Re: Why Did Jews Marry Christians? #general

Jules Levin


On 4/8/2021 12:41 PM, Sarah L Meyer wrote:
In the 19th century Jews married Christians either for marriage or to
protect their family from antisemitism or for economic reasons - to
get a "good" job, enter college, etc.

A granduncle born in St. Petersburg c. 1880, married an Irish girl in
Chicago around 1902.  The family was devastated.  But they were
consoled by a little bundle of joy arriving about 6 or 7 months after
the wedding.  (This was found by researchers thru Jewishgen; the
generations of my family coming after that date never knew about it.) 
  Another example: *Oscar Venceslas De Lubicz-Milosz*, 1877–1939),
French poet, mystical writer, and diplomat. Milosz, who was born in
Chereya, Belorussia to a Lithuanian nobleman and the baptized daughter
of a Warsaw Hebrew tIeacher....
In the introduction to his poetry in Lithuanian I read that his father a
Polish cavalry officer in the Russian service, rode through  a village,
and his eyes met the eyes of a beautiful Jewish maiden. He swept her off
her feet and rode off with her.  Let us not forget eros as a motivation
for intermarriage!

Jules Levin

Los Angeles

Re: Replying in private - no need to publish your email #guidelines


If I think anything I say may have wider usefulness, I will continue to share publicly.  I'm sure moderators can determine if I am mistaken.
Barbara Sloan
Conway, SC

Assistance Needed to translate the Hebrew on Family Gravestones #translation

Aimee Smythe

I am interested in getting your  help to  translate the Hebrew on these family gravestones . Ancestors  are thought to be from Lemberg, Austria emigrating to US in 1880s, buried in Cincinnati, Ohio.
Thank you,
Amelia Bartel Smythe
Tucson, Arizona

Looking for Family of Rut Sokol - Brooklyn NY #usa

Steven Granek

I am trying to locate relatives of a Rut (Ruth?) Sokol who lived (by her Yad Vashem testimonies) in Brooklyn NY in 1993. Rut is/was my newly discovered 2nd cousin from a part of my family whose existence I am just uncovering. Her father was Daniel Ecksztajn and grandmother Freyda Eksztajn (nee Orum), the latter my Great Aunt (who no one ever had told me about). While Damiel and Freyda apparently dies in the Holocaust, Rut apparently made it to the US and was married. And I believe she had children who are my relatives. All help appreciated.

Steve Granek
Columbia, MD USA

Re: Are "Muni" and "Munya" nicknames? For what name? #names

Chana Bonn

The only Munya I ever knew was also an Emanuel. 

Chana Bonn, Philadelphia 

Re: Viewmate translation Russian - surname for bride, no surname for groom? #lithuania #records


the name is listed as Yankel Efroimovich, which might mean either "Yankel son Efroim" or "Yankel Efroimovich" (as in someone's last name).  In this case, I think they didn't list his patronymic, just like record #14 - Toder Freynk (а 73 y.o., who married a 43 y.o. and gave 300 (!) rubles, as opposed to others on the same page, who only gave 42 or 84 rubles)
Shulke's father's name is Eliash.

Here is a twofer for you :)
Her brother is listed in the record above, #16 - a widower, Abram son of Eliash Ordman, but I can't make out name of his bride.  It starts with letters "RA", her father's name is Meyer.

Mike Vayser

Re: Why Did Jews Marry Christians? #general

Janet Furba

On Wed, Apr 7, 2021 at 11:55 AM, Cliff Karchmer wrote:
The intermarriages were not forbidden. But one of the two had to change his or her confession because there were then only religious marriages recognized by the State.
Janet Furba, Germany

Re: Why Did Jews Marry Christians? #general

Sarah L Meyer

In the 19th century Jews married Christians either for marriage or to protect their family from antisemitism or for economic reasons - to get a "good" job, enter college, etc.

Sarah L Meyer
Georgetown TX
BIRGARDOVSKY, EDELBERG, HITE (CHAIT), PERCHIK Russia (southern Ukraine) and some Latvia or Lithuania

Viewmate translation Russian - surname for bride, no surname for groom? #lithuania #records

Michele Lock

On Jewishgen, I found the probable 1854 marriage record for the brother of my great great grandfather Aron Lak, from the town of Telsiai, Lithuania. The brother's name is Jankel Lak, son of Efroim, according to his own gravestone. From his family's Hamburg ship passenger list, his wife's name was Shula (short for Shulamit, I imagine).

The Jewishgen record is for a Jankel son of Efroim, but there is no groom's surname indexed. For the bride, she is listed as Shulke Ordman; this corresponds to a US birth record, where her maiden surname was given as Ortman. 

For the original image below on Viewmate (Record #17), I'd like a translation from the Russian to confirm there is nothing written for the groom's surname, and to confirm her surname and father's name. Anything else of note about the either person would also be of interest. For some unknown reason, the Hebrew side of the record was not filled out.

Has anyone come across this type of situation before, where no groom's surname was given? I suspect this Jankel Lak did not have his birth recorded, so when he married, they had a problem with how to write the marriage record.
Michele Lock

Lock/Lak/Lok and Kalon/Kolon in Zagare/Joniskis/Gruzdziai and in Plunge/Telsiai, Lithuania
Trisinsky/Trushinsky/Sturisky and Leybman in Dotnuva, Lithuania
Olitsky in Alytus, Suwalki, Poland/Lithuania
Gutman/Goodman in Czestochowa, Poland
Lavine/Lev/Lew in Trenton, New Jersey and Lida/Vilna gub., Belarus

Re: Why Did Jews Marry Christians? #general

Sherri Bobish

Hi Cliff,

I found you question interesting, and while searching for some info on the subject I found this book (I have not read it.)
Confessions of the Shtetl. Converts from Judaism in Imperial Russia, 1817-1906 by Ellie R. Schainker
This site has a detailed commentary on the book, which on its own is interesting.

