Date   

Abraham WENGER #yiddish

Sara Lynns
 

my uncle (Abraham WENGER) >from Russia is
listed in the 1920 census as a musician.
I am a member of my Jewish gen group and
tried several venues with my search.
no success YET.

appreciate your help
Jackie Lerner-Aderman

Moderator's note: Please reply privately.


Yiddish Theatre and Vadeville #YiddishTheatre Abraham WENGER #yiddish

Sara Lynns
 

my uncle (Abraham WENGER) >from Russia is
listed in the 1920 census as a musician.
I am a member of my Jewish gen group and
tried several venues with my search.
no success YET.

appreciate your help
Jackie Lerner-Aderman

Moderator's note: Please reply privately.


Re: interim residences before leaving for the US, etc. #general

Sally M. Bruckheimer <sallybru@...>
 

People moved around a lot more than most of us think! My grandfather was
supposed to have been born in Berdichev, and his brother, just a year or 2
younger said Odessa.

A lot depends on the exact question which was asked, also. 'Where were you
born' is different than'Where are you from' and both might get a different
answer than 'Where did you last live [before getting on this ship, perhaps].
For one cousin of mine, born 1868 or so, the first would be Marseilles,
France, the second, Augustow, Poland, the third, England. I have his
written answers to go on >from various documents.

So don't give up hope. Think about the answers and the questions and look
in all the places you might find more records.

Sally Bruckheimer
Chatham, NJ

"Since I never heard mention of
Lipkany before and since it is over 100 miles >from Starokonstantinov
(Ukraine), the place I've heretofore believed to be my ancestral home town,
I wonder if many Jews took up residence briefly in locations other than
their actual shtetlach of origin before departing for the US or other
countries."


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: interim residences before leaving for the US, etc. #general

Sally M. Bruckheimer <sallybru@...>
 

People moved around a lot more than most of us think! My grandfather was
supposed to have been born in Berdichev, and his brother, just a year or 2
younger said Odessa.

A lot depends on the exact question which was asked, also. 'Where were you
born' is different than'Where are you from' and both might get a different
answer than 'Where did you last live [before getting on this ship, perhaps].
For one cousin of mine, born 1868 or so, the first would be Marseilles,
France, the second, Augustow, Poland, the third, England. I have his
written answers to go on >from various documents.

So don't give up hope. Think about the answers and the questions and look
in all the places you might find more records.

Sally Bruckheimer
Chatham, NJ

"Since I never heard mention of
Lipkany before and since it is over 100 miles >from Starokonstantinov
(Ukraine), the place I've heretofore believed to be my ancestral home town,
I wonder if many Jews took up residence briefly in locations other than
their actual shtetlach of origin before departing for the US or other
countries."


Re: interim residences before leaving for the US, etc. #general

Ida & Joseph Schwarcz
 

My parents were refugees in Kishinev, Bessarabia, then Romania, 1919-1923.
My father's siblings were there too, and left for the US shortly before my
parents left. They are listed as coming >from Bucharest! My parents left from
Costanza but on their manifest it lists their home towns in Ukraine. So a
lot depends on who filled out the forms, how the questions were asked, and
how much the respondents wanted to reveal.
Ida Selavan Selavan
Arad, Israel

Dr. Joseph M. Schwarcz
Dr. Ida Selavan Schwarcz
Tappuah 7/3, Arad
IL-89053, Israel

-----Original Message-----
From: Evan Fishman [mailto:ebf2001@comcast.net]
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 9:08 PM
Genners,

Thanks to all who responded to my query about the correct transcription of a
town listed on a manifest. Most replies suggested Lipkany, (Moldova) as the
correct rendition. >snip<

... I wonder if many Jews took up residence briefly in locations other than
their actual shtetlach of origin before departing for the US or other
countries.


