Date   

Re: Vilna Gaon #general

Adam Cherson
 

Dear Jeff,
There is currently a project at FTDNA which is looking at the deeper
'Sephardic' ancestry of 'Ashkenazim'. I do not know how your situation
may dovetail with this project but I will give you the information so
you can pursue this line of inquiry yourself: look for the R-FGC20747
Study Group on FamilyTreeDNA.com .

Cordially,

Adam Cherson

"Jeff Miller" <singingtm@...> wrote:
"In the 20 years since I purchased a copy of Chaim Freedman's 1997 book,
"Eliyahu's Branches," I have researched my first cousin's vague claim of
ourbeing related to "the most famous Rabbi in Russia," and decided the
closest identification and verification I can make is a somewhat distant
relationship through my verified connection to the BLANKFORTl family,
and specifically to the Rebecca Blankfort KRAMER family related to/descended
from Tuviah JURBARSKY.
In addition to reuniting with Blankfort relatives, finding source documents
for the family, I have recently had a Blankfort family member do autosomal
DNA testing, and her results further confirm the connection.

I am interested in a few things that readers may be able to help me with.

First, do you have any sources, or can point me toward any sources, to
update the information on these related families?

Second, a Blankfort relative who has been recently DNA tested writes, "I
remember my grandfather Barney telling us that we were direct
descendants of the Abarbanels of Spain and direct descendants of King David."
I have tried relatively unsuccessfully to find any documentary support for this
claim, and only mild DNA evidence of any Sephardic connection of members of the
family that in modern times is Ashkenazi. Any thoughts and suggestions about
that would be most welcome in my investigation of this claim.

Third, on page 289 of "Eliyahu's Branches," Yekhezkel (Charles) Kramer death
date is given as 1951. Another source by Dr. Neil Rosenstein, "The Gaon of
Vilna and His Cousinhood," also published in 1997, provides a different year
of death [1945]. I am seeking more information about this and other related
family members.

Thank you in advance for your insights and assistance.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen RE: Vilna Gaon #general

Adam Cherson
 

Dear Jeff,
There is currently a project at FTDNA which is looking at the deeper
'Sephardic' ancestry of 'Ashkenazim'. I do not know how your situation
may dovetail with this project but I will give you the information so
you can pursue this line of inquiry yourself: look for the R-FGC20747
Study Group on FamilyTreeDNA.com .

Cordially,

Adam Cherson

"Jeff Miller" <singingtm@...> wrote:
"In the 20 years since I purchased a copy of Chaim Freedman's 1997 book,
"Eliyahu's Branches," I have researched my first cousin's vague claim of
ourbeing related to "the most famous Rabbi in Russia," and decided the
closest identification and verification I can make is a somewhat distant
relationship through my verified connection to the BLANKFORTl family,
and specifically to the Rebecca Blankfort KRAMER family related to/descended
from Tuviah JURBARSKY.
In addition to reuniting with Blankfort relatives, finding source documents
for the family, I have recently had a Blankfort family member do autosomal
DNA testing, and her results further confirm the connection.

I am interested in a few things that readers may be able to help me with.

First, do you have any sources, or can point me toward any sources, to
update the information on these related families?

Second, a Blankfort relative who has been recently DNA tested writes, "I
remember my grandfather Barney telling us that we were direct
descendants of the Abarbanels of Spain and direct descendants of King David."
I have tried relatively unsuccessfully to find any documentary support for this
claim, and only mild DNA evidence of any Sephardic connection of members of the
family that in modern times is Ashkenazi. Any thoughts and suggestions about
that would be most welcome in my investigation of this claim.

Third, on page 289 of "Eliyahu's Branches," Yekhezkel (Charles) Kramer death
date is given as 1951. Another source by Dr. Neil Rosenstein, "The Gaon of
Vilna and His Cousinhood," also published in 1997, provides a different year
of death [1945]. I am seeking more information about this and other related
family members.

Thank you in advance for your insights and assistance.


