Date   

Still looking For Betty SHANE (Berta SHAYNGESICHT) from London #unitedkingdom

Yehuda Dodo <yehudad@...>
 

Hi fellow Genners!

I want to thank all those who gave me more information.
This is what I know about her so far:

She was born 1931 in Belgium.
She probably was a member of Habonim in North London in 1946 and lived in BallsPond Road Islington.
She married my father, Yaacov (Jacob) Dodo, May 1957 in Kiryat Shmona, Israel.
They were living in London and got divorced there before 1965.
She was living in xxxxxxxx Drive, Clayhall ILFORD
I think she stayed in London.

Any help will be appriciated

Thank you for helping,
Yehuda Dodo

MODERATOR NOTE: In accordance with our privacy policy, part of the address above has
been edited. Please contact Yehuda directly for more information.


JCR-UK SIG #UnitedKingdom Still looking For Betty SHANE (Berta SHAYNGESICHT) from London #unitedkingdom

Yehuda Dodo <yehudad@...>
 

Hi fellow Genners!

I want to thank all those who gave me more information.
This is what I know about her so far:

She was born 1931 in Belgium.
She probably was a member of Habonim in North London in 1946 and lived in BallsPond Road Islington.
She married my father, Yaacov (Jacob) Dodo, May 1957 in Kiryat Shmona, Israel.
They were living in London and got divorced there before 1965.
She was living in xxxxxxxx Drive, Clayhall ILFORD
I think she stayed in London.

Any help will be appriciated

Thank you for helping,
Yehuda Dodo

MODERATOR NOTE: In accordance with our privacy policy, part of the address above has
been edited. Please contact Yehuda directly for more information.


Name Betreas = Erzebet #hungary

Sam Schleman <Samara99@...>
 

Hello all.

I have come across a relative whose name in the birth register in Szabolcs
County was Erzebet, as was her name on the ship's manifest in 1921. However,
no one in the family recognized her with that name, in that she was known as
Betreas for the remainder of her life.

Out of curiosity, did she completely change the name by which she was
called, or could Betreas be considered a variation of Erzebet, such as
Elizabeth becoming Betty in the US?

Thanks.

Sam Schleman
Malvern, PA
Samara99@...

Moderator: Betreas is a relatively uncommon female name that may be a version of Beatrice. As many H-SIG subscribers have pointed out, Hungarian-Jewish immigrants, like all immigrants and, indeed, like all Americans, picked new names for many different reasons. The fact that most Hungarian Erzebets might become Elizabeth or Betty doesn't mean that some might have decided to become Beatrice or Betreas after arriving in the US.


Hungary SIG #Hungary Name Betreas = Erzebet #hungary

Sam Schleman <Samara99@...>
 

Hello all.

I have come across a relative whose name in the birth register in Szabolcs
County was Erzebet, as was her name on the ship's manifest in 1921. However,
no one in the family recognized her with that name, in that she was known as
Betreas for the remainder of her life.

Out of curiosity, did she completely change the name by which she was
called, or could Betreas be considered a variation of Erzebet, such as
Elizabeth becoming Betty in the US?

Thanks.

Sam Schleman
Malvern, PA
Samara99@...

Moderator: Betreas is a relatively uncommon female name that may be a version of Beatrice. As many H-SIG subscribers have pointed out, Hungarian-Jewish immigrants, like all immigrants and, indeed, like all Americans, picked new names for many different reasons. The fact that most Hungarian Erzebets might become Elizabeth or Betty doesn't mean that some might have decided to become Beatrice or Betreas after arriving in the US.


Baal Shem Tov's Wife #hungary

nancy scholem <nkfisch@...>
 

A number of cousins that I have spoken with have told me that we are related
to the Baal Shem Tov through marriage. According to what I have heard, his
wife had a brother, Abraham Gershom of Kutow (who moved to Hebron) and
another brother was Zvi Hersh. Zvi Hersh's grand-daughter married my
grgrgrgrgrandfather, Yakov Fisch of Nagykallo.