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine RE: interim residences before leaving for the US, etc. #ukraine

Ida & Joseph Schwarcz
 

My parents were refugees in Kishinev, Bessarabia, then Romania, 1919-1923.
My father's siblings were there too, and left for the US shortly before my
parents left. They are listed as coming >from Bucharest! My parents left from
Costanza but on their manifest it lists their home towns in Ukraine. So a
lot depends on who filled out the forms, how the questions were asked, and
how much the respondents wanted to reveal.
Ida Selavan Selavan
Arad, Israel

Dr. Joseph M. Schwarcz
Dr. Ida Selavan Schwarcz
Tappuah 7/3, Arad
IL-89053, Israel

-----Original Message-----
From: Evan Fishman [mailto:ebf2001@comcast.net]
Sent: Wednesday, September 01, 2004 9:08 PM
Genners,

Thanks to all who responded to my query about the correct transcription of a
town listed on a manifest. Most replies suggested Lipkany, (Moldova) as the
correct rendition. >snip<

... I wonder if many Jews took up residence briefly in locations other than
their actual shtetlach of origin before departing for the US or other
countries.


interim residences before leaving for the US, etc RE: #ukraine

Tamar Dothan <dothan-t@...>
 

In reply o Evan Fishman:

One more reason to leave one's town was to escape pogroms. Knowing the
period of immigration would help you determine if that could have been your
family's reason for leaving.

About a month ago I was given a letter my grandfather had written in 1922
from Chortkov, a town I never knew he had lived in. He describes it as an
"interim residence" for many Jewish refugees including his own family, and
refers to their place of origin as "eretz hadamim" ="bloody country". It
seems he first took his family out of Dunayevtze, in Podolia, their home
town, to escape danger. It took him several more months in Chortkov to make
all the arrangments for further travel .

Sincerely,

Tamar Dothan

Jerusalem, Israel


Looking for: EDELMAN ->from Keidan and Kraziai; SROELOV- >from Keidan,
Siaulenai and USA; SMILG->from Keidan; LEVIN->from Keidan and Paris;

YOSEPOV and LUTZKY ->from Zhvanetz; LERNER->from Dunayevtze, Minkovtsy,
Kitaigorod and Tiraspol; LISSIN->from Dunayevtze.


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine interim residences before leaving for the US, etc RE: #ukraine

Tamar Dothan <dothan-t@...>
 

In reply o Evan Fishman:

One more reason to leave one's town was to escape pogroms. Knowing the
period of immigration would help you determine if that could have been your
family's reason for leaving.

About a month ago I was given a letter my grandfather had written in 1922
from Chortkov, a town I never knew he had lived in. He describes it as an
"interim residence" for many Jewish refugees including his own family, and
refers to their place of origin as "eretz hadamim" ="bloody country". It
seems he first took his family out of Dunayevtze, in Podolia, their home
town, to escape danger. It took him several more months in Chortkov to make
all the arrangments for further travel .

Sincerely,

Tamar Dothan

Jerusalem, Israel


Looking for: EDELMAN ->from Keidan and Kraziai; SROELOV- >from Keidan,
Siaulenai and USA; SMILG->from Keidan; LEVIN->from Keidan and Paris;

YOSEPOV and LUTZKY ->from Zhvanetz; LERNER->from Dunayevtze, Minkovtsy,
Kitaigorod and Tiraspol; LISSIN->from Dunayevtze.


Re: interim residences before leaving for the US, etc. #general

Michelle Frager <lulu_brooks@...>
 

Dear Evan Fishman et al:

In my family and research experience, people didn't necessarily go
directly >from the shtetl to the boat without a break in the journey,
sometimes of months. Reasons often included the need for additional
funds, temporary or mild illness, or the need for further travel
arrangements to the sailing point.

People stayed with relatives or other connections -- my father and
aunt lived with an aunt in Romania for two or three months on their
way to German ports, where they lived in Germany for several weeks
and claimed to be residents of Budapest, not Podolian. A great uncle
stayed a while in London, so his US arrival manifest could lead
someone to think him a resident Brit, unless they looked closely.

