Date   

History of the jews in OCSA, CEGLED, ALBERTISA in Pest megye #hungary

Ilan Szekely <tcdb@...>
 

Hello H-Siggers

I am a silent watcher for along time. Now I have a question.

I found a document my father wrote about his family ancestors.
Seems that all of his family ancestors lived in Pest megye in the towns
of Cegled, Ocsa, Alberti-isa (now Albertisa)
and Duna KisVarsany. All locations are south east of Budapest.
Later the family moved to the town of Budapest.
My G-G-grandfather STEINER Zakarias was born in Ocsa ca. 1790.

My question is about the history of Jews in this area. Where can I find
information? The Internet search resulted in nothing.

Ilan Szekely
______________________________
E-mail: ilan.szekely@mac.com
______________________________

Researching - STEINER, SZEKELY, WEISZ, LAUFER, MARBERGER - all in
Hungary


Re: naming patterns #hungary

Dorothy Kohanski <dkohanski@...>
 

I don't think we can make "pattern" assumptions for assimilated Jews,
especially in the United States. My mother's branch is >from Budapest and
Vienna. I bear her first name, Adele, as my middle name. My brother,
totally unfamiliar with Jewish custom, named his son Robert after himself.
There are also a number of Jacks on my father's side in the USA, generation
after generation. My own children's names are original in the family, not
named after anyone in particular. However, MY son with five children has
returned to the naming of his children after deceased relatives, and just to
confuse the issue further, his two youngest children, by his second wife,
both bear their mother's maiden name as a middle name ! And their
daughter's first name is original in the family, but his son is named after
my late husband. So go figure! I think we can assume naming patterns
probably held in the "old country" but not necessarily in the US, and not in
Israel where the Yiddish names seem to be "out" and new Hebrew names are
"in" (both first and last).
Since I was not given a Hebrew name at birth, I adopted one for myself -
Kinnereth.
Dorothy Adele Dellar Kohanski (aka "Kinnereth")
Laguna Woods, CA


* Trip to Hungary and visiting cemeteries #hungary

Tom Venetianer <tom.vene@...>
 

Dear all,

My experience has been very similar to that mentioned by Margarita. Even in=
Neolog (reform) cemeteries, the older tombstones, dating back to the=
18th/early 19th centuries, usually carry Hebrew engravings only.

Some tips which might be helpful, mainly for those not fluent in Hebrew:

1. If you know the Hebrew names of the people whose graves you plan to=
visit, carry their list written in Hebrew.

2. If you know the date of decease, carry both the common and Hebrew dates,=
the later written in Hebrew characters.

3. Carry a Hebrew transliteration of family names.

4. Learn the basics of Hebrew - reading the letters and understanding dates.=
A handy page for that purpose: <http://www.jewishgen.org/infofiles/tombston=
es.html>. Carry a printed version with you.

The purpose of all the above is to "compare" what one sees on the tombstones=
and what one is looking for. This can be a time consuming process but it=
could result in hits.

5. In smaller cemeteries (say up to 100 graves) it is worthwhile to take=
digital photos of all graves. That allows examining them later with more=
time to find matches and identifications. Besides, a person with command of=
Hebrew could later examine those pictures.

6. Try to find the pinkas (register of deaths). Even in very small villages=
and abandoned cemeteries, sometimes the local central Jewish congregation/u=
nion/federation may have them or knows who stores them.

Good luck
Tom

At 00:00 -0600 15.03.2005, H-SIG digest wrote:
Subject: RE: Trip to Hungary
From: "Margarita Lacko" <mishpologia@uzidog.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:09:04 -0500

In Abaujszanto, my relatives (BLAU, LOW) were very religious and their
tombstones are all in Hebrew. I don't remember about the rest of the
tombstones.

In Gyongyos, although I didn't find my relatives (FISCHER, HEBER,
HANOFER/HANNOVER) some stones are in Hebrew but the names are in Latin
characters. Most of the stones were in Hungarian.
Margarita Lack=DB
--
-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Tom Venetianer <mailto:tom.vene@uol.com.br>
Sao Paulo - Brazil


Hungary SIG #Hungary History of the jews in OCSA, CEGLED, ALBERTISA in Pest megye #hungary

Ilan Szekely <tcdb@...>
 

Hello H-Siggers

I am a silent watcher for along time. Now I have a question.

I found a document my father wrote about his family ancestors.
Seems that all of his family ancestors lived in Pest megye in the towns
of Cegled, Ocsa, Alberti-isa (now Albertisa)
and Duna KisVarsany. All locations are south east of Budapest.
Later the family moved to the town of Budapest.
My G-G-grandfather STEINER Zakarias was born in Ocsa ca. 1790.