Here are my questions:

1. In references to the Baal Shem Tov's wife, I have seen her referred to
as "Hanna" and also as "Leah Rochel". Does anyone know a definite name?

2. My grgrgrandfather was Zvi Hersh Fisch and it is a very common family
name. I also have read that the Baal Shem Tov gave a brocha with 2 hands to
Yakov Fisch to travel to Hungary and spread the word of the Chassidic
movement. So, I also know for sure that there was a connection between the
2, but does anyone know of a source that I can use to document the
marriage/nephew connection?

Many thanks for any help.

Nancy Scholem
NY NY


Hungary SIG #Hungary Baal Shem Tov's Wife #hungary

nancy scholem <nkfisch@...>
 

A number of cousins that I have spoken with have told me that we are related
to the Baal Shem Tov through marriage. According to what I have heard, his
wife had a brother, Abraham Gershom of Kutow (who moved to Hebron) and
another brother was Zvi Hersh. Zvi Hersh's grand-daughter married my
grgrgrgrgrandfather, Yakov Fisch of Nagykallo.

Here are my questions:

1. In references to the Baal Shem Tov's wife, I have seen her referred to
as "Hanna" and also as "Leah Rochel". Does anyone know a definite name?

2. My grgrgrandfather was Zvi Hersh Fisch and it is a very common family
name. I also have read that the Baal Shem Tov gave a brocha with 2 hands to
Yakov Fisch to travel to Hungary and spread the word of the Chassidic
movement. So, I also know for sure that there was a connection between the
2, but does anyone know of a source that I can use to document the
marriage/nephew connection?

Many thanks for any help.

Nancy Scholem
NY NY


accented text #hungary

tom klein <h-sig@...>
 

at the risk of being branded the resident curmudgeon, i want to ask people (again) not to post messages with accented characters.

even though the text may look right on YOUR screen, the process of passing it through the list server, and then through various different computer operating systems practically guarantees that it will be garbled at the receiving end.

yesterday, giselle bodziony posted three messages containing hungarian text, and i could barely read any of it, because most of the accented characters were either disappeared completely, or otherwise transformed.

where it is necessary, such as transcribed text, please either drop the accents or else use the convention that many hungarian internet users have adopted, of entering the accents as separate letters following the vowel.

ko:sz sze'pen.


....... klein tama's, toronto

Moderator: I appreciate Tom's explanation as to why we must reject messages received in accented text. We realize that some subscribers consider this to be yet another bothersome and bureacratic JewishGen rule. In fact, as Tom points out, the intent is to just make sure that recipients can read your messages. Isn't that, after all, the intent of posting messages to H-SIG?


Hungary SIG #Hungary accented text #hungary

tom klein <h-sig@...>
 

at the risk of being branded the resident curmudgeon, i want to ask people (again) not to post messages with accented characters.

even though the text may look right on YOUR screen, the process of passing it through the list server, and then through various different computer operating systems practically guarantees that it will be garbled at the receiving end.

yesterday, giselle bodziony posted three messages containing hungarian text, and i could barely read any of it, because most of the accented characters were either disappeared completely, or otherwise transformed.

where it is necessary, such as transcribed text, please either drop the accents or else use the convention that many hungarian internet users have adopted, of entering the accents as separate letters following the vowel.

ko:sz sze'pen.


....... klein tama's, toronto

Moderator: I appreciate Tom's explanation as to why we must reject messages received in accented text. We realize that some subscribers consider this to be yet another bothersome and bureacratic JewishGen rule. In fact, as Tom points out, the intent is to just make sure that recipients can read your messages. Isn't that, after all, the intent of posting messages to H-SIG?


