Date   

Imigrants Who Returned to Poland #general

LOUISE HAJDENBERG
 

Family lore has it that one relative, around 1900, went back to Poland
because America was a "traife" country. I hope I am spelling that
correctly. Another relative >from Poland, who hated living on the Lower
East Side, around 1900, saved her change, packed her bags and bought a
ticket back to Poland. She changed her mind at the last minute.
Louise Hajdenberg
New York NY

BRILLIANT,MAUMERSTEIN/MARMELSTEIN,GOLTZMAN/HOLTZMAN Zaslov Ukraine;FROMAN/FRUMIN
Sochowce Ukraine;YOUNG/JUNG/YUNG Zaslov Ukraine, Lyakhovichi ( Lachowitz)
Belarus,St. Louis, NewYork; BERLANDShepetovkaUkraine;FRIEDMAN, Rzeszow Poland
NOTENBERG/NOTTENBERG/NATHANBERG/NATHAN, TOBIAS Talsi Latvia;RAWITZ, Ropczyce
Poland ROSENBLATT,Bila Tserkva,Tetiev Ukraine; Sadagora,Czernowitz Poland
FEIGENBAUM, Debica, Ropczyce,Rzeszow, Swoszowa( Svasov) bez.Yaslo, Riglitz,


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Imigrants Who Returned to Poland #general

LOUISE HAJDENBERG
 

Family lore has it that one relative, around 1900, went back to Poland
because America was a "traife" country. I hope I am spelling that
correctly. Another relative >from Poland, who hated living on the Lower
East Side, around 1900, saved her change, packed her bags and bought a
ticket back to Poland. She changed her mind at the last minute.
Louise Hajdenberg
New York NY

BRILLIANT,MAUMERSTEIN/MARMELSTEIN,GOLTZMAN/HOLTZMAN Zaslov Ukraine;FROMAN/FRUMIN
Sochowce Ukraine;YOUNG/JUNG/YUNG Zaslov Ukraine, Lyakhovichi ( Lachowitz)
Belarus,St. Louis, NewYork; BERLANDShepetovkaUkraine;FRIEDMAN, Rzeszow Poland
NOTENBERG/NOTTENBERG/NATHANBERG/NATHAN, TOBIAS Talsi Latvia;RAWITZ, Ropczyce
Poland ROSENBLATT,Bila Tserkva,Tetiev Ukraine; Sadagora,Czernowitz Poland
FEIGENBAUM, Debica, Ropczyce,Rzeszow, Swoszowa( Svasov) bez.Yaslo, Riglitz,


Seeking misplaced STIEFEL family researcher #germany

erstiefel@...
 

While we were vacationing on the sunny island of Maui we received a message
on our laptop, inquiring about a STIEFEL.

Unfortunately, in transferring the message to our computer it got lost. I
would appreciate it if the person who wrote us us contact us again at
erstiefel@msn.com Thank you !

ERNEST R. STIEFEL, Seattle, Washington erstiefel@msn.com


Immigrants from Poland who returned #general

Neiel and Joan Baronberg <njbaron@...>
 

One more reason an immigