Date   

"...respect the sensitivities of the living" #general

Bernard Kouchel <koosh@...>
 

In the genealogical hunt to collect names, we sometimes find misguided
persons. They deliberately publish sensitive information about other
living relatives, despite objections.
I would label such persons as gossips, not genealogists. Genealogists
endeavor to unite families, not divide them.
I refer you to the words of the late Rabbi Malcolm Stern, Dean of
American-Jewish Genealogy, who wrote:

"Thou shalt respect the sensitivities of the living in
whatever you record but tell the truth about the dead."


Email to <mstern@mail.jewishgen.org> for a copy of _Rabbi
Stern's Ten Commandments for Genealogists_. Or, access it on the web
at: http://www.jewishgen.org/infofiles/
--
Bernard I. Kouchel
<mailto:bkouchel@jewishgen.org>


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen "...respect the sensitivities of the living" #general

Bernard Kouchel <koosh@...>
 

In the genealogical hunt to collect names, we sometimes find misguided
persons. They deliberately publish sensitive information about other
living relatives, despite objections.
I would label such persons as gossips, not genealogists. Genealogists
endeavor to unite families, not divide them.
I refer you to the words of the late Rabbi Malcolm Stern, Dean of
American-Jewish Genealogy, who wrote:

"Thou shalt respect the sensitivities of the living in
whatever you record but tell the truth about the dead."


Email to <mstern@mail.jewishgen.org> for a copy of _Rabbi
Stern's Ten Commandments for Genealogists_. Or, access it on the web
at: http://www.jewishgen.org/infofiles/
--
Bernard I. Kouchel
<mailto:bkouchel@jewishgen.org>


Metz, France #general

NEIL185@...
 

Looking for someone with email in Metz, France or others who
can help me with local research there.
Thanks,

Neil ROSENSTEIN


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Metz, France #general

NEIL185@...
 

Looking for someone with email in Metz, France or others who
can help me with local research there.
Thanks,

Neil ROSENSTEIN


Re: Isidor RENDELSTEIN from 1920 US Census for Brooklyn, NY #general

Anita Berk <anitab@...>
 

I didn't see the original post, however, I have a family named Berlofsky,
who arrived in 1899. I couldn't find them on the 1900 census. I found
them on the 1920 census with their name spelled Berofsky (different
soundex). I found them in the Naturalizations under Baralofsky.... I
never found birth records for the 1st 3 kids, although the all state they
were born in NYC, and I never found a marriage record for one of the kids
who was married around 1915.

My conclusion was they were skipped in the 1900 census, and the one
marriage must have never been recorded. Since I haven't found them on a
passenger manifest yet, I don't know if the kids were really born in NYC
(I doubt it).

Anita Berk

Ricki L. Zunk wrote:
I've checked for naturalization records -- no luck. I've checked SSDI
listings (including probable surname variances that would be logical) --
no luck. I've asked all of the family members I've been able to locate
-- no luck.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Isidor RENDELSTEIN from 1920 US Census for Brooklyn, NY #general

Anita Berk <anitab@...>
 

I didn't see the original post, however, I have a family named Berlofsky,
who arrived in 1899. I couldn't find them on the 1900 census. I found
them on the 1920 census with their name spelled Berofsky (different
soundex). I found them in the Naturalizations under Baralofsky.... I
never found birth records for the 1st 3 kids, although the all state they
were born in NYC, and I never found a marriage record for one of the kids
who was married around 1915.

My conclusion was they were skipped in the 1900 census, and the one
marriage must have never been recorded. Since I haven't found them on a
passenger manifest yet, I don't know if the kids were really born in NYC
(I doubt it).

Anita Berk

Ricki L. Zunk wrote:
I've checked for naturalization records -- no luck. I've checked SSDI
listings (including probable surname variances that would be logical) --
no luck. I've asked all of the family members I've been able to locate
-- no luck.


Baron de Hirsh settlement #general

r feldman <medserv@...>
 

I just found out that my GGrandfather came to Canada under the auspices
of Baron de Hirsh. He origanally went to a town called Baron de Hirsh,
Saskatchewan, which is now called Hirsh. I would like to know if anyone
knows where to find the records of Baron de Hirsh, immigration etc. I do
not know if he was in Saskatchewan long enough to have other records
such as birth of my Grasndfather before moving to Brandon Manitoba. any
help would be appreciated.

Thank you in advance,
Ron Feldman

Searching Ruskin, Greenberg >from Schadrin Belarus; Feldman Graychaka
Russia , Brandon, Winnipeg Manitoba; Grossman, Slobotski Bialistock
Poland; Palayew / Palayev Brestlitovsk .


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Baron de Hirsh settlement #general

r feldman <medserv@...>
 

I just found out that my GGrandfather came to Canada under the auspices
of Baron de Hirsh. He origanally went to a town called Baron de Hirsh,
Saskatchewan, which is now called Hirsh. I would like to know if anyone
knows where to find the records of Baron de Hirsh, immigration etc. I do
not know if he was in Saskatchewan long enough to have other records
such as birth of my Grasndfather before moving to Brandon Manitoba. any
help would be appreciated.

Thank you in advance,
Ron Feldman

Searching Ruskin, Greenberg >from Schadrin Belarus; Feldman Graychaka
Russia , Brandon, Winnipeg Manitoba; Grossman, Slobotski Bialistock
Poland; Palayew / Palayev Brestlitovsk .


Gravestones and names? #general

A. E. Jordan
 

I went to one of the family graves today and I realized how lacking my Herbrew
education is for what I am trying to do. Its too many years >from when I went
to Hebrew school to now I am afraid for me to remember everything.

On my great grandmother's stone it says in English "Chaie Sarah Jordan" -- all
the family members who remember her know her as Sarah as do all of the offical
records. Is Chaie some term of respect or honor or is it a name?

Also on the gates to the plot is the words "Chevra Moses Montifiore of
Hoboken" What does Chevra mean? Moses Montifiore is the name of the burial
society/temple they went to and yes it was in Hoboken.

Thanks in advance for your help. If these are really stupid questions you can
post me privately not to waste everyone else' space and time.

Thanks!

Allan Jordan
aejordan@aol.com

PS -- I have not even begun to deal with the Hebrew inscriptions of each of
the stones.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Gravestones and names? #general

A. E. Jordan
 

I went to one of the family graves today and I realized how lacking my Herbrew
education is for what I am trying to do. Its too many years >from when I went
to Hebrew school to now I am afraid for me to remember everything.

On my great grandmother's stone it says in English "Chaie Sarah Jordan" -- all
the family members who remember her know her as Sarah as do all of the offical
records. Is Chaie some term of respect or honor or is it a name?

Also on the gates to the plot is the words "Chevra Moses Montifiore of
Hoboken" What does Chevra mean? Moses Montifiore is the name of the burial
society/temple they went to and yes it was in Hoboken.

Thanks in advance for your help. If these are really stupid questions you can
post me privately not to waste everyone else' space and time.

Thanks!

Allan Jordan
aejordan@aol.com

PS -- I have not even begun to deal with the Hebrew inscriptions of each of
the stones.


Re: Sean FERGUSON story #general

Anita Berk <anitab@...>
 

I wouldn't be surprised if it were true!

Anita Berk

So, the story goes, they simply
traded visas and passports, assuming the family name of the other.

I have my doubts about this, but so goes the story. I always tell my kids,
as a joke, that we're here illegally....we could be sent packing back to
Baranovich at any time! ^_^

Anita Berk
anitab@starmail.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen re: Sean FERGUSON story #general

Anita Berk <anitab@...>
 

I wouldn't be surprised if it were true!

Anita Berk

So, the story goes, they simply
traded visas and passports, assuming the family name of the other.

