Date   

Re: Firstname "Emanuel" on JRI-Poland : thank you ! #general

Prof. G. L. Esterson <jerry@...>
 

Florence Mendelssohn of Paris posted as follows:

"Thank you for your replies about the firstname *Emanuel*.
I still don't know the exact (numerical) frequency of this firstname on the
JRI-Poland data base, but I can give you just an exemple :
among 6158 persons having the patronyme *KOHN* (DM -Soudex) on the
data-base, I found several rare firstnames (Etka , Szymen, Gberek, Lewin ,
C'erence, Krasse, Szepal, Dobrisz, Wotek, Blaj , Ulo , Beinisz,...) , but
no
Emanuel !!!
Statistics may be usefull in genealogy ...
If I have the chance to discover the birth-act of my *Emanuel*( Mendel ?
Menahem ?.. ) I will be very happy to tell you what was his native first
name!"

First, nearly all of the example names quoted above *were* fairly common in
various countries in Europe.

Second, there is some confusion about the name Emanuel in the posted
message and the Hebrew name Imanueyl found in our Bible (Isaiah
7:14). There were several non-Jewish name versions of the Biblical name
Imanueyl which were adopted by non-Jews in Europe. There were three main
ones which were early adopted by Christians in Germany: Emanuel, Imanuel,
and Immanuel.

Later, during the Enlightenment when Jews were emancipated in Germany,
these very same three names became popular secular names for Jews in
Germany. This popularity began around the beginning of the 19th century,
and even before, as Jews embraced German culture and their new freedom, and
expanded rapidly during the 19th century. This occurred to such an extent
that the rabbis of Germany who were involved with setting Jewish divorce
law in Hilchot Gitin (divorce law) books authorized the use of these *new*
names (as the rabbis termed them) for use as kinuim for Jewish men and
women in writing a Get (divorce document). The above three names were
among the 500 such German secular names adopted by German Jews and used in
this way.

These *new* kinuim thus joined the long-used Yiddish *old* names (as the
rabbis called the Yiddish names) and were then used very much as were the
Old names, with two exceptions. First, for Old names, they always allowed
some Hebrew names to *fall out of use* and not be written in a Get, if the
Hebrew name was no longer used, and if the Yiddish name was the only one
used. But this was not the case for the New names. In this case, they
always had to be written along with the Hebrew (Primary) name of the person
which did not *fall out of use*. Second, the New name had to be written in
Hebrew characters rather than in their original Latin characters, and the
resulting pronunciation of the New kinui had to be as close as possible to
the original pronunciation in the vernacular, non-Jewish language from
which they came.

Thus, the legal name of persons who had adopted one of the New names would
need to be written this way: Yisraeyl hamechune Emanuel -- all in Hebrew
characters. It was common for these New names not to be related in a close
way with the person's Hebrew, primary name, as this example shows. But
there were a few names that did acquire a close link to certain Hebrew
names. Avraham and Alfred were one example: Avraham haMechune Alfred, and
Imanueyl and Emanuel were another: Imanueyl haMechune Emanuel; these were
recognized linkages.

>from Germany, these new names spread rapidly to Poland and Hungary and
acquired in those countries the same authorization for use in a Get as had
occurred in Germany. But the Polish and Hungarian Jews did substitute some
of their own local variations for the original German secular names --
perhaps about ten percent of the original names. The same occurred in some
other European countries, where one will occasionally see one of the 500
*new* names >from Germany, which were used for non-Jewish purposes.

You can find more information about these names by searching for them on
the Given Names Data Base web site at
http://www.jewishgen.org/databases/GivenNames/search.htm . They appear in
the German, Polish, and Hungarian data bases, and are shown there in
capital letters to distinguish them >from the old names and the Hebrew
names. These entries will be refined in the next update of this web site.

