Date   

Re: Viewmate help please 1878 Galician Birth Record #galicia

Peter Jassem <pjassem@...>
 

The first one says Morocznik (surname? place name?) and the other two refer
to Bolszowce, which is a small place (now) in Ukraine. Can't figure out
anything else without the context.

Peter Jassem
Toronto

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I have posted 3 files on ViewMate which are >from a 1878 Galician birth
record. I believe they are occupations, and I believe they are in
German. I would appreciate some help deciphering and translating them.

The direct links are:

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6618
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6619
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6620

Please respond privately. Thank you for your help.

Fran
Manassas, VA
FranSegall@comcast.net
***********************************

Moderator Note: Reminder to respond privately when asked.


Gesher Galicia SIG #Galicia RE: Viewmate help please 1878 Galician Birth Record #galicia

Peter Jassem <pjassem@...>
 

The first one says Morocznik (surname? place name?) and the other two refer
to Bolszowce, which is a small place (now) in Ukraine. Can't figure out
anything else without the context.

Peter Jassem
Toronto

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I have posted 3 files on ViewMate which are >from a 1878 Galician birth
record. I believe they are occupations, and I believe they are in
German. I would appreciate some help deciphering and translating them.

The direct links are:

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6618
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6619
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6620

Please respond privately. Thank you for your help.

Fran
Manassas, VA
FranSegall@comcast.net
***********************************

Moderator Note: Reminder to respond privately when asked.


Re: Podhordisz in Galacia #galicia

Alexander Sharon
 

Dear Galitzyaners,

I'd like to clarify few things regarding the JG policy of the current
locality names in Ukraine.

First of all, allow me to explain role of the USBGN (United States Board of
the Geographical Names), since JewishGen's ShtetlSeeker for Central and
Eastern Europe database is actually the extract >from BGN database.

USBGN

The work of the BGN is carried primarily out by two of its standing
committees: the Domestic Names Committee (DNC) and the Foreign Names
Committee (FNC).

The FNC is concerned with the development of standard placename spellings
for features outside the U.S. and its territories.

The FNC relies heavily on native mapping, census reports, official
bulletins, and other foreign material to collect and standardize foreign
geographic names for use by U.S. Government agencies.

In cooperation with its British counterpart, the Permanent Committee on
Geographical Names for British Official Use, the FNC has developed systems
for the conversion of non-Roman writing systems (e.g., Greek, Cyrillic,
Arabic) to Roman script in order to convert non-Roman-script geographic
names to Roman-script forms in a consistant manner.

Members of the FNC come >from the Central Intelligence Agency, the
Departments of Defense and State, and the Library of Congress. Staff support
for the FNC is provided by the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency.

I am also aware that USBGN is cooperating with the cartographic and other
specialists >from the Taras Shevchenko and Ivan Franko Universities in Kiev
and Lviv respectively, since I have been using kind services of those
specialists in the past while working on the JGFF database update and on the
second edition of WOWW.

It is correct that word the "under" is translates into Russian and Polish as
"pod" and in Ukrainian as ''pid", and thus logically "Pidhorodyshche" should
be the correct current town name, not the Polish original or transliterated
"Podgorodyshche" and "Podhorodyszcze", and not the currently used by USBNG
Russian era "Podgorodishche".

I have also noticed another pattern in other town names in Ukraine.

For example USBGN lists current town name in Ternopil's Zolochiv (Polish:
Zloczow) district as "Podgortsy" but provides also as the alternative Polish
and Ukrainian spelling: Pidhorodtsi, Podhorce and Podgortse.

My point is that there is no other source available as the official and
reliable as BGN database. Extracted >from BGN system ShtetlSeeker database
is linked by many of Central and European genealogical sites.

It has it weaknesses indeed, I could not for example to locate number of
some smaller localities, which I have managed to locate using Mapquest. But
it is still the best available tool.

Alexander Sharon
Calgary, Alberta



"Susana Leistner Bloch" wrote

Brian Lenius is, of course, correct in the Current / Ukrainian name of
this town and the spellings in Polish and Russian.. I am grateful that he
submitted a message giving such valuable information. Had I not rushed
to respond I would have done what I always do and consulted his
"Genealogical Gazetteer of Galicia." which always sits right next to me
and, even in my travels, is my constant companion. There has never been a
time when I did not learn >from Brian Lenius.

