Date   

privacy legislation #hungary

George Farkas <gfarkas@...>
 

At 02/08/2004 08:18 PM, David & Diana Laufer sent the a message which
included the following:
Since Privacy laws were passed in Australia a few years ago, it may be
difficult to obtain
the desired information.
which prompted me to ask:

How much do you feel that privacy legislation (not only in Australia) is
impeding genealogical research?
Do do believe that this privacy legislation is worth it?

George Farkas
Montreal

Moderator: This is another one of those topics that are important but not really subjects for debate on this list. Please continue discussions off-list unless they are directly related to problems obtaining records in the formerly Hungarian-speaking areas that are the scope of this list.


Hungary SIG #Hungary privacy legislation #hungary

George Farkas <gfarkas@...>
 

At 02/08/2004 08:18 PM, David & Diana Laufer sent the a message which
included the following:
Since Privacy laws were passed in Australia a few years ago, it may be
difficult to obtain
the desired information.
which prompted me to ask:

How much do you feel that privacy legislation (not only in Australia) is
impeding genealogical research?
Do do believe that this privacy legislation is worth it?

George Farkas
Montreal

Moderator: This is another one of those topics that are important but not really subjects for debate on this list. Please continue discussions off-list unless they are directly related to problems obtaining records in the formerly Hungarian-speaking areas that are the scope of this list.


Re: The Moderator's comments on a new bibliography #hungary

jan meisels allen <janmallen@...>
 

As an H-SIG member I took offense at the e-mail sent by the authors
complaining about the additional note placed by the moderator of the
one-time posting and that JewishGen had no connection with the book they
were promoting. The e-mail authors should be aware that other publicatons,
CDs, etc. have had similar notations not only on this SIG but all JewishGen
SIGs/Discussion groups, and no one else over the years seems to take such
offense.

JewishGen is a non-profit entity and probably has to require such
designations to maintain its status. The comment Jewish Gen has no
connection with this publication is again probably due to the fiduciary
rules. One time is all that any such venture is mentioned on any JewishGen
site. The rules were set up for all to follow, not " Perhaps the RULES are
not so strict, as the Moderator thinks" ...just because it does not suite
them.

The authors are, in my opinion, way off base by castigating our very
excellent, and helpful moderator who is required to follow the rules set by
the organization that hosts this SIG discussion group. No one else, when
they request similar postings, seems to have taken such offense by the
addition to the message- neither should they.

Jan Meisels Allen
Agoura Hills, CA

SEARCHING: REICH, WALD, ZUPNIK-Eperjes,HUNGARY/Presov,SLOVAKIA; Szivdnik;
Sebes Kellemes, HUNGARY(Sarisske Luky, SLOVAKIA) Salgo, HUNGARY
MEISELS, SEGAL, LIEBERMAN --Brody, UKRAINE
KLAJNMAN, SZLANG-- Sochaczew, Poland
FREJER, IMJAK, WILAMOWSKY, KREPLAK, SZAPIRA, SOBOTKA, PIATKOWSKA, --
Lomza- Stawiski,POLAND
GUTFARB -- Zambrow, POLAND

----- Original Message -----
From: "ãåã âåøãåï" <mirda@netvision.net.il>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 11:23 PM
Subject: [h-sig] The Moderator's comments on a new bibliography


<snip>


Re: Deutsch Re: (Re)introduction #hungary

BruceKitty@...
 

Victor,
My grandmother's maiden name was Deutsch. I saw "Deutsch" as one of the
family
names in your searches too. What country, city, does your Deutsch ancestor
come
from? Mine is Hungarian,
Many thanks for your reply,
Kitty Sauber, NY


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: The Moderator's comments on a new bibliography #hungary

jan meisels allen <janmallen@...>
 

As an H-SIG member I took offense at the e-mail sent by the authors
complaining about the additional note placed by the moderator of the
one-time posting and that JewishGen had no connection with the book they
were promoting. The e-mail authors should be aware that other publicatons,
CDs, etc. have had similar notations not only on this SIG but all JewishGen
SIGs/Discussion groups, and no one else over the years seems to take such
offense.

JewishGen is a non-profit entity and probably has to require such
designations to maintain its status. The comment Jewish Gen has no
connection with this publication is again probably due to the fiduciary
rules. One time is all that any such venture is mentioned on any JewishGen
site. The rules were set up for all to follow, not " Perhaps the RULES are
not so strict, as the Moderator thinks" ...just because it does not suite
them.

