Stern in "Udim zeitschrift der Rabbinerkonferenz in der
Bundesrepublik Deutschland", Frankfurt am Main 1973 on page 132 give the
explanation that the family name BASCH is a acronym of B"S (Bet - Shin) and
it mean Ben Shimeon or BRASCH = Ben Rabi Shimeon.

I think that it is enough explanation for the name BASCH as a acronym. We can get
more explanation for the acronym B"S like Ben Shemuel, Ben Shabtai, Ben Shimson,
Ben Shlomo etc.......

My favorite explanation is that BASCH is a cantor, but this is only my opinion.
All the books that I mentioned are in my home so I have the information directly
from the books. Best regards.
Ury Link Amsterdam Holland


Re: Jewish Naming Conventions #germany

Michael Marx <MHMarx@...>
 

I wanted to thank the many people who responded, mostly by private
email, to my inquiry about Jewish naming patterns with respect to
patronymics vs. surnames. I wish I could report back a clear consensus
on this subject, but it appears that (as the MOD noted), traditions
varied depending on time, place and other factors. In some cases, Jews
had permanent family surnames before the civil registration laws
required them; in other cases it appears that Jews may have used both
surnames and patronymics. I had hoped that a clear pattern would
facilitate research, particularly those records before the 19th
century, but it seems that the only thing certain in this regard is
that nothing is certain.

Michael Marx, Lexington, MA, USA MHMarx@alum.mit.edu


German SIG #Germany Re: Jewish Naming Conventions #germany

Michael Marx <MHMarx@...>
 

I wanted to thank the many people who responded, mostly by private
email, to my inquiry about Jewish naming patterns with respect to
patronymics vs. surnames. I wish I could report back a clear consensus
on this subject, but it appears that (as the MOD noted), traditions
varied depending on time, place and other factors. In some cases, Jews
had permanent family surnames before the civil registration laws
required them; in other cases it appears that Jews may have used both
surnames and patronymics. I had hoped that a clear pattern would
facilitate research, particularly those records before the 19th
century, but it seems that the only thing certain in this regard is
that nothing is certain.

Michael Marx, Lexington, MA, USA MHMarx@alum.mit.edu


GRUENEBAUM family of Gambach bei Butzbach, Oberhessen #germany

Ralph N. Baer <RalphNBaer@...>
 

This is a major update and correction of a message that I posted on Gersig
in September 2003. Gambach is a town in the Oberhessen exclave of what was
once Hessen-Darmstadt. It is now part of the city of Muenzenberg, near
Butzbach and a few miles south of Giessen.

I am a third great-grandson of Kaufmann GRUENEBAUM (1757 - 22 April 1840
Gambach). He was married twice. I do not know the name of his first wife,
but his second wife, my third great-grandmother, was named Siesa (Suess).
The previous message called her Siera -- this was a misreading back in the 1930's.

He had the following children, all except for the first were children of Siesa.

1)Schoenle GRUENEBAUM 1792 probably Gambach, married in 1816 to ?, lived in Staden

2) Sarabas GRUENEBAUM 1794 probably Gambach

3) Joseph GRUENEBAUM 1796 probably Gambach - 19 November 1846 Gambach, married to
Malchen STRAUSS about 1809 Geiss-Nidda - 10 September 1877 Gambach

4) Guedel GRUENEBAUM 1798 probably Gambach, married 1817 Muenzenberg to ?

5) Moses GRUENEBAUM 1804 Gambach - 15 April 1871 Gambach, cut-goods trader,
married 2 April 1832 Gambach to Babette (Liebet, Betha) ROSENBAUM 1810 Gambach - 7
June 1852 Gambach

6) Graile (Carolina) GRUENEBAUM 1806 Gambach, married 10 March 1846
Muschenheim to Joseph BAMBERGER about 1800 Muschenheim

7) Jesaias (Scheier) GRUENEBAUM 1809 Gambach - 20 May 1823 Gambach

8) Rebeca (Riefgen) GRUENEBAUM 1812 Gambach, married 3 December 1835
Kirchgoens to Isaac MAIER Kirchgoens

I am very interested in adding to what I know about these people and their
descendants. I am even more interested in finding out about earlier ancestors.

I have not yet had the opportunity to look through records that the Mormons
have copied for Staden and Muenzenberg which should have further data on the
families of Schoenle and Guedel. Has anyone copied these records?

