Date   

Gomel--POLEY Family #belarus

Carol Edan <caroled@...>
 

Shalom,

I have noticed quite a few posts about Gomel. My POLEY family roots have
some relation to Gomel.
My great-grandmother Mary MUSHNITSKY POLEY was "said" to have been born
there. Several of her children, she had 8, where also born there. It was
the family's last residence before coming to the states. Jacob POLEY
arrived in 1904, the rest of the family came later in 1906. They resided in
Boston. I remember my grandmother telling about the "progroms" and have
read about the 1903 progrom in Gomel.

Would like to know also if there are any records available.

Carol Monosson Edan

MONOSSON/POLEY/MUSHNITSKY
ARONSON/PRICE
RABINOVITZ


Belarus SIG #Belarus Gomel--POLEY Family #belarus

Carol Edan <caroled@...>
 

Shalom,

I have noticed quite a few posts about Gomel. My POLEY family roots have
some relation to Gomel.
My great-grandmother Mary MUSHNITSKY POLEY was "said" to have been born
there. Several of her children, she had 8, where also born there. It was
the family's last residence before coming to the states. Jacob POLEY
arrived in 1904, the rest of the family came later in 1906. They resided in
Boston. I remember my grandmother telling about the "progroms" and have
read about the 1903 progrom in Gomel.

Would like to know also if there are any records available.

Carol Monosson Edan

MONOSSON/POLEY/MUSHNITSKY
ARONSON/PRICE
RABINOVITZ


Re: Rabbi Kolatch's books as a source #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 99-01-07 15:47:38 EST, jonina.duker@juno.com writes:

<< After a private correspondence with the knowledgeable Michael Bernet
it appears that in at least 2 instances Mr. Bernet believes Kolatch to be
wrong (Kolatch clear that male name Yona/Jonah does mean "dove", Kolatch
clear that Jonina feminine of Yona/Jonah). >>

Two clarifications:
1. I am far >from "knowledgable." I know a few things here and there that
I know how to put together, and I know how to make myself seem convincing.
Heck, I got started in genealogy just six months ago!

2. "Question authority" is a Jewish principle (just watch Abraham and
Moses arguing with God--and winning!). Ninety percent of the Jewish codes
in the last 1800 years are reports of the most learned and most respected
of our rabbis arguing about and differing on a fact, a principle or an
interpretation.

I was not there when the prophet got the name Yonah >from his father or his
mother. Neither, to the best of my knoeledge, was Kolatch <g>. I do not
doubt that there are midrashic interpretations for the name Yona. I
wouldn't be surprised if some of them gave explanations why he should be
called after a bird. I'm pretty sure that for every two who said "dove"
one at least said "no way."

But it doesn't even matter why the prophet Yonah was called Yonah. I was
called Me'ir because my gf was called Me'ir, and he was called after an
ancestor. We'd have to go back 2000 years or so to discover why the first
Me'ir was called "the illuminator" by his parents.

Ury >from Holland suggests that the name Taube or Taibele is probably a
corruption of the Hebrew Tov/Tovah ("good"). (I go along with Ury on this.
Another Yiddish form of good is Gittel). Taube (in the sense of dove) became
Yonah (f) which happens to be spelled exactly like the prophet. But the
Man's name Yonah and the woman's name Yonah are not derived the same
way--whatever Kolatch or any great scholar might say.

As for Yoninah >from Yonah. I am sure there have been parents who said,
"let's call her after gramma Taibele-Yoyne" (or after grandad Yonah
Wallfisch) and decided they neede to fancy it up a little (perhaps so she
wouldn't be thought a tomboy) and decided on Yonina. They have some
justification. Yon is the masculine form for dove (probably 99% of
Israelis are ignorant of that). A diminuitive in Hebrew can be created by
doubling the last letter, so Yonin would be a little male dove, add ah,
and you get the feminine Yoninah. But I think that this is a very recent
creation.

The oldest of the three daughters of Job after his fortune was restored
("and there were no women more beautiful in all the land") was called
Yemima (whence Jemimah for pancakes). In Aramaic, that would probably
be rendered Yonina. So, if there is a history to the name Yonina, it's
probably the Aramaic name for one of Job's three beautiful daughter.


Or, as the Bard told us, a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

Michael Bernet, New York
seeking:

BERNET, BERNAT, BAERNET, BERNERTH etc >from Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg
KONIGSHOFER: Welbhausen, Konigshofen, Furth; PODERATZKI: Paris, Nurnberg.
ALTMANN: Kattowitz, Breslau, Poznan, Beuthen--Upper Silesia/Poland
WOLF: Frankfurt (Aron Wolf m. Babette Goldschmidt ca 1860) also in
Wurzburg, also Sali WOLF, Rotterdam

MODERATOR NOTE: This thread is now closed.
Any further comments, please send privately.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Rabbi Kolatch's books as a source #general

MBernet@...
 

