Date   

Translation request in ViewMate #translation #yiddish

Baker Rosalie
 

Subj: ViewMate translation request - Polish and Yiddish

I've posted a vital record in Polish for which I need a translation. It is on ViewMate at the following address ...
https://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM88920
Please respond via the form provided on the ViewMate image page.
Thank you very much.
Rosalie Baker


Help ship records - not all family did entire journey to USA #usa #russia #records #belarus

mandy.molava@...
 

Hello

My Great grandfather came to England around 1905, his brothers went to the USA, but I cannot find my G grandfathers ships records. An Ancestry spokesperson at one of the conferences, said there were many reasons for getting off the ship in England - sickness, illness, pregnancies, not enough funds for the whole journey etc, it was possible that my G grandmother was pregnant at the time. I wondered if anyone knew if there were any such thing as an 'early leavers ship records' anywhere? 

Thank you in advance
Mandy Molava


Another ViewMate Translation request - Russian/Ukrainian #translation #ukraine

@mbserber
 

I've posted the backs of 2 additional photographs with writing in Russian (or Ukrainian) for which I need a translation. It is on ViewMate at the following address ...
https://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM88930
Please respond via the form provided on the ViewMate image page.
Thank you very much.
Michael Serber


ViewMate translation request - Russian/Ukrainian #translation #ukraine

@mbserber
 

I've posted the backs of 2 photographs with writing in Russian (or Ukrainian) for which I need a translation. It is on ViewMate at the following address ...
https://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM88929
Please respond via the form provided on the ViewMate image page.
Thank you very much.
Michael Serber


Re: JewishGen Talks: Roots of Jews from Eastern Europe #JewishGenUpdates #education

Avraham Groll
 

Yes. Please see the previous post for links to the YouTube channel.
Happy Chanukah.


Re: JewishGen Talks: Roots of Jews from Eastern Europe #JewishGenUpdates #education

Eliyahu Allon
 

Although I signed up for this lecture and an earlier one on DNA origins, I missed both because of schedule conflicts. Are there recordings of these talks that I could listen to?

 

Regards,

 

Eliyahu Allon

eliallon@...

(O) 248.677.1159

(M) 248.259.1144

www.LinkedIn.com/in/edallon

 

From: main@... [mailto:main@...] On Behalf Of Nancy Siegel
Sent: Friday, December 4, 2020 5:08 PM
To: main@...
Subject: [Special] [JewishGen.org] JewishGen Talks: Roots of Jews from Eastern Europe #JewishGenUpdates #education

 

We invite you to attend another free presentation in our series of JewishGen Talks webinars, with our speaker, Dr. Alexander Beider.

 

Roots of Jews from Eastern Europe:

Names, Language, and History

Wednesday, December 9, 2020

2:00 pm Eastern Time (New York)

 

About the Talk

According to the traditional point of view, the ancestors of all Ashkenazi Jews (including those from Eastern Europe) lived in the Middle Ages in the Rhineland, western Germany. This consideration is supported by the religious rite practiced by Ashkenazim that originated in the area in question. The provenance from Germany seems also to be confirmed by the daily use of Yiddish, a language whose German basis is on the surface. Further analysis of this language and the given names used by Jews in Eastern Europe reveals a more nuanced picture. Alongside the real migrants from the Rhineland, we find traces of Jewish ancestors who spoke Slavic languages in the Middle Ages and lived in the Czech lands as well as in the territories of modern western Ukraine and western Belarus. 



About the Speaker

Alexander Beider was born in Moscow in 1963. He studied mathematics and theoretical physics at the Moscow Institute of Physics and Technology, from which he received a PhD in applied mathematics (1989). Since 1990, he has lived with his family in Paris, France. In 2000, he received his second PhD, this time in the domain of Jewish Studies, from Sorbonne. 