I have my doubts about this, but so goes the story. I always tell my kids,
as a joke, that we're here illegally....we could be sent packing back to
Baranovich at any time! ^_^

Anita Berk
anitab@starmail.com


Miami death notice? #general

Norman Brotman <NORMAN-BROTMAN@...>
 

I had an uncle who died in Miami in June, 1982. I would like to get in
touch with his son, my cousin. Unfortunately, the cousin's name is Howard
Rosenberg. There must a lot of Howard Rosenbergs in the US. I suspect
that if I were able to look at a copy of the obit, there would be a refence
to the surviviors, ans if not, there would be a reference to the funeral
home. They could tell me where they sent the bill.

What paper would be likely to carry the obit, and what is its address? Are
there back copies available anywhere on microfilm?

Does anybody know if d c's are kept by county, by municipality or statewide
in Florida?

TIA

Norman Brotman


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Miami death notice? #general

Norman Brotman <NORMAN-BROTMAN@...>
 

I had an uncle who died in Miami in June, 1982. I would like to get in
touch with his son, my cousin. Unfortunately, the cousin's name is Howard
Rosenberg. There must a lot of Howard Rosenbergs in the US. I suspect
that if I were able to look at a copy of the obit, there would be a refence
to the surviviors, ans if not, there would be a reference to the funeral
home. They could tell me where they sent the bill.

What paper would be likely to carry the obit, and what is its address? Are
there back copies available anywhere on microfilm?

Does anybody know if d c's are kept by county, by municipality or statewide
in Florida?

TIA

Norman Brotman


Hebrew dates in Jewish records #general

MBernet@...
 

I have some burial records >from Frensdorf, near Bamberg, in Germany. The
date in Hebrew is given as Heh-Vav. Heh is five and Vav is six, so it
would be the 11th of the month, which to my knowledge is always written
Yod(10)-Aleph(1).

The only two dates that commonly have an anomaly in Hebrew, are 15 (written
Tet-Vav, 9+6) and 16 (written Tet-Zayin, 9+7). In both cases this is to
avoid writing a Divine name. Yod aleph is not a divine name to my
knowledge in Hebrew (perhaps, though, in Aramaic?).

Were these ancestors of min foolish, ignorant, superstitious or extra pious?

Michael Bernet
*****************************
seeking:

BERNET, BERNAT, BAERNET etc >from Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg, (Bavaria)
KONIGSHOFER: Welbhausen, Konigshofen, Furth (S. Germany)
ALTMANN: Kattowitz, Breslau, Poznan, Beuthen--Upper Silesia/Poland
WOLF(F): Frankfurt, Wurzburg, Furth, Yugoslavia, Westchester
WOLF, Sali & Rachel, Rotterdam, murdered by Dr. Petiot, Paris ca 1942
WEIL[L], Albert, Fr. hon. consul in Nurnberg; returned to France 1936/7.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Hebrew dates in Jewish records #general

MBernet@...
 

I have some burial records >from Frensdorf, near Bamberg, in Germany. The
date in Hebrew is given as Heh-Vav. Heh is five and Vav is six, so it
would be the 11th of the month, which to my knowledge is always written
Yod(10)-Aleph(1).

The only two dates that commonly have an anomaly in Hebrew, are 15 (written
Tet-Vav, 9+6) and 16 (written Tet-Zayin, 9+7). In both cases this is to
avoid writing a Divine name. Yod aleph is not a divine name to my
knowledge in Hebrew (perhaps, though, in Aramaic?).

Were these ancestors of min foolish, ignorant, superstitious or extra pious?

