Date   

Re: Name Scheindel #general

Alan Greenberg
 

Although I don't know the derivation, I have seen the name Jennie
used, and a quick Google search shows that they are commonly used together.

Alan Greenberg
Montreal, Canada

At 30/10/2006 03:08 PM, Irv Kramer wrote:
I have a boarding pass for a person by the name of Scheindel Stein
that I know belongs to my family. I cannot figure out what the
first name would be in English. Could someone help me?


Re: Name Scheindel #general

Judith Romney Wegner
 

While it is impossible to say for sure, one possibility for her
English name might be Jenny or even Jane. (these being sound-alikes
for the Yiddish name Sheindel. I also know someone whose "English"
name, Shandelle, is simply an "anglicized" spelling of Sheindel,

Judith Romney Wegner


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Name Scheindel #general

Alan Greenberg
 

Although I don't know the derivation, I have seen the name Jennie
used, and a quick Google search shows that they are commonly used together.

Alan Greenberg
Montreal, Canada

At 30/10/2006 03:08 PM, Irv Kramer wrote:
I have a boarding pass for a person by the name of Scheindel Stein
that I know belongs to my family. I cannot figure out what the
first name would be in English. Could someone help me?


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Name Scheindel #general

Judith Romney Wegner
 

While it is impossible to say for sure, one possibility for her
English name might be Jenny or even Jane. (these being sound-alikes
for the Yiddish name Sheindel. I also know someone whose "English"
name, Shandelle, is simply an "anglicized" spelling of Sheindel,

Judith Romney Wegner


Navigating the On-Line Canadian Passenger Lists #general

Steve Orlen
 

Dear Cousins,

We've been given some good advice lately on how to navigate the new
on-line Canadian Passenger Lists. They're indexed not by passenger
name, but by year, ship name, port of departure & arrival, et cetera.
If you don't have at least a year & a ship name, searching for a
relative would be impossible. We've been advised to put in a minimal
amount of information - 1907 - Ottawa (the name of the ship) - which
turned out to be good advice.

So I found the several arrivals of the Ottawa arriving at Montreal
for 1907, and learned quickly that the manifests are alphabetical by
surname. And once I got past the "L" listings (Rachel Liberman), I
went on to another arrival. Until I realized that each manifest
includes maybe 6-10 rolls through the alphabet! And it's relatively slow...

Best of luck,

Steve Orlen
Tucson, AZ


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Navigating the On-Line Canadian Passenger Lists #general

Steve Orlen
 

Dear Cousins,

We've been given some good advice lately on how to navigate the new
on-line Canadian Passenger Lists. They're indexed not by passenger
name, but by year, ship name, port of departure & arrival, et cetera.
If you don't have at least a year & a ship name, searching for a
relative would be impossible. We've been advised to put in a minimal
amount of information - 1907 - Ottawa (the name of the ship) - which
turned out to be good advice.

So I found the several arrivals of the Ottawa arriving at Montreal
for 1907, and learned quickly that the manifests are alphabetical by
surname. And once I got past the "L" listings (Rachel Liberman), I
went on to another arrival. Until I realized that each manifest
includes maybe 6-10 rolls through the alphabet! And it's relatively slow...

Best of luck,

Steve Orlen
Tucson, AZ


Bronnaya Gora, Belarus near Baranovichi #general

Larry Schenker <lpsca@...>
 

I am trying to locate Bronnaya Gora, Belarus the site where 50,000 Jews
were massacred during World War II. It is near Baranovichi with Lat:
53:08:29N (53.1415) Lon: 26:03:04E (26.0511) and North of Pinsk Lat:
52:07 - Lon: 26:04.

Using ShtetlSeeker and searching on Bronnaya Gora two hits come up, but
both are SE of Minsk, whereas Bronnaya Gora is West or SW of Minsk.

Can anyone please give me the latitude and longitude of Bronnaya Gora?

Larry Schenker
Los Angeles, CA 90024
lpsca@...


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Bronnaya Gora, Belarus near Baranovichi #general

Larry Schenker <lpsca@...>
 

I am trying to locate Bronnaya Gora, Belarus the site where 50,000 Jews
were massacred during World War II. It is near Baranovichi with Lat:
53:08:29N (53.1415) Lon: 26:03:04E (26.0511) and North of Pinsk Lat:
52:07 - Lon: 26:04.

Using ShtetlSeeker and searching on Bronnaya Gora two hits come up, but
both are SE of Minsk, whereas Bronnaya Gora is West or SW of Minsk.

Can anyone please give me the latitude and longitude of Bronnaya Gora?

Larry Schenker
Los Angeles, CA 90024
lpsca@...


London Poor Jews Temporary Shelter Database #lithuania

Ada Green
 

The London Poor Jews Temporary Shelter Database formerly at
http://chrysalis.its.uct.ac.za/shelter/shelter.htm seems to have gone
bye-bye. Can anyone tell me where it's gone?