My question is about the history of Jews in this area. Where can I find
information? The Internet search resulted in nothing.

Ilan Szekely
______________________________
E-mail: ilan.szekely@mac.com
______________________________

Researching - STEINER, SZEKELY, WEISZ, LAUFER, MARBERGER - all in
Hungary


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: naming patterns #hungary

Dorothy Kohanski <dkohanski@...>
 

I don't think we can make "pattern" assumptions for assimilated Jews,
especially in the United States. My mother's branch is >from Budapest and
Vienna. I bear her first name, Adele, as my middle name. My brother,
totally unfamiliar with Jewish custom, named his son Robert after himself.
There are also a number of Jacks on my father's side in the USA, generation
after generation. My own children's names are original in the family, not
named after anyone in particular. However, MY son with five children has
returned to the naming of his children after deceased relatives, and just to
confuse the issue further, his two youngest children, by his second wife,
both bear their mother's maiden name as a middle name ! And their
daughter's first name is original in the family, but his son is named after
my late husband. So go figure! I think we can assume naming patterns
probably held in the "old country" but not necessarily in the US, and not in
Israel where the Yiddish names seem to be "out" and new Hebrew names are
"in" (both first and last).
Since I was not given a Hebrew name at birth, I adopted one for myself -
Kinnereth.
Dorothy Adele Dellar Kohanski (aka "Kinnereth")
Laguna Woods, CA


Hungary SIG #Hungary * Trip to Hungary and visiting cemeteries #hungary

Tom Venetianer <tom.vene@...>
 

Dear all,

My experience has been very similar to that mentioned by Margarita. Even in=
Neolog (reform) cemeteries, the older tombstones, dating back to the=
18th/early 19th centuries, usually carry Hebrew engravings only.

Some tips which might be helpful, mainly for those not fluent in Hebrew:

1. If you know the Hebrew names of the people whose graves you plan to=
visit, carry their list written in Hebrew.

2. If you know the date of decease, carry both the common and Hebrew dates,=
the later written in Hebrew characters.

3. Carry a Hebrew transliteration of family names.

4. Learn the basics of Hebrew - reading the letters and understanding dates.=
A handy page for that purpose: <http://www.jewishgen.org/infofiles/tombston=
es.html>. Carry a printed version with you.

The purpose of all the above is to "compare" what one sees on the tombstones=
and what one is looking for. This can be a time consuming process but it=
could result in hits.

5. In smaller cemeteries (say up to 100 graves) it is worthwhile to take=
digital photos of all graves. That allows examining them later with more=
time to find matches and identifications. Besides, a person with command of=
Hebrew could later examine those pictures.

6. Try to find the pinkas (register of deaths). Even in very small villages=
and abandoned cemeteries, sometimes the local central Jewish congregation/u=
nion/federation may have them or knows who stores them.

Good luck
Tom

At 00:00 -0600 15.03.2005, H-SIG digest wrote:
Subject: RE: Trip to Hungary
From: "Margarita Lacko" <mishpologia@uzidog.com>
Date: Fri, 11 Mar 2005 11:09:04 -0500

In Abaujszanto, my relatives (BLAU, LOW) were very religious and their
tombstones are all in Hebrew. I don't remember about the rest of the
tombstones.

In Gyongyos, although I didn't find my relatives (FISCHER, HEBER,
HANOFER/HANNOVER) some stones are in Hebrew but the names are in Latin
characters. Most of the stones were in Hungarian.
Margarita Lack=DB
--
-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-.-
Tom Venetianer <mailto:tom.vene@uol.com.br>
Sao Paulo - Brazil


Re: Translation from Hebrew #hungary

SteinerGabi <gavor@...>
 

The grom is Aharon Shlomo, son of Shabat
The bride is Fruma, daughter of Arin or Ario
The date is 03 of Adar a 5673, wich is Feb. 10 1913
Steiner Gabi
Ramat-Gan, Israel

----- Original Message -----
From: "Fern Ward" <FRWard@direcpc.com>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 7:57 AM
Subject: [h-sig] Translation >from Hebrew


I have posted a Wedding certificae on Viewmate. (VM5650 Translation-Hebrew)
If anyone can please advise me who it was for and the date of the
marriage,
I would really appreciate it!
Thanks
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=5650
Please respond directly to
FRWard@direcpc.com
Thank you

Fern Ward
Laveen, AZ
ZELMANOVICS, KATZ

Moderator: Please respond off-list.


