Re: Need copy of record located at LDS library - KLEPFISZ #poland #records

Michaele Burris

There is an FHC open near me.  I can get a copy of the record next week.
Michaele Burris

Balassagyarmat street names/maps #hungary


My grandfather Ferencz Weisz was born at 379 Nagyhid utca in Balassagyarmat in 1880, I have a photo of the house. I think the street may have been called Altstadt st just before that. Does anyone have or know where I may find a map of the town in the 1870s or 1880s to work out where on the street the house would have been?
Many thanks
Emma Cole

Handwriting Help #records


Can anyone decipher the handwriting on this Passenger Manifest Lines 28-30 Column 11 for Hinde Lurie and Family. I am providing a Link to the entire document and a Screenshot below
Thanks for your patience and help
Jay Filan
Brooklyn, New York

SUMMARY OF RESPONSES AND HAPPY RESULTS! We believe we are related, but DNA doesn't show connection... ??? KLEPFISZ #poland #warsaw #dna

Elizabeth Jackson

Thank you everyone for the many responses with wonderful explanations and suggestions.  Our JewishGenners are always so helpful!

While my "cousin" and I knew it was possible that our connection was far enough back that we would not share any DNA, the most common thread among the responses was to check your DNA on numerous sites as sometimes you will match on one and not on another.  With that in mind, I loaded my DNA to FamilyTreeDNA, a place where my "cousin" already had hers.  Sure enough, here we find we are a match!  4th cousin to remote, but a match none the less!

We have been in touch for almost 30 years now, not knowing for sure if we were related.  Yesterday was a day of miracles for us as we were able to finally find some proof of our connection.  Chances are we may never find the actual connection, but it is nice to know that we truly are related.

Some of you asked if we cannot go farther back on our family lines.  Sadly, not at this point.  We have checked all the normal sources, but sometimes it is not possible to continue.

On my own line, I have gone back as far as my 3rd great grandparents, Mosek Izaak Klepfisz (b. 1940) and Esther Mandel.  However, this is based on information from other's trees and I do not have specific records to verify the information..  My 2x great grandfather was Nison Mosiek Klepfisz b. ca. 1770.  His wife was Szosa Ajzensprung.  JewishGen does have a record for the marriage of their son Dawid Mordka Klepfisz to Etta Laja Ruda in Warsaw (whom I know to be my great grandparents), so this is my proof that they are my 2x great grandparents.  There is also a record of death for Dawid, 4 Jul 1922 Warszawa, Mazowiedkie, Poland.  As far as locations for my ancestors, I only know Warsaw.

As you can see, I continue to research and I do not give up.  And in not giving up, my cousin and I finally at least have a shred of proof of our relationship.

Thanks again to everyone who offered suggestions.  I am happy to report a bit of a success story!

Elizabeth Jackson
Michigan, USA

Re: Triangulating matches #dna

Milton Koch

I use chromosome browser, then move the possible matching ones to a "word" document where the common segments can be visually observed along with the size of overlap.
Milton Koch

Re: Wolk family of Lithuania #lithuania

David Wolk

Carol Hoffman,

Thanks for your response re. suggested resources.  Have tried the LitvakSIG and the JewishGen Family Finder.  No matter how I spell the family name, town or country, the result is the same - zero.  Any thoughts?

David Wolk

Re: Family of Haim And Ides BRAUNSTEIN / COJOCARU of Saveni Romania #romania #usa #israel #holocaust


There is a marriage in 1909 of  Haim son of Copel Cojocariu with Ides daughter  of Saia Harabagiu. The names in the Romanian civil records do not always fit with what descendants may know.  If interested in prior to 1915 you can contact me privately.

Luc Radu
Great Neck, NY

Re: Translation of document help #germany #translation


The date is for Sabbath Eve, 21 Adar 5521.  There are two months of Adar in a Hebrew leap year. The date for the second month of Adar occurred on Friday, 27 March 1761. 

The list of names:
Itzig is a common nickname for men whose given name is Yitzchak (Isaac), although it does not rule out the possibility that it could be a surname.
The list for men and women whose given names begin with the Hebrew letter yud, pronounced in English as Y, e.g., Yosef, Yenta, Yonah.
There are no surnames on this list. It is of male and female name in the form  Given Name son of or daughter of Father's Given Name.  

David Rosen
Boston, MA

On 3/19/2021 10:22 AM, genealog.research@... wrote:
Dear all,

I just recently found out that I have jews ancestry in Germany (in the city of Dessau) about 1800. About what I really excited. Some sources I found are in Hebrew, however.

If there is anyone, knowing Hebrew, it would you be so kind to help me with my two questions. Thank you very much in advance. :)

1) Can please somebody translate the following words from Hebrew to English? I guess this is a date. The source is from 1869.