Michael Bernet
*****************************
seeking:

BERNET, BERNAT, BAERNET etc >from Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg, (Bavaria)
KONIGSHOFER: Welbhausen, Konigshofen, Furth (S. Germany)
ALTMANN: Kattowitz, Breslau, Poznan, Beuthen--Upper Silesia/Poland
WOLF(F): Frankfurt, Wurzburg, Furth, Yugoslavia, Westchester
WOLF, Sali & Rachel, Rotterdam, murdered by Dr. Petiot, Paris ca 1942
WEIL[L], Albert, Fr. hon. consul in Nurnberg; returned to France 1936/7.


Montefiore Census #general

malkajef@...
 

Does the 19th century Montefiore Census exist anywhere other than in
Israel? On line or at the Mormons?

Same question for the Arolsen Red Cross records.

Jeff Malka


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Montefiore Census #general

malkajef@...
 

Does the 19th century Montefiore Census exist anywhere other than in
Israel? On line or at the Mormons?

Same question for the Arolsen Red Cross records.

Jeff Malka


The end of the "Bar" / "Bat" discussion #lithuania

DNHIowa@...
 

Dear SIG:

Its been a lively discussion. We knew that Litvaks would always have their
opinions. And the interesting part was, as Jerry Esterson put it so well -
"You're right" - "You're right" - and "You're right." Or, as Tevye would
have said "on the other hand, there is no other hand."

The newest and final set of Revision List instructions, starting today, have
been refined, and they have already been sent to our newest inputters. All
former input will be made uniform with these.

Thanks for all of your ideas. We learn something new every day. Now, lets
move on to other matters.

For your information, this is what the inputters will be getting. If you have
further comments or questions on this, please contact me directly. As our
moderator, Carol Coplin Baker has wisely said, the public discussion has
ended.

Davida Noyek Handler
Co-coordinator, LitvakSIG

-------------------------



To Inputters:

Thanks again for being willing to input via "cut and paste." I am attaching a
translation for . Please let me know if you can read it.

The data within needs to be correctly placed in the Revision List fields,
which are at the top of the file.

All original fields >from the records have been retained, and some additional
fields - which will be addressed in the introduction - have been added for
clarification. It will always be made clear to the researcher that these
fields are "Additional Information supplied by inputter" as opposed to
"Original information contained within the records." We will emphasize these
fields with an italic font, in order to differentiate.

The fields (in this order) are:

|| Page# || 1850Reg || 1858Reg || Surname || Givenname || Father ||
Mother || Age 1850 || Age 1858 || Reason Left || Year Left ||
Relationship/Head || Spouse || Surname2 || Other Comments || Day ||
Month || Year || Town || Uyezd || Guberniya || RecordPublication ||

The "Additional" fields, which were not in the original records are:

|| Spouse || Surname2 || Other Comments ||

This will be fully explained in the introduction to these Revision Lists.

There has been much discussion on the "ben/bat" issue. Its a lot of extra
work, but, since the maiden names of wives have not been given in these
Revision Lists, it will help further searches of Vital Records if we can
differentiate between the various Leahs and Yankels, etc. The decision at
this point is heavily weighted toward our inputting "Leah, daughter of
Shlioma" and "Yankel, son of Itsyk" - rather than - "Leah bat Shlioma" and
"Yankel ben Itsyk" etc., in the "spouse" field.

Please enter all translations exactly as they are spelled. If you have a
question on anything, in any field, mark with a bullet and put your question
in the "other comments" field.

Please keep all fields in the exact order of this template.

Each person will have their own line, and surnames must be inserted on this
line.

Where two families appear in the same household, list the other family in the
household in "Surname 2" field. For instance, if LEVIN and GRINSPAN appear in
one family, you would mark:

LEVIN* *see GRINSPAN
LEVIN* *see GRINSPAN
LEVIN* *see GRINSPAN
GRINSPAN* *see LEVIN
GRINSPAN* *see LEVIN

In the case of abbreviations, please spell each one out fully - Unknown -
Died - Sister-in-law - etc.

If you have comments or questions that don't seem to fit anywhere in your
input, please insert an extra column called "inputters questions." We will
remove this column after the comments or questions have been answered.