Prof. G. L. Esterson, Ra'anana, Israel


Kitchinova Rebbe/Kretchnover Rebbe #general

Mitch Silk <silk@...>
 

caren b rubio <carenru@...> wrote:

Dear Genners-
Can anyone provide me with information on the Kitchinova Rebbe and the
Chassidim who followed him?
Thank you!
Caren Rubio
carenru@...

My response is:

Are you sure that you have the name right? The only chassidus of which I am
aware that bears a resemblance to this is Kretchnif (the Kretchnover Rebbe),
which stems >from the Nadvorna line. The first Kretchnover Rebbe was Rebbe
Meir, who was a son of the first Nadvorna Rebbe (Mordechai Leifer). Rebbe
Meir settled in the town of Kretchnif and thus the name.

Mitchell Silk
Hong Kong

MENSCHENFREUND, Nadvorna, Delatyn


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Kitchinova Rebbe/Kretchnover Rebbe #general

Mitch Silk <silk@...>
 

caren b rubio <carenru@...> wrote:

Dear Genners-
Can anyone provide me with information on the Kitchinova Rebbe and the
Chassidim who followed him?
Thank you!
Caren Rubio
carenru@...

My response is:

Are you sure that you have the name right? The only chassidus of which I am
aware that bears a resemblance to this is Kretchnif (the Kretchnover Rebbe),
which stems >from the Nadvorna line. The first Kretchnover Rebbe was Rebbe
Meir, who was a son of the first Nadvorna Rebbe (Mordechai Leifer). Rebbe
Meir settled in the town of Kretchnif and thus the name.

Mitchell Silk
Hong Kong

MENSCHENFREUND, Nadvorna, Delatyn


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Firstname "Emanuel" on JRI-Poland : thank you ! #general

Prof. G. L. Esterson <jerry@...>
 

Florence Mendelssohn of Paris posted as follows:

"Thank you for your replies about the firstname *Emanuel*.
I still don't know the exact (numerical) frequency of this firstname on the
JRI-Poland data base, but I can give you just an exemple :
among 6158 persons having the patronyme *KOHN* (DM -Soudex) on the
data-base, I found several rare firstnames (Etka , Szymen, Gberek, Lewin ,
C'erence, Krasse, Szepal, Dobrisz, Wotek, Blaj , Ulo , Beinisz,...) , but
no
Emanuel !!!
Statistics may be usefull in genealogy ...
If I have the chance to discover the birth-act of my *Emanuel*( Mendel ?
Menahem ?.. ) I will be very happy to tell you what was his native first
name!"

First, nearly all of the example names quoted above *were* fairly common in
various countries in Europe.

Second, there is some confusion about the name Emanuel in the posted
message and the Hebrew name Imanueyl found in our Bible (Isaiah
7:14). There were several non-Jewish name versions of the Biblical name
Imanueyl which were adopted by non-Jews in Europe. There were three main
ones which were early adopted by Christians in Germany: Emanuel, Imanuel,
and Immanuel.

Later, during the Enlightenment when Jews were emancipated in Germany,
these very same three names became popular secular names for Jews in
Germany. This popularity began around the beginning of the 19th century,
and even before, as Jews embraced German culture and their new freedom, and
expanded rapidly during the 19th century. This occurred to such an extent
that the rabbis of Germany who were involved with setting Jewish divorce
law in Hilchot Gitin (divorce law) books authorized the use of these *new*
names (as the rabbis termed them) for use as kinuim for Jewish men and
women in writing a Get (divorce document). The above three names were
among the 500 such German secular names adopted by German Jews and used in
this way.

These *new* kinuim thus joined the long-used Yiddish *old* names (as the
rabbis called the Yiddish names) and were then used very much as were the
Old names, with two exceptions. First, for Old names, they always allowed
some Hebrew names to *fall out of use* and not be written in a Get, if the
Hebrew name was no longer used, and if the Yiddish name was the only one
used. But this was not the case for the New names. In this case, they
always had to be written along with the Hebrew (Primary) name of the person
which did not *fall out of use*. Second, the New name had to be written in
Hebrew characters rather than in their original Latin characters, and the
resulting pronunciation of the New kinui had to be as close as possible to
the original pronunciation in the vernacular, non-Jewish language from
which they came.