2) Can please someone look at the following page (a kind of register from the same source as the image above) and see if there is any person with the surname "Itzig". I am looking for a woman called "Henriette (Elisabeth) Itzig". Maybe the name was spelled differently in Hebrew back then. However, if the are other persons with the same surname, I would like to know how on which line they are written and how the whole name translates from Hebrew to Englisch.

Best wishes,


Sebastian Neumann
Dresden, Germany

Towns: Dessau, Sachsen-Anhalt, Germany

Re: DRUCKERs of Kyiv, Ukraine (Kiev) to rabbinic line. #rabbinic

David Seldner

Rabbi David Drucker (approx. 1518-1600), son of Shlomo Ashkenazi Luria and Dinah Rappaport, married to Kendel Isserles (sister of the REMA, Moses Isserles) was the father-in-law of Saul Wahl Katzenellenbogen, the famous so-called King of Poland for one night.
There is lots of information on genealogical sites.
David Seldner, Karlsruhe, Germany

Re: POLISH CERTIFICATE OF NATIONALITY #poland #general #austria-czech

Ian Charles

I've had some "private" responses that might be very useful. If I have any success, will report back here

Ian Charles
London, UK

Re: Translation of document help #germany #translation

Rodney Eisfelder

You are right about it being a date, but there are no words. Everything is an abreviation or acronym, which makes the interpretation a little uncertain. The first "word" stands for "Erev Shabbat Kodesh" (Friday evening). The second "word" means 21. The third word should be the month, and this has me confused. The year is (5)521 which is 1761. The final symbol (not even a letter, but a tri-graph), indicates that the year is in the short form, omitting the thousands. If the month abbreviation stands for Adar, then there were two months of Adar in that year, and they should be distinguished by either an Alef or Bet. But they are not.

The second image appears to a page from a burial register. Most of the names are of the form "x son of y", or "x daughter of y". A few are of the form "x wife of y". Only a couple appear to be preceded by a surname. A few are followed by an occupation (which could also be a surname). So, is Itzig a surname or a patronym?
This page has people whose Hebrew name begins with a Yod - names like Jona, Joseph, Israel, Jacob, Yenta etc. One can only guess what Hebrew name Henriette would have had, and hence which page of the register you should be looking at.

I hope this helps a little,
Rodney EIsfelder
Melbourne, Australia

Re: Strategies For Researching Non-Direct Ancestry U.S. Relatives Who We Lost Touch With #records

Sally Bruckheimer <sallybruc@...>

"what are the best strategies for researching all the cousins and relatives who also came over but where I don't know names for sure or who their children are."

You do this the same way you find your ancestors. You find documents for people with the hopefully not too common surname. With a common surname, like my Löwenstein ggrandmother, you keep track of the people with the same name - like another of the same surname living next door on a census. When you find where your ancestors came from, hopefully you will find brothers and sisters names which will match. Just keep working.

It took me 35 years to find the right little town in Nassau where my ggrandmother was born, but when I found it, I found she was one of 20 children of the correct parents who had moved from another little town. That town has a book of history, including records of the Jewish families that lived there: there were 3 families that were related before surnames existed. I have about a million cousins now, descendants of the 3 related families.

Sally Bruckheimer
Princeton, NJ

Re: Why Various Spellings of A Family Name #names

John Byng

My Grandfather changed his name by Deed Poll (a legal instrument) in 1925 from Bing to Byng.  It may have been to hide his Jewish parentage or to avoid association with the German Bings after WW1.  His father emigrated to London England from Hungary (perhaps Arad now Romania) and married in a Jewish ceremony in London but at some stage they seem to have abandoned their religious affiliation and it is only recently that I have discovered that my Christian father had Jewish grandparents.  Other descendants of my Great Grandfather are still using the Bing spelling.  
John Byng, Crawley UK
Researching great grandfather Louis Bing born about 1831 in Hungary (perhaps Arad now in Romania), died 1893 in Portsea, Hampshire England.

Re: Gritzman and Zakusaya families of Bialystok #names #poland


My great-grandfather was Morris Gratz from Bialystok. We were always told he had changed his name. Do you think there might be a Gritzman connection?
Irene Plotzker 
Wilmington, Delaware 

Re: Why Various Spellings of A Family Name #names

Ittai Hershman

With all these anecdotes about historical change, I'll just relate a contemporary example: my own given name.  I am named after a biblical hero character in 2 Samuel.  My parents gave me the spelling in Hebrew as it appears in the Masoretic text (אתי) and in English as it appears in the King James Version (Ittai).  Decades later, this became a very popular name in Israel.  

As a contemporary name in Israel, it is spelled with an added written Yud (איתי) to disambiguate it from the name Etty; and, in English, there are many permutations (e.g. Itay, Itai, Ittay) that one can see on Facebook.  For official purposes in Israel, using the Masoretic Hebrew spelling of my name would be swimming uphill, so fI use the Israeli convention for identification purposes there.  But, I use the Masoretic Hebrew spelling for myself.

