Date   

Searching OGONTZ-OGINZ, Massachusetts, USA #usa

Scooby Doo
 

Dear Fellow Genners,

Never underestimate the value of Newspapers in helping with your "Brick Walls".
I have been searching various branches of my Welsh Jewish Family that settled in the USA in the mid 1880's
I have managed to track down the descendants of 5 siblings, but couldn't get any further with one of the siblings, who appears as Inder|Inde|Hinda in various documents.
When I asked a granddaughter of one of Inder's siblings if she knew of any of her grandmother's siblings, she said she didn't know any of them but when I mentioned the name, Hinda/Inder, she said that name did sound familiar, but that's all she could tell me.
 
This week I found an online newspaper Obituary for one of the siblings, Harry Bertell ( Born Henry Bertelesteine) (Most family members went by Bertlestein/Bertelstein), who died on 31 October 1967 in Kenneth City, Florioda.
The Obituary mentions he was originally from Massachusetts.
It also mentions a sister named Indie Ogontz of Boston as a surviving member of his family.
So I finally found her married surname.
 
I used online directories and discovered that she was married to a David Ogontz and they lived in Boston, MA.
I found a death date online for Indie|Inde: 5 November 1972, Boston, MA. (She was born on 3 September 1893, Hyde Park, MA, USA)
 
I have found online records for a David Jacob Ogontz, who was married to a Rebecca and they had a few kids. They also appeared to have lived in Massachusetts at some stage as well
I don't know whether this is the same David Ogontz who married my relative or not.
Indie/Inde could well have been a second wife, but dates and timings of certain records appear to discount this.
On David Jacob Ogontz's WWII Draft Card- he notes the person who will always know his address as Isaac OGINZ of cambridge, MA.
This strongly suggests that Ogontz & Oginz are variations of the same surname and that David & Isaac were somehow related.
 
I have found no marriage details for Indie & David , no death certificate for either of them nor have I found any references as to where they might have been buried/cremated?
I have also found no references to any kids they might have had, but I have a feeling they didn't have any kids.
 
I would be most grateful if anyone can add any further information about this couple: where they might be buried, if they had any kids or  even knowledge of any extended family who might be able to help me further.
 
Happy Chanukah
Dr Joel Levy, London UK.
 
Searching
BLOOM, DAGUT, DAGUTSKI, DAVIS, GAVENDA, GAVENDO ,GAWENDA,
GOVENDO, GOVENDIR, GALINSKY, GILINSKY, GILINSKI, HARRIS, ISAACS, KING, LYONS,
PHILLIPS, PUPISKI, SAGER, SAGORSKY, SOGERSKY, SHER, GITROV/KHITROV
 


Re: Mandselshteyn - Starokonstantinov #ukraine #names #records

mvayser@...
 

From Starokonstantinov 1834, 1850, 1858 censuses

1834 DAZhO 118-14-268
ID * Name * Relationship * Previous age * Current Age
764 * Mandelshteyn Khaim s.o. Itsko * head * 39 * 1825
764 * Mandelshteyn Leya * wife * - * 40
764 * Mandelshteyn Itsek * son * 15 * 33
764 * Mandelshteyn Khaya * Itsek's wife * - 30
764 * Mandelshteyn Malya * daughter * - * 12
764 * Mandelshteyn Avrum * son * - * 16
764 * Mandelshteyn Ester-Deyra [2 middle characters are unclear, but probably should be Dvoyra] * Avrum's wife * - * 16
764 * Mandelshteyn Mikhel * son * - * 14
764 * Mandelshteyn Moyshe * son * - * ? [possibly 8]
764 * Mandelshteyn Zus * son * 10 [in 1816] * died in 1827
764 * Mandelshteyn Barukh * son * 2.5 * died in 1824
 
1850 DAZhO 118-14-276
ID * Name * Relationship * Previous age * Current Age
323 * Mandelshteyn Itsko s.o. Khaim * head * 33 * 49
323 * Mandelshteyn Khaya * wife * - * 46
323 * Mandelshteyn Abramko * brother * 16 * 32
323 * Mandelshteyn Basya * SIL (Abramko's wife) * - * 25
323 * Mandelshteyn Itsko * nephew (Abram's son) * - * 14
323 * Mandelshteyn Khaya * niece (Abram's daughter) * - * 1/2
323 * Mandelshteyn Moshko * brother * 8 * sent to military in 1839
323 * Mandelshteyn Mikhel * brother * 14 * currently not present
323 * Mandelshteyn Ester * SIL (Mikhel's wife) * - * 30
323 * Mandelshteyn Srul * nephew (Mikhel's son) * - * currently not present
763 * Mandelshteyn Mikhel * - * 14 * 27
763 * Mandelshteyn Srul * son * - * 7
 
Itsko is also mentioned on the errata page with the note saying that instead of indicating his age as 4, they wrote 14.
 
