Date   

re; Holocaust victims born in New York #austria-czech

Celia Male <celiamale@...>
 

Monica Leonards of Philadelphia asked recently how it
was that people born in the US, were deported from
Vienna and were holocaust victims - in essence, she
wondered why they did not return to the US in time?

I discussed this matter with Joe HERZ, an
old-established and knowledgeable SIG member from
Texas. He gives me full permission to post his views
as he has problems with plain text. This is what he
told me during our conversation:

"I would like to mention something concerning US
citizenship abroad. In the 1920s a new law came in
effect. Naturalized US citizens who returned to and
resided permanently in the country of their origin
lost their US citizenship after 3 years if they did
not return to the USA permanently.

Naturalized citizens residing in other foreign
countries lost their US citizenship after 5 years of
permanent residence abroad. There were exceptions to
this law and in the 1950s the Warren US Supreme Court
declared the law unconstitutional. Former US citizens
who had lost US citizenship under the law could
recover it. This may explain why some US citizens
living in Vienna could not return to the USA."

Celia Male [UK]


Austria-Czech SIG #Austria-Czech re; Holocaust victims born in New York #austria-czech

Celia Male <celiamale@...>
 

Monica Leonards of Philadelphia asked recently how it
was that people born in the US, were deported from
Vienna and were holocaust victims - in essence, she
wondered why they did not return to the US in time?

I discussed this matter with Joe HERZ, an
old-established and knowledgeable SIG member from
Texas. He gives me full permission to post his views
as he has problems with plain text. This is what he
told me during our conversation:

"I would like to mention something concerning US
citizenship abroad. In the 1920s a new law came in
effect. Naturalized US citizens who returned to and
resided permanently in the country of their origin
lost their US citizenship after 3 years if they did
not return to the USA permanently.

Naturalized citizens residing in other foreign
countries lost their US citizenship after 5 years of
permanent residence abroad. There were exceptions to
this law and in the 1950s the Warren US Supreme Court
declared the law unconstitutional. Former US citizens
who had lost US citizenship under the law could
recover it. This may explain why some US citizens
living in Vienna could not return to the USA."

Celia Male [UK]


Re: Emigration to UK in 1938 #austria-czech

VMotor <vmotor@...>
 

You will find a wealth of related information about this at
Richard Gaskell's web site:

http://www.geocities.com/czechandslovakthings/WW2_aguide.htm

bonne chance,

Karel Vanek
Belleville
Canada

HELFGOTT - Radlow, Vienna, Becov nad Teplou
AUERBACH - Becov nad Teplou, Vienna
STEINER - Oschelin

--- peter bakos <pgbakos@hotmail.com> wrote:

Prior to the start of WWII the UK (as well as the US) had a
policy of refusing DP's and refugees, particularly Jewish ones.

In the case of a cousin, the Vienna police records state that this
person "went to England" does not reflect whether or not they actually
gained entry. If that is the case, what happened to those persons?
-snip-


Austria-Czech SIG #Austria-Czech Re: Emigration to UK in 1938 #austria-czech

VMotor <vmotor@...>
 

You will find a wealth of related information about this at
Richard Gaskell's web site:

http://www.geocities.com/czechandslovakthings/WW2_aguide.htm

bonne chance,

Karel Vanek
Belleville
Canada

HELFGOTT - Radlow, Vienna, Becov nad Teplou
AUERBACH - Becov nad Teplou, Vienna
STEINER - Oschelin

--- peter bakos <pgbakos@hotmail.com> wrote:

Prior to the start of WWII the UK (as well as the US) had a
policy of refusing DP's and refugees, particularly Jewish ones.

In the case of a cousin, the Vienna police records state that this
person "went to England" does not reflect whether or not they actually
gained entry. If that is the case, what happened to those persons?
-snip-


Re: Bohemian Jewish census of 1793 #austria-czech

Celia Male <celiamale@...>
 

Vera Finberg of Fairfax, Virginia asks about the 1793
Jewish census of Bohemia as mentioned in Ruth Coman's
posting yesterday on Kurzwaren, Schnittwaren which
followed on logically >from my Hausieren posting a few
days ago [nb genealogy of postings!].

re the 1793 census of Jews in Bohemia: I have
mentioned this many, many times in my postings on this
SIG. There was an earlier 1783 Jewish census of
Bohemia as well - and earlier ones too which are
mentioned on our A-C website.