If not, the LitvakSIG FAQs will no longer be able to be linked to it.

Ada Green
Acting LitvakSIG webmaster

MODERATOR'S NOTE: Please respond privately.


Lithuania SIG #Lithuania London Poor Jews Temporary Shelter Database #lithuania

Ada Green
 

The London Poor Jews Temporary Shelter Database formerly at
http://chrysalis.its.uct.ac.za/shelter/shelter.htm seems to have gone
bye-bye. Can anyone tell me where it's gone?

If not, the LitvakSIG FAQs will no longer be able to be linked to it.

Ada Green
Acting LitvakSIG webmaster

MODERATOR'S NOTE: Please respond privately.


Re: Jewish naming practices - "the second" #germany

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 10/29/2006 vogelko@... writes:
"I came across a grave in Germany (which may or may not be of my
great-great-grandfather) where the name was "Leopold Vogel II". The
individual was clearly >from a somewhat religious background as the grave
also included traditional Hebrew inscription. If this was indeed my
ancestor, he was probably Orthodox.
Yesterday, I received >from Alex Calzareth (thanks again, Alex!) a probate
record, regarding another ancestor, who was most definitely Orthodox and he
too is referred to as "Lazarus Isaak II".
My question is - was it accepted for Orthodox Jews to be referred to, with
the appendage "II" ("the second")? In what circumstances? I can understand
it perhaps being so in an official document, but would this also be
demonstrated on a headstone? Would this indicate that the individual was
named after an ancestor with the same name? If so - then I would think that
there would be quite a few "II"s, since many Jews were named after
ancestors. Has anyone else come across this?" ========>

How about Oscar Hammerstein I (1847E280931919) and his grandson, Oscar II
(1895 E28093 1960)?

OK, neither was Orthodox, and the younger got his name while his Opa still
had 24 years of life in front of him.

"Modernization," aka "reform," aka "emancipation," aka many other terms,
was a complicated issue for Jews in Europe >from about 1830 to 1930. Trying on
the German or "universal" model did not necessarily always imply a departure
from religious laws and customs. The Orthodox congregations in Germany were
also feverish innovators, >from sermons in German, bible- and
prayerbook-translations in German, trimmed beard, translations, Zilinderhut
(top hat) required to be called to read the Torah, rabbis with neatly
trimmed beard, -- even in the most Orthodox of synagogues.

Many who were not strictly observant were members of an Orthodox
synagogue--sometimes by choice, preference, nostalgia . . .

And certainly, many of the non-Orthodox cherished Jewish customs and
symbols, if only out of respect to more observant members of the family. If you
look around you at the non-Jewish majority in the USA, at holiday songs and
celebrations, at weddings, christenings and tombstones, you will find religious
symbols, wording and invocations observed even by those who have little
connection with the strictures of their faith.

When I was a little kid in Germany, my father occasionally introduced me
to clients and colleagues as "Herr Bernet, Junior" or "Herr Bernet II." They
smiled, I was proud, my dad was even prouder. I have a vague impression that
the "II" was used in a firm or family to indicate a member of a younger
generation who had the same name as an elder (e.g. a nephew).

In short, it's difficult to judge a person's level of Orthodox conduct
based on customs or inscriptions alone, and oral transmission is probably not
always an accurate guide. My paternal gm was extremely Orthodox (Frankfurt's
A.R.Hirsch congregation); my pgm MAIER probably was not until perhaps shortly
before his marriage--none of his 8 siblings was--and his tombstone was
obviously dictated by someone who didn't even know his father's Hebrew name
or that he was a Levite, yet the stone bore some very noble and poetic Hebrew
sentiments (very likely carved by a non-Jewish stonemason >from a sample book).

I assume the siblings took care of his stone. The separatist Orthodox synagogue
to which my father and my gm went had not yet been completed. And he died
suddenly >from a stroke leaving a widow with three children aged 6 to 8 who
either was too distracted or was not allowed to participate in the selection
of the inscription.

As you see, what goes on a tombstone can differ >from a person's specific
degree of ritual observance or religious knowledge.

Michael Bernet, New York MBernet@...


German SIG #Germany Re: Jewish naming practices - "the second" #germany

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 10/29/2006 vogelko@... writes:
"I came across a grave in Germany (which may or may not be of my
great-great-grandfather) where the name was "Leopold Vogel II". The
individual was clearly >from a somewhat religious background as the grave
also included traditional Hebrew inscription. If this was indeed my
ancestor, he was probably Orthodox.
Yesterday, I received >from Alex Calzareth (thanks again, Alex!) a probate
record, regarding another ancestor, who was most definitely Orthodox and he
too is referred to as "Lazarus Isaak II".
My question is - was it accepted for Orthodox Jews to be referred to, with
the appendage "II" ("the second")? In what circumstances? I can understand
it perhaps being so in an official document, but would this also be
demonstrated on a headstone? Would this indicate that the individual was
named after an ancestor with the same name? If so - then I would think that
there would be quite a few "II"s, since many Jews were named after
ancestors. Has anyone else come across this?" ========>

How about Oscar Hammerstein I (1847E280931919) and his grandson, Oscar II
(1895 E28093 1960)?