However both Alex Sharon and I used the word "current" in reference to the
standard used by JewishGen ShtetLinks, Where Once We Walked (WOWW), etc...
This "current" name was used by us in accordance with the US Board on
Geographic Names (US BGN.). Why the Jewish Genealogy world would use the
US BGN standard in Eastern European town names is something I have always
wondered about.... but it is what it is <grin>.

The variant spellings were given because the information is useful when
researching a town in Eastern Europe. Such variants appear in several
places including Yizkor Books, Vital records, etc... and help identify a
town. I would have never identified some of my family's ancestral towns
by the way they spelled it had I not had this information.


Gesher Galicia SIG #Galicia Re: Re:Podhordisz in Galacia #galicia

Alexander Sharon
 

Dear Galitzyaners,

I'd like to clarify few things regarding the JG policy of the current
locality names in Ukraine.

First of all, allow me to explain role of the USBGN (United States Board of
the Geographical Names), since JewishGen's ShtetlSeeker for Central and
Eastern Europe database is actually the extract >from BGN database.

USBGN

The work of the BGN is carried primarily out by two of its standing
committees: the Domestic Names Committee (DNC) and the Foreign Names
Committee (FNC).

The FNC is concerned with the development of standard placename spellings
for features outside the U.S. and its territories.

The FNC relies heavily on native mapping, census reports, official
bulletins, and other foreign material to collect and standardize foreign
geographic names for use by U.S. Government agencies.

In cooperation with its British counterpart, the Permanent Committee on
Geographical Names for British Official Use, the FNC has developed systems
for the conversion of non-Roman writing systems (e.g., Greek, Cyrillic,
Arabic) to Roman script in order to convert non-Roman-script geographic
names to Roman-script forms in a consistant manner.

Members of the FNC come >from the Central Intelligence Agency, the
Departments of Defense and State, and the Library of Congress. Staff support
for the FNC is provided by the National Geospatial-Intelligence Agency.

I am also aware that USBGN is cooperating with the cartographic and other
specialists >from the Taras Shevchenko and Ivan Franko Universities in Kiev
and Lviv respectively, since I have been using kind services of those
specialists in the past while working on the JGFF database update and on the
second edition of WOWW.

It is correct that word the "under" is translates into Russian and Polish as
"pod" and in Ukrainian as ''pid", and thus logically "Pidhorodyshche" should
be the correct current town name, not the Polish original or transliterated
"Podgorodyshche" and "Podhorodyszcze", and not the currently used by USBNG
Russian era "Podgorodishche".

I have also noticed another pattern in other town names in Ukraine.

For example USBGN lists current town name in Ternopil's Zolochiv (Polish:
Zloczow) district as "Podgortsy" but provides also as the alternative Polish
and Ukrainian spelling: Pidhorodtsi, Podhorce and Podgortse.

My point is that there is no other source available as the official and
reliable as BGN database. Extracted >from BGN system ShtetlSeeker database
is linked by many of Central and European genealogical sites.

It has it weaknesses indeed, I could not for example to locate number of
some smaller localities, which I have managed to locate using Mapquest. But
it is still the best available tool.

Alexander Sharon
Calgary, Alberta



"Susana Leistner Bloch" wrote

Brian Lenius is, of course, correct in the Current / Ukrainian name of
this town and the spellings in Polish and Russian.. I am grateful that he
submitted a message giving such valuable information. Had I not rushed
to respond I would have done what I always do and consulted his
"Genealogical Gazetteer of Galicia." which always sits right next to me
and, even in my travels, is my constant companion. There has never been a
time when I did not learn >from Brian Lenius.

However both Alex Sharon and I used the word "current" in reference to the
standard used by JewishGen ShtetLinks, Where Once We Walked (WOWW), etc...
This "current" name was used by us in accordance with the US Board on
Geographic Names (US BGN.). Why the Jewish Genealogy world would use the
US BGN standard in Eastern European town names is something I have always
wondered about.... but it is what it is <grin>.

The variant spellings were given because the information is useful when
researching a town in Eastern Europe. Such variants appear in several
places including Yizkor Books, Vital records, etc... and help identify a
town. I would have never identified some of my family's ancestral towns
by the way they spelled it had I not had this information.


* Re: Hungarian Electronic Library #hungary

Tom Venetianer <tom.vene@...>
 

Dear all,

The site pointed by Gabi offers a fantastic meta-search engine which searches major Hungarian libraries databases and online bookstores. The address is:
http://mek.oszk.hu/html/konyvkereso.phtml

Although the search engine is in Hungarian, with the "dictionary" below you can find what you are looking for:

Szerzo" = author
Cim = Title
keres = search button

One database of special interest is the ODR (Orszagos Dokumentumellata Rendszer) which searches the major Hungarian libraries and returns the exact location of each volume found.