In a message dated 99-01-07 15:47:38 EST, jonina.duker@juno.com writes:

<< After a private correspondence with the knowledgeable Michael Bernet
it appears that in at least 2 instances Mr. Bernet believes Kolatch to be
wrong (Kolatch clear that male name Yona/Jonah does mean "dove", Kolatch
clear that Jonina feminine of Yona/Jonah). >>

Two clarifications:
1. I am far >from "knowledgable." I know a few things here and there that
I know how to put together, and I know how to make myself seem convincing.
Heck, I got started in genealogy just six months ago!

2. "Question authority" is a Jewish principle (just watch Abraham and
Moses arguing with God--and winning!). Ninety percent of the Jewish codes
in the last 1800 years are reports of the most learned and most respected
of our rabbis arguing about and differing on a fact, a principle or an
interpretation.

I was not there when the prophet got the name Yonah >from his father or his
mother. Neither, to the best of my knoeledge, was Kolatch <g>. I do not
doubt that there are midrashic interpretations for the name Yona. I
wouldn't be surprised if some of them gave explanations why he should be
called after a bird. I'm pretty sure that for every two who said "dove"
one at least said "no way."

But it doesn't even matter why the prophet Yonah was called Yonah. I was
called Me'ir because my gf was called Me'ir, and he was called after an
ancestor. We'd have to go back 2000 years or so to discover why the first
Me'ir was called "the illuminator" by his parents.

Ury >from Holland suggests that the name Taube or Taibele is probably a
corruption of the Hebrew Tov/Tovah ("good"). (I go along with Ury on this.
Another Yiddish form of good is Gittel). Taube (in the sense of dove) became
Yonah (f) which happens to be spelled exactly like the prophet. But the
Man's name Yonah and the woman's name Yonah are not derived the same
way--whatever Kolatch or any great scholar might say.

As for Yoninah >from Yonah. I am sure there have been parents who said,
"let's call her after gramma Taibele-Yoyne" (or after grandad Yonah
Wallfisch) and decided they neede to fancy it up a little (perhaps so she
wouldn't be thought a tomboy) and decided on Yonina. They have some
justification. Yon is the masculine form for dove (probably 99% of
Israelis are ignorant of that). A diminuitive in Hebrew can be created by
doubling the last letter, so Yonin would be a little male dove, add ah,
and you get the feminine Yoninah. But I think that this is a very recent
creation.

The oldest of the three daughters of Job after his fortune was restored
("and there were no women more beautiful in all the land") was called
Yemima (whence Jemimah for pancakes). In Aramaic, that would probably
be rendered Yonina. So, if there is a history to the name Yonina, it's
probably the Aramaic name for one of Job's three beautiful daughter.


Or, as the Bard told us, a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

Michael Bernet, New York
seeking:

BERNET, BERNAT, BAERNET, BERNERTH etc >from Frensdorf, Bamberg, Nurnberg
KONIGSHOFER: Welbhausen, Konigshofen, Furth; PODERATZKI: Paris, Nurnberg.
ALTMANN: Kattowitz, Breslau, Poznan, Beuthen--Upper Silesia/Poland
WOLF: Frankfurt (Aron Wolf m. Babette Goldschmidt ca 1860) also in
Wurzburg, also Sali WOLF, Rotterdam

MODERATOR NOTE: This thread is now closed.
Any further comments, please send privately.


Re: Kobrin 1904 #belarus

Jacqueline A. Jones <jones@...>
 

My grandfather left Russia in 1905, for the same reason (conscription would
have been for 25 years!). As for why your grandfather wasn't conscripted, I
suspect they just didn't get to everybody, not having today's outstanding
communications.
-jackie

Jacqueline A. Jones
<jones@sci.brooklyn.cuny.edu>

Philip Mintz wrote:

Hi Everyone: I hope that someone can help me with an oral family tale. My
cousin states that my gg-father emigrated >from Kobrin about 1904 because it
changed >from Poland to Russia at that time, and Russia was conscripting for
the Russo-Japanese war. However, my grandfather was about 21 then and
emigrated (with a wife and 2 children) nine years later. The question -
wouldn't my grandfather have been conscripted if the tale is true? Any
information of that place and time would be appreciated.