Dr. Beider uses onomastics and linguistics as tools to unravel the history of the Jewish people. He has written a series of reference books dealing with the etymology of Jewish surnames, all published by Avotaynu Inc. They include: A
Dictionary of Jewish Surnames from the Russian Empire (1993, 2nd revised edition in 2008), Jewish Surnames in Prague (15th-18th centuries) (1994), A Dictionary of Jewish Surnames from the Kingdom of Poland (1996), A Dictionary of Jewish Surnames from Galicia (2004), A Dictionary of Jewish Surnames from Maghreb, Gibraltar, and Malta (2017), and A Dictionary of Jewish Surnames from Italy, France and “Portuguese” Communities (2019). His Dictionary of Ashkenazic Given Names (2001) is the reference study in the domain of traditional Yiddish first names. Origins of Yiddish Dialects (Oxford University Press, 2015) synthesizes scholarship on the subject for the half century since the publication of Max Weinreich's “History of the Yiddish Language” (1973) and, according to certain critics, represents a comprehensive and convincing revision of its esteemed predecessor, no less than a new standard work in the domain. Dr. Beider is also the designer of the linguistic part of the Beider-Morse Phonetic Matching method of computer-based searches for equivalent surnames.



Registration is free with a suggested donation.

Please click here to register now!




For more information regarding JewishGen Talks webinars, go to:

https://www.jewishgen.org/live



--
Nancy Siegel
Director of Communications
JewishGen.org
(San Francisco, California)
nsiegel@...




JewishGen Talks: New Recordings Available #JewishGenUpdates

Avraham Groll
 
Edited

Dear Friends,
 
Recordings of our most recent two JewishGen Talks are now available via the JewishGen YouTube channel.
For a complete list of December JewishGen Talks, please visit: JewishGen.org/live.

Wishing you all a Happy Chanukah.
Avraham
 
Avraham Groll
Executive Director
JewishGen.org
 
PS. If you are in a position to do so, please consider contributing to our Fall Appeal. A gift of any amount will make a real difference. Gifts of $100+ qualify for premium features.





JewishGen Talks: Researching Your Bessarabian and Transnistria Jewish Roots with JewishGen.org #JewishGenUpdates

Avraham Groll
 

We invite you to attend another free presentation in our series of JewishGen Talks webinars, with Inna Vayner and Yefim Kogan.
 
Workshop: Researching Your Bessarabian and Transnistria Jewish Roots with JewishGen.org
Sunday, December 13, 2020
12:00 pm Eastern Time (New York)

Registration is free with a suggested donation.
Please click here to register now!
 
About the Talk
In this participatory workshop, we will share how to best search the JewishGen databases, as well as JewishGen.org/Bessarabia. Along the way, we will share histories, resources, data, and research tips to help each other research Jewish Genealogy in the region of the Bessarabia gubernia of the former Russian Empire (including parts of today's Moldova and Ukraine) as well as today's Transnistria region with sections of Kherson and Podolia gubernias. *Requires a JewishGen account and access to a computer.

About Inna Vayner & Yefim Kogan:
Inna Vayner was born in Tiraspol, Moldova and immigrated with her family to the United States in 2002. Inna is co-Director of the JewishGen Bessarabia Research Division, and is also a professional genealogist and a founder of findyourcousins.com.

Yefim Kogan was born in Kishinev, Moldova. After immigrating from the USSR in 1989 he has engaged in extensive genealogical and historical research. Yefim is co-Director of the JewishGen Bessarabia Research Division - which he organized in 2011 - and continues to work on multiple projects and present at conferences. In 2012, he received a Master's Degree in Jewish Liberal Studies from Hebrew College Boston, with a focus on Jewish Cultural History.

Registration is free with a suggested donation.
Please click here to register now!



Help 'Brisk Russian' puzzle on London Census #russia #records

mandy.molava@...
 

Hello
I have found the 1911 London Census for my great grandparents, it gives 'Brisk Russian' as the birthplace. After attending the Ancestry conference last year in London, spoke briefly with one of the Jewish speakers who really seemed to know her stuff, but said that when the Census was done, usually the nearest town was written, rather than the birthplace? And that Brest was in 2 places! Can anyone confirm these, please? I think I may have found a record in Russia, but I keep going back to the how and if, before I look any further. No other more recent records found with anything other than same on, too no ship records found for any other clues.

Thank you in advance 
Mandy Molava


How did my great grandmother travel to Ireland from Kyiv? #ukraine #general

jgexd7@...
 

Hello
My great grandmother Polly Fieldman was born in Kiev in 1889. She had a sister Leah (Lily) also born in Kiev about 1891. The other children were all born in Ireland.
The family (Polly and Leah and their parents Solomon /Samuel / David and Luby) travelled to Ireland around 1892 - 1893 and first settled in Dublin. My great great grandfather was named as Solomon / Samuel / David in different documents. We don't know when or where he died.
I had been led to believe that the family left on their migration via St. Petersburg but have no way to substantiate this.
Recently I saw something that indicated the family could have journeyed via Odessa.
There do not seem to be any passenger records for boats travelling to Ireland at the time. I wondered if anyone has any family who could have made a similar journey. Did they travel overland through Europe and then across England to get to Ireland?
I do know there are stories of migrants who wanted to get to America but the fare they had only allowed them to complete part of the journey.
My interest is in learning about the type of journey that the family had.
Thank you for reading this. Any help or guidance would be appreciated. It is important to me to know about the lives and ways of people and not just dates and places.
John Edwards


Re: Searching OGONTZ-OGINZ, Massachusetts, USA #usa

R Jaffer
 

The David Jacob in the WWII registration is his wife as the address is the same as found in a 1941 Boston directory in which both he and Indie are together. He is a painter as is the man in the WWI registration and 1927 Boston Directory. Since his first wife is still living in NY in 1940 according to their son George's WWII registration, David either abandoned or divorced his first wife. Indie and David first appear together in a 1933 directory. Obtaining a marriage cert from Boston is a complicated procedure.

Since the burial locations are not found on any online sites, I suggest you order the death certs from: https://www.boston.gov/departments/registry/how-get-death-certificate

The spelling below is taken from the death cert index on above site. Death records should list burial locations.

David Ogontz  6/10/1960
Indie Ogontz 11/05/1972
Lasser Bertelstein 07/15/1927
Easter Bertelesteine (Blume) 06/23/1929




Re: Looking for a researcher for records in Romania #bessarabia #records #romania

Yefim Kogan
 

Marcia, 

you added "#Bessarabia"... does that mean that someone was from Bessarabia region  (1918-1940 was under Romania)?
We have a lot of records:  birth, marriages, revisions, etc. at the Bessarabia database.  Did you try to research yourself?

All the best,
Happy Chanukah!

Yefim Kogan


Neuauflage Datenbank 2020 / New editon and update database Jews in the German Empire 2020 #austria-czech #records #germany

Andreas Schwab
 

I forward the email I obtained from Ingo Paul:

Liebe Freunde der Datenbank „Juden im ehemaligen Deutschen Reich“,
mit der Ankündigung einer Neuauflage der Datenbank mit über 223.000 Personen verbinde ich eine Bitte an Sie, die Sie unten in drei Sprachen (Deutsch, Englisch und Iwrith) finden.

Dear friends and supporters of the database “Jews of the former German Empire”

With the announcement of the new edition of the database with now over 223.000 entries on individuals I would also like to ask for your support.


הנדון: מהדורה חדשה למאגר המידע "יהודים"

ידידים יקרים של מאגר המידע "יהודים שחיו תחת שלטון הרייך הגרמני",

הודעה זו בדבר עדכון מאגר המידע היא הזדמנות עבורי לפנות אליכם בבקשה אישית שתיכתב להלן בגרמנית, באנגלית ובעברית.




DEUTSCH
Seit dem 20.10.2020 steht im Netz eine Neuauflage der Datenbank „Juden im ehemaligen Deutschen Reich“ mit 223.000 Personen, die über folgende Adresse zu erreichen ist:
Mit dieser Ankündigung möchte ich eine Bitte verbinden. Ich versuche seit dem Sommer 2020 meinen obersten Dienstherrn in Bremen, Bürgermeister Dr. Bovenschulte, davon zu überzeugen, mich als Bremer Lehrer für die wissenschaftliche Arbeit an der Datenbank und für daraus entstehende Projekte abzuordnen.
Dafür brauche ich Referenzen in Form von Empfehlungsschreiben, wie wichtig meine Arbeit für Juden und Nichtjuden in aller Welt ist. Ich habe schon einige dieser Schreiben bekommen, die ich in den Anhang gelegt habe. Ebenso eines meiner Projekte für den Margot-Friedländer-Preis.
Wie können Sie mir helfen?
(1) Schreiben Sie mir bitte ein persönliches Empfehlungsschreiben, in dem Sie beschreiben, welche Bedeutung meine Arbeit für Sie, Ihre Bekannten, die jüdische Gemeinschaft oder die wissenschaftliche Arbeit und Forschung hat.
Sie können diese Empfehlung per Post schicken:

Ingo Paul
Föhrenweg 6
27721 Ritterhude
Germany
oder als PDF oder Bild an meine Adresse: ingopaul24@...
(2) Leiten Sie bitte diese E-Mail an Ihre Freunde und Bekannten weiter und weisen Sie sie damit auf meine Datenbank hin. Vielleicht können diese mir auch eine Empfehlung schreiben.
(3) Fragen Sie in Ihrer jüdischen Gemeinde in Deutschland nach, ob meine Briefe angekommen sind, in denen ich um eine Empfehlung bat. Ich hatte im September und November mehrere Briefe an alle 100 jüdischen Gemeinde in Deutschland geschickt, bisher aber nur Antworten vom Landesverband Sachsen, Sachsen-Anhalt und aus Heidelberg bekommen, die ich auch in den Anhang gelegt habe. Ich kann mir vorstellen, dass meine Briefe vielleicht bei der vielen Post und den vielen Aufgaben im Gemeindebüro untergegangen sind.
Haben Sie Kontakt zu einer jüdischen Gemeinde außerhalb Deutschlands, so schicke Sie doch bitte meine Bitte an den Vorstand. Ich schreibe dann auch gerne noch mehr zu mir und meinen Projekten.
(4) Leiten Sie meine Bitte auch an Institutionen, Foren und anderen Interessentengruppen mit der Bitte um Unterstützung weiter.
(5) Kennen Sie jemanden aus Politik, Wissenschaft oder Kultur, der als Prominenter mein Anliegen unterstützen könnte ? Können Sie Kontakte herstellen?
Ich danke Ihnen für Ihre Zeit und Hilfe,
Ihr unermüdlicher Ingo Paul.

Anhang:
Beispiele für Empfehlungsschreiben (Deutsch)
Beschreibung eines Schülerprojektes (Deutsch)
Kurzdarstellung der Datenbankarbeit (Deutsch, Englisch)




ENGLISH

The new edition of „Jews of the former German Empire“ with data on 223.000 individuals is active since 20. October, 2020 and can be reached via the link below:

https://www.online-ofb.de/juden_nw/?lang=de


With this announcement I would also kindly like to ask for your support. Since the summer of 2020 I am attempting to convince the head of the state of Bremen, its mayor Dr. Bovenschulte to assign me as a teacher in the state of Bremen to the historical research work on this important database and the projects that are generated out of it. In order to support my intention and bolster my standing, I am currently in the process of collecting references and recommendations.

These recommendations, stating the importance of my work throughout the world – for Jews and non-Jews alike- will help make my case and hopefully result in an even more comprehensive database in the future. Several recommendations have already been received and are attached. Additionally one of my project has won the Margot Friedländer Preis.

Can you help?

Please, could you take a moment and write a personal recommendation describing the importance of this work for you, your acquaintances, the Jewish communities or overall historic research.

Please kindly forward this recommendation via mailt tot he address below:


Ingo Paul

Föhrenweg 6

27721 Ritterhude

Germany


or in either PDF file or Image file to this email address: ingopaul24@...

Please, could you kindly forward this email to your friends and acquaintances and point out this data base to them? Maybe they in turn can also kindly consider writing a recommendation for my work.




עברית

העדכון האחרון של מאגר המידע "יהודים תחת שלטן הרייך הגרמני" נמצא ברשת האינטרנט החל מ-20 באוקטובר 2020 בכתובת

https://www.online-ofb.de/juden_nw/?lang=de

כאמור, נוסף להודעה זו, ברצוני לבקש את תמיכתכם בעניין הנוגע לי אישית:

החל מקיץ 2020 אני מנסה לשכנע את המעסיק הבכיר שלי, ראש העיר ברמן ד"ר בובנשולטה, לפטור אותי מחובותיי במסגרת תפקידי כמורה בברמן וזאת על מנת שאוכל להתרכז בעבודתי המדעית במאגר המידע ובפרויקטים הקשורים אליו, דבר שידרוש ממני עבודה במשרה מלאה.

כדי לקדם בקשה זו אזדקק להמלצות המעידות על חשיבותה של עבודתי הן ליהודים הן ללא יהודים ברחבי העולם.

אציין כי כבר קיבלתי כמה המלצות, המצורפות להלן, בהן גם המלצה לקבלת פרס מרגוט פרידלנדר.

תוכלו לסייע לי בדרכים הבאות:

  1. באמצעות המלצה אישית המביעה את חשיבותה של עבודתי בעבורכם, בעבור מכריכם וכן את חשיבותה למען הקהילה היהודית ולקידום המחקר המדעי.

אודה לכם אם תשלחו את המלצותיכם בדואר רגיל לכתובת


Ingo Paul, Föhrenweg 6, 27721 Ritterhude, Germany


או בקובץ PDF לכתובת האימייל ingopaul24@...


  1. אנא העבירו מייל זה לחברים ולמכרים כדי שגם הם יוכלו לעשות שימוש במאגר הנתונים ולחקור על אודות משפחתם בתקופת שלטון הרייך בגרמניה. ייתכן שהם יהיו מוכנים לכתוב מכתב המלצה עבורי.


  1. אודה לכם אם תבררו בקהילות היהודיות ברחבי גרמניה אם המכתבים שלי הגיעו אליהם. שלחתי מכתבים בספטמבר-אוקטובר 2020 לכל מאה הקהילות ועד כה קיבלתי מענה רק מזאכזן, מזאכזן-אנהאלט ומהיידלברג (ראו המלצות להלן). ככל הנראה לא היה די זמן לטפל בבקשה שלי או שאולי מכתביי הלכו לאיבוד.



  1. במקרה שיש לכם קשר לקהילה יהודית מחוץ לגרמניה, אנא שלחו בקשה זו למנהיג הקהילה. אשמח לשלוח מידע מפורט יותר על הפרויקטים שלי.


  1. אודה לכם אם תעבירו בקשה זו גם למוסדות, פורומים או כל קבוצה שעשויה למצוא עניין במאגר הנתונים ובפרויקטים שלי.



  1. אם אתם מקושרים לאישיות בולטת מהפוליטיקה, המדע או התרבות, אשמח אם תקשרו בינינו למען קידום המטרה החשובה של הפרויקטים שלי.

תודה מקרב לב על תמיכתם ועל שהקדשתם מזמנכם. לפי שעה אמשיך לעבוד בהתנדבות.

בברכה, אינגו פאול


קובץ מצורף

המלצות

תיאור פרויקט בגרמנית

תיאור קצר של העבודה במאגר מידע בגרמנית ואנגלית





                                                                                                  Ingo Paul
                                                                                                Föhrenweg 6
                                                                                          27721 Platjenwerbe               
                                                                                       Deutschland / Germany
                                     
                                                                                       Phon +49 421 63 97 79 5
                                                                                       ingopaul24@...

                                                                  https://www.online-ofb.de/juden_nw/?lang=de

                                         Ich helfe Ihnen von Herzen gerne und recherchiere für Sie stets kostenlos.
                                              Falls Sie aber das Bedürfnis verspüren, z.B. die Erweiterung meiner
                                          Forschungsbibliothek zu unterstützen, können Sie mir gerne mit Büchern
                                                                        oder einer Spende unter die Arme greifen.
                                              Ingo Paul, IBAN DE62 2919 0330 1011 1395 00 BIC GENODEF 1HB2
                                                                          Paypal (an: ingopaul24@...)

                                        It is a pleasure for me to help you and I will always research for you for free.
                                           However, I deeply appreciate it, if you want to support me to increase my
                                                             private research library by sending books or donation.
                                                Ingo Paul, IBAN DE62 2919 0330 1011 1395 00 BIC GENODEF 1HB2
                                                                           Paypal (an: ingopaul24@...







--
Andrea Schwab, Montreal, Canada


Lesson learned #dna #lithuania #ukraine

sharon yampell
 

I have been working on my family tree for just over 15 years and I recently learned a huge lesson, just because someone tells you that your family comes from one place, does not necessarily mean it is the right place.