Enjoy
Tom


--------- At 09:43 -0400 24.07.2005, bookstore@agawa.com wrote/escreveu:

I was on the hunt for some Hungarian book listings and came across this website which is an interesting source of information. Some of it is translated into English:
http://mek.oszk.hu/
--
-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Tom Venetianer <mailto:tom.vene@uol.com.br>
Sao Paulo - Brazil


Hungary SIG #Hungary * Re: Hungarian Electronic Library #hungary

Tom Venetianer <tom.vene@...>
 

Dear all,

The site pointed by Gabi offers a fantastic meta-search engine which searches major Hungarian libraries databases and online bookstores. The address is:
http://mek.oszk.hu/html/konyvkereso.phtml

Although the search engine is in Hungarian, with the "dictionary" below you can find what you are looking for:

Szerzo" = author
Cim = Title
keres = search button

One database of special interest is the ODR (Orszagos Dokumentumellata Rendszer) which searches the major Hungarian libraries and returns the exact location of each volume found.

Enjoy
Tom


--------- At 09:43 -0400 24.07.2005, bookstore@agawa.com wrote/escreveu:

I was on the hunt for some Hungarian book listings and came across this website which is an interesting source of information. Some of it is translated into English:
http://mek.oszk.hu/
--
-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Tom Venetianer <mailto:tom.vene@uol.com.br>
Sao Paulo - Brazil


Given names "Szejma Zmarl" #poland

Robert Strumwasser <RobertStrumwasser@...>
 

I recently came across the name "Szejma Zmarl" in the 1939 Census of Biala
Podlaska.

After searching the Given Names DataBase (GNDB), I've concluded that "Zmarl"
is "Shmarya." Does this appear to be correct?

As for "Szejma," I'm guessing that it's "Shmuel," as the GNDB gives one
Yiddish nickname as "Shmie."

Does anyone have any different/better thoughts?

Any and all help appreciated.

Thanks,

Robert Strumwasser
Sharon, MA, USA
RobertStrumwasser@comcast.net

Researching:
any STRUMWASSER, STROMWASSER, SZTROMVASER, STRONGWATER, ETC.
in Galicia: LOBL >from Sadagora, KALTER >from near Zhelibory, Voynilov, &
Svitanok >from Taurage, Lith: GLICKMAN, COHN, HURWITZ, ROZ, SEGAL/SIEGAL,
EISENBERG >from Kamenetz Podolskij: JURIST/URIST, PETCHEKOVSKY/PATCHOFSKY,
SAPOZNIK, CZAP >from near Izyaslav: RUTFIELD (and variants - ROTFELD, ect.),
KATZ, LERNER, & KUDISH >from Rafalovka & Manevichi, Ukraine: ROSENFELD,
BRATT


JRI Poland #Poland Given names "Szejma Zmarl" #poland

Robert Strumwasser <RobertStrumwasser@...>
 

I recently came across the name "Szejma Zmarl" in the 1939 Census of Biala
Podlaska.

After searching the Given Names DataBase (GNDB), I've concluded that "Zmarl"
is "Shmarya." Does this appear to be correct?

As for "Szejma," I'm guessing that it's "Shmuel," as the GNDB gives one
Yiddish nickname as "Shmie."

Does anyone have any different/better thoughts?

Any and all help appreciated.

Thanks,

Robert Strumwasser
Sharon, MA, USA
RobertStrumwasser@comcast.net

Researching:
any STRUMWASSER, STROMWASSER, SZTROMVASER, STRONGWATER, ETC.
in Galicia: LOBL >from Sadagora, KALTER >from near Zhelibory, Voynilov, &
Svitanok >from Taurage, Lith: GLICKMAN, COHN, HURWITZ, ROZ, SEGAL/SIEGAL,
EISENBERG >from Kamenetz Podolskij: JURIST/URIST, PETCHEKOVSKY/PATCHOFSKY,
SAPOZNIK, CZAP >from near Izyaslav: RUTFIELD (and variants - ROTFELD, ect.),
KATZ, LERNER, & KUDISH >from Rafalovka & Manevichi, Ukraine: ROSENFELD,
BRATT


Help with 1939 Census of Biala Podlaska #poland

Robert Strumwasser <RobertStrumwasser@...>
 

I've been trying to use the information contained in the wonderful 1939
Census of Biala Podlaska that is now online at JRI-Poland. Unfortunately,
I've been having a bit of a problem interpreting some of the data and I was
hoping that someone here might be able to shed some light.