Lots of people stayed in the emigrant settlements built by the
shipping interests, Hamburg, I believe being the major example of
this. You can read and see photos of this at the Hamburg lists site.

And if they were fearful and could manage the deception, some simply
lied about their hometown in fear of being found by authorities -- in
many cases they were essentially the illegal immigrants of the era.


Michelle Frager NY area
http://www.shtetlinks.jewishgen.org/snitkov/ShtetLinksSnitkov_Index.htm
= TREIGER (FRAGER) SIROTA ZEKTSER SIBELBERG (sic) BRONSHTEIN in
Ukraine, Bessarabia, Romania
= FRAKT WOLFSON LIFSCHITZ KLAVIR in Belarus, Lithuania



--- Evan Fishman <ebf2001@comcast.net> wrote:> ---
9/1/04

Genners,

Thanks to all who responded to my query about the correct
transcription of a town listed on a manifest.... <snip> since it is
over 100 miles >from Starokonstantinov (Ukraine), the place I've
heretofore believed to be my ancestral home town, I wonder if many
Jews took up residence briefly in locations other than their actual
shtetlach of origin before departing for the US or other
countries.<snip>...


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Re: interim residences before leaving for the US, etc. #ukraine

Michelle Frager <lulu_brooks@...>
 

Dear Evan Fishman et al:

In my family and research experience, people didn't necessarily go
directly >from the shtetl to the boat without a break in the journey,
sometimes of months. Reasons often included the need for additional
funds, temporary or mild illness, or the need for further travel
arrangements to the sailing point.

People stayed with relatives or other connections -- my father and
aunt lived with an aunt in Romania for two or three months on their
way to German ports, where they lived in Germany for several weeks
and claimed to be residents of Budapest, not Podolian. A great uncle
stayed a while in London, so his US arrival manifest could lead
someone to think him a resident Brit, unless they looked closely.

Lots of people stayed in the emigrant settlements built by the
shipping interests, Hamburg, I believe being the major example of
this. You can read and see photos of this at the Hamburg lists site.

And if they were fearful and could manage the deception, some simply
lied about their hometown in fear of being found by authorities -- in
many cases they were essentially the illegal immigrants of the era.


Michelle Frager NY area
http://www.shtetlinks.jewishgen.org/snitkov/ShtetLinksSnitkov_Index.htm
= TREIGER (FRAGER) SIROTA ZEKTSER SIBELBERG (sic) BRONSHTEIN in
Ukraine, Bessarabia, Romania
= FRAKT WOLFSON LIFSCHITZ KLAVIR in Belarus, Lithuania



--- Evan Fishman <ebf2001@comcast.net> wrote:> ---
9/1/04

Genners,

Thanks to all who responded to my query about the correct
transcription of a town listed on a manifest.... <snip> since it is
over 100 miles >from Starokonstantinov (Ukraine), the place I've
heretofore believed to be my ancestral home town, I wonder if many
Jews took up residence briefly in locations other than their actual
shtetlach of origin before departing for the US or other
countries.<snip>...


Re: Russian Jews - immigration and emigration lists from the 1880s #ukraine

Ida & Joseph Schwarcz
 

Fascinating. Since I have cataracts I cannot volunteer to read >from the
microfilms. I know that my late in-laws (first marriage) made aliya from
Brody in 1923. Brody was an important center for emigration. Berl Stock
(later Professor Dov Sadan) met my father-in-law there. I would be
interested in helping in any way that does not require reading microfilms.
Ida Selavan Schwarcz
Arad, Israel

Dr. Joseph M. Schwarcz
Dr. Ida Selavan Schwarcz
Israel

-----Original Message-----
From: Ukraine Moderating Team [mailto:Ukraine Moderating Team]
Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2004 9:56 AM

Genners:

Suzan Wynne has graciously given us permission to reprint her letter
to the Gesher-GaliciaSig Digest because it is relevant to the Ukraine.
If anyone woud like to volunteer for this project please let us know so
that we may let Suzan know.