1858 DAZhO 118-14-293
ID * Name * Relationship * Previous age * Current Age
498 * Mandelshteyn Itsko s.o. Khaim * head * 49 * died in 1852
498 * Mandelshteyn Abramko * brother * 32 * 40
498 * Mandelshteyn Basya * SIL * - * 33
498 * Mandelshteyn Itsko * nephew (son of Abramko) * 4 * 12
498 * Mandelshteyn Khaya * niece * - * 8.5
498 * Mandelshteyn Reyzya * niece * - * 4
498 * Mandelshteyn Khantsya * niece * - * 3
498 * Mandelshteyn Khasya * niece * - * 1
914 * Mandelshteyn Mekhel s.o. Khaim * head * 30 * 38
914 * Mandelshteyn Ester * wife * - 38
914 * Mandelshteyn Srul * son * 7 * 15

Mike Vayser


Memories of Migration: Between Personal and Collective Experience - Webinar, Sunday, December 27, 11:00 AM EST #announcements #events #education

N. Kotz
 

Join the AFHU and the Jewish Geneology Society of Greater Washington (JGSGW) for Memories of Migration: Between Personal and Collective Experience on Sunday, December 27 at 11:00 AM EST.

The large-scale migration of Jews across continents and oceans is one of the most characteristic features of the modern Jewish narrative. What do we now know about the reasons and the circumstances that guided millions of Jewish migrants around the globe? What has been the role of the United States, its Jewish community, and other countries around the world in these migrations?

Please join American Friends of the Hebrew University for a presentation and Q & A by Stephen S. Wise Professor of American Jewish History and Institutions at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and chair of the Department of Jewish History and Contemporary Jewry, Eli Lederhendler.

Registration is required. Visit https://www.afhu.org/event/memories-of-migration/ for more information and to register.

Nancy Kotz
VP for Communicaitons, JGSGW


Re: tens of thousands members "family trees" in Ancestry #announcements #general #education

Susan&David
 

I have found about a dozen of these for my own extended  family on Ancestry.  They are called Family Groups. 

From Google:
Definition A family group record is created to show at least the names of the husband, wife, and children of a family. Most family group records also show birth, marriage, and death information, additional spouses (if any) of the parents, and children's spouses.

The family group records I have seen usually include the source of a particular piece of information.  You can see if the source is as good as the one you have. If it is better than yours you have gained something.  My experience is that the family group record has something like an immigration date taken from a census while I have the ship's manifest itself.  Rather than being disturbed, I offer to send the person a link to the document. 

David Rosen
Boston, MA


On 12/8/2020 10:44 AM, Teewinot wrote:
Hi Angel,

Have you come across "family trees" in Ancestry with tens of thousands
of members that are not a tree but what looks a collection of disjointed
small family trees? They seem to be related to DNA investigations. Any
idea why anybody would do this?
Yes, I have. They have my close family members, but have them married
to people who are not my family. And best of all, it says we're not
even a DNA match! I have no idea what that's all about, but I find it
disturbing.

Jeri Friedman
Port Saint Lucie, Florida



Re: tens of thousands members "family trees" in Ancestry #announcements #general #education

stephen@...
 

I have found a number of people on both ancestry and my heritage who have been raiding other family trees and adding them to their database. These people have been around before DNA testing and I can’t see the logic behind their collections and I think some of them are just obsessive collectors. I know a collector who has over 80,000 names and he told me he started researching his wife’s Jewish family and he enjoyed the research so much that he just kept adding names. Thanks to him I discovered a whole branch of my family, but at the same time I don’t think he was interested in correcting any mistakes in his collection.
--
Stephen Schmideg
Melbourne, Australia
stephen@...


Name changed in London before coming to US, searching for original name #names

Phil Goldfarb
 

I have a relative by the name of Barnett Mulmed who was born in Brest-Litovsk on July 17, 1879. He went to London and changed his name to Mulmed and arrived in the US on the SS New York on Feb. 25, 1906.

My question is: is there any on line site where I can find the record of his name change in London? I would imagine that this happened in late 1905 or early 1906 before he left. After several generations his original name is lost to the family.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Phil Goldfarb
Tulsa, OK
phil.goldfarb@...  


searching for a relative who had a business in Rivne in 1939 #holocaust #ukraine

hmb02446@...
 

I would appreciate suggestions on next steps in searching information about a relative (great uncle) who I believe likely died in the Shoah. The last name is BRONSZTEJN, first initial S. (I thought the name was Simon, but it may have been Srul). He was probably born in the 1870s, probably in Ostrog/Ostroh.
 
I have a copy of a business envelope postmarked 1939 for his business (glassware) under the name Bronsztejn, S., located at 8 Pocztowa (Post Office Street) in Rovno. Recently I found online a 1939 list of Jewish businesses in Rivno which included Srul Brojnsztejn at 8 Pocztowa, which made me wonder if his name was Srul, not Simon. 
 
From the USHMM, I found the name of Srul Brojnsztejn of Warsaw, not Rovno, on a list of Jewish survivors.
 
In 2004, I wrote to the Red Cross Holocaust victims tracing center seeking information about Simon Bronsztejn. They apparently corresponded with the archives in Rovno. The archives forwarded a letter in 2004 stating that “in the list of  Jewish population of Rovno as of January 15, 1942 the name of Simon (Shimon) Bronshtein could not be found.” It also said “in the book of Ukrainian Grief of Rovno Region, Rovno, of the year 2002, Khaya Bronshtein is listed as an owner of the building at 8 Post Office Street during the years of 1937-38. It is further stated that she was shot by the German fascist occupiers in November 1941.”
 
At Yad Vashem, there is a page of testimony regarding Chaya Brojnsztejn of Rovno, stating that she was killed in 1942 in Rovno. There also two other listings  for Khaya Bronshteyn of Rovno without documents attached, one of which refers to a list of persons evacuated to Uzbekistan and the other of which states presumably murdered in the Shoah.   
 
I would appreciate any suggestions anyone may have regarding possible next steps and follow up, including the name of a researcher who could check property and other records in Rivne, if they exist. Or online sources I can check myself. 
 
Many thanks. 
 
Howard Brown
Stowe, VT
 
Researching BRONSZTEJN in Ostrog, Rivne and Warsaw, SHIKHMAN  in Makariv and Kiev, and SHVETS in Makariv.
 
 


Re: Help Needed Reading Nativity on Census #russia #records

YaleZuss@...
 

If the word is actually Leuta, rather than Leoto, it could mean Lithuania.
 
--Yale Zussman


Searching for an experience genealogist for research in Ukraine 1800's #ukraine #belarus

mjbenenson@...
 

Subject: Experience genealogist for research in Ukraine 1800's #ukraine #belarus
I am looking to find an experienced researcher that has experience in Ukraine and Belarus,
particularly pre 1910. Family roots in Dnieper (Ekaterinoslav, etc.) and Borisov, Belarus.
Please contact me;  Michael Benenson (Florida, USA) at mjbenenson@...


December 13 Meeting of the Minnesota Jewish Genealogical Society (MNJGS) #announcements #jgs-iajgs

WALTER ELIAS
 

MNJGS is pleased to present a panel discussion of the film The Flat on Sunday December 13, 2020 at 1:00 Central Time.
 
Summary: As the film maker cleans out the apartment that belonged to his grandparents, who immigrated from Nazi Germany, he uncovers clues pointing to a complicated and shocking story.
 
Panelists are Rodney Martel, documentary film maker, Bradley Prager, Professor Univ. of Missouri, Sheer Ganor, Visiting Professor Univ. of Minnesota. Details of the program can be found at MNJGS.org under Events. 
 
Submitted by Walter S. Elias, Past President
wselias@...


Re: place in Teleneshty Yizkor book #yizkorbooks

ginapat7@...
 

My paternal  great-grandmother, Tsarna Bernstein, was born in Teleneshti.  My maternal grandmother, Chave Spiwak (changed from Glattstein) was born in Shukelten (sp). I was told that is now Cioceltani.