The authors are, in my opinion, way off base by castigating our very
excellent, and helpful moderator who is required to follow the rules set by
the organization that hosts this SIG discussion group. No one else, when
they request similar postings, seems to have taken such offense by the
addition to the message- neither should they.

Jan Meisels Allen
Agoura Hills, CA

SEARCHING: REICH, WALD, ZUPNIK-Eperjes,HUNGARY/Presov,SLOVAKIA; Szivdnik;
Sebes Kellemes, HUNGARY(Sarisske Luky, SLOVAKIA) Salgo, HUNGARY
MEISELS, SEGAL, LIEBERMAN --Brody, UKRAINE
KLAJNMAN, SZLANG-- Sochaczew, Poland
FREJER, IMJAK, WILAMOWSKY, KREPLAK, SZAPIRA, SOBOTKA, PIATKOWSKA, --
Lomza- Stawiski,POLAND
GUTFARB -- Zambrow, POLAND

----- Original Message -----
From: "ãåã âåøãåï" <mirda@netvision.net.il>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 11:23 PM
Subject: [h-sig] The Moderator's comments on a new bibliography


<snip>


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Deutsch Re: (Re)introduction #hungary

BruceKitty@...
 

Victor,
My grandmother's maiden name was Deutsch. I saw "Deutsch" as one of the
family
names in your searches too. What country, city, does your Deutsch ancestor
come
from? Mine is Hungarian,
Many thanks for your reply,
Kitty Sauber, NY


FW: Translation of documents #hungary

annsel <annsel@...>
 

-----Original Message-----
From: annsel [mailto:annsel@cox.net]
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2004 4:33 PM
To: 'h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org'
Subject: Translation of documents

Hi All,
I need some help with the translation of 2 documents that belonged to my
Great Grandfather. The first document viewmate 4484 show my Great Great GF
and his wife, if I'm reading it correctly. I don't know what the second line
would be. I believe the second document lists all the siblings of my GGF
Emanuel Rosenbaum. If so, this would be the only document I have to prove
relationships. I've had so much help in the past >from this group that I'm
hoping someone out there can help again. I'm truly grateful. The two
documents can be viewed at:

(http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate


Please respond privately

Anne Selikov
So Cal

Researching: ROSENBAUM Veke, BERKOVICS M. Jestreb, SCHWACH Debrecen, ONIGES
Zemplen County Kiraly Helmcz


Re: Translation of documents #hungary

MGS18@...
 

Dear Anne,

The town of Magyar Jesztreb is in my family file as well. Just wondering
if the surnames SCHWARTZ or GROSSHANDLER have popped up in your research.

Mindy Soclof
Ann Arbor, MI

BERKOVICS M. Jestreb


Re: Hungarian Jewish Congress attendee #hungary

??? ?????? <mirda@...>
 

You can find information about Philip (Rafael) Bettelheim in the
"Magyar Zsido Lexikon" ed. by Ujvari Peter
Budapest 1929, p. 115 under the name of Bettelheim B. Mozes.
Philip (Rafael) was his son.
If you have difficulties to find it we can send the information ether in
Hungarian or in English translation/.
Miryam & David Gordon
Rehovot, Israel

----- Original Message -----
From: <KLOOGWEIN@aol.com>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 4:33 PM
Subject: [h-sig] Hungarian Jewish Congress attendee


At the Hungarian Jewish Congress of 1868/1869, one of the attendees was
PHILIPP BETTELHEIM. Does anyone know where I can find biographical or
genealogic
information about this individual?

Judy Weinstein
Great Neck, NY USA


Hungary SIG #Hungary FW: Translation of documents #hungary

annsel <annsel@...>
 

-----Original Message-----
From: annsel [mailto:annsel@cox.net]
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2004 4:33 PM
To: 'h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org'
Subject: Translation of documents

Hi All,
I need some help with the translation of 2 documents that belonged to my
Great Grandfather. The first document viewmate 4484 show my Great Great GF
and his wife, if I'm reading it correctly. I don't know what the second line
would be. I believe the second document lists all the siblings of my GGF
Emanuel Rosenbaum. If so, this would be the only document I have to prove
relationships. I've had so much help in the past >from this group that I'm
hoping someone out there can help again. I'm truly grateful. The two
documents can be viewed at:

(http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate


Please respond privately

Anne Selikov
So Cal

Researching: ROSENBAUM Veke, BERKOVICS M. Jestreb, SCHWACH Debrecen, ONIGES
Zemplen County Kiraly Helmcz


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Translation of documents #hungary

MGS18@...
 

Dear Anne,

The town of Magyar Jesztreb is in my family file as well. Just wondering
if the surnames SCHWARTZ or GROSSHANDLER have popped up in your research.

Mindy Soclof
Ann Arbor, MI

BERKOVICS M. Jestreb


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Hungarian Jewish Congress attendee #hungary

??? ?????? <mirda@...>
 

You can find information about Philip (Rafael) Bettelheim in the
"Magyar Zsido Lexikon" ed. by Ujvari Peter
Budapest 1929, p. 115 under the name of Bettelheim B. Mozes.
Philip (Rafael) was his son.
If you have difficulties to find it we can send the information ether in
Hungarian or in English translation/.
Miryam & David Gordon
Rehovot, Israel

----- Original Message -----
From: <KLOOGWEIN@aol.com>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2004 4:33 PM
Subject: [h-sig] Hungarian Jewish Congress attendee


At the Hungarian Jewish Congress of 1868/1869, one of the attendees was
PHILIPP BETTELHEIM. Does anyone know where I can find biographical or
genealogic
information about this individual?

Judy Weinstein
Great Neck, NY USA


Re: National Archives of Australia #hungary

David & Diana Laufer <laufer@...>
 

Pat,

Since Privacy laws were passed in Australia a few years ago, it may be difficult to obtain
the desired information.

However, may I suggest that you try another organisation namely Jewish Care, previously
known as the Jewish Welfare Society (JWS). That organisation was formed in the early 1940's
to assist the many Jewish refugees who arrived in Australia. Its activities have expanded
greatly since then. There are really 2 organisations with that name, one based in Sydney
in the State of New South Wales; the other in Melbourne in the State of Victoria. Here is
the URL of the Sydney Jewish Care.
http://www.jewishcare.com.au/MintDigital.NET/JewishCare.aspx
I must warn you however, that Jewish Care may also be constrained by the Privacy Laws.

You could also try the online version of Australian telephone directories -
http://www.whitepages.com.au/wp/resSearch.jhtml

David Laufer
Sydney

----- Original Message -----
From: "Patricia J Weisshaus" <patjw28@earthlink.net>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2004 12:17 AM
Subject: Re: [h-sig] National Archives of Australia


Does anyone have an idea if these records are being added to or is this it?
I couldn't find my family who emigrated to Australia in 1957 by way of
Trieste after escaping in the 1956 uprising.

Pat


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: National Archives of Australia #hungary

David & Diana Laufer <laufer@...>
 

Pat,

Since Privacy laws were passed in Australia a few years ago, it may be difficult to obtain
the desired information.

However, may I suggest that you try another organisation namely Jewish Care, previously
known as the Jewish Welfare Society (JWS). That organisation was formed in the early 1940's
to assist the many Jewish refugees who arrived in Australia. Its activities have expanded
greatly since then. There are really 2 organisations with that name, one based in Sydney
in the State of New South Wales; the other in Melbourne in the State of Victoria. Here is
the URL of the Sydney Jewish Care.
http://www.jewishcare.com.au/MintDigital.NET/JewishCare.aspx
I must warn you however, that Jewish Care may also be constrained by the Privacy Laws.

You could also try the online version of Australian telephone directories -
http://www.whitepages.com.au/wp/resSearch.jhtml

David Laufer
Sydney

----- Original Message -----
From: "Patricia J Weisshaus" <patjw28@earthlink.net>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Friday, July 16, 2004 12:17 AM
Subject: Re: [h-sig] National Archives of Australia


Does anyone have an idea if these records are being added to or is this it?
I couldn't find my family who emigrated to Australia in 1957 by way of
Trieste after escaping in the 1956 uprising.

Pat


(Re)introduction #hungary

Oudeyis <victor@...>
 

Dear researchers in Hungarian geneology,

Following an intensive period of researching the Hungarian, Slovakian, and
Transylvanian roots of the various branches of my family, the combination of
several critical dead ends and pressing work has regretfully imposed upon me
the role of LURKER.