Hinda Solomon, Rishon LeZion Israel, (hinda_s@hotmail.com)brought it to
our attention and would like to know approximately how many entries there
are and if they are easy to read.


Subject: Brody
From: "Suzan & Ron Wynne" <srwynne@erols.com> Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004

While in Jerusalem at last month's Jewish Genealogy conference, I spent
a lot of time at the Central Archives for the History of the Jewish
People. I requested a microfilm that had had some promising material for
one of my towns and noted that most of the film had information about
Brody, which is not of personal interest. So, I was quickly scrolling
through, but, then, my eye caught a form with columns. Hmmm. I stopped
scrolling and saw that I was looking at emigration lists. This film and
several more had images of immigration and emigration lists >from the 1880s.
While the vast majority of those listed were Russian Jews fleeing from
pogroms and being moved on to Vienna, there were Brody residents among
those listed.

The material cries out to be indexed. The indexing will have to be done
in Israel at the Central Archives because efforts to have the microfilms
reproduced and sent to the US have been rejected for the moment.
Permission would have to be granted >from officials at the archives in Lviv
and there is some political sensitivity involved. Are there any Israelis
interested in taking on this indexing project?

Suzan Wynne
Kensington, MD


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine RE: Russian Jews - immigration and emigration lists from the 1880s #ukraine

Ida & Joseph Schwarcz
 

Fascinating. Since I have cataracts I cannot volunteer to read >from the
microfilms. I know that my late in-laws (first marriage) made aliya from
Brody in 1923. Brody was an important center for emigration. Berl Stock
(later Professor Dov Sadan) met my father-in-law there. I would be
interested in helping in any way that does not require reading microfilms.
Ida Selavan Schwarcz
Arad, Israel

Dr. Joseph M. Schwarcz
Dr. Ida Selavan Schwarcz
Israel

-----Original Message-----
From: Ukraine Moderating Team [mailto:Ukraine Moderating Team]
Sent: Sunday, August 29, 2004 9:56 AM

Genners:

Suzan Wynne has graciously given us permission to reprint her letter
to the Gesher-GaliciaSig Digest because it is relevant to the Ukraine.
If anyone woud like to volunteer for this project please let us know so
that we may let Suzan know.

Hinda Solomon, Rishon LeZion Israel, (hinda_s@hotmail.com)brought it to
our attention and would like to know approximately how many entries there
are and if they are easy to read.


Subject: Brody
From: "Suzan & Ron Wynne" <srwynne@erols.com> Date: Fri, 27 Aug 2004

While in Jerusalem at last month's Jewish Genealogy conference, I spent
a lot of time at the Central Archives for the History of the Jewish
People. I requested a microfilm that had had some promising material for
one of my towns and noted that most of the film had information about
Brody, which is not of personal interest. So, I was quickly scrolling
through, but, then, my eye caught a form with columns. Hmmm. I stopped
scrolling and saw that I was looking at emigration lists. This film and
several more had images of immigration and emigration lists >from the 1880s.
While the vast majority of those listed were Russian Jews fleeing from
pogroms and being moved on to Vienna, there were Brody residents among
those listed.

The material cries out to be indexed. The indexing will have to be done
in Israel at the Central Archives because efforts to have the microfilms
reproduced and sent to the US have been rejected for the moment.
Permission would have to be granted >from officials at the archives in Lviv
and there is some political sensitivity involved. Are there any Israelis
interested in taking on this indexing project?