Please search the Austria-Czech website using the
search facility. Enter the word "census" and many
references will appear out of the aether! I am often
surprised how few people use our website and also the
message archives [enter "census" as well!]. They could
answer many of your questions! Simple Internet
searches with keywords also answer many questions.
These can then be followed up by more intensive
research.

I have only been to Prague twice and on the second
trip I visited the State Archives, where I looked at
the original 1783 and 1793 Jewish censuses for Kolin.
This is of course a thrill, but very hard work if you
do not read Old German script and do not recognise the
many archaic words.

The 1793 census of Jews in Bohemia has been
transcribed into modern Roman letters ie German we can
all read easily, and will be issued as a complete opus
in the next year or so. Unfortunately, the text that
accompanies it is only in Czech.

It will eventually cover the complete census - ie all
the 16 Kreis of Bohemia as well as Prague. At present,
four volumes are available >from the State archives in
Prague, covering 13 Kreis.

We are still waiting impatiently for the Klattauer,
Rakonitzer and Tschaslauer Kreis as well as Prague
itself. I also pray that there will be a cumulative
index as it is a very time-consuming business trawling
through the names and villages/towns in the 13
individual indices so far. This opus would be a
perfect candidate for a DVD/CD.

The most powerful approach to Jewish genealogical
research in Bohemia is to compare the 1783 and 1793
Jewish censuses, the BMD record and the Familianten
records all housed in Prague. The 1783 census often
has the original names of the families - as do the
familiant records before the official name changes.
But who has the time and energy? We all started too
late. That is why many people employ a competent
genealogist. Using the 1793 census transcriptions you
can prepare some of the groundwork for this research
yourself.

BTW: the Adler Society in Vienna purchased the four
volumes which can be inspected every Wednesday night,
if you happen to be in Vienna! The Hungarian SIG also
has copious information on censuses which are being
transcribed and which point to the Moravian origin of
many Hungarian Jews.

Celia Male [UK]

PS: to give you an idea of the scope of these volumes,
I proudly present the 1793 census entry for two of my
gt-gt-gt grandfathers: Samuel KOHN of Grossbock [Velka
Bukovina] Koniggratzer Kreis and Juda POPPER of
Kolin [Kaurzimer Kreis]: Samuel KOHN [16] gehoren
in Schutz nach Gradlitz; Feder und Pottaschenhandel;
Weib: Marianna; Tochter: Maria. My gt-gt grandfather
Raphael KOHN had not yet been born. His son Albert
moved to Vienna.

The 16 refers to the fact that he is the 16th family
in the census of Grossbock.

For Juda POPPER the information re his sons says:
erstgeborener sohn Jacob, ledig [ie single];
zweitgeborener sohn: Wolf, ledig etc [my gt-gt
grandfather]; upto the fifth born son and one
daughter. It also includes the two Jewish maids in the
household >from Blinka and Low SINA - the instructor
from Trietsch in Moravia. The five boys and one girl
obviously had private lessons all day >from a strict
teacher, who is perhaps related to another member of
our SIG?

The census thus gives valuable information about
lifestyles and social status too.


Austria-Czech SIG #Austria-Czech Re: Bohemian Jewish census of 1793 #austria-czech

Celia Male <celiamale@...>
 

Vera Finberg of Fairfax, Virginia asks about the 1793
Jewish census of Bohemia as mentioned in Ruth Coman's
posting yesterday on Kurzwaren, Schnittwaren which
followed on logically >from my Hausieren posting a few
days ago [nb genealogy of postings!].

re the 1793 census of Jews in Bohemia: I have
mentioned this many, many times in my postings on this
SIG. There was an earlier 1783 Jewish census of
Bohemia as well - and earlier ones too which are
mentioned on our A-C website.

Please search the Austria-Czech website using the
search facility. Enter the word "census" and many
references will appear out of the aether! I am often
surprised how few people use our website and also the
message archives [enter "census" as well!]. They could
answer many of your questions! Simple Internet
searches with keywords also answer many questions.
These can then be followed up by more intensive
research.

I have only been to Prague twice and on the second
trip I visited the State Archives, where I looked at
the original 1783 and 1793 Jewish censuses for Kolin.
This is of course a thrill, but very hard work if you
do not read Old German script and do not recognise the
many archaic words.

The 1793 census of Jews in Bohemia has been
transcribed into modern Roman letters ie German we can
all read easily, and will be issued as a complete opus
in the next year or so. Unfortunately, the text that
accompanies it is only in Czech.