Belarus SIG #Belarus Re: Kobrin 1904 #belarus

Jacqueline A. Jones <jones@...>
 

My grandfather left Russia in 1905, for the same reason (conscription would
have been for 25 years!). As for why your grandfather wasn't conscripted, I
suspect they just didn't get to everybody, not having today's outstanding
communications.
-jackie

Jacqueline A. Jones
<jones@sci.brooklyn.cuny.edu>

Philip Mintz wrote:

Hi Everyone: I hope that someone can help me with an oral family tale. My
cousin states that my gg-father emigrated >from Kobrin about 1904 because it
changed >from Poland to Russia at that time, and Russia was conscripting for
the Russo-Japanese war. However, my grandfather was about 21 then and
emigrated (with a wife and 2 children) nine years later. The question -
wouldn't my grandfather have been conscripted if the tale is true? Any
information of that place and time would be appreciated.


Re: BIELSKY Partisans #belarus

SKerlin882@...
 

goldblat@primenet.com writes:
this reminded me of the history of this band called "defiance" by nehama tec.
Dear Dr. Goldblat,

I enjoyed your review of Tec's book. The author has written other works
including an "autobiography"about her own life including living as a
converted Christian. ("sounds like our Secretary of State Madeline Albright").

What moved me about the book is that these stories are finally coming out
to the general public so that we can learn the truth. Her book is well
documented with extensive footnotes.

There are so many other remarkable stories which people including my own
older relatives have refused to believe. For example, my own cousin lived
in the fields outside of Pinsk. One of the relatives of the President
Weizman's family (the Chemerinski's) lived in the forest in Belarus as
well. When the war with Germans ended, he came out of the woods only to
be killed by the local populace.

I have attempted to contact Professor Tec to present her with some of these
stories but did not have any response. In addition, I have presented some
of the materials that I have on my own family to the Clark University
Holocaust
Center.

Stephen Kerlin,AICP

MODERATOR'S NOTE: Stephen, if the contents of materials that you presented
to Clark University might be of general interest to members of the Belarus
SIG, I hope you will make an effort to provide this data to the SIG
webmaster and/or the SIG newsletter editor.


Belarus SIG #Belarus Re: BIELSKY Partisans #belarus

SKerlin882@...
 

goldblat@primenet.com writes:
this reminded me of the history of this band called "defiance" by nehama tec.
Dear Dr. Goldblat,

I enjoyed your review of Tec's book. The author has written other works
including an "autobiography"about her own life including living as a
converted Christian. ("sounds like our Secretary of State Madeline Albright").

What moved me about the book is that these stories are finally coming out
to the general public so that we can learn the truth. Her book is well
documented with extensive footnotes.

There are so many other remarkable stories which people including my own
older relatives have refused to believe. For example, my own cousin lived
in the fields outside of Pinsk. One of the relatives of the President
Weizman's family (the Chemerinski's) lived in the forest in Belarus as
well. When the war with Germans ended, he came out of the woods only to
be killed by the local populace.

I have attempted to contact Professor Tec to present her with some of these
stories but did not have any response. In addition, I have presented some
of the materials that I have on my own family to the Clark University
Holocaust
Center.

Stephen Kerlin,AICP

MODERATOR'S NOTE: Stephen, if the contents of materials that you presented
to Clark University might be of general interest to members of the Belarus
SIG, I hope you will make an effort to provide this data to the SIG
webmaster and/or the SIG newsletter editor.


Calendar Programs #general

Chuck Weinstein <cweinstein@...>
 

Calendar Creator, which was distributed by Creative Office, which has
since been swallowed up by another software company, has the ability to
print Jewish calendar dates and has the Jewish holidays already included
in its databases. It is available at most computer stores. I have no
financial interest in this product, just a satisfied consumer.
It has no Hebrew fonts, so it can't print in Hebrew. There is a new
version of Jewish Calendar (www.calendar-maven.com/index.htm) that will
print and store anniversaries on both Jewish and English dates. Both of
these products are for Windows 95 or 98.

Chuck Weinstein in San Mateo, CA
cweinstein@jewishgen.org


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Calendar Programs #general

Chuck Weinstein <cweinstein@...>
 

Calendar Creator, which was distributed by Creative Office, which has
since been swallowed up by another software company, has the ability to
print Jewish calendar dates and has the Jewish holidays already included
in its databases. It is available at most computer stores. I have no
financial interest in this product, just a satisfied consumer.
It has no Hebrew fonts, so it can't print in Hebrew. There is a new
version of Jewish Calendar (www.calendar-maven.com/index.htm) that will
print and store anniversaries on both Jewish and English dates. Both of
these products are for Windows 95 or 98.