Gina Glazer


Re: tens of thousands members "family trees" in Ancestry #announcements #general #education

Teewinot
 

Hi Angel,

Have you come across "family trees" in Ancestry with tens of thousands
of members that are not a tree but what looks a collection of disjointed
small family trees? They seem to be related to DNA investigations. Any
idea why anybody would do this?
Yes, I have. They have my close family members, but have them married
to people who are not my family. And best of all, it says we're not
even a DNA match! I have no idea what that's all about, but I find it
disturbing.

Jeri Friedman
Port Saint Lucie, Florida

--
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Re: Help please with Jewish Family research in Turkey #names

viviansilco@...
 

Have you tried the site of the Israel National Library?  They have lots of material about communities around the world, including books in the library and documents in the archives.  

best success,
Vivian Silbermann


Re: Romanian Birth records #romania #records

Steve Stein
 

What was Maramaros before WW I, today is split between Romania and Ukraine. Be open to the possibility of either, depending on the town.

Steve Stein
Highland Park, NJ


Re: Levitic Status in 19th Century Polish Vital Records #records #poland

Jill Whitehead
 

Your best bet to understand Levitic status is to take a DNA test to find out if you have the classic levite DNA markers. 

I am not aware of any Suwalki Lomza records showing this sort of information, as records were civil records and not religious records. 

The DNA of my great grandfather's line shows the classic Levite markers but his name was Abraham's/Abrams formerly Ceglarski from Suwalki. 

Not all those called Levy have the Levite markers - they may have Cohenim markers, or neither Cohenim nor Levy markers, but other ones altogether.

I have the records of one of my other great grandfathers Aaron Guttenberg from Rajgrod in Lomza Gubernia, and these are civil records which just record his birth and later marriage, and place and time of these events.

As  some of his records are recorded later in time to escape the Tsar's draft in the 1860's, I doubt he would have volunteered any other information which would have put him in danger of the draft (if he had any other information of note) . In the event, he escaped to Hull, UK in 1865 with his wife and baby daughter.

In this area of NE Poland, as it was often in the front line of conflicts (e.g. WW1 and WW2), data is less easy to find anyway.  I am not aware of anything like Ketubas/marriage contracts being found, and they are probably long lost for many places in this area. 

Jill Whitehead, Surrey, UK 


Re: Romanian Birth records #romania #records

luc.radu@...
 

Records older than 100 years would be at the Baia Mare office on National Archives. Later  ones at the civill office of the  Town Hall (Primarie) of place of birth.  The law about getting them (officially only death records can be obtained by a direct descendant) can sometimes be softened by a visit to that office. 

Luc Radu
Great Neck, NY


Looking for civil records from Siret and from Banila pe Siret #records

jackperetz371@...
 

My paternal ancestors are from these locations.
Jack Peretz


Re: Looking for Urche GERSZONOWICZ-GOLDSTEIN born about 1893 in Lodz and emigrated to USA #lodz #usa #poland #russia

Sharon E Siegel
 

If you locate any connection between Lodz birthplace and your search name, our parents Anna Iglicka Rzezak Siegel and Israel Rzezak Siegel were from Lodz and immigrated to USA aboard the Marine Perch in 1946.  Israel was born in 1905 in Lodz, and his family that he descended from lived there long before that.  Anna was born in Lodz and also had many generations there.  They lost most of their family to invasion in Lodz by Nazis.  I will be on the look out for Gerszonowic and Szerpansk as I continue my search, too. Best to you, 
--
Sharon E. Siegel 
Port Jervis, NY USA


Re: Romanian Birth records #romania #records

Susanna Vendel
 

Maramures is a region/province in Romania. oi you know the locality of birth? Here is a list of the localities in Maramures.
https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/List%C4%83_de_localit%C4%83%C8%9Bi_din_jude%C8%9Bul_Maramure%C8%99

Susanna Vendel, Stockholm


INDIANER from Jaroslaw plus BAUMAGARTEN #poland

Mark A. Roseman <rosemanlawoffice@...>
 

My g grandmother Sime Reisel Indianer was born in Jaroslaw, Poland.. Her mother was Fanny Baumgarten

rosemanlawoffice@...

Mark Roseman

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