It will eventually cover the complete census - ie all
the 16 Kreis of Bohemia as well as Prague. At present,
four volumes are available >from the State archives in
Prague, covering 13 Kreis.

We are still waiting impatiently for the Klattauer,
Rakonitzer and Tschaslauer Kreis as well as Prague
itself. I also pray that there will be a cumulative
index as it is a very time-consuming business trawling
through the names and villages/towns in the 13
individual indices so far. This opus would be a
perfect candidate for a DVD/CD.

The most powerful approach to Jewish genealogical
research in Bohemia is to compare the 1783 and 1793
Jewish censuses, the BMD record and the Familianten
records all housed in Prague. The 1783 census often
has the original names of the families - as do the
familiant records before the official name changes.
But who has the time and energy? We all started too
late. That is why many people employ a competent
genealogist. Using the 1793 census transcriptions you
can prepare some of the groundwork for this research
yourself.

BTW: the Adler Society in Vienna purchased the four
volumes which can be inspected every Wednesday night,
if you happen to be in Vienna! The Hungarian SIG also
has copious information on censuses which are being
transcribed and which point to the Moravian origin of
many Hungarian Jews.

Celia Male [UK]

PS: to give you an idea of the scope of these volumes,
I proudly present the 1793 census entry for two of my
gt-gt-gt grandfathers: Samuel KOHN of Grossbock [Velka
Bukovina] Koniggratzer Kreis and Juda POPPER of
Kolin [Kaurzimer Kreis]: Samuel KOHN [16] gehoren
in Schutz nach Gradlitz; Feder und Pottaschenhandel;
Weib: Marianna; Tochter: Maria. My gt-gt grandfather
Raphael KOHN had not yet been born. His son Albert
moved to Vienna.

The 16 refers to the fact that he is the 16th family
in the census of Grossbock.

For Juda POPPER the information re his sons says:
erstgeborener sohn Jacob, ledig [ie single];
zweitgeborener sohn: Wolf, ledig etc [my gt-gt
grandfather]; upto the fifth born son and one
daughter. It also includes the two Jewish maids in the
household >from Blinka and Low SINA - the instructor
from Trietsch in Moravia. The five boys and one girl
obviously had private lessons all day >from a strict
teacher, who is perhaps related to another member of
our SIG?

The census thus gives valuable information about
lifestyles and social status too.


Szczerzec cemetery #galicia

Logan J. Kleinwaks
 

I would appreciate hearing >from anyone who has documentation or photographs
of the Szczerzec cemetery, or who has a recommendation of how to obtain a
photograph of a tombstone (which may or may not still be standing) there.

Thanks very much and best regards,

Logan Kleinwaks
kleinwaks@alumni.princeton.edu
near Washington, D.C.

[MODERATOR NOTE: Please answer privately]


Gesher Galicia SIG #Galicia Szczerzec cemetery #galicia

Logan J. Kleinwaks
 

I would appreciate hearing >from anyone who has documentation or photographs
of the Szczerzec cemetery, or who has a recommendation of how to obtain a
photograph of a tombstone (which may or may not still be standing) there.

Thanks very much and best regards,

Logan Kleinwaks
kleinwaks@alumni.princeton.edu
near Washington, D.C.

[MODERATOR NOTE: Please answer privately]


Call for Articles for The Galitzianer #galicia

Edward Goldstein
 

The next issue of the Galitzianer will appear on 15 May 2005.

You are invited to contribute articles and other material that may be
of interest to individuals doing research on their Jewish ancestors
from Galicia. material written by others is acceptable, provided
permission to publish it is granted in writing by the copyright holder.
(Assume that, with few exceptions, all material originally published
in the United States after 1923 or abroad after 1922 is subject to
copyright protection, except for material produced by a government.)

Both unpublished and previously published material is acceptable.
Articles may cover such diverse topics as accounts of research
successes or failures, description of research trips to Galicia, lists
of names of individuals >from Galicia, etc. Graphics, including
photographs are invited, preferably in electronic format.

Text submissions should be in electronic format, preferably Microsoft
Word. Other word processing formats are also acceptable. They should be
sent as email attachments to Editor.TheGalitzianer@verizon.net. Text in
the body of emails is also acceptable, if you do not have access to a
word processing application. Clean typewritten text is acceptable as a
last resort. Hand-written material or type-written material that is of
poor quality is not acceptable, except for very brief items or material
of very special interest.

Please contact me, preferably by email if you have any questions.

Edward Goldstein
Editor, The Galitzianer


Gesher Galicia SIG #Galicia Call for Articles for The Galitzianer #galicia

Edward Goldstein
 

The next issue of the Galitzianer will appear on 15 May 2005.

You are invited to contribute articles and other material that may be
of interest to individuals doing research on their Jewish ancestors
from Galicia. material written by others is acceptable, provided
permission to publish it is granted in writing by the copyright holder.
(Assume that, with few exceptions, all material originally published
in the United States after 1923 or abroad after 1922 is subject to
copyright protection, except for material produced by a government.)

Both unpublished and previously published material is acceptable.
Articles may cover such diverse topics as accounts of research
successes or failures, description of research trips to Galicia, lists
of names of individuals >from Galicia, etc. Graphics, including
photographs are invited, preferably in electronic format.

Text submissions should be in electronic format, preferably Microsoft
Word. Other word processing formats are also acceptable. They should be
sent as email attachments to Editor.TheGalitzianer@verizon.net. Text in
the body of emails is also acceptable, if you do not have access to a
word processing application. Clean typewritten text is acceptable as a
last resort. Hand-written material or type-written material that is of
poor quality is not acceptable, except for very brief items or material
of very special interest.

Please contact me, preferably by email if you have any questions.

Edward Goldstein
Editor, The Galitzianer


Re: Assimilating and Fabricating Immigrants #general

Hilary Henkin <hilary@...>
 

Dear Orinne,
I can offer one suggestion to why the father has a plain headstone: lack
of money at that time.

I have a personal example: Around 1906, my grandfather Ruven Genkin was
supposed to emigrate >from Russia to Argentina. He and his brother got
snookered out of all their money in Amsterdam, and the local aid society
was able to scrape up enough funds to get them only to Canada.

My research revealed that an older half-brother had already been in Buenos
Aires, and in 1913 he joined the family in Toronto. Around 1922, the
family moved to Los Angeles. The half-brother never married, and in 1932,
died. When I inquired at the cemetery about a photo of his gravestone last
year, they told me there wasn't one - the grave was totally bare. I can
only surmise that with no wife or full siblings, and in the depths of the
Depression, the family didn't have the money for a headstone, and no one
ever got around to it.

And yes, one of my genealogical goals is to have a headstone placed at his
grave.

Hilary Henkin

Researching:
Mogilev - BERLIN; BELIISKI; HENKIN - GENKIN; MESCENOKOV; POZ - POZE
Ekaterinoslav - KATZ; LAPIDUS; LAVROTIN - LAVRUTIN; PESACHINSKY;
SHIMERNITSKY; STEINHART
Roumania: DONNENFIELD; RINCOVER - HARINCOVER; DOLLINGER
Harbin, China: SREBERK - SCHRIEBER; LITEBSK; SCHON --


Re: Name Yitta #general

Ury Link
 

Dear Genners,

Barbara Mannlein asked:

>>I recorded (>from oral reports) a Jewish name of Yetta. Today the
descendant of that woman told me that her Jewish name was Yita, pronounced
"Yitt-ah". Is their such a name or is it only a regional Yiddish
pronunciation?>>>>>

my answer is: You have 2 explanation for this name ,the first one is for
Yetta, this name is a shortening of the name Henriette or Henrietta ,a
female form of the French name Henri.
The second explanation is that the name Yitta is a nickname to the Hebrew
name Yehudith.

The name Henriette or Henrietta was popular in the 19 century in Germany
and Midden Europe between Jews and not Jews.
The name Yitta was popular between the Jews of Lita

You see that you have to deal with 2 different names Yetta and Yitta.

Best regards
Ury Link
Amsterdam
Holland


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Assimilating and Fabricating Immigrants #general

Hilary Henkin <hilary@...>
 

Dear Orinne,
I can offer one suggestion to why the father has a plain headstone: lack
of money at that time.

I have a personal example: Around 1906, my grandfather Ruven Genkin was
supposed to emigrate >from Russia to Argentina. He and his brother got
snookered out of all their money in Amsterdam, and the local aid society
was able to scrape up enough funds to get them only to Canada.

My research revealed that an older half-brother had already been in Buenos
Aires, and in 1913 he joined the family in Toronto. Around 1922, the
family moved to Los Angeles. The half-brother never married, and in 1932,
died. When I inquired at the cemetery about a photo of his gravestone last
year, they told me there wasn't one - the grave was totally bare. I can
only surmise that with no wife or full siblings, and in the depths of the
Depression, the family didn't have the money for a headstone, and no one
ever got around to it.