Re: BASCH and BERNSTEIN from Budapest #hungary

tom klein <h-sig@...>
 

i can't help you very much with the specifics of your family, but some aspects of this letter resemble my own family history, so i can't resist making a few observations:

any letter written in 1957 (at the height of the cold war and just after the 1956 revolution) to the united states was subject to government censorship, probably in both countries.

some of the content may have been INTENDED for the authorities, especially since an "aunt" living in hungary wouldn't have had to tell a "nephew" about his own background ("he was like a brother to her"). or she may have needed money for the medical treatment, and couldn't ask outright (under the communists, doctors were government employees and forbidden to take money >from patients, officially...). my parents also wrote some letters "for public consumption" so that the authorities wouldn't confiscate our belongings when my father fled the country.

some letters also contained "family code", because some activities were illegal and dangerous. in my family's case, "uncle sam" may have arrived safely, except that we didn't have a real uncle by that name, but there was no safe way to thank our relatives for the dollars they had sent us. in other cases, it was about escape routes to the west, etc. but mail was being opened, and everybody knew it.

i would wait until i had confirmation >from some other sources before accepting all of it at face value.


....... tom klein, toronto

Vicki Blum Vigil <aev@...> wrote:

Trying to figure out adoption/foster parent relationship and get
confirming documents on:

Olga BASCH married to Dr. Georg BASCH sent letter >from Budapest in
1957 to my dad - Emerick Blum in Cleveland, Ohio. She signed it "Aunt
Olga". In 1957, she was 63 years old and in the hospital had a
gallstone operation; her husband was still alive.

Relationship: Olga writes that her father DR. JAKOB BERNSTEIN a
physician and mother REGINA BERNSTEIN "educated" my paternal
grandfather (FRANK/VINCENT BLUM/BLOOM). Perhaps one of them was a
teacher? She writes that Frank/Vincent was an orphan and he was like
a brother to her- Olga; and that Frank/Vincent maintained a permanent
correspondence with her -Olga's mother. (Frank died in 1944 in
Cleveland)
[snip!]


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: BASCH and BERNSTEIN from Budapest #hungary

tom klein <h-sig@...>
 

i can't help you very much with the specifics of your family, but some aspects of this letter resemble my own family history, so i can't resist making a few observations:

any letter written in 1957 (at the height of the cold war and just after the 1956 revolution) to the united states was subject to government censorship, probably in both countries.

some of the content may have been INTENDED for the authorities, especially since an "aunt" living in hungary wouldn't have had to tell a "nephew" about his own background ("he was like a brother to her"). or she may have needed money for the medical treatment, and couldn't ask outright (under the communists, doctors were government employees and forbidden to take money >from patients, officially...). my parents also wrote some letters "for public consumption" so that the authorities wouldn't confiscate our belongings when my father fled the country.

some letters also contained "family code", because some activities were illegal and dangerous. in my family's case, "uncle sam" may have arrived safely, except that we didn't have a real uncle by that name, but there was no safe way to thank our relatives for the dollars they had sent us. in other cases, it was about escape routes to the west, etc. but mail was being opened, and everybody knew it.

i would wait until i had confirmation >from some other sources before accepting all of it at face value.


....... tom klein, toronto

Vicki Blum Vigil <aev@...> wrote:

Trying to figure out adoption/foster parent relationship and get
confirming documents on:

Olga BASCH married to Dr. Georg BASCH sent letter >from Budapest in
1957 to my dad - Emerick Blum in Cleveland, Ohio. She signed it "Aunt
Olga". In 1957, she was 63 years old and in the hospital had a
gallstone operation; her husband was still alive.

Relationship: Olga writes that her father DR. JAKOB BERNSTEIN a
physician and mother REGINA BERNSTEIN "educated" my paternal
grandfather (FRANK/VINCENT BLUM/BLOOM). Perhaps one of them was a
teacher? She writes that Frank/Vincent was an orphan and he was like
a brother to her- Olga; and that Frank/Vincent maintained a permanent
correspondence with her -Olga's mother. (Frank died in 1944 in
Cleveland)
[snip!]


ABRAHAM Family in Hatceg =Hateg #hungary

"רוזן
 

ABRAHAM Family in Hatceg =Hateg

The mother of my GGardmother Zali Serl (miden mame Fritsch)Fischer was born
in 1885)}came >from Hatceg.
Her name was Malka ABRAHAM
Her parents Ester and Moshe ABRAHAM were >from a village called Szent kiray

Malka ABRAHAM had a brother Shlomo and a sister Chaya=Haya
Shlomo had a son Layos who married Shari=Sharlotte
they had a dougther Eva,
They all died in the holocaust
That all the information I have.
I'll appreciate any more information.is anybody has to offer.

Anat Rosen (Rashkes)
Abirim
Israel
m4rosen@...

Researching: MENDEL, FISCHER,FRITSCH, SCHWARTZ, ABRAHAM, LAYNER -
Transylvania


Re: Hungarian Book Availability #hungary

Robert Neu
 

I don't know about in the USA, but it is available;able at the Memorial
Museum of Hungarian Speaking Jewry in Safed.

It does not list all WWI Hungarian Jewish soldiers, and is very hard to
consult as there is no index nor rime or reason as to what name and or
photographs appear where.

A valid project if a book can be accessed would be to create an index.

Robert Neu
--- Adam Smith <ajsmith98@...> wrote:

Hi Everyone,
A few months back there was discussion about a book that is kept at
Yad
Vashem, that was published in Hungarian. In English, it is called
"Jews
serving in the Austro-Hungarian army - A golden album of the Jewish
soldiers
in WWI". Does anyone know if this book is available in the USA?

Here are the Hungarian details:

"A Magyar Hadviselt Zsidok. ARANYALBUMA Az 1914-1918 Vilaghaboru
Emlekere"
Szerkesztette Hegedus Marton
A Magyar Hadviselt Zsidok Aranyalbuma
Szerkesztobizottsaga Kozremukodesevel
Budapest, 1940

Take care,
Adam Smith

New York, NY

Searching:
OBERLANDER: Chinadievo, Mukachevo, Svalyava Ukraine, Miskolc, Hungary
BEZDEDI: Any
TAMBOR: Maramaros area Ukraine, and Nyiregyhaza, Miskolc, Hungary
SAPSOWITZ/SAPSZOVICS/SAPSOVIC-Iza, Lipsha, Khust, Ukraine,
Bratislavia,
Slovakia


Hungary SIG #Hungary ABRAHAM Family in Hatceg =Hateg #hungary

"רוזן
 

ABRAHAM Family in Hatceg =Hateg

The mother of my GGardmother Zali Serl (miden mame Fritsch)Fischer was born
in 1885)}came >from Hatceg.
Her name was Malka ABRAHAM
Her parents Ester and Moshe ABRAHAM were >from a village called Szent kiray

Malka ABRAHAM had a brother Shlomo and a sister Chaya=Haya
Shlomo had a son Layos who married Shari=Sharlotte
they had a dougther Eva,
They all died in the holocaust
That all the information I have.
I'll appreciate any more information.is anybody has to offer.

Anat Rosen (Rashkes)
Abirim
Israel
m4rosen@...

Researching: MENDEL, FISCHER,FRITSCH, SCHWARTZ, ABRAHAM, LAYNER -
Transylvania


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Hungarian Book Availability #hungary

Robert Neu
 

I don't know about in the USA, but it is available;able at the Memorial
Museum of Hungarian Speaking Jewry in Safed.

It does not list all WWI Hungarian Jewish soldiers, and is very hard to
consult as there is no index nor rime or reason as to what name and or
photographs appear where.

A valid project if a book can be accessed would be to create an index.

Robert Neu
--- Adam Smith <ajsmith98@...> wrote:

Hi Everyone,
A few months back there was discussion about a book that is kept at
Yad
Vashem, that was published in Hungarian. In English, it is called
"Jews
serving in the Austro-Hungarian army - A golden album of the Jewish
soldiers
in WWI". Does anyone know if this book is available in the USA?

Here are the Hungarian details:

"A Magyar Hadviselt Zsidok. ARANYALBUMA Az 1914-1918 Vilaghaboru
Emlekere"
Szerkesztette Hegedus Marton
A Magyar Hadviselt Zsidok Aranyalbuma
Szerkesztobizottsaga Kozremukodesevel
Budapest, 1940

Take care,
Adam Smith

New York, NY

Searching:
OBERLANDER: Chinadievo, Mukachevo, Svalyava Ukraine, Miskolc, Hungary
BEZDEDI: Any
TAMBOR: Maramaros area Ukraine, and Nyiregyhaza, Miskolc, Hungary
SAPSOWITZ/SAPSZOVICS/SAPSOVIC-Iza, Lipsha, Khust, Ukraine,
Bratislavia,
Slovakia


Re: Hessisch Lichtenau #hungary

Gábor Hirsch <hirsch@...>
 

May be you can find the information you are looking for on the homepage
of the camp http://www.buchenwald.de/, there is also the informations
paper edited by the Jewish community Budapest in 1945 about the
displaced persons waiting for repatriation in different camps "Hirek az
Elhurcoltakrol" it is available in the Hungarian Archive in Budapest, I
ordered in 2002 a microfilm copy and got it for an affordable price. I
informed H-SIG in December 2002 about the content of the different
issues, my interest was Nr. 3. about the camp Sluzk in USSR where I
spent some month in 1945. Some of the issues are waiting for
transcription as on 7/7/2004 Joyce Field >from Jewishgen informed us, she
was looking for proofreaders.

Here is again the list of the 5 issues published of the paper "Hirek
az Elhurcoltakrol" (News >from the dragged away persons) May be in one of
the issues you can find the information you are looking for, the paper
lists the survivors.

The first issue (5. July 1945, 16 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps: Homberg, Kammer- Schaerfling, Lipcse, Frielendorf, Ebensee,
Hillersleben, Aurolzmuenster, Buchenwald, Sachsenhausen, Sondheim,
Unter-Themenau, Goerlitz, Wells, Troebitz (>from Bergen-Belsen)

The second issue (17. July 1945, 24 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps who remained in Theresienstadt, Deportees in holyday resort
Sweden, Bergen, Salzwedel, Celle, Ziegenhein.

The third issue (14. August 1945, 24 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps Bergen-Belsen, Dornach, Feldafing, Garmisch-Partenkirchen,
Mannheim, Szluck (Belorussia, this last list is transcibed), in this
list there are 8 person born in the 187x-ies, 21 children born after
1940, one girl, Bein Angela born 1944 in Birkenau, and a boy Papp Dezsoe
born 1945 in Zielenrig.

The fourth issue (2. September 1945, 16 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps POW-s and deportees in Siberia, Ural, Germany and Austria; Azbeszt
(Siberia), Nizsgij-Tagil (Nr. 153/1 camp), Morschanszk (SU, 64) Molotow
(Borowszk), 107/15 forced labor unit >from Heves Bok (Nr.103 camp),
Minszk forced lagborer, Deportees in hospital Wels, Landsbergen (West
from Munich), Neustift (near Innsbruck), Tuerkheim (SW >from Augsburg),
St. Ottilien, Rheinsholdhain (bei Glachau, women), Targam Allensburg
(near Leipzig), Penzing West >from Munich), Feldafing (South >from
Munich), Dachau, Dilich (bei Kassel), Wells

The fifth issue (20. October 1945, 24 pages) listed the inmates POW-s
and deportees in different places in Soviet Union, French, Switzerland,
Nizsnij Tagil (253/6 camp), Rusztava (bei Tiflisz 181-3) 109/7 forced
labor unit, Gorki (117/1 camp), Persons cared by the American Mission in
Italy, Persons cared by the UNRRA in Italy, deportees in Sweden
searching family members in Hungary, >from Bergen-Belsen to Sweden, Ravel
Wallerberg Organisation's (Stockholm) message, list of German
communities where deportees live or lived, Osby, Sigtuna, different
camps in SU, deportees in Paris, Fuessin, hospital Seehaupt,hospital
Geretsried, Oberfaehring, Hannover and vicinity, Bruzlav,
Rheinfeld-Salina (Switzerland), Luebeck.