Many descendants of this family moved to the US, especially Baltimore, in
the 19th century. The spelling GREENEBAUM was usually used. This included
my great-grandmother Caroline, a daughter of Moses, who married my
great-grandfather Nathan Carl BAER in New York on 15 May 1867. They
returned to Germany about 1873.

Ralph N. Baer Washington, DC RalphNBaer@aol.com


German SIG #Germany GRUENEBAUM family of Gambach bei Butzbach, Oberhessen #germany

Ralph N. Baer <RalphNBaer@...>
 

This is a major update and correction of a message that I posted on Gersig
in September 2003. Gambach is a town in the Oberhessen exclave of what was
once Hessen-Darmstadt. It is now part of the city of Muenzenberg, near
Butzbach and a few miles south of Giessen.

I am a third great-grandson of Kaufmann GRUENEBAUM (1757 - 22 April 1840
Gambach). He was married twice. I do not know the name of his first wife,
but his second wife, my third great-grandmother, was named Siesa (Suess).
The previous message called her Siera -- this was a misreading back in the 1930's.

He had the following children, all except for the first were children of Siesa.

1)Schoenle GRUENEBAUM 1792 probably Gambach, married in 1816 to ?, lived in Staden

2) Sarabas GRUENEBAUM 1794 probably Gambach

3) Joseph GRUENEBAUM 1796 probably Gambach - 19 November 1846 Gambach, married to
Malchen STRAUSS about 1809 Geiss-Nidda - 10 September 1877 Gambach

4) Guedel GRUENEBAUM 1798 probably Gambach, married 1817 Muenzenberg to ?

5) Moses GRUENEBAUM 1804 Gambach - 15 April 1871 Gambach, cut-goods trader,
married 2 April 1832 Gambach to Babette (Liebet, Betha) ROSENBAUM 1810 Gambach - 7
June 1852 Gambach

6) Graile (Carolina) GRUENEBAUM 1806 Gambach, married 10 March 1846
Muschenheim to Joseph BAMBERGER about 1800 Muschenheim

7) Jesaias (Scheier) GRUENEBAUM 1809 Gambach - 20 May 1823 Gambach

8) Rebeca (Riefgen) GRUENEBAUM 1812 Gambach, married 3 December 1835
Kirchgoens to Isaac MAIER Kirchgoens

I am very interested in adding to what I know about these people and their
descendants. I am even more interested in finding out about earlier ancestors.

I have not yet had the opportunity to look through records that the Mormons
have copied for Staden and Muenzenberg which should have further data on the
families of Schoenle and Guedel. Has anyone copied these records?

Many descendants of this family moved to the US, especially Baltimore, in
the 19th century. The spelling GREENEBAUM was usually used. This included
my great-grandmother Caroline, a daughter of Moses, who married my
great-grandfather Nathan Carl BAER in New York on 15 May 1867. They
returned to Germany about 1873.

Ralph N. Baer Washington, DC RalphNBaer@aol.com


Lithuanian State Archives #general

e-jbonkes <e-jbonkes@...>
 

Has anyone had success with the Lithuanian State Archives?
I have two different addresses but do not know which is
the correct one to write to. Also do you have to pay when
sending in a request, or can you pay later.?
How much would it be?

Thank you group.

Edna Bonkes.
B.C. Canada.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Lithuanian State Archives #general

e-jbonkes <e-jbonkes@...>
 

Has anyone had success with the Lithuanian State Archives?
I have two different addresses but do not know which is
the correct one to write to. Also do you have to pay when
sending in a request, or can you pay later.?
How much would it be?

Thank you group.

Edna Bonkes.
B.C. Canada.


REISS from Synowodsko (or Skole) #general

Israel P
 

I am looking for descendants of (Simche) Alter REISS of
Synowodsko or Skole (East Galicia). We know of daughters
Blime-Jutte (1892) and Eige (1895), plus three others who died
as children, but there may have been others.

Israel Pickholtz


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen REISS from Synowodsko (or Skole) #general

Israel P
 

I am looking for descendants of (Simche) Alter REISS of
Synowodsko or Skole (East Galicia). We know of daughters
Blime-Jutte (1892) and Eige (1895), plus three others who died
as children, but there may have been others.

Israel Pickholtz