Re: Entries in the new NYC (pre 1930) marriage license database, that don't have NYC marriage certificates #general

Renee Steinig
 

Mark London <mrl@...> wrote about NYC marriage license
applications now indexed on Ancestry for which there are no NYC
corresponding certificates. I've encountered another problem: missing
listings of licenses obtained in NYC. I'm quite sure of one of them
because I was the bride! The license was undoubtedly issued in the
Manhattan Marriage License Bureau in (yikes!) June 1967: I have a
paper copy of the license, obtained last year, not to mention a
50-year-old souvenir pen!

After I could not find my own license in the index, I searched for
total listings in 1967 and surrounding years. The counts: 1965 -
136,256, 1966 - 130,256, 1967 - 18,812, 1968 - 149,888, 1969 -
154,022. I think it's safe to say that most 1967 licenses are missing
from the index.
Renee

Renee Stern Steinig
Dix Hills NY USA
genmaven@...


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Entries in the new NYC (pre 1930) marriage license database, that don't have NYC marriage certificates #general

Renee Steinig
 

Mark London <mrl@...> wrote about NYC marriage license
applications now indexed on Ancestry for which there are no NYC
corresponding certificates. I've encountered another problem: missing
listings of licenses obtained in NYC. I'm quite sure of one of them
because I was the bride! The license was undoubtedly issued in the
Manhattan Marriage License Bureau in (yikes!) June 1967: I have a
paper copy of the license, obtained last year, not to mention a
50-year-old souvenir pen!

After I could not find my own license in the index, I searched for
total listings in 1967 and surrounding years. The counts: 1965 -
136,256, 1966 - 130,256, 1967 - 18,812, 1968 - 149,888, 1969 -
154,022. I think it's safe to say that most 1967 licenses are missing
from the index.
Renee

Renee Stern Steinig
Dix Hills NY USA
genmaven@...


Genealogy of my grandmother #general

QUEENMOLLY2@...
 

My grandmother was born 15 Apr 1891 possibly in Warsaw. Her name was Eve JEGUSH
or JAGUSH. One of her grandparents was Ashkenazi and one was not. Where can I look
now?

David Michael Paolucci

MODERATOR NOTE: Please remember to sign one's name to messages. Only surnames should
be set in upper case letters.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Genealogy of my grandmother #general

QUEENMOLLY2@...
 

My grandmother was born 15 Apr 1891 possibly in Warsaw. Her name was Eve JEGUSH
or JAGUSH. One of her grandparents was Ashkenazi and one was not. Where can I look
now?

David Michael Paolucci

MODERATOR NOTE: Please remember to sign one's name to messages. Only surnames should
be set in upper case letters.


PREISLER family from Rzeszow 1910 #general

Dina Hill
 

Rzeszow PSA 1910 Census includes the following for the PREISLER family:
Adolf born 1863 born in Zolynia (father)-father
Franciszka 1870 born in Rzeszow-mother

Their children:
Aleksander (M) born 1897
Anna (F) born 1898
Stanislawa (F) born 1902
Kazimierz (F) born 1904
Jozef (M) born 1908
Adam (M) born 1910

I know what happened to Adam once he moved to the USA, but I don't
know where he or his siblings or his parents went after this census in
1910. The children were all born in Rzeszow and their mother as well.

I searched for them in the USA, and I haven't found them at all.

Does anyone know where to go with this information? They didn't fall
off the face of this earth after 1910. I would so appreciate any help
any of you can give me.

Best Regards,
Dina Aptekar Hill


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen PREISLER family from Rzeszow 1910 #general

Dina Hill
 

Rzeszow PSA 1910 Census includes the following for the PREISLER family:
Adolf born 1863 born in Zolynia (father)-father
Franciszka 1870 born in Rzeszow-mother

Their children:
Aleksander (M) born 1897
Anna (F) born 1898
Stanislawa (F) born 1902
Kazimierz (F) born 1904
Jozef (M) born 1908
Adam (M) born 1910

I know what happened to Adam once he moved to the USA, but I don't
know where he or his siblings or his parents went after this census in
1910. The children were all born in Rzeszow and their mother as well.