Detailed interactive Slovakia map site #hungary

Judith Deutsch Bennett <benne034@...>
 

A friend sent me this site for very detailed maps of Slovakia

There is also a website where you can get interactive maps and zoom in to
get streets or whole cities.
It is at :

<http://www.supernavigator.sk/navigator>;www.supernavigator.sk/navigator


NOTE: If there is anyone who wrote to me and I did not respond to I
apologize. My e-mail program crashed and a lot of messages were lost.

Judy Deutsch Bennett

DEUTSCH, FEINER, GANS,PICK: Trencsen

ROSENBLUM, GROSZMAN<GROSMAN, GALE, HOPKOVITZ, ALTMAN: Zemplen, Saris


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Translation from Hebrew #hungary

SteinerGabi <gavor@...>
 

The grom is Aharon Shlomo, son of Shabat
The bride is Fruma, daughter of Arin or Ario
The date is 03 of Adar a 5673, wich is Feb. 10 1913
Steiner Gabi
Ramat-Gan, Israel

----- Original Message -----
From: "Fern Ward" <FRWard@direcpc.com>
To: "H-SIG" <h-sig@lyris.jewishgen.org>
Sent: Monday, March 14, 2005 7:57 AM
Subject: [h-sig] Translation >from Hebrew


I have posted a Wedding certificae on Viewmate. (VM5650 Translation-Hebrew)
If anyone can please advise me who it was for and the date of the
marriage,
I would really appreciate it!
Thanks
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=5650
Please respond directly to
FRWard@direcpc.com
Thank you

Fern Ward
Laveen, AZ
ZELMANOVICS, KATZ

Moderator: Please respond off-list.


Hungary SIG #Hungary Detailed interactive Slovakia map site #hungary

Judith Deutsch Bennett <benne034@...>
 

A friend sent me this site for very detailed maps of Slovakia

There is also a website where you can get interactive maps and zoom in to
get streets or whole cities.
It is at :

<http://www.supernavigator.sk/navigator>;www.supernavigator.sk/navigator


NOTE: If there is anyone who wrote to me and I did not respond to I
apologize. My e-mail program crashed and a lot of messages were lost.

Judy Deutsch Bennett

DEUTSCH, FEINER, GANS,PICK: Trencsen

ROSENBLUM, GROSZMAN<GROSMAN, GALE, HOPKOVITZ, ALTMAN: Zemplen, Saris


Looking for Volunteers #hungary

Carol J. Robinson <caroljr@...>
 

We have received permission to transcribe Jewish births, marriages and
deaths >from the Szerencs district registers (Zemplen megye), FHL
microfilm # 642948. I anticipate receiving electronic images shortly.
I have one volunteer to work on transcribing these records, but he would
welcome others to help with the transcription work. Because the images
are electronic, this transcription work can be done at home.

I also have received photographs of the Holocaust Memorial in the
Jewish cemetery of Mezocsat, Borsod megye, Hungary. This memorial could
be transcribed directly >from the photos or I can provide electronic images.

If you would be willing to help transcribe the vital records >from the
Szerencs district registers or transcribe the names on the Mezocsat
Holocaust Memorial, please contact me directly at caroljr@alamedanet.net.

Carol Robinson
H-SIG Research Coordinator
caroljr@alamedanet.net
Alameda, CA USA


Hungary SIG #Hungary Looking for Volunteers #hungary

Carol J. Robinson <caroljr@...>
 

We have received permission to transcribe Jewish births, marriages and
deaths >from the Szerencs district registers (Zemplen megye), FHL
microfilm # 642948. I anticipate receiving electronic images shortly.
I have one volunteer to work on transcribing these records, but he would
welcome others to help with the transcription work. Because the images
are electronic, this transcription work can be done at home.

I also have received photographs of the Holocaust Memorial in the
Jewish cemetery of Mezocsat, Borsod megye, Hungary. This memorial could
be transcribed directly >from the photos or I can provide electronic images.

If you would be willing to help transcribe the vital records >from the
Szerencs district registers or transcribe the names on the Mezocsat
Holocaust Memorial, please contact me directly at caroljr@alamedanet.net.

Carol Robinson
H-SIG Research Coordinator
caroljr@alamedanet.net
Alameda, CA USA


Seeking Information on Poljana (Polyana) and Weisz (Weiss) and Alter #hungary

Ruth Busch
 

I am writing >from New Zealand and trying to trace anyone who be related =
to either Weiss (or Weisz) or Alter >from Poljana (Polyana) =
Czechoslovakia.=20
I'm also looking for anyone who might have be related to people with the =
surname Katz >from Kadjanov (6 kms. >from Munchas) in what was =
Czechoslovakia between World War I and World War II but is now in the =
Ukraine (and belonged to Hungary during WWII).=20
I'm also interested in learning about Munchas (now Munkachevo in the =
Ukraine). My parents were married by the Munchache(?) Rabbi in 1935 and =
lived there until the war. Their surname was Weiss.=20
Cheers!=20
ruth busch
ps I assume this is the right specialist group given the map changes =
involved above. Please advise.

Moderator: Yes, you have found the right SIG. H-SIG covers areas that were part of the Hungarian kingdom before the end of World War I. this includes Munkacs, which became part of the new nation of Czechoslovakia following the Treaty of Trianon and is now Mukaceve, Ukraine. Have you checked the JewishGen Family Finder and the All Hungary Database for these names?


Hungary SIG #Hungary Seeking Information on Poljana (Polyana) and Weisz (Weiss) and Alter #hungary

Ruth Busch
 

I am writing >from New Zealand and trying to trace anyone who be related =
to either Weiss (or Weisz) or Alter >from Poljana (Polyana) =
Czechoslovakia.=20
I'm also looking for anyone who might have be related to people with the =
surname Katz >from Kadjanov (6 kms. >from Munchas) in what was =
Czechoslovakia between World War I and World War II but is now in the =
Ukraine (and belonged to Hungary during WWII).=20
I'm also interested in learning about Munchas (now Munkachevo in the =
Ukraine). My parents were married by the Munchache(?) Rabbi in 1935 and =
lived there until the war. Their surname was Weiss.=20
Cheers!=20
ruth busch
ps I assume this is the right specialist group given the map changes =
involved above. Please advise.

Moderator: Yes, you have found the right SIG. H-SIG covers areas that were part of the Hungarian kingdom before the end of World War I. this includes Munkacs, which became part of the new nation of Czechoslovakia following the Treaty of Trianon and is now Mukaceve, Ukraine. Have you checked the JewishGen Family Finder and the All Hungary Database for these names?


Re: Naming patterns #hungary

George Farkas <gfarkas@...>
 

My great grandfather's sister Mari Links Kohn had two children called
Wilhelm (Wolf) Kohn, both named after the same relative. The older
one died when he was less than three months old. Four years later,
she gave another child the same name.

My step great grandmother (Fani Knopfelmacher) was given the same
Hungarian name as her mother (Fani Links Knopfelmacher) but their
Hebrew/Jewish names were different (Frummet and Fradel Sara).

george

George Farkas
Montreal




At 09/03/2005 01:24 PM, alex p miller sent the following message:

Hello, Friends,

I wonder if you have encountered unusual naming patterns in Jewish
families.(other than naming a child after a deceased ancestor)

Examples:
-Naming a child the same as a living parent
-Naming a child after a deceased sibling
-Naming two living children the same name

Best Regards,

Alex Miller, Chester CO. PA
alex.miller@ juno.com


The name "Fany" #hungary

MSankar <sankosy5@...>
 

Hello friends -

I was hoping to get a little help with a name I encountered in one of my
family branches. In the Salgotarjan (Nograd) marriage records for the early
1890's, I found the names of the parents of my GGgmr: Seidner Mor & Fany
Maria. It is also written this way for an 1869 birth record.

I know that in Hungarian the last name comes first, so the bride's father
would be "Mr. Mor SEIDNER" if he were in North America. But does the "Fany"
refer to the mother's maiden name, as in the former "Miss Maria FANY", or
are these her two given names, such as Mary Jane? Given that this woman is
only referred to in later records as SEIDNER Maria or (SEIDNER Morne - Mrs.
Mor SEIDNER), I have been presuming that FANY may have been her maiden name.

Is this a Hungarian last name? If it were a first name, it may have derived
from a form of Franceska. Either way, I don't think that this is common,
especially spelled with one "n".

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks!

M. Sankar
Ontario

Searching:

SEIDNER - Salgotarjan, Budapest
WINTER - Salgotarjan, Abauj-Szina
HOLLANDER, SPITZ, WIESNER/WIZNER - Abauj-Szina, Kosice/Kassa
GLOCKNER, BECK - Somogy, Budapest
WEINBERGER - Baja
FREUND - Paks


Hungary SIG #Hungary Re: Naming patterns #hungary

George Farkas <gfarkas@...>
 

My great grandfather's sister Mari Links Kohn had two children called
Wilhelm (Wolf) Kohn, both named after the same relative. The older
one died when he was less than three months old. Four years later,
she gave another child the same name.