Still I've not given up all hope of uncovering more information: so in
obedience to the request of the SIG to identify myself and my interests the
following are the kin groups of interest:

Searching

FRIEDLANDERS (FRIEDLAENDER), DEUTCH, WEISS, GOODMANS: Neues Pechdorf,
Hunfalu, Kosice, Slovakia; Miskolz, Mad, Boldvice, Hungary; Vienna, Austria,
New York City, NY; Cleveland, Ohio; Chicago, Il; GARDINERS: Austria-Hungary;
San Francisco, California; ROKACH (ROKEAH): Tarnow, Krakow, Warsaw, Poland
and of course Beltz in Russia (yeah it's those Rokeahs); LAX (LAUCHS):
Sziget, Transylvania, New York City, NY; GROSSMAN: Tarnow, Poland, PALAGYI:
Hungary

Of particular interest:
1. Does anyone have any information where the Friedlanders of Neues Pechdorf
came >from (sometime at the end of the 18th century?)

Thanks,
Victor Friedlander-Rokach

Moderator: Please identify your place of residence.


Re: Translation of documents #hungary

Tom Beer <beer_tom@...>
 

Both documents seem to be registers that give entry numbers to other
documents.
The second line of the first document (4484) says:
2. The widow Mrs Ja'nos Balog nee Zsuzsanna Ra'cz 13.1.2
it looks to me as if this is not related to the previous line.

The second document starts with Eszter Rosenbaum (Mrs Herman Fabian).
Then has the following Rosenbaums: Emanuel, Csili, Zsani, Moricz and
Mo'vison (?).
Each is on a separate line. It looks to me as if the numbers, all of which
start with 13, are entry numbers to some other legal documents.
Each of the names is listed as "kiskoru" which means, I think, that they are
a child (i.e. have not attained the legal age of majority).
Further down the date on which they ceased to be "kiskoru" is listed
Emanuel, Csili, 1887 (both on one line)
Zsani 1891 Moricz 1893 and Mo'vison (?)

The word that was underlined is "kiskoru", but it appears on almost every
line of the second document.

Tom BEER, Melbourne

From: "annsel" <annsel@cox.net>
Reply-To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Subject: [h-sig] Translation of documents
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2004 16:33:01 -0700


Hi All,
I need some help with the translation of 2 documents that belonged to my
Great Grandfather. The first document viewmate 4484 show my Great Great GF


Hungary SIG #Hungary (Re)introduction #hungary

Oudeyis <victor@...>
 

Dear researchers in Hungarian geneology,

Following an intensive period of researching the Hungarian, Slovakian, and
Transylvanian roots of the various branches of my family, the combination of
several critical dead ends and pressing work has regretfully imposed upon me
the role of LURKER.

Still I've not given up all hope of uncovering more information: so in
obedience to the request of the SIG to identify myself and my interests the
following are the kin groups of interest:

Searching

FRIEDLANDERS (FRIEDLAENDER), DEUTCH, WEISS, GOODMANS: Neues Pechdorf,
Hunfalu, Kosice, Slovakia; Miskolz, Mad, Boldvice, Hungary; Vienna, Austria,
New York City, NY; Cleveland, Ohio; Chicago, Il; GARDINERS: Austria-Hungary;
San Francisco, California; ROKACH (ROKEAH): Tarnow, Krakow, Warsaw, Poland
and of course Beltz in Russia (yeah it's those Rokeahs); LAX (LAUCHS):
Sziget, Transylvania, New York City, NY; GROSSMAN: Tarnow, Poland, PALAGYI:
Hungary

Of particular interest:
1. Does anyone have any information where the Friedlanders of Neues Pechdorf
came >from (sometime at the end of the 18th century?)

Thanks,
Victor Friedlander-Rokach

Moderator: Please identify your place of residence.


Hungary SIG #Hungary RE: Translation of documents #hungary

Tom Beer <beer_tom@...>
 

Both documents seem to be registers that give entry numbers to other
documents.
The second line of the first document (4484) says:
2. The widow Mrs Ja'nos Balog nee Zsuzsanna Ra'cz 13.1.2
it looks to me as if this is not related to the previous line.