Chuck Weinstein in San Mateo, CA
cweinstein@jewishgen.org


Re: printing ornamental family tree #general

WROZI <wrozi@...>
 

You can have Kinko's do the calendar printing. The results are
outstanding.

Roslyn Goldman Downey
Winter Park, FL


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: printing ornamental family tree #general

WROZI <wrozi@...>
 

You can have Kinko's do the calendar printing. The results are
outstanding.

Roslyn Goldman Downey
Winter Park, FL


genealogy software for linux (or windows) #general

Hans Warnar <jaw.warnar@...>
 

Hi there,

Today I discovered a genealogy-program designed for Linux (and for
Windows9x. Dutch version is coming (for free!!).

See for yourself:

Website:
http://pauillac.inria.fr/~ddr/GeneWeb/index-en.htm


Download:
ftp://ftp.inria.fr/INRIA/Projects/cristal/Daniel.de_Rauglaudre/GeneWeb/Linux
/
ftp://ftp.inria.fr/INRIA/Projects/cristal/Daniel.de_Rauglaudre/GeneWeb/Windo
ws/

Have fun,

Hans Warnar,
Helmond, the Netherlands


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen genealogy software for linux (or windows) #general

Hans Warnar <jaw.warnar@...>
 

Hi there,

Today I discovered a genealogy-program designed for Linux (and for
Windows9x. Dutch version is coming (for free!!).

See for yourself:

Website:
http://pauillac.inria.fr/~ddr/GeneWeb/index-en.htm


Download:
ftp://ftp.inria.fr/INRIA/Projects/cristal/Daniel.de_Rauglaudre/GeneWeb/Linux
/
ftp://ftp.inria.fr/INRIA/Projects/cristal/Daniel.de_Rauglaudre/GeneWeb/Windo
ws/

Have fun,

Hans Warnar,
Helmond, the Netherlands


Re: Ira ZINMAN #general

NFatouros@...
 

Dear People,

In her message #48, 1/5/99, Jonina Duker inquired about an Ira Zinman,
of "Illinois or Indiana," with whom she had lost contact.

As I later told to her, I immediately recognized the name as belonging
to a lawyer living in my town, who specializes in immigration law, and
who helped my former husband with some legal problems. I could hardly
wait to call him to be sure that he was THE Ira Zinman. In fact,at 9:00
a.m., when neither he nor his secretary were yet in his office because
of all the ice and snow in our area, I called him at home! He was a
little startled but recognized who I was. I read Ms. Duker's message
to him, and he told me that it must have been at least twelve years s
ince he and Ms. Duker had corresponded or talked.

He was also interested to learn about Jewishgen, and when I copied Ms
Duker's message and sent it to him, I praised and described in great
detail all the benefits Jewishgen offers.

Although Ms. Duker had asked that responses to her message be sent
privately to her, because she did not have ready access to a computer,
this morning she gave me permission to crow about having found her Ira
Zinman. And so I am!

It is uncanny how many links are made merely by participating in this
mail group.

Naomi
Naomi Fatouros
NFatouros@aol.com
Bloomington, Indiana
99/01/07


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Ira ZINMAN #general

NFatouros@...
 

Dear People,

In her message #48, 1/5/99, Jonina Duker inquired about an Ira Zinman,
of "Illinois or Indiana," with whom she had lost contact.

As I later told to her, I immediately recognized the name as belonging
to a lawyer living in my town, who specializes in immigration law, and
who helped my former husband with some legal problems. I could hardly
wait to call him to be sure that he was THE Ira Zinman. In fact,at 9:00
a.m., when neither he nor his secretary were yet in his office because
of all the ice and snow in our area, I called him at home! He was a
little startled but recognized who I was. I read Ms. Duker's message
to him, and he told me that it must have been at least twelve years s
ince he and Ms. Duker had corresponded or talked.

He was also interested to learn about Jewishgen, and when I copied Ms
Duker's message and sent it to him, I praised and described in great
detail all the benefits Jewishgen offers.

Although Ms. Duker had asked that responses to her message be sent
privately to her, because she did not have ready access to a computer,
this morning she gave me permission to crow about having found her Ira
Zinman. And so I am!

It is uncanny how many links are made merely by participating in this
mail group.

Naomi
Naomi Fatouros
NFatouros@aol.com
Bloomington, Indiana
99/01/07


On giving out information #general

Harold Pollins <pollins@...>
 

Here is a not quite hypothetical ethical problem.