I searched for them in the USA, and I haven't found them at all.

Does anyone know where to go with this information? They didn't fall
off the face of this earth after 1910. I would so appreciate any help
any of you can give me.

Best Regards,
Dina Aptekar Hill


Vilna Gaon #general

Jeff Miller
 

In the 20 years since I purchased a copy of Chaim Freedman's 1997 book,
"Eliyahu's Branches," I have researched my first cousin's vague claim of our
being related to "the most famous Rabbi in Russia," and decided the closest
identification and verification I can make is a somewhat distant
relationship through my verified connection to the BLANKFORTl family, and
specifically to the Rebecca Blankfort KRAMER family related to/descended
from Tuviah JURBARSKY.
In addition to reuniting with Blankfort relatives, finding source documents
for the family, I have recently had a Blankfort family member do autosomal
DNA testing, and her results further confirm the connection.

I am interested in a few things that readers may be able to help me with.

First, do you have any sources, or can point me toward any sources, to
update the information on these related families?

Second, a Blankfort relative who has been recently DNA tested writes, "I
remember my grandfather Barney telling us that we were direct descendants of
the Abarbanels of Spain and direct descendants of King David." I have tried
relatively unsuccessfully to find any documentary support for this claim,
and only mild DNA evidence of any Sephardic connection of members of the
family that in modern times is Ashkenazi. Any thoughts and suggestions about
that would be most welcome in my investigation of this claim.

Third, on page 289 of "Eliyahu's Branches," Yekhezkel (Charles) Kramer death
date is given as 1951. Another source by Dr. Neil Rosenstein, "The Gaon of
Vilna and His Cousinhood," also published in 1997, provides a different year
of death [1945]. I am seeking more information about this and other related
family members.

Thank you in advance for your insights and assistance.

Warmest regards,

Jeff Miller
Maryland, U.S.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Vilna Gaon #general

Jeff Miller
 

In the 20 years since I purchased a copy of Chaim Freedman's 1997 book,
"Eliyahu's Branches," I have researched my first cousin's vague claim of our
being related to "the most famous Rabbi in Russia," and decided the closest
identification and verification I can make is a somewhat distant
relationship through my verified connection to the BLANKFORTl family, and
specifically to the Rebecca Blankfort KRAMER family related to/descended
from Tuviah JURBARSKY.
In addition to reuniting with Blankfort relatives, finding source documents
for the family, I have recently had a Blankfort family member do autosomal
DNA testing, and her results further confirm the connection.

I am interested in a few things that readers may be able to help me with.

First, do you have any sources, or can point me toward any sources, to
update the information on these related families?

Second, a Blankfort relative who has been recently DNA tested writes, "I
remember my grandfather Barney telling us that we were direct descendants of
the Abarbanels of Spain and direct descendants of King David." I have tried
relatively unsuccessfully to find any documentary support for this claim,
and only mild DNA evidence of any Sephardic connection of members of the
family that in modern times is Ashkenazi. Any thoughts and suggestions about
that would be most welcome in my investigation of this claim.

Third, on page 289 of "Eliyahu's Branches," Yekhezkel (Charles) Kramer death
date is given as 1951. Another source by Dr. Neil Rosenstein, "The Gaon of
Vilna and His Cousinhood," also published in 1997, provides a different year
of death [1945]. I am seeking more information about this and other related
family members.

Thank you in advance for your insights and assistance.

Warmest regards,

Jeff Miller
Maryland, U.S.


ViewMate Yiddish translation #hungary

Stuart Ungar
 

I've posted a letter in Yiddish for which I need a translation. It is on =
ViewMate at the following address ...
http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=3DVM55157
Please respond via the form provided in the ViewMate application.
Thank you very much!
Stuart UNGAR

Moderator: Please use Viewmate to respond or contact Stuart off-list.