The second document starts with Eszter Rosenbaum (Mrs Herman Fabian).
Then has the following Rosenbaums: Emanuel, Csili, Zsani, Moricz and
Mo'vison (?).
Each is on a separate line. It looks to me as if the numbers, all of which
start with 13, are entry numbers to some other legal documents.
Each of the names is listed as "kiskoru" which means, I think, that they are
a child (i.e. have not attained the legal age of majority).
Further down the date on which they ceased to be "kiskoru" is listed
Emanuel, Csili, 1887 (both on one line)
Zsani 1891 Moricz 1893 and Mo'vison (?)

The word that was underlined is "kiskoru", but it appears on almost every
line of the second document.

Tom BEER, Melbourne

From: "annsel" <annsel@cox.net>
Reply-To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Subject: [h-sig] Translation of documents
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2004 16:33:01 -0700


Hi All,
I need some help with the translation of 2 documents that belonged to my
Great Grandfather. The first document viewmate 4484 show my Great Great GF


The Moderator's comments on a new bibliography #hungary

דוד גורדון <mirda@...>
 

In the original message dated on the 1 August 2004
1. We declared, that we have no financial or commercial interest in the
announcement of the publication
2. We intentionally omitted all the details of the publisher and the
bookshop, that sells the book.
In spite of these facts, the Moderator found necessary to add the following
comments (as cited below):

Moderator: " Per JewishGen policy, we are posting this one-time message
regarding a publication that may be of interest to subscribers. JewishGen
has
no connection with this publication and no other information,,,"

These comments are so apologetic, as to make one wonder, what possible
potential crime might cause such a threatened reaction.
What concerns the "one time message": Has anybody thought, that we are going
to announce the publication every day again and again? Even if so, could
not the
Moderator send it back refusing to pass it then?
What matters the statement, that "JewishGen has no connection with this
publication....": Of course JewishGen has some connection with this
publication, because it may help its members in their activity.
In fact JewishGen has a nice list of publications, called the "Book
Reviews" to which the mentioned bibliography should belong.

As a summary, we emphasize, that we do appreciate very much the voluntary
work
of the Moderator. Still, we have the feeling, that the Moderator has an
exaggerated
fear to BREAK THE RULES.
Perhaps the RULES are not so strict, as the Moderator thinks? Perhaps the
potential contributors are not so malevolent and deserve a more tender
treatment?
Perhaps the moderator might have also a role just in keeping us closer?

Miryam & David Gordon
Rehovot, Israel

Moderator: Yes, I try to moderate as persuasively and "tenderly" as possible. Nevertheless, the job of moderator requires adherence to some basic rules. I regret that some subscribers find this difficult to understand.


Hungary SIG #Hungary The Moderator's comments on a new bibliography #hungary

דוד גורדון <mirda@...>
 

In the original message dated on the 1 August 2004
1. We declared, that we have no financial or commercial interest in the
announcement of the publication
2. We intentionally omitted all the details of the publisher and the
bookshop, that sells the book.
In spite of these facts, the Moderator found necessary to add the following
comments (as cited below):

Moderator: " Per JewishGen policy, we are posting this one-time message
regarding a publication that may be of interest to subscribers. JewishGen
has
no connection with this publication and no other information,,,"

These comments are so apologetic, as to make one wonder, what possible
potential crime might cause such a threatened reaction.
What concerns the "one time message": Has anybody thought, that we are going
to announce the publication every day again and again? Even if so, could
not the
Moderator send it back refusing to pass it then?
What matters the statement, that "JewishGen has no connection with this
publication....": Of course JewishGen has some connection with this
publication, because it may help its members in their activity.
In fact JewishGen has a nice list of publications, called the "Book
Reviews" to which the mentioned bibliography should belong.

As a summary, we emphasize, that we do appreciate very much the voluntary
work
of the Moderator. Still, we have the feeling, that the Moderator has an
exaggerated
fear to BREAK THE RULES.
Perhaps the RULES are not so strict, as the Moderator thinks? Perhaps the
potential contributors are not so malevolent and deserve a more tender
treatment?
Perhaps the moderator might have also a role just in keeping us closer?

Miryam & David Gordon
Rehovot, Israel

Moderator: Yes, I try to moderate as persuasively and "tenderly" as possible. Nevertheless, the job of moderator requires adherence to some basic rules. I regret that some subscribers find this difficult to understand.