And yes, one of my genealogical goals is to have a headstone placed at his
grave.

Hilary Henkin

Researching:
Mogilev - BERLIN; BELIISKI; HENKIN - GENKIN; MESCENOKOV; POZ - POZE
Ekaterinoslav - KATZ; LAPIDUS; LAVROTIN - LAVRUTIN; PESACHINSKY;
SHIMERNITSKY; STEINHART
Roumania: DONNENFIELD; RINCOVER - HARINCOVER; DOLLINGER
Harbin, China: SREBERK - SCHRIEBER; LITEBSK; SCHON --


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Name Yitta #general

Ury Link
 

Dear Genners,

Barbara Mannlein asked:

>>I recorded (>from oral reports) a Jewish name of Yetta. Today the
descendant of that woman told me that her Jewish name was Yita, pronounced
"Yitt-ah". Is their such a name or is it only a regional Yiddish
pronunciation?>>>>>

my answer is: You have 2 explanation for this name ,the first one is for
Yetta, this name is a shortening of the name Henriette or Henrietta ,a
female form of the French name Henri.
The second explanation is that the name Yitta is a nickname to the Hebrew
name Yehudith.

The name Henriette or Henrietta was popular in the 19 century in Germany
and Midden Europe between Jews and not Jews.
The name Yitta was popular between the Jews of Lita

You see that you have to deal with 2 different names Yetta and Yitta.

Best regards
Ury Link
Amsterdam
Holland


Re: Cost of travel to UK #general

Ralph Apel <Ralph.Apel@...>
 

If memory serves 85 pre-WW1 roubles was approx. 10 pounds sterling,
nearly 2 onths wages for a working man.

peter@clearneasy.freeserve.co.uk (Peter Levene) wrote:

I have been going through some old documents belonging to my grandfather
and have found several receipts for money sent to his parents in Bialystok
during the years 1903 to 1913. The last amount was 85 roubles sent to his
mother, who I am led to believe, died the following month. Does anyone know
if 85 roubles was sufficient to bring two people to England in 1913?
Peter Levene, UK


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Cost of travel to UK #general

Ralph Apel <Ralph.Apel@...>
 

If memory serves 85 pre-WW1 roubles was approx. 10 pounds sterling,
nearly 2 onths wages for a working man.

peter@clearneasy.freeserve.co.uk (Peter Levene) wrote:

I have been going through some old documents belonging to my grandfather
and have found several receipts for money sent to his parents in Bialystok
during the years 1903 to 1913. The last amount was 85 roubles sent to his
mother, who I am led to believe, died the following month. Does anyone know
if 85 roubles was sufficient to bring two people to England in 1913?
Peter Levene, UK


Help needed obtaining a ship's passenger list after 1957 #general

Felicia P. Zieff <tzippy_chs@...>
 

Dear friends,

Does anyone know how I can obtain the passenger list of the ship I came to
the U.S. on in 1965? The ship was the S.S. United States. We boarded at Le
Havre, France and arrived in New York Harbor on September 21, 1965. I've
already contacted the S.S. United States Conservancy organization. They
claimed that this list does not exist. If you can help, please contact me
privately.

Thank you.

Felicia P. Zieff
Chicago


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Help needed obtaining a ship's passenger list after 1957 #general

Felicia P. Zieff <tzippy_chs@...>
 

Dear friends,

Does anyone know how I can obtain the passenger list of the ship I came to
the U.S. on in 1965? The ship was the S.S. United States. We boarded at Le
Havre, France and arrived in New York Harbor on September 21, 1965. I've
already contacted the S.S. United States Conservancy organization. They
claimed that this list does not exist. If you can help, please contact me
privately.

Thank you.

Felicia P. Zieff
Chicago


Looking for researcher Jewel Fishkin #general

Joan W.Breslow <webjoandog@...>
 

If there is any contact information available for Jewel Fishkin, I
would appreciate contact offering same.

Am researching HYET / HYDE and JACOBSON / JACABSON, >from Lavia.

Thanks,

Joan, San Marcos,Ca..
webjoandog@earthlink.net


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Looking for researcher Jewel Fishkin #general

Joan W.Breslow <webjoandog@...>
 

If there is any contact information available for Jewel Fishkin, I
would appreciate contact offering same.

Am researching HYET / HYDE and JACOBSON / JACABSON, >from Lavia.

Thanks,

Joan, San Marcos,Ca..
webjoandog@earthlink.net