My step great grandmother (Fani Knopfelmacher) was given the same
Hungarian name as her mother (Fani Links Knopfelmacher) but their
Hebrew/Jewish names were different (Frummet and Fradel Sara).

george

George Farkas
Montreal




At 09/03/2005 01:24 PM, alex p miller sent the following message:

Hello, Friends,

I wonder if you have encountered unusual naming patterns in Jewish
families.(other than naming a child after a deceased ancestor)

Examples:
-Naming a child the same as a living parent
-Naming a child after a deceased sibling
-Naming two living children the same name

Best Regards,

Alex Miller, Chester CO. PA
alex.miller@ juno.com


Hungary SIG #Hungary The name "Fany" #hungary

MSankar <sankosy5@...>
 

Hello friends -

I was hoping to get a little help with a name I encountered in one of my
family branches. In the Salgotarjan (Nograd) marriage records for the early
1890's, I found the names of the parents of my GGgmr: Seidner Mor & Fany
Maria. It is also written this way for an 1869 birth record.

I know that in Hungarian the last name comes first, so the bride's father
would be "Mr. Mor SEIDNER" if he were in North America. But does the "Fany"
refer to the mother's maiden name, as in the former "Miss Maria FANY", or
are these her two given names, such as Mary Jane? Given that this woman is
only referred to in later records as SEIDNER Maria or (SEIDNER Morne - Mrs.
Mor SEIDNER), I have been presuming that FANY may have been her maiden name.

Is this a Hungarian last name? If it were a first name, it may have derived
from a form of Franceska. Either way, I don't think that this is common,
especially spelled with one "n".

Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Thanks!

M. Sankar
Ontario

Searching:

SEIDNER - Salgotarjan, Budapest
WINTER - Salgotarjan, Abauj-Szina
HOLLANDER, SPITZ, WIESNER/WIZNER - Abauj-Szina, Kosice/Kassa
GLOCKNER, BECK - Somogy, Budapest
WEINBERGER - Baja
FREUND - Paks


Dave's invaluable support #belarus

IRO <iro@...>
 

Dear all,

I want to join those messages in which members of SIG Belarus expressed =
the
appreciation and gratitude to David for his invaluable support which he
rendered to people searching the roots in Belarus. I am sure that due to
Dave many of us, members of SIG Belarus, could open a lot of interesting =
and
helpful information about the ancestors. I would especially like to
emphasize that huge role which Dave has played in business of studying =
and
preservation of the Jewish heritage in Belarus. All these years the =
Jewish
community of Belarus was in close contact to this person. His merits =
before
the Jewish community are very great and are not appreciated yet up to =
the
end. I am sure that this friendship and mutual cooperation on many =
questions
connected to studying and preservation of the Jewish heritage of =
Belarus,
will proceed in the future.
With best regards,
Yuri Dorn

Head of the Board=20
of the Union of Religious Jewish Congregations of the Republic of =
Belarus

Member of the Board=20
of Jewish Religious Revival Charitable Mission=20
of the Union of Religious Jewish Congregations in the Republic of =
Belarus

Coordinator=20
of the Jewish Heritage Research Group in the Republic of Belarus

P.S.I also want to join Dave's opinion concerning researches in =
historical
archive of the city of Minsk. Unfortunately, the created situation and
conditions for researches in it do not inspire me optimism.=20


Belarus SIG #Belarus Dave's invaluable support #belarus

IRO <iro@...>
 

Dear all,

I want to join those messages in which members of SIG Belarus expressed =
the
appreciation and gratitude to David for his invaluable support which he
rendered to people searching the roots in Belarus. I am sure that due to
Dave many of us, members of SIG Belarus, could open a lot of interesting =
and
helpful information about the ancestors. I would especially like to
emphasize that huge role which Dave has played in business of studying =
and
preservation of the Jewish heritage in Belarus. All these years the =
Jewish
community of Belarus was in close contact to this person. His merits =
before
the Jewish community are very great and are not appreciated yet up to =
the
end. I am sure that this friendship and mutual cooperation on many =
questions
connected to studying and preservation of the Jewish heritage of =
Belarus,
will proceed in the future.
With best regards,
Yuri Dorn

Head of the Board=20
of the Union of Religious Jewish Congregations of the Republic of =
Belarus

Member of the Board=20
of Jewish Religious Revival Charitable Mission=20
of the Union of Religious Jewish Congregations in the Republic of =
Belarus

Coordinator=20
of the Jewish Heritage Research Group in the Republic of Belarus

P.S.I also want to join Dave's opinion concerning researches in =
historical
archive of the city of Minsk. Unfortunately, the created situation and
conditions for researches in it do not inspire me optimism.=20