Hungary SIG #Hungary ViewMate Yiddish translation #hungary

Stuart Ungar
 

I've posted a letter in Yiddish for which I need a translation. It is on =
ViewMate at the following address ...
http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=3DVM55157
Please respond via the form provided in the ViewMate application.
Thank you very much!
Stuart UNGAR

Moderator: Please use Viewmate to respond or contact Stuart off-list.


New York Jewish fraternities/orders/lodges #general

Jeff Miller
 

A cousin reports that he has a walking stick that was given to an ancestor
named Mordecai Dov Ber Kramer, Charles (Ezekiel) Kramer's father, that bears
the inscription "MB Kramer." It was presented on April 6 1914 by "The NY
Lodge, No. 16, OBA" - Does anyone recognize this abbreviation or know about
the presenting organization; possibilities might be the "Grand Lodge Order
sand Brith Abraham"

Was this a Masonic Order? Was that spelling correct? Or was it "Grand Lodge
Orders and Brith Abraham" [OBA could be Order of Brith Abraham?] That sounds
very Jewish - could it be interpreted as Order of Covenant of Abraham? Could
it be a Jewish fraternal order? Was B'nai Brith connected to Masonic orders?

I'd be interested in resources related to New York Jewish
fraternities/orders/lodges.

Thank you,
Jeff Miller
Maryland


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen New York Jewish fraternities/orders/lodges #general

Jeff Miller
 

A cousin reports that he has a walking stick that was given to an ancestor
named Mordecai Dov Ber Kramer, Charles (Ezekiel) Kramer's father, that bears
the inscription "MB Kramer." It was presented on April 6 1914 by "The NY
Lodge, No. 16, OBA" - Does anyone recognize this abbreviation or know about
the presenting organization; possibilities might be the "Grand Lodge Order
sand Brith Abraham"

Was this a Masonic Order? Was that spelling correct? Or was it "Grand Lodge
Orders and Brith Abraham" [OBA could be Order of Brith Abraham?] That sounds
very Jewish - could it be interpreted as Order of Covenant of Abraham? Could
it be a Jewish fraternal order? Was B'nai Brith connected to Masonic orders?

I'd be interested in resources related to New York Jewish
fraternities/orders/lodges.

Thank you,
Jeff Miller
Maryland


Re: Mother and son share a tombstone--is it possible? #general

tom
 

Having more than one name on a stone, and presumably more than one person
buried in a plot, is not unheard of. There may have been financial or personal
circumstances that lead to this. (a widow might have had her own plot paid for,
but might not have had the means to buy another plot for her son, etc.)

To clarify the religious aspects, you should probably consult an orthodox rabbi.

....... tom klein, Toronto

Josephine Rosenblum <jorose@...> wrote:

In an Orthodox cemetery in Cincinnati, a mother and son share one tombstone.
The names and dates bear this out. She was born a full generation before him,
plus the names match what I know of their relationship. He (the son) was
divorced and had died one year before his mother. The woman's husband (and
his father) had died years earlier. The stone does not mention any
relationship in English.

The death dates are in the 1920s.

It does not seem logical that an Orthodox cemetery would allow this. Because
others may encounter this situation, please send replies to the group.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Mother and son share a tombstone--is it possible? #general

tom
 

Having more than one name on a stone, and presumably more than one person
buried in a plot, is not unheard of. There may have been financial or personal
circumstances that lead to this. (a widow might have had her own plot paid for,
but might not have had the means to buy another plot for her son, etc.)

To clarify the religious aspects, you should probably consult an orthodox rabbi.

....... tom klein, Toronto

Josephine Rosenblum <jorose@...> wrote:

In an Orthodox cemetery in Cincinnati, a mother and son share one tombstone.
The names and dates bear this out. She was born a full generation before him,
plus the names match what I know of their relationship. He (the son) was
divorced and had died one year before his mother. The woman's husband (and
his father) had died years earlier. The stone does not mention any
relationship in English.

The death dates are in the 1920s.

It does not seem logical that an Orthodox cemetery would allow this. Because
others may encounter this situation, please send replies to the group.