OK, neither was Orthodox, and the younger got his name while his Opa still
had 24 years of life in front of him.

"Modernization," aka "reform," aka "emancipation," aka many other terms,
was a complicated issue for Jews in Europe >from about 1830 to 1930. Trying on
the German or "universal" model did not necessarily always imply a departure
from religious laws and customs. The Orthodox congregations in Germany were
also feverish innovators, >from sermons in German, bible- and
prayerbook-translations in German, trimmed beard, translations, Zilinderhut
(top hat) required to be called to read the Torah, rabbis with neatly
trimmed beard, -- even in the most Orthodox of synagogues.

Many who were not strictly observant were members of an Orthodox
synagogue--sometimes by choice, preference, nostalgia . . .

And certainly, many of the non-Orthodox cherished Jewish customs and
symbols, if only out of respect to more observant members of the family. If you
look around you at the non-Jewish majority in the USA, at holiday songs and
celebrations, at weddings, christenings and tombstones, you will find religious
symbols, wording and invocations observed even by those who have little
connection with the strictures of their faith.

When I was a little kid in Germany, my father occasionally introduced me
to clients and colleagues as "Herr Bernet, Junior" or "Herr Bernet II." They
smiled, I was proud, my dad was even prouder. I have a vague impression that
the "II" was used in a firm or family to indicate a member of a younger
generation who had the same name as an elder (e.g. a nephew).

In short, it's difficult to judge a person's level of Orthodox conduct
based on customs or inscriptions alone, and oral transmission is probably not
always an accurate guide. My paternal gm was extremely Orthodox (Frankfurt's
A.R.Hirsch congregation); my pgm MAIER probably was not until perhaps shortly
before his marriage--none of his 8 siblings was--and his tombstone was
obviously dictated by someone who didn't even know his father's Hebrew name
or that he was a Levite, yet the stone bore some very noble and poetic Hebrew
sentiments (very likely carved by a non-Jewish stonemason >from a sample book).

I assume the siblings took care of his stone. The separatist Orthodox synagogue
to which my father and my gm went had not yet been completed. And he died
suddenly >from a stroke leaving a widow with three children aged 6 to 8 who
either was too distracted or was not allowed to participate in the selection
of the inscription.

As you see, what goes on a tombstone can differ >from a person's specific
degree of ritual observance or religious knowledge.

Michael Bernet, New York MBernet@...


Re: Religious Marriage of Rose and Irving HELFMAN #general

Zev Griner <zgriner@...>
 

Unlike a civil ceremony that is recorded for posterity, a religious
ceremony would have been recorded in the ketubah, religious marriage
contract, your father would have signed. Technically, this contract
belonged to your mother, but most probably was put into an envelope and
kept in drawer or folder. The rabbi that married them may have kept
personal records, but I don't think they were recorded elsewhere.

Just some thoughts,
Zev Griner

Marilyn Siegel wrote:

I was wondering if anyone could help me. My parents were married in
a civil ceremony in The Bronx on March 2, 1923
Rose (Silverman) and Irving HELFMAN

However, their religious ceremony was held on June 10, 1923, the
date they actually celebrated. I just realized that I have the papers
for the civil proceedings, but not the religious one. I would presume they
were married in a synagogue, or a Rabbie in The Bronx.
Is there any way I could find out this information. They had both
lived at 899 E. 169 St. in The Bronx.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Religious Marriage of Rose and Irving HELFMAN #general

Zev Griner <zgriner@...>
 

Unlike a civil ceremony that is recorded for posterity, a religious
ceremony would have been recorded in the ketubah, religious marriage
contract, your father would have signed. Technically, this contract
belonged to your mother, but most probably was put into an envelope and
kept in drawer or folder. The rabbi that married them may have kept
personal records, but I don't think they were recorded elsewhere.

Just some thoughts,
Zev Griner

Marilyn Siegel wrote:

I was wondering if anyone could help me. My parents were married in
a civil ceremony in The Bronx on March 2, 1923
Rose (Silverman) and Irving HELFMAN

However, their religious ceremony was held on June 10, 1923, the
date they actually celebrated. I just realized that I have the papers
for the civil proceedings, but not the religious one. I would presume they
were married in a synagogue, or a Rabbie in The Bronx.
Is there any way I could find out this information. They had both
lived at 899 E. 169 St. in The Bronx.