Your fear of the Hungarian readers is unfounded, I accompanied a group
of HaShomer >from Switzerland to Hungary (60 year commemoration) and
Poland (Krakow, Auschwitz, Warsaw, Treblinka), the Hungarian, Swiss,
Austrian were with an Israeli guide, in my impression the young people
spoke better English as our guide. The Internet users of all countries
are forced to some English.

Best regards
Gabor Hirsch

bodziony@... schrieb:
> Dear Genners,
>
> Hessisch Lichtenau was a camp which belonged to the concentration
> camp of Buchenwald. Does anyone know where I can search for victims
> and survivors of that camp in Hessisch Lichtenau?
>
> I would like to write the same text in Hungarian too, because some
> Hungarian readers in this mailinglist might have limited knowledge of
> English:
>
> Hessisch Lichtenau tabor a Buchenwald halaltaborhoz tartozott.
> Tudja-e valaki, hol lehet a Hessisch Lichtenau tabor aldozatai es
> tulelöi utan kutatni?
>
> I thank you very much for your help.
>
> Giselle Bodziony


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Hessisch Lichtenau #hungary

Gábor Hirsch <hirsch@...>
 

May be you can find the information you are looking for on the homepage
of the camp http://www.buchenwald.de/, there is also the informations
paper edited by the Jewish community Budapest in 1945 about the
displaced persons waiting for repatriation in different camps "Hirek az
Elhurcoltakrol" it is available in the Hungarian Archive in Budapest, I
ordered in 2002 a microfilm copy and got it for an affordable price. I
informed H-SIG in December 2002 about the content of the different
issues, my interest was Nr. 3. about the camp Sluzk in USSR where I
spent some month in 1945. Some of the issues are waiting for
transcription as on 7/7/2004 Joyce Field >from Jewishgen informed us, she
was looking for proofreaders.

Here is again the list of the 5 issues published of the paper "Hirek
az Elhurcoltakrol" (News >from the dragged away persons) May be in one of
the issues you can find the information you are looking for, the paper
lists the survivors.

The first issue (5. July 1945, 16 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps: Homberg, Kammer- Schaerfling, Lipcse, Frielendorf, Ebensee,
Hillersleben, Aurolzmuenster, Buchenwald, Sachsenhausen, Sondheim,
Unter-Themenau, Goerlitz, Wells, Troebitz (>from Bergen-Belsen)

The second issue (17. July 1945, 24 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps who remained in Theresienstadt, Deportees in holyday resort
Sweden, Bergen, Salzwedel, Celle, Ziegenhein.

The third issue (14. August 1945, 24 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps Bergen-Belsen, Dornach, Feldafing, Garmisch-Partenkirchen,
Mannheim, Szluck (Belorussia, this last list is transcibed), in this
list there are 8 person born in the 187x-ies, 21 children born after
1940, one girl, Bein Angela born 1944 in Birkenau, and a boy Papp Dezsoe
born 1945 in Zielenrig.

The fourth issue (2. September 1945, 16 pages) listed the inmates of the
camps POW-s and deportees in Siberia, Ural, Germany and Austria; Azbeszt
(Siberia), Nizsgij-Tagil (Nr. 153/1 camp), Morschanszk (SU, 64) Molotow
(Borowszk), 107/15 forced labor unit >from Heves Bok (Nr.103 camp),
Minszk forced lagborer, Deportees in hospital Wels, Landsbergen (West
from Munich), Neustift (near Innsbruck), Tuerkheim (SW >from Augsburg),
St. Ottilien, Rheinsholdhain (bei Glachau, women), Targam Allensburg
(near Leipzig), Penzing West >from Munich), Feldafing (South >from
Munich), Dachau, Dilich (bei Kassel), Wells