The sample input at the top of this file is supplied as a guideline for your
input. If you notice anything that is questionable within any of these files,
please get back to Anne <aroth@indy.net> or <ROTHMAN_ANNE_NONLILLY@lilly.com>
or to me <dnhiowa@aol.com> so that we can take care of it.

Questions?

comments?

We'll do our best to help.

Thanks again -

Davida


Lithuania SIG #Lithuania The end of the "Bar" / "Bat" discussion #lithuania

DNHIowa@...
 

Dear SIG:

Its been a lively discussion. We knew that Litvaks would always have their
opinions. And the interesting part was, as Jerry Esterson put it so well -
"You're right" - "You're right" - and "You're right." Or, as Tevye would
have said "on the other hand, there is no other hand."

The newest and final set of Revision List instructions, starting today, have
been refined, and they have already been sent to our newest inputters. All
former input will be made uniform with these.

Thanks for all of your ideas. We learn something new every day. Now, lets
move on to other matters.

For your information, this is what the inputters will be getting. If you have
further comments or questions on this, please contact me directly. As our
moderator, Carol Coplin Baker has wisely said, the public discussion has
ended.

Davida Noyek Handler
Co-coordinator, LitvakSIG

-------------------------



To Inputters:

Thanks again for being willing to input via "cut and paste." I am attaching a
translation for . Please let me know if you can read it.

The data within needs to be correctly placed in the Revision List fields,
which are at the top of the file.

All original fields >from the records have been retained, and some additional
fields - which will be addressed in the introduction - have been added for
clarification. It will always be made clear to the researcher that these
fields are "Additional Information supplied by inputter" as opposed to
"Original information contained within the records." We will emphasize these
fields with an italic font, in order to differentiate.

The fields (in this order) are:

|| Page# || 1850Reg || 1858Reg || Surname || Givenname || Father ||
Mother || Age 1850 || Age 1858 || Reason Left || Year Left ||
Relationship/Head || Spouse || Surname2 || Other Comments || Day ||
Month || Year || Town || Uyezd || Guberniya || RecordPublication ||

The "Additional" fields, which were not in the original records are:

|| Spouse || Surname2 || Other Comments ||

This will be fully explained in the introduction to these Revision Lists.

There has been much discussion on the "ben/bat" issue. Its a lot of extra
work, but, since the maiden names of wives have not been given in these
Revision Lists, it will help further searches of Vital Records if we can
differentiate between the various Leahs and Yankels, etc. The decision at
this point is heavily weighted toward our inputting "Leah, daughter of
Shlioma" and "Yankel, son of Itsyk" - rather than - "Leah bat Shlioma" and
"Yankel ben Itsyk" etc., in the "spouse" field.

Please enter all translations exactly as they are spelled. If you have a
question on anything, in any field, mark with a bullet and put your question
in the "other comments" field.

Please keep all fields in the exact order of this template.

Each person will have their own line, and surnames must be inserted on this
line.

Where two families appear in the same household, list the other family in the
household in "Surname 2" field. For instance, if LEVIN and GRINSPAN appear in
one family, you would mark:

LEVIN* *see GRINSPAN
LEVIN* *see GRINSPAN
LEVIN* *see GRINSPAN
GRINSPAN* *see LEVIN
GRINSPAN* *see LEVIN

In the case of abbreviations, please spell each one out fully - Unknown -
Died - Sister-in-law - etc.

If you have comments or questions that don't seem to fit anywhere in your
input, please insert an extra column called "inputters questions." We will
remove this column after the comments or questions have been answered.

The sample input at the top of this file is supplied as a guideline for your
input. If you notice anything that is questionable within any of these files,
please get back to Anne <aroth@indy.net> or <ROTHMAN_ANNE_NONLILLY@lilly.com>
or to me <dnhiowa@aol.com> so that we can take care of it.

Questions?

comments?

We'll do our best to help.

Thanks again -

Davida