Montlake and Greenbaum #unitedkingdom

Diane Jacobs <thegenie@...>
 

I am looking for the descendants of Albert Solomon Montlake and
Jennie Greenbaum Montlake. In 1915 Jennie Montlake arrives in NYC
from London with her infant son Nathan Montlake. Her husband spends
two separate terms in Sing Sing Prison and then deserts them in NYC
around 1920 and marries Anna Becker and moves to Chicago. They have one
daughter.

Jennie changes her name soon after and I have no idea what the new name is.
In 1937 Albert Solomon Montlake is a jewelry and bonds fence who is to
be a witness for the government and is assassinated in Chicago.

Jennie Montlake, the first wife, and son Nathan learn of his death and
prepare to go to court for part of the estate. The son works for a bank in
Washington DC and for the first time learns the identify of his father as
reported by the Washington Post.

If anyone has any information on these people, please advise.

Thank you.

Diane Jacobs
Somerset, NJ


JCR-UK SIG #UnitedKingdom Montlake and Greenbaum #unitedkingdom

Diane Jacobs <thegenie@...>
 

I am looking for the descendants of Albert Solomon Montlake and
Jennie Greenbaum Montlake. In 1915 Jennie Montlake arrives in NYC
from London with her infant son Nathan Montlake. Her husband spends
two separate terms in Sing Sing Prison and then deserts them in NYC
around 1920 and marries Anna Becker and moves to Chicago. They have one
daughter.

Jennie changes her name soon after and I have no idea what the new name is.
In 1937 Albert Solomon Montlake is a jewelry and bonds fence who is to
be a witness for the government and is assassinated in Chicago.

Jennie Montlake, the first wife, and son Nathan learn of his death and
prepare to go to court for part of the estate. The son works for a bank in
Washington DC and for the first time learns the identify of his father as
reported by the Washington Post.

If anyone has any information on these people, please advise.

Thank you.

Diane Jacobs
Somerset, NJ


Belgium abt 1910- do you recognize anyone? #general

JEF BARNETT <JBarnett@...>
 

I have posted a picture of a family in Belgium >from around 1910 that I am
trying to identify. The story is that my grandmother (or grandfather) had a
sister who was denied entry into the US as she was deaf and dumb. The sister
went to live with this family in Belgium. My Grandfather went back and forth
to visit her and ended up dieing in Belgium around this time.

My grandparents names were Abram and Pesal Grossman. I have no idea of this
family's name, relationship or evern location in Belgium. Can anyone
recognize this family?

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8720

Jef Barnett
Bensalem, PA

BANDRYMER (Bandrimer or Bandremer) -Serock, Pultusk, Ostrow Maz., Rozan Poland
KRASHA - Serock, Krasnosielc Poland
NOWAK (Novak, Nowack) -Serock, Krasnosielc Poland
BULMAN- Poland
SOLARZ- Serock, Krasnosielc Poland (lost in the Holocaust)
SILVERBERG- Serock, Krasnosielc Poland (lost in the Holocaust)


Translation of a Cyrillic document #general

wrosenz@...
 

Dear Genners,
I would greatly appreciate it if someone would help me and translate a small
Cyrillic document >from the Ukranian State Archives. The document is posted as
Viewmate 8745 and can be viewed at the following address:

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8745

Please respond privately to wrosenz@...

Thanks in advance,
Bill Rosenzweig
Tucson, AZ


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Belgium abt 1910- do you recognize anyone? #general

JEF BARNETT <JBarnett@...>
 

I have posted a picture of a family in Belgium >from around 1910 that I am
trying to identify. The story is that my grandmother (or grandfather) had a
sister who was denied entry into the US as she was deaf and dumb. The sister
went to live with this family in Belgium. My Grandfather went back and forth
to visit her and ended up dieing in Belgium around this time.

My grandparents names were Abram and Pesal Grossman. I have no idea of this
family's name, relationship or evern location in Belgium. Can anyone
recognize this family?

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8720

Jef Barnett
Bensalem, PA

BANDRYMER (Bandrimer or Bandremer) -Serock, Pultusk, Ostrow Maz., Rozan Poland
KRASHA - Serock, Krasnosielc Poland
NOWAK (Novak, Nowack) -Serock, Krasnosielc Poland
BULMAN- Poland
SOLARZ- Serock, Krasnosielc Poland (lost in the Holocaust)
SILVERBERG- Serock, Krasnosielc Poland (lost in the Holocaust)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Translation of a Cyrillic document #general

wrosenz@...
 

Dear Genners,
I would greatly appreciate it if someone would help me and translate a small
Cyrillic document >from the Ukranian State Archives. The document is posted as
Viewmate 8745 and can be viewed at the following address:

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8745

Please respond privately to wrosenz@...

Thanks in advance,
Bill Rosenzweig
Tucson, AZ