I'm finding a number of records that are clearly a listing for a man, yet
also have an entry under "Maidensurn."

For example, I found Menachem JAWOC, with a "maidensurn" of WAJNCWEJG. It
then goes on to give his parents' names, and his mother's surname as
SZTROMWASER.

In such a case, is the "maidensurn" column referring to his **wife's**
maiden surname??

If so, does it still keep it's "usual meaning" when it appears in a listing
for a woman? (e.g., is it then referring to *her own* maiden surname, with
the primary surname for the entry being her married surname).

Also, the website explaining the project gives the following information:
"Researchers with an interest in their families' records must identify
themselves as relatives when ordering copies of the cards >from the Ronald S.
Lauder Foundation Genealogy Project."

Is merely identifying myself as a relative sufficient? Do they require
proof of some kind? If so, what would be sufficient? In addition, what if
you can't yet prove a direct relationship to everyone whose card you want?
One of the reasons one might want a card is to prove exactly this kind of
relationship. For example, there were several SZTROMWASER families living
in Biala Podlaska; I have a hard time believing they were not all related
even if I cannot yet "prove" it.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance

Robert Strumwasser
Sharon, MA, USA
RobertStrumwasser@comcast.net

Researching:
any STRUMWASSER, STROMWASSER, SZTROMVASER, STRONGWATER, ETC.
in Galicia: LOBL >from Sadagora, KALTER >from near Zhelibory, Voynilov, &
Svitanok >from Taurage, Lith: GLICKMAN, COHN, HURWITZ, ROZ, SEGAL/SIEGAL,
EISENBERG >from Kamenetz Podolskij: JURIST/URIST, PETCHEKOVSKY/PATCHOFSKY,
SAPOZNIK, CZAP >from near Izyaslav: RUTFIELD (and variants - ROTFELD, ect.),
KATZ, LERNER, & KUDISH >from Rafalovka & Manevichi, Ukraine: ROSENFELD,
BRATT


JRI Poland #Poland Help with 1939 Census of Biala Podlaska #poland

Robert Strumwasser <RobertStrumwasser@...>
 

I've been trying to use the information contained in the wonderful 1939
Census of Biala Podlaska that is now online at JRI-Poland. Unfortunately,
I've been having a bit of a problem interpreting some of the data and I was
hoping that someone here might be able to shed some light.

I'm finding a number of records that are clearly a listing for a man, yet
also have an entry under "Maidensurn."

For example, I found Menachem JAWOC, with a "maidensurn" of WAJNCWEJG. It
then goes on to give his parents' names, and his mother's surname as
SZTROMWASER.

In such a case, is the "maidensurn" column referring to his **wife's**
maiden surname??

If so, does it still keep it's "usual meaning" when it appears in a listing
for a woman? (e.g., is it then referring to *her own* maiden surname, with
the primary surname for the entry being her married surname).

Also, the website explaining the project gives the following information:
"Researchers with an interest in their families' records must identify
themselves as relatives when ordering copies of the cards >from the Ronald S.
Lauder Foundation Genealogy Project."

Is merely identifying myself as a relative sufficient? Do they require
proof of some kind? If so, what would be sufficient? In addition, what if
you can't yet prove a direct relationship to everyone whose card you want?
One of the reasons one might want a card is to prove exactly this kind of
relationship. For example, there were several SZTROMWASER families living
in Biala Podlaska; I have a hard time believing they were not all related
even if I cannot yet "prove" it.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance

Robert Strumwasser
Sharon, MA, USA
RobertStrumwasser@comcast.net

Researching:
any STRUMWASSER, STROMWASSER, SZTROMVASER, STRONGWATER, ETC.
in Galicia: LOBL >from Sadagora, KALTER >from near Zhelibory, Voynilov, &
Svitanok >from Taurage, Lith: GLICKMAN, COHN, HURWITZ, ROZ, SEGAL/SIEGAL,
EISENBERG >from Kamenetz Podolskij: JURIST/URIST, PETCHEKOVSKY/PATCHOFSKY,
SAPOZNIK, CZAP >from near Izyaslav: RUTFIELD (and variants - ROTFELD, ect.),
KATZ, LERNER, & KUDISH >from Rafalovka & Manevichi, Ukraine: ROSENFELD,
BRATT


Ordering Copies of Records through JRI-Poland #poland

Mark Halpern
 

About one month ago, coinciding with the start of the Jewish Genealogy
Conference in Las Vegas, the Jewish Records Indexing - Poland "Search
Database" page and functionality were changed.