Someone has seen your name and has concluded he is related to you. He sends
you parts of his family tree as evidence. He asks for yours in return.
Should I send it?

Some of the information I have on my tree has been sent to me in good faith
by members of my extended family. Do I have the right to pass it on to
others? I could ask my family members for their permission to communicate
it to third parties; but their tree contains details >from distant relations
and they in turn ought, presumably, to be asked to give their permission.

I do not know the recent sender, the one asking for my family tree, from
Adam. I do not know what he will do with the information I send him. Will
he send it on to others? Who knows where it will end up or what use will be
made of it.

Let me extend the point. I am interested primarily in my paternal and
maternal family and their immediate connections. I have been told that an
extremely distant forbear of my late wife's - via umpteen marriages - was
an officer in the army in the mid-19th century. A Sephardi noch. That gave
me a moment's frisson of interest but it quickly passed. My own family is
very ordinary. I do not expect to find any famous people, rabbis even, in
the lineage. On the contrary; I am told our family left what is now
Belarus in order to escape the Chassidim. All I want to do is to be able
to go back a little before the 1880s. That would be satisfying enough.

Harold Pollins
Oxford England

pollins@globalnet.co.uk


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen On giving out information #general

Harold Pollins <pollins@...>
 

Here is a not quite hypothetical ethical problem.

Someone has seen your name and has concluded he is related to you. He sends
you parts of his family tree as evidence. He asks for yours in return.
Should I send it?

Some of the information I have on my tree has been sent to me in good faith
by members of my extended family. Do I have the right to pass it on to
others? I could ask my family members for their permission to communicate
it to third parties; but their tree contains details >from distant relations
and they in turn ought, presumably, to be asked to give their permission.

I do not know the recent sender, the one asking for my family tree, from
Adam. I do not know what he will do with the information I send him. Will
he send it on to others? Who knows where it will end up or what use will be
made of it.

Let me extend the point. I am interested primarily in my paternal and
maternal family and their immediate connections. I have been told that an
extremely distant forbear of my late wife's - via umpteen marriages - was
an officer in the army in the mid-19th century. A Sephardi noch. That gave
me a moment's frisson of interest but it quickly passed. My own family is
very ordinary. I do not expect to find any famous people, rabbis even, in
the lineage. On the contrary; I am told our family left what is now
Belarus in order to escape the Chassidim. All I want to do is to be able
to go back a little before the 1880s. That would be satisfying enough.

Harold Pollins
Oxford England

pollins@globalnet.co.uk


Re: Jews from Crimea #general

Guillermo Steinberg <guillo@...>
 

steven weiss wrote:

What significance is it that Russian was used and not Yiddish.
Would Jews >from a large city like Simferopol look down on Yiddish?
Did Krymchak Jews know the Yiddish language?
Thank you Steven Weiss Chicago
A relative of mine called Mauricio Charchir (Mordechai Bechar Tischajchir)
was born in Kerch, Crimea, in 1881. He narrates in his Memories the scene
in which his father stands as a candidate for emigration to Argentina in 1891, before the Jewish Colonisation Association Commitee: "There were
three people at the table. They looked surprised when daddy talked in
Russian. One of them spoke Russian. They began argueing in French. Finally
they told him: -We doubt you're a yid (Jew). They began examining us:
-What do you say when you get up in the morning?
-Mode ani lefonejo...
Then they asked him what he used to say before going to sleep. Daddy
answered. Next question:
-Tell us about Jewish feasts all through the year. Daddy answered, and then
the man said:
-=A1Debolne! (Accepted)."


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Jews from Crimea #general

Guillermo Steinberg <guillo@...>
 

steven weiss wrote:

What significance is it that Russian was used and not Yiddish.
Would Jews >from a large city like Simferopol look down on Yiddish?
Did Krymchak Jews know the Yiddish language?
Thank you Steven Weiss Chicago
A relative of mine called Mauricio Charchir (Mordechai Bechar Tischajchir)
was born in Kerch, Crimea, in 1881. He narrates in his Memories the scene
in which his father stands as a candidate for emigration to Argentina in 1891, before the Jewish Colonisation Association Commitee: "There were
three people at the table. They looked surprised when daddy talked in
Russian. One of them spoke Russian. They began argueing in French. Finally
they told him: -We doubt you're a yid (Jew). They began examining us:
-What do you say when you get up in the morning?
-Mode ani lefonejo...
Then they asked him what he used to say before going to sleep. Daddy
answered. Next question:
-Tell us about Jewish feasts all through the year. Daddy answered, and then
the man said:
-=A1Debolne! (Accepted)."