 

My maternal grandfather had always  told me his family came from Kunev, which is near Ostrog.  So when I tried to research his family, that is where I have always looked.  Then recently while searching through my DNA matches, I came across someone with a variation of his last name that was from Ireland.  I researched the names she had on her tree, which brought me to some other trees that had some of the older relatives she did not have and lo and behold, it showed that my grandfather’s family actually came from Lithuania…

 

This was a huge discovery for me since I was wondering, how did my great great grandfather meet my great great grandmother if her family was from Zagare in  Lithuania and he was from Kunev?  Somehow, my 2x great grandparents met in and later left Zagare and made their way to Kunev and that is where my great grandfather and his siblings were born.  It is my guess that my grandfather never knew, and maybe even his father never knew that the family was originally from Lithuania.

 

Sharon F. Yampell

Voorhees, New Jersey

GenealogicalGenie@...

 


Re: searching for a relative who had a business in Rivne in 1939 #holocaust #ukraine

Bernard Flam
 

Hi from Paris,
Dear Howard,
During inter-war period in Poland, business and companies had to be registered to Polish administration.
I don't know for Rivne, but in Lodz, these files have been preserved and can be copied at local (city) archives (in Poland, normally Polish USC archives).
So I could get copies of my GG-Uncle's business file who managed an "Irish Pub" in Lodz' main street.
One astonishing point : to definitely close this business file (which hadn't been closed after Holocaust, even if my whole Lodz family had been exterminated), Polish administration sent two official letters at business address in 1972'.
As nobody replied (they knew and we know why...), this administration could close the company's file.
Khavershaft
Bernard Flam
Archives & History of Medem Center - Arbeter Ring (Bund / Workmen Circle of France)


Re: tens of thousands members "family trees" in Ancestry #announcements #general #education

andrew@...
 

I have a research tree on Ancestry that is much like you describe. 

In my case, it's not about DNA, it's about members of a landsmanschaft of which my family was a member. (Tiferes Achim Anshei Dinaburg, if it matters.)

I am using the "Friends and Neighbors" approach in the hope that as I grow this interconnected network of mini-family trees, I will find that some of them turn out to be cousins. I started by putting in everyone buried in one of the community's burial society plots, or mentioned in newspaper listings about TAAD, and so on. And I keep growing and growing those small trees and sometimes succeed in stitching them together.

I also have a tree where I'm trying to connect all known instances of the Werdesheim family name; that's now grown to 9 respectable full-sized subtrees and a few dozen scattered records that we can't yet connect, so it's the same kind of approach.

Best,
  Andrew Greene
  Newton MA


On Mon, Dec 7, 2020 at 1:36 PM <kosfiszer8@...> wrote:
Have you come across "family trees" in Ancestry with tens of thousands of members that are not a tree but what looks a collection of disjointed small family trees? They seem to be related to DNA investigations. Any idea why anybody would do this?

Angel Kosfiszer
Richardson, TX


ViewMate translation request - Romanian #romania #records #translation

aviv_ya@...
 

I've posted a vital record in Romanian for which I need a translation. It is on ViewMate at the following address:

https://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM88940

Please respond via the form provided on the ViewMate image page.

Thank you very much

Aviv Yahav


Jaroslaw Poland cemetery photographs #poland #photographs

Mark A. Roseman <rosemanlawoffice@...>
 

Request person to take photos of tombstones there of  Indianer tombstones. 
--
Mark Roseman


Re: Help in figuring out a name #names

Sherri Bobish
 


I agree that it looks like Bechel Teitler.  The "B" compares to how he writes his upper case "B's" on the manifest.

Perhaps search for someone with that name in records of the town from which he came, and search for Bechel Teitler in incoming U.S. passenger manifests as he may have come to the U.S. afterwards.

Consider that Bechel may have alternate spellings in other records.

Regards,

Sherri Bobish


Re: tens of thousands members "family trees" in Ancestry #announcements #general #education

jel
 

I and many others on JewishGen have ranted about this for years. There seems to be many individuals -- I call them "amassers" -- who pluck small family groups as new data appear on Ancestry and construct "trees" that are mindlessly picked up by genealogical naifs who add unrelated members of their families and construct  larger family trees. Seldom do verifying, additional sources appear that justify this mindless activity. I've contacted individuals asking about their relationship to members of my family and they either do not reply or give the lame excuse that they "forgot and have to look up" how they are related. A few have said they just saw the data on Ancestry and constructed a tree. Why? Anyone's guess. Maybe they get some sort of brownie points (in their own minds) for constructing these family group trees.
Judith Lipmanson

Smyrna, DE

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