Re: Information about military governor of Germany #general

André Convers
 

Following the post of Debbie Long please note that the French Military Governor
of Saar (Germany) in 1945 was Gilbert GRANDVAL (1904-1981), he changed his
name >from HIRSCH to GRANDVAL, he was the son of Edmond HIRSCH and
Jeanne OLLENDORF and grandson of the editor Paul OLLENDORF.

Andre Convers
Riec sur Belon, France

Deborah Long <debbietheteacher@...> wrote:

Would you have any suggestions where I can find out more about what it
meant to be a post-WWII military governor of Germany? Here is the
relative who I am researching:

"FRIED, HERBERT, Chicago, 111., Capt., USA, appointed military governor
of Hanover, Germany; reptd. Apr. 27, 1945."

I would like to know Captain Fried's duties and accomplishments. He was
reported to be the first (and maybe only) Jewish military governor at
that time.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Information about military governor of Germany #general

André Convers
 

Following the post of Debbie Long please note that the French Military Governor
of Saar (Germany) in 1945 was Gilbert GRANDVAL (1904-1981), he changed his
name >from HIRSCH to GRANDVAL, he was the son of Edmond HIRSCH and
Jeanne OLLENDORF and grandson of the editor Paul OLLENDORF.

Andre Convers
Riec sur Belon, France

Deborah Long <debbietheteacher@...> wrote:

Would you have any suggestions where I can find out more about what it
meant to be a post-WWII military governor of Germany? Here is the
relative who I am researching:

"FRIED, HERBERT, Chicago, 111., Capt., USA, appointed military governor
of Hanover, Germany; reptd. Apr. 27, 1945."

I would like to know Captain Fried's duties and accomplishments. He was
reported to be the first (and maybe only) Jewish military governor at
that time.


Entries in the new NYC (pre 1930) marriage license database, that don't have NYC marriage certificates. #general

Mark London <mrl@...>
 

Hi - I was just shown new hints on ancestry.com, for NYC marriage licenses
from the new NYC database of applications (pre 1930), that were obtained by
Reclaim the Records.

I've already come across 2 cases, for which there is no NYC corresponding
certificate. I know that the marriages definitely occurred, but I don't know
where they occurred.

I decided to search for names on one page of this new database, and discovered
that there quite a number of people, who did not have NYC marriage certificates.

from what I can tell, an NYC marriage license, would allow you to be married
anywhere in the state of New York. So it's possible that these marriages didn't
actually occur in NYC. Or would there be a more likely reason why a NYC
marriage, would not have resulted in an NYC marriage certificate?

As an aside, I came across a 3rd case >from the new license database, in which
the ancestry.com NYC marriage certificate database, did not contain an entry
for the marriage certificate. But the Italian Genealogy NYC site, did have an
entry for the marriage certificate. I don't know how common that occurs, though.
FWIW!

Mark London
Natick, MA


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Entries in the new NYC (pre 1930) marriage license database, that don't have NYC marriage certificates. #general

Mark London <mrl@...>
 

Hi - I was just shown new hints on ancestry.com, for NYC marriage licenses
from the new NYC database of applications (pre 1930), that were obtained by
Reclaim the Records.

I've already come across 2 cases, for which there is no NYC corresponding
certificate. I know that the marriages definitely occurred, but I don't know
where they occurred.

I decided to search for names on one page of this new database, and discovered
that there quite a number of people, who did not have NYC marriage certificates.

from what I can tell, an NYC marriage license, would allow you to be married
anywhere in the state of New York. So it's possible that these marriages didn't
actually occur in NYC. Or would there be a more likely reason why a NYC
marriage, would not have resulted in an NYC marriage certificate?

As an aside, I came across a 3rd case >from the new license database, in which
the ancestry.com NYC marriage certificate database, did not contain an entry
for the marriage certificate. But the Italian Genealogy NYC site, did have an
entry for the marriage certificate. I don't know how common that occurs, though.
FWIW!

Mark London
Natick, MA