Suzan Wynne
Kensington, MD


Searching descendants MERMELSTEIN #general

Deborah Sterling
 

I am assisting a Holocaust survivor who would like to find her relatives,
descendants of Edmond and Matilda MERMELSTEIN.
Matilda's maiden name was KRAMER. and
the descendants of Jerry KRAMER.
The descendants, if still living, could be between 50-60''s in age.
Looking for the following people:
1) Judy Mermelstein,
2) Debbie Mermelstein,
3) Charley Mermelstein,
4) Susan Kramer, and
5) Micky Kramer .
If anyone has any information, I will reply with more details to see if it
is possible
it is the correct person.
thanks,
Deborah
dls18@earthlink.net


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Searching descendants MERMELSTEIN #general

Deborah Sterling
 

I am assisting a Holocaust survivor who would like to find her relatives,
descendants of Edmond and Matilda MERMELSTEIN.
Matilda's maiden name was KRAMER. and
the descendants of Jerry KRAMER.
The descendants, if still living, could be between 50-60''s in age.
Looking for the following people:
1) Judy Mermelstein,
2) Debbie Mermelstein,
3) Charley Mermelstein,
4) Susan Kramer, and
5) Micky Kramer .
If anyone has any information, I will reply with more details to see if it
is possible
it is the correct person.
thanks,
Deborah
dls18@earthlink.net


A Mitzvah for the New Year! -- Seeking Bella ROGERS nee SPEIER #general

Flo Elman
 

Dear Fellow Members,
A friend's mother, Mildred Greenspoon (in her 80s), is a Holocaust survivor,
& would desperately like to locate the woman who saved her life in those dire
years. Mildred is now living in Toronto.

The woman's name was Bella Speier; her married name was Rogers. They were
marched together >from Shtutoff (not sure of spelling). My friend's mother
does not know where Bella was before that as they met in Shtutoff. Bella
went somewhere in Australia after liberation. It was Bella who hid Mildred
in a hay wagon when she became too ill to walk. That is where the Russians
found her. She still has vivid memories of the soldier who carried her out
of the barn, and the tears rolling down his face; the gentle way he handled
her.

from what she told me, Bella & her husband were subsequently divorced. If
you have any further information about this lady, or her family, please
contact me privately at haflo@shaw.ca . What a mitzvah this would be if we
could reunite them by Rosh Hashonah.

L'shana tova to all of you.
Sincerely,
Florence Elman
Calgary, Canada
haflo@shaw.ca


LEIDE(R)SDORF(F), Germany & Denmark & Sweden #scandinavia

Elsebeth Paikin
 

I am looking for information about
LEIDERSDORFFS (various spellings).

I have a goldsmith Ulrich LEIDERSDORFF
(in the census 1845 spelled LEIDERSSTORFF!)
born 1803 in Sweden (Stockholm)
married to Magdalene NORDENMANN / NORDEMANN
born 1804 in Sweden (Skaane)
(I presume they were married around 1828 - probably in Sweden!?)
They moved to Denmark as we find:
a daughter Laura born in 1828 in Copenhagen County, and
a son christened in Bronshoj, Copenhagen, named Aksel Valdemar,
born in 1831.

I presume that Ulrich to be of Jewish heritage but maybe he
converted in Sweden?

I don't know anything about Magdalene.

However, the family legend has it that Ulrich was a son of a
Jewish banker >from Hamburg around 1800 by the name of Nathan, and it
is said that this banker lent money to the Swedish king Gustav IV....

In Denmark there are four LEIDERSDORFFs buried in the Old Jewish Cemetery:

Aron Moses Leidesdorf (d. 1747)
Elchana Leidesdorf, child (d. 1744)
David Samuel Leidesdorf, >from Altona (d. 1793)
Moses Nathan Leidesdorf, >from Stockholm (d. 1826)

The latter Moses Nathan LEIDESDORF is noted to be ">from Stockholm".
I don't know where that information comes from. He was 72 years old,
when he died, so he must have been born around 1754.

I hope someone can help me with information about LEIDERSDORFFs and
a bankier by the name of Nathan or NATHAN in Hamburg.