Hope this helps,

Sherri Bobish

Searching for relatives of Harold Goel LERNER and Rosalie (FINE) LERNER #general #names #usa


I am searching for relatives of Harold Goel Lerner and Rosalie (Fine) Lerner who I believe are related to me. They are both buried alongside other Fine relatives of mine in the Mount Lebanon Cemetery in Queens, NY.

They lived in Ft. Lee, NJ. Children: Joseph and Susan.

Harold Goel Lerner was born in Providence, RI (5 Jun 1926) and died NJ (19 Jun 2006)
Rosalie (Fine) Lerner was born in NYC, (19 Jun 1926) and died NJ (14 Sep 1998)

I believe Harold and Rosalie were married in the Bronx in 1954.


Jeff Fine
Montclair, NJ, USA

Galician Military Records #galicia

Barbara Ellman

I came across this posting from American Ancestors regarding military records for Galicia (1865-1918):

This is the first such record that I've seen.  Looks like a local researcher would be required.

Barbara Ellman
Secaucus NJ USA
ELLMAN, COIRA, MAIDMAN - Minkovtsy, Ukraine
KAGLE, FASS - Ulanow, Poland

New York City Death Record Questions #general #records #usa


I am trying to request the death certificates for some likely distant cousins, Julius Fine and Samuel H. Fine, who are buried near other of my Fine relatives in the Mount Lebanon Cemetery in Queens. They died in the 1954 and 1956.
Currently NYC Death records after 1949 are available only from the Department of Health and only to certain relatives:
  1. The following relations to the deceased may request both a death certificate and the confidential cause of death medical report: Spouse, Domestic partner, Parent, Child, Sibling. Grandparent, Grandchild, Informant listed on the certificate, Person in control of disposition.
  2. The following relations may only request a death certificate, not the cause of death: Niece/Nephew, Aunt/Uncle, Great grandchild and great-great grandchildGrandniece/Grandnephew
1. It seems like there are specific exceptions to the specific relatives listed above for specific legal purposes. Are there any exceptions for genealogical purposes? 
2. I have read in previous posts that after 50 years, the records move to the "genealogical" group. Is that correct? We are already 72 years past 1949.
Jeff Fine
Montclair, NJ, USA

Re: Are "Muni" and "Munya" nicknames? For what name? #names

Trudy Greener

My Russian first cousin was Munya, and I understood that it was short for Emanuel... 

Trudy (Litt) Greener, Jerusalem  (Litvak and Naiman families from Chimerovitz, Ukraine)

Re: Are "Muni" and "Munya" nicknames? For what name? #names

Linda Cantor

I had the opportunity at a genealogy conference years ago to ask the late Shmuel Gorr (author of Jewish Personal Names) about Manes, my grandfather's name.  He told me that it was a nickname or  diminutive for Menachem.

Linda Cantor

Re: Copying Hebrew text from a PDF into a Translation tool - OCR (Optical Character Recognition) Help Request #general

H Duboff


Have you tried uploading it to Google Translate?

Toward the top there is a choice of text or document.  You may be able to upload the PDF.

Mequon, Wisconsin

Re: Why Did Jews Marry Christians? #general

Cliff Karchmer

Hi Linda!  Thanks for your reply.  To make sure I understand you, like the Conversos, are you suggesting the converstion was not an actuaol embrace of another religion--but make to appear so for social and political reasons?  I could understand that.  My underlying question is whether such a marriage to a Christian would, under Russian law, protect those assets from something--like taxation?  Czarist confiscation? Please let me know if you can further enlighten me.

Cliff Karchmer.

Re: Looking for Hans and Fritz Loew from Meddlin, Colombia #germany #general


Hi Gidon.
Tell me what kind of information you are looking for.  I belong to Colombias JGS and we have been documenting the history of the community in Medellin. Feel free to send me an email at info@... . We will be glad to help!
Lia Sragovicz

Re: Why Did Jews Marry Christians? #general

Lin Mor

Even though my maternal grandfather's brother converted to Russian Orthodox for "business reasons" in Rostov-on-Don, Russia, his descendants identify as Jewish. Consider the possibility that the conversion served as the "public religion." Think about the Conversos of Spain and Portugal, I think perhaps there are some similarities here, but with nowhere as dire consequences.

Linda Cohen Morzillo

Saratoga Springs, NY




PRESS and SCHNEIDER in Vidukle and other Raseiniai towns

AMCHISLAVSKY and ERLICHMAN in Rostov-on-Don and previously Kozelets and Oster, Chernigov Gubernia

COHEN/KAGAN and BORNSTEIN in Oshmiany and France

KOSOFSKY in Shchuchyn, near Lida, Belarus

SWOTINSKY in Grodno Gubernia Poland/Russia/Belarus

In memory of LeRoy Weinstein, z'l #JewishGenUpdates

Avraham Groll

Dear JewishGen Community,

We send our heartfelt condolences to Chuck Weinstein, long-time Towns Director for the Ukraine Research Division, and our 2019 Susan E. King Volunteer of the Year, on the loss of his beloved father LeRoy Weinstein - Yehuda Leib ben Shmuel and Tzippi, z'l.

May his memory be for a blessing, and may Chuck and the entire Weinstein family be consoled among the mourners of Zion and Jerusalem.

Avraham Groll (on behalf of the entire JewishGen Team)
Executive Director

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