Thus, the legal name of persons who had adopted one of the New names would
need to be written this way: Yisraeyl hamechune Emanuel -- all in Hebrew
characters. It was common for these New names not to be related in a close
way with the person's Hebrew, primary name, as this example shows. But
there were a few names that did acquire a close link to certain Hebrew
names. Avraham and Alfred were one example: Avraham haMechune Alfred, and
Imanueyl and Emanuel were another: Imanueyl haMechune Emanuel; these were
recognized linkages.

>from Germany, these new names spread rapidly to Poland and Hungary and
acquired in those countries the same authorization for use in a Get as had
occurred in Germany. But the Polish and Hungarian Jews did substitute some
of their own local variations for the original German secular names --
perhaps about ten percent of the original names. The same occurred in some
other European countries, where one will occasionally see one of the 500
*new* names >from Germany, which were used for non-Jewish purposes.

You can find more information about these names by searching for them on
the Given Names Data Base web site at
http://www.jewishgen.org/databases/GivenNames/search.htm . They appear in
the German, Polish, and Hungarian data bases, and are shown there in
capital letters to distinguish them >from the old names and the Hebrew
names. These entries will be refined in the next update of this web site.

Prof. G. L. Esterson, Ra'anana, Israel


Re: Letter *A* preceding a surname #general

tom klein <bossman@...>
 

in hebrew, the letter *heh* preceding a word is the equivalent of the
english definite article *the*. in the case of *hacohen*, as in *shlomo
ben moshe hacohen*, it means *the priest*, which is a hereditary title,
but not necessarily a surname.

depending on the person's accent, *hacohen* can easily transform
into *acohen*, especially in places where the *h* is not pronounced, such
as russia and france.

regards,


tom klein, toronto

"Goulnik, Yves {PBC~Basel}" <YVES.GOULNIK@...> wrote:


I was wondering whether the letter 'A' in front of a surname had any
meaning. I have come across a few AGULNIK also >from Odessa but was
not able to assess whether there was any relationship to my own
surname GULNIK.

However, reading the story of Jewish Agricultural Colonies in Russia,
one of the web pages lists people with Elcana ACOHEN as their father
and KOHAN/KOHEN as their surname.

So, what is the meaning of affixed letter 'A'?

thx/Yv yves.goulnik@... http://goulniky.free.fr/


Success on Census - Reversing Names #general

Rlberliner@...
 

I have written about diligently searching for my great uncle, Abraham JACOBS,
and who we think to be his son, Hyman JACOBS.

I hope the following will help all genners. While searching on the census
through ancestry.com, we found Hyman JACOBS. However, the catch is that we
put him in as Jacob HYMAN, and up he came with all of the children we know to
be the right ones. There are some discrepancies in the birthdates with what
we had and what they list. But the point is, try reversing names, even if you
don't have two first names like Hyman and Jacob. Since then I have seen a
Mollie, Goldberg on the census. See what I mean.

Good luck to all of us!
Rachelle Berliner
Savannah, GA
rlberliner@...


ViewMate#1608- translate back of photo from German #general

Feige Stern <fstern@...>
 

I recently submitted a scan of the back of a photo of a man I believe to be
my husband's GGF, which I thought was written in Polish. A kind JGenner
wrote back, and said he thought it was written in German.
If someone fluent in German would be kind enough to translate it for me, I'd
be very grateful.
It can be seen at:
http://www.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/source/vm1608.html
(the title is *please translate back of photo*).
Please respond directly to me.
Feige Stern
Researching:
KAUVAR/KLEVARSKY/KOLOVARSKY, Seduva, Lithuania: SILVERSTEIN, Kedainiai,
Rasseiniai, Lithuania: NAFTEL, Rasseiniai, Lithuania: SCHENKER, Dankera,
Latvia; HOFFMAN, Bessarabia; SCHWARTZ, Braila, Romania; STERN, Russia;
FRIEDMAN, Odessa, Russia: SOBEL, Kleparov, Galicia


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Success on Census - Reversing Names #general

Rlberliner@...
 

I have written about diligently searching for my great uncle, Abraham JACOBS,
and who we think to be his son, Hyman JACOBS.

I hope the following will help all genners. While searching on the census
through ancestry.com, we found Hyman JACOBS. However, the catch is that we
put him in as Jacob HYMAN, and up he came with all of the children we know to
be the right ones. There are some discrepancies in the birthdates with what
we had and what they list. But the point is, try reversing names, even if you
don't have two first names like Hyman and Jacob. Since then I have seen a
Mollie, Goldberg on the census. See what I mean.

Good luck to all of us!
Rachelle Berliner
Savannah, GA
rlberliner@...


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen ViewMate#1608- translate back of photo from German #general

Feige Stern <fstern@...>
 

I recently submitted a scan of the back of a photo of a man I believe to be
my husband's GGF, which I thought was written in Polish. A kind JGenner
wrote back, and said he thought it was written in German.
If someone fluent in German would be kind enough to translate it for me, I'd
be very grateful.
It can be seen at:
http://www.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/source/vm1608.html
(the title is *please translate back of photo*).
Please respond directly to me.
Feige Stern
Researching:
KAUVAR/KLEVARSKY/KOLOVARSKY, Seduva, Lithuania: SILVERSTEIN, Kedainiai,
Rasseiniai, Lithuania: NAFTEL, Rasseiniai, Lithuania: SCHENKER, Dankera,
Latvia; HOFFMAN, Bessarabia; SCHWARTZ, Braila, Romania; STERN, Russia;
FRIEDMAN, Odessa, Russia: SOBEL, Kleparov, Galicia


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Letter *A* preceding a surname #general

tom klein <bossman@...>
 

in hebrew, the letter *heh* preceding a word is the equivalent of the
english definite article *the*. in the case of *hacohen*, as in *shlomo
ben moshe hacohen*, it means *the priest*, which is a hereditary title,
but not necessarily a surname.

depending on the person's accent, *hacohen* can easily transform
into *acohen*, especially in places where the *h* is not pronounced, such
as russia and france.

regards,


tom klein, toronto

"Goulnik, Yves {PBC~Basel}" <YVES.GOULNIK@...> wrote:


I was wondering whether the letter 'A' in front of a surname had any
meaning. I have come across a few AGULNIK also >from Odessa but was
not able to assess whether there was any relationship to my own
surname GULNIK.

However, reading the story of Jewish Agricultural Colonies in Russia,
one of the web pages lists people with Elcana ACOHEN as their father
and KOHAN/KOHEN as their surname.

So, what is the meaning of affixed letter 'A'?

thx/Yv yves.goulnik@... http://goulniky.free.fr/


Rabbinic Genealogy SIG #Rabbinic Previous Queries #rabbinic

rosinskyb
 

Hi

I'd like to thank everybody that sent answers to my questions
regarding EPSTEIN and the Brest yeshiva. Concerning Leslie Reich's
question as to the young man's age. He was 18 and was married to a
14 year old girl. He had a son born a few months after his death,
and the son was named after him.

Philip Rosinsky


Previous Queries #rabbinic

rosinskyb
 

Hi

I'd like to thank everybody that sent answers to my questions
regarding EPSTEIN and the Brest yeshiva. Concerning Leslie Reich's
question as to the young man's age. He was 18 and was married to a
14 year old girl. He had a son born a few months after his death,
and the son was named after him.