Best regards


-------------------------------------------------------
Elsebeth Paikin, Copenhagen, Denmark
Coordinator & webmaster of JewishGen's SCANDINAVIA SIG
http://www.jewishgen.org/scandinavia
http://home.worldonline.dk/~epaikin/
mailto:elsebeth@paikin.dk
-------------------------------------------------------=20


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen A Mitzvah for the New Year! -- Seeking Bella ROGERS nee SPEIER #general

Flo Elman
 

Dear Fellow Members,
A friend's mother, Mildred Greenspoon (in her 80s), is a Holocaust survivor,
& would desperately like to locate the woman who saved her life in those dire
years. Mildred is now living in Toronto.

The woman's name was Bella Speier; her married name was Rogers. They were
marched together >from Shtutoff (not sure of spelling). My friend's mother
does not know where Bella was before that as they met in Shtutoff. Bella
went somewhere in Australia after liberation. It was Bella who hid Mildred
in a hay wagon when she became too ill to walk. That is where the Russians
found her. She still has vivid memories of the soldier who carried her out
of the barn, and the tears rolling down his face; the gentle way he handled
her.

from what she told me, Bella & her husband were subsequently divorced. If
you have any further information about this lady, or her family, please
contact me privately at haflo@shaw.ca . What a mitzvah this would be if we
could reunite them by Rosh Hashonah.

L'shana tova to all of you.
Sincerely,
Florence Elman
Calgary, Canada
haflo@shaw.ca


Scandinavia SIG #Scandinavia LEIDE(R)SDORF(F), Germany & Denmark & Sweden #scandinavia

Elsebeth Paikin
 

I am looking for information about
LEIDERSDORFFS (various spellings).

I have a goldsmith Ulrich LEIDERSDORFF
(in the census 1845 spelled LEIDERSSTORFF!)
born 1803 in Sweden (Stockholm)
married to Magdalene NORDENMANN / NORDEMANN
born 1804 in Sweden (Skaane)
(I presume they were married around 1828 - probably in Sweden!?)
They moved to Denmark as we find:
a daughter Laura born in 1828 in Copenhagen County, and
a son christened in Bronshoj, Copenhagen, named Aksel Valdemar,
born in 1831.

I presume that Ulrich to be of Jewish heritage but maybe he
converted in Sweden?

I don't know anything about Magdalene.

However, the family legend has it that Ulrich was a son of a
Jewish banker >from Hamburg around 1800 by the name of Nathan, and it
is said that this banker lent money to the Swedish king Gustav IV....

In Denmark there are four LEIDERSDORFFs buried in the Old Jewish Cemetery:

Aron Moses Leidesdorf (d. 1747)
Elchana Leidesdorf, child (d. 1744)
David Samuel Leidesdorf, >from Altona (d. 1793)
Moses Nathan Leidesdorf, >from Stockholm (d. 1826)

The latter Moses Nathan LEIDESDORF is noted to be ">from Stockholm".
I don't know where that information comes from. He was 72 years old,
when he died, so he must have been born around 1754.

I hope someone can help me with information about LEIDERSDORFFs and
a bankier by the name of Nathan or NATHAN in Hamburg.

Best regards


-------------------------------------------------------
Elsebeth Paikin, Copenhagen, Denmark
Coordinator & webmaster of JewishGen's SCANDINAVIA SIG
http://www.jewishgen.org/scandinavia
http://home.worldonline.dk/~epaikin/
mailto:elsebeth@paikin.dk
-------------------------------------------------------=20


FTM help needed #general

Trudy Barch
 

Hello everyone,

I am looking for someone that is very familiar with Family Tree Maker
program to answer some questions for me.

Please reply privately.

Thank you.

Trudy Barch
Illinois


Family Reunion planning #general

DebWE308@...
 

Dear Genners,
After 24 years of researching, I have decided to make a family reunion. I am
looking for advice as to how to plan it. I am only doing my maternal side, but
should I invite everyone on my family tree even people who are so distant?
Any comments and suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Debbie Wang Etzion
Great Neck, NY

SCHECHTER >from Tyvrov, Ukaine
NIKIPROVETSKY >from Nikiforovci, Ukraine
SALTZMAN form Pinsk