The fifth issue (20. October 1945, 24 pages) listed the inmates POW-s
and deportees in different places in Soviet Union, French, Switzerland,
Nizsnij Tagil (253/6 camp), Rusztava (bei Tiflisz 181-3) 109/7 forced
labor unit, Gorki (117/1 camp), Persons cared by the American Mission in
Italy, Persons cared by the UNRRA in Italy, deportees in Sweden
searching family members in Hungary, >from Bergen-Belsen to Sweden, Ravel
Wallerberg Organisation's (Stockholm) message, list of German
communities where deportees live or lived, Osby, Sigtuna, different
camps in SU, deportees in Paris, Fuessin, hospital Seehaupt,hospital
Geretsried, Oberfaehring, Hannover and vicinity, Bruzlav,
Rheinfeld-Salina (Switzerland), Luebeck.

Your fear of the Hungarian readers is unfounded, I accompanied a group
of HaShomer >from Switzerland to Hungary (60 year commemoration) and
Poland (Krakow, Auschwitz, Warsaw, Treblinka), the Hungarian, Swiss,
Austrian were with an Israeli guide, in my impression the young people
spoke better English as our guide. The Internet users of all countries
are forced to some English.

Best regards
Gabor Hirsch

bodziony@... schrieb:
> Dear Genners,
>
> Hessisch Lichtenau was a camp which belonged to the concentration
> camp of Buchenwald. Does anyone know where I can search for victims
> and survivors of that camp in Hessisch Lichtenau?
>
> I would like to write the same text in Hungarian too, because some
> Hungarian readers in this mailinglist might have limited knowledge of
> English:
>
> Hessisch Lichtenau tabor a Buchenwald halaltaborhoz tartozott.
> Tudja-e valaki, hol lehet a Hessisch Lichtenau tabor aldozatai es
> tulelöi utan kutatni?
>
> I thank you very much for your help.
>
> Giselle Bodziony


GRANER, SCHLESINGER, KRAMER, GOTTDIENER and others #hungary

georges <georges.graner@...>
 

Dear Genners,
Since I have not posted anything on H-Sig for a while, I thought it would
be a good idea to give you the list of names and places I am looking for.

GRANER (b. 1805 Rabadhidvég(Vas megye)) also Ko:rmend
SCHLESINGER (b 1802 Szered)(b.1807 Senitz(Nitra)) (b. 1832
Pezinok-Basin(Pozsony))
KRAMER (b.1833 Abaujker)(b.Monok 1864)
GOTTDIENER or GOTDINER (Tiszalo:k, Tiszalucz, Kis Toronya)
FISCHEL (Paks (Tolna))
SAUBERMANN
KRAUSZ (1808 Gyo:nk (Tolna))
GROSZ (Tiszalucz (Zemplen))
BLACK (Tiszalucz (Zemplen))
Does this ring a bell ?

Best wishes

Georges GRANER
georges.graner@...


Hungary SIG #Hungary GRANER, SCHLESINGER, KRAMER, GOTTDIENER and others #hungary

georges <georges.graner@...>
 

Dear Genners,
Since I have not posted anything on H-Sig for a while, I thought it would
be a good idea to give you the list of names and places I am looking for.

GRANER (b. 1805 Rabadhidvég(Vas megye)) also Ko:rmend
SCHLESINGER (b 1802 Szered)(b.1807 Senitz(Nitra)) (b. 1832
Pezinok-Basin(Pozsony))
KRAMER (b.1833 Abaujker)(b.Monok 1864)
GOTTDIENER or GOTDINER (Tiszalo:k, Tiszalucz, Kis Toronya)
FISCHEL (Paks (Tolna))
SAUBERMANN
KRAUSZ (1808 Gyo:nk (Tolna))
GROSZ (Tiszalucz (Zemplen))
BLACK (Tiszalucz (Zemplen))
Does this ring a bell ?

Best wishes

Georges GRANER
georges.graner@...