Likewise, of course, there are various spelling permutations of each of my family surnames.  Borders and languages were crossed, sometimes written alphabets were crossed, and cultural conventions applied.  So, contractions, translations, and spelling changes; not to mention sometimes the invention of new names altogether, are part of what makes our immigration stories interesting, it seems to me.

Ittai Hershman
New York City

Re: Handwriting Help #records

Diane Jacobs

C/O M. Filmopfsky. 238 Metroolitan av
Brooklyn NY

On Mar 19, 2021, at 4:30 PM, pathetiq1@... wrote:

Hi Jay, 

I am afraid that this is the manifest for a certain Scheine Alienikowa going to her aunt Hinde Laurie at 238 metropolitan Ave Brooklyn. I see no mother's name in this document. 
Giannis Daropoulos 


Diane Jacobs, Somerset, New Jersey

Re: Searching for art stolen from German Jewish family. #germany


You must read 'The Orpheus Clock' by Simon Goodman.  He is the master of this topic, and he is also around on social media.

Sadly, my widowed German grandmother had everything stolen from her (or forced sale, undoubtedly, at pennies on the dollar), and there was no list of family assets for me to begin to trace.  The only thing I know of was her Bosendorfer concert grand piano, but the factory (Austrian) won't even lift a finger to help me trace it.  I was told that someone contacted my aunt in London in the 50s and offered to SELL it to her, but she couldn't afford to buy it back.

Best of luck!
Marc Stevens

Strategies For Researching Non-Direct Ancestry U.S. Relatives Who We Lost Touch With #records

David Levine

Hi everyone,

I have just spent months researching my direct ancestry which included immigration, manifests, naturalization documents, etc for people whose stories I mostly knew.
My question is, what are the best strategies for researching all the cousins and relatives who also came over but where I don't know names for sure or who their children are.
Some of them have come up as DNA matches however they often have as little information as I have
These are all people who came to/lived in the US so records should be out there.
It is getting started where I am stumped
For example, my GGF had a sister who I have as "unknown" Lefkowitz. Didn't come over at same time.
And I have a few children -  Rose  "UNKNOWN"
Knowing little, its hard to start a search.

Best Regards,
David Levine
San Francisco, CA, USA
Weinstein -> Solotwina, Galicia | Frisch, Hilman, Jungerman, Schindler -> Rozniatow, Galicia | Golanski, Kramerofsky/Kromerovsky -> Kiev | Lefkowitz -> Petrikov, Belarus | Shub, Rosen Hlusk, Belarus | Levine, Weiner, Zamoshkin -> Slutsk, Belarus 

Re: Why Various Spellings of A Family Name #names

Peter Straus

My own theory is that, especially when literacy in German was not universal, one must remember that the original function of written language was to record spoken language, and as such, the modern concept of a “right” and a “wrong” spelling doesn’t have much basis, so long as it sounded right—and don’t forget regional dialects.  This concept appears to underlie variations in given names like “Sophie” and “Sophia,” “Joseph” and “Josef,” but in surnames as well, particularly in the early years of their use (the early 1800s in the lands west of the Rhine).   Thus my paternal line’s family has consistently spelled its name “Straus” in most records from the 1800s, but there is lack of consistency between “Straus” and “Strauss” in the earlier records.


--peter straus

  San Francisco, California, USA

Re: We believe we are related, but DNA doesn't show connection... ??? KLEPFISZ #poland #warsaw #dna

Moishe Miller

You raise a great question: "We believe we are related, but DNA doesn't show connection". I will try to give three non-technical answers:
1. Your genetic (DNA) tree will be different than your "real" (genealogical) tree. You will always get DNA from parents, grandparents and even all 8 great-grandparents. Further back in time, you will likely get DNA from all 16 gg-gp's, but sometimes maybe only from 15 or 14. Each generation further back in time results in less "pieces" (cM's) of DNA being from all ancestors.
2. The DNA segments (cM) you receive will always be large enough so that you will share some DNA with a 2nd cousin. But, you could have a legitimate 3rd cousin that does not match any of your DNA. It could be that the segments you have from the common gg-gp's do not overlap. 
3. When your DNA is created, there is something at the chromosome level known as crossover. The "non-sciencey" meaning is that chromosomes tend to recombine at specific break points. So a given chromosome will only have so many pieces and not more. For instance, if a chromosome only has 15 crossover sections, you will not get a segment from at least one of your 16 gg-gp's. It is sort of like musical chairs. In this example, 16 gg-gp's and only 15 crossovers, leaves at least one off. If two segments come from the same one gg-gp, than you will only have 14 gg-gp's represented in that chromosome. If you want to learn more about crossover, and how it differs by gender, see this blog posts by Roberta Estes: from 2017 and from 2019.

Wishing everyone stays safe and healthy,

Moishe Miller
Brooklyn, NY
JGFF #3391

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