Philip Rosinsky


Cong Ah Zedek Ansh Timkowitz YIVO Landsmanshaften #belarus

JSelig3460@...
 

Timkowitzers:
Can the reader explain the significance of the name "Nacoma Club" as it
pertains to the Montefiore Cemetery [Queens, NY] burial permits ?
Jerry Seligsohn
NYC
SELIGSOHN and ELKIN of Mogilev/Dnepr


Belarus SIG #Belarus Cong Ah Zedek Ansh Timkowitz YIVO Landsmanshaften #belarus

JSelig3460@...
 

Timkowitzers:
Can the reader explain the significance of the name "Nacoma Club" as it
pertains to the Montefiore Cemetery [Queens, NY] burial permits ?
Jerry Seligsohn
NYC
SELIGSOHN and ELKIN of Mogilev/Dnepr


Rabbinic Genealogy SIG #Rabbinic R. Yomtov Lipman HELLER #rabbinic

Susan Edel
 

I am looking for the descendants of R. Yomtov Lipman HELLER from
whom I hear we are descended. Are there any books that would give
me information about him and his descendants, or can anyone help me.
I have been told that the ELLERN family are descendants of his.

Many thanks,

Susan Edel
Petach Tikva, Israel

Also researching FEUCHTWANGER, BING, FARNTROG and SCHWAB all from
Bavaria, Germany.


R. Yomtov Lipman HELLER #rabbinic

Susan Edel
 

I am looking for the descendants of R. Yomtov Lipman HELLER from
whom I hear we are descended. Are there any books that would give
me information about him and his descendants, or can anyone help me.
I have been told that the ELLERN family are descendants of his.

Many thanks,

Susan Edel
Petach Tikva, Israel

Also researching FEUCHTWANGER, BING, FARNTROG and SCHWAB all from
Bavaria, Germany.


#Ciechanow #Poland IAJGS Conference #ciechanow #poland

Stan Zeidenberg
 

For any in the group who are planning to be in Toronto for the
Conference, please let me know so that we can make some
arrangements to meet.

For complete Conference information, please see:

http://www.jgstoronto2002.ca/

Stan Zeidenberg
Ciechanow Research Group


IAJGS Conference #ciechanow #poland

Stan Zeidenberg
 

For any in the group who are planning to be in Toronto for the
Conference, please let me know so that we can make some
arrangements to meet.

For complete Conference information, please see:

http://www.jgstoronto2002.ca/

Stan Zeidenberg
Ciechanow Research Group


Success on Census - Reversing Names #belarus

Rlberliner@...
 

I have written about diligently searching for my great uncle, ABRAHAM JACOBS,
and who we think to be his son, HYMAN JACOBS.

I hope the following will help all genners. While searching on the census
through ancestry.com, we found HYMAN JACOBS. However, the catch is that we
put him in as JACOB HYMAN, and up he came with all of the children we know to
be the right ones. There are some discrepancies in the birthdates with what
we had and what they list. But the point is, try reversing names, even if you
don't have two first names like Hyman and Jacob. Since then I have seen a
Mollie, Goldberg on the census. See what I mean.

Good luck to all of us!
Rachelle Berliner
Savannah, GA
rlberliner@...


Belarus SIG #Belarus Success on Census - Reversing Names #belarus

Rlberliner@...
 

I have written about diligently searching for my great uncle, ABRAHAM JACOBS,
and who we think to be his son, HYMAN JACOBS.

I hope the following will help all genners. While searching on the census
through ancestry.com, we found HYMAN JACOBS. However, the catch is that we
put him in as JACOB HYMAN, and up he came with all of the children we know to
be the right ones. There are some discrepancies in the birthdates with what
we had and what they list. But the point is, try reversing names, even if you
don't have two first names like Hyman and Jacob. Since then I have seen a
Mollie, Goldberg on the census. See what I mean.

Good luck to all of us!
Rachelle Berliner
Savannah, GA
rlberliner@...