Re: A name in Cyrillic: PACHOW?? #general

Stan Goodman <SPAM_FOILER@...>
 

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 15:16:30 UTC, John@... (Marx, Jonathan
Schreiner) opined:
X-No-archive: yes
Hello, the name is Jacobya -- in other words Jacob or Jacobs. My
grandfrather's name was Jacob so I'm used to seeing it spelled. The "Ya"
letter can sometimes look like a "P"
The final letter of the word, which you have interpreted as a "ya", is in
fact a "tverdiy znak" (hard sign), which was obligatory in the
pre-revolutionary orthography.

The letter before the tverdiy znak is a "V" sound; the Russian name should
end in "B".

I cannot see how the initial letter of the name can be interpreted as
anything but a "P", although anything is possible. For comparison, see the
word "zayavlenie" (announcement) in the middle of line twelve of the image,
in which the "ya" is well formed and unmistakable; one would expect that the
initial "Ya" of the name would resemble it in some way, which it does not --
it seems to be a very clear "P". As I said in my previous note in this
thread, this is definitely one of the more legible Akts, leaving little room
for creative reading of obscure characters.

I agree that "Pachow" is not a name, at least one known to me. But I would
suggest looking for supporting evidence that a Yakob is hiding behind it
before jumping to that conclusion.

--
Stan Goodman, Qiryat Tiv'on, Israel

Searching:
NEACHOWICZ/NOACHOWICZ, NEJMAN/NAJMAN, SURALSKI: >from Lomza Gubernia
ISMACH: >from Lomza Gubernia, Galicia, and Ukraina
HERTANU, ABRAMOVICI, LAUER: >from Dorohoi District, Romania
GRISARU, VATARU: >from Iasi, Dorohoi, and Mileanca, Romania

See my interactive family tree (requires Java 1.1.6 or better). the URL is:
http://www.hashkedim.com
For reasons connected with anti-spam/junk security, the return address is
not valid. To communicate with me, please visit my website (see the URL
above -- no Java required for this purpose) and fill in the email form
there.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: A name in Cyrillic: PACHOW?? #general

Stan Goodman <SPAM_FOILER@...>
 

On Tue, 20 Jul 2004 15:16:30 UTC, John@... (Marx, Jonathan
Schreiner) opined:
X-No-archive: yes
Hello, the name is Jacobya -- in other words Jacob or Jacobs. My
grandfrather's name was Jacob so I'm used to seeing it spelled. The "Ya"
letter can sometimes look like a "P"
The final letter of the word, which you have interpreted as a "ya", is in
fact a "tverdiy znak" (hard sign), which was obligatory in the
pre-revolutionary orthography.

The letter before the tverdiy znak is a "V" sound; the Russian name should
end in "B".

I cannot see how the initial letter of the name can be interpreted as
anything but a "P", although anything is possible. For comparison, see the
word "zayavlenie" (announcement) in the middle of line twelve of the image,
in which the "ya" is well formed and unmistakable; one would expect that the
initial "Ya" of the name would resemble it in some way, which it does not --
it seems to be a very clear "P". As I said in my previous note in this
thread, this is definitely one of the more legible Akts, leaving little room
for creative reading of obscure characters.

I agree that "Pachow" is not a name, at least one known to me. But I would
suggest looking for supporting evidence that a Yakob is hiding behind it
before jumping to that conclusion.

--
Stan Goodman, Qiryat Tiv'on, Israel

Searching:
NEACHOWICZ/NOACHOWICZ, NEJMAN/NAJMAN, SURALSKI: >from Lomza Gubernia
ISMACH: >from Lomza Gubernia, Galicia, and Ukraina
HERTANU, ABRAMOVICI, LAUER: >from Dorohoi District, Romania
GRISARU, VATARU: >from Iasi, Dorohoi, and Mileanca, Romania

See my interactive family tree (requires Java 1.1.6 or better). the URL is:
http://www.hashkedim.com
For reasons connected with anti-spam/junk security, the return address is
not valid. To communicate with me, please visit my website (see the URL
above -- no Java required for this purpose) and fill in the email form
there.