Although the process for ordering records did not change, an Order F-A-Q
(Frequently Asked Questions) was prepared and is available for your
reference at http://www.jri-poland.org/psa/orderfaq.htm.

If you have a question about ordering records >from the PSA indices in the
JRI-Poland database, please refer to the Order F-A-Q first.

Thank you,

Mark Halpern
JRI-Poland Order Processing Coordinator


JRI Poland #Poland Ordering Copies of Records through JRI-Poland #poland

Mark Halpern
 

About one month ago, coinciding with the start of the Jewish Genealogy
Conference in Las Vegas, the Jewish Records Indexing - Poland "Search
Database" page and functionality were changed.

Although the process for ordering records did not change, an Order F-A-Q
(Frequently Asked Questions) was prepared and is available for your
reference at http://www.jri-poland.org/psa/orderfaq.htm.

If you have a question about ordering records >from the PSA indices in the
JRI-Poland database, please refer to the Order F-A-Q first.

Thank you,

Mark Halpern
JRI-Poland Order Processing Coordinator


Re: Flour mills #ukraine

Nardo Bonomi
 

Dear researchers,

Also my ggfather had a flour mill in Ukraine before and until the World War
I.
Do someone know if (and where) there are records or publications about this
sort of small industries.
(Tax) registers of mills existed in almost all Europe.
Thank you

NardoBonomi
Greve - Firenze - Italy
email nbonomi@libero.it

Researching on
GROBMAN Ukraine
BRAVERMAN Ukraine
LUFT Galizia
GRUNBLATT anywhere

My mother and her sister left Zvenegrodka, Ukraine, sometime in 1913-14.
They left for the U.S. because the family was large, impoverished, and
opportunities seemed to be better in America.

My mother had told me that her father was a miller. He was known and liked
by the local peasants because he gave honest weight. But that's all she
told
me and I never thought to ask for more details. She is gone and of course
today I have a million questions that she is unable to answer and which
she
may not ever have been able to answer.

Perhaps someone out there can answer the following:

Why would a miller not be able to make a living for his family in preWorld
War I Ukraine? The idea of operating a flour mill conjures up visions at
least of a lower middle class existence. Was milling a marginal
occupation?
Didn't operating a mill require capital? Didn't a mill require purchase
and
repair of equipment? Was operating the mill a seasonal occupation, busy
after the harvest but otherwise idle? And did this mean only occasional
income? Was the mill operated by water power? Where would such a mill have
been located at that time? Who owned the site of the mill, the operator or
a
financier whose interest charges were high?

Can someone in Ukraine SIG answer or direct me to answers of my questions?

Please respond privately.
Noyma Appelbaum
Philadelphia, PA
noyma@bellatlantic.net


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Re: Flour mills #ukraine

Nardo Bonomi
 

Dear researchers,

Also my ggfather had a flour mill in Ukraine before and until the World War
I.
Do someone know if (and where) there are records or publications about this
sort of small industries.
(Tax) registers of mills existed in almost all Europe.
Thank you

NardoBonomi
Greve - Firenze - Italy
email nbonomi@libero.it

Researching on
GROBMAN Ukraine
BRAVERMAN Ukraine
LUFT Galizia
GRUNBLATT anywhere

My mother and her sister left Zvenegrodka, Ukraine, sometime in 1913-14.
They left for the U.S. because the family was large, impoverished, and
opportunities seemed to be better in America.

My mother had told me that her father was a miller. He was known and liked
by the local peasants because he gave honest weight. But that's all she
told
me and I never thought to ask for more details. She is gone and of course
today I have a million questions that she is unable to answer and which
she
may not ever have been able to answer.

Perhaps someone out there can answer the following:

Why would a miller not be able to make a living for his family in preWorld
War I Ukraine? The idea of operating a flour mill conjures up visions at
least of a lower middle class existence. Was milling a marginal
occupation?
Didn't operating a mill require capital? Didn't a mill require purchase
and
repair of equipment? Was operating the mill a seasonal occupation, busy
after the harvest but otherwise idle? And did this mean only occasional
income? Was the mill operated by water power? Where would such a mill have
been located at that time? Who owned the site of the mill, the operator or
a
financier whose interest charges were high?

Can someone in Ukraine SIG answer or direct me to answers of my questions?

Please respond privately.
Noyma Appelbaum
Philadelphia, PA
noyma@bellatlantic.net


Mr. Aaron Kaplan , Ohav Zedek of Bayonne,NJ #general

Yoni Shapiro <yonigen@...>
 

If you have roots in Bayonne,NJ please read on. Their were many shuls in
the city The Uptown Shul, Talmud Torah , etc.. Today there is one shul
(observant) left in the city-Ohav Zedek which just completed its 50th
year. If anyone has any connections to Bayonne the man you would like to
speak to is Mr. Aaron Kaplan . please email me for his contact info.
Yoni Shapiro
lwd, nj


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Mr. Aaron Kaplan , Ohav Zedek of Bayonne,NJ #general

Yoni Shapiro <yonigen@...>
 

If you have roots in Bayonne,NJ please read on. Their were many shuls in
the city The Uptown Shul, Talmud Torah , etc.. Today there is one shul
(observant) left in the city-Ohav Zedek which just completed its 50th
year. If anyone has any connections to Bayonne the man you would like to
speak to is Mr. Aaron Kaplan . please email me for his contact info.
Yoni Shapiro
lwd, nj


Re: ukraine digest: August 08, 2005 #ukraine

N.C. Gabriel <uy9p1@...>
 

Hi Noyma,

I don't know to what degree I can answer your
questions. One of my great grandfathers operated a
horse driven mill in Samgorodok near Vinnitsa. He was
not well off but the family was comfortable. He
specialized in buckwheat (and possibly also barley).
The horse drove the mill by treading on a treadmill
that was elevated at an angle.

There were also water driven mills which might have
been more suitable for the other grains (mostly wheat
and rye) which were turned into flower (the buckwheat
just had to be dehusked).

Zvenigorodka was a larger town and there was probably
more competition there possibly accounting for your
mother's family's impoverished status. There also may
have been more profit in processing whole buckwheat
and barley as opposed to grinding the other grains
into flour.

One thing I can tell you. Your mother and her sister
were very fortunate in leaving Ukraine as early as
they did. The Jews of Ukraine went throught absolute
hell in the years 1919 and 1920.

On March 25, 1920 my paternal grandfather's shtetel of
Tetiev (about 60 miles NW of Zvenigorodka) was burnt
to the ground and 4 to 5,000 of the 6-7,000 Jews who
lived there (including my grandfather's mother) were
murdered.

Hope this helps. Best of luck in your research.


Nathen Gabriel
North Vancouver, BC


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Re: ukraine digest: August 08, 2005 #ukraine

N.C. Gabriel <uy9p1@...>
 

Hi Noyma,

I don't know to what degree I can answer your
questions. One of my great grandfathers operated a
horse driven mill in Samgorodok near Vinnitsa. He was
not well off but the family was comfortable. He
specialized in buckwheat (and possibly also barley).
The horse drove the mill by treading on a treadmill
that was elevated at an angle.

There were also water driven mills which might have
been more suitable for the other grains (mostly wheat
and rye) which were turned into flower (the buckwheat
just had to be dehusked).

Zvenigorodka was a larger town and there was probably
more competition there possibly accounting for your
mother's family's impoverished status. There also may
have been more profit in processing whole buckwheat
and barley as opposed to grinding the other grains
into flour.

One thing I can tell you. Your mother and her sister
were very fortunate in leaving Ukraine as early as
they did. The Jews of Ukraine went throught absolute
hell in the years 1919 and 1920.

On March 25, 1920 my paternal grandfather's shtetel of
Tetiev (about 60 miles NW of Zvenigorodka) was burnt
to the ground and 4 to 5,000 of the 6-7,000 Jews who
lived there (including my grandfather's mother) were
murdered.

Hope this helps. Best of luck in your research.


Nathen Gabriel
North Vancouver, BC


Romanian translation #romania

C Gryfe <a_cgryfe@...>
 

Hello All:
Would someone please translate the Romanian inscription in the image
VM6622
which is >from the reverse of an old photo and is posted at
http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6622

Thank you.

Cyril Gryfe,
Toronto, Canada
a_cgryfe@sympatico.ca


Romania SIG #Romania Romanian translation #romania

C Gryfe <a_cgryfe@...>
 

Hello All:
Would someone please translate the Romanian inscription in the image
VM6622
which is >from the reverse of an old photo and is posted at
http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=6622

Thank you.

Cyril Gryfe,
Toronto, Canada
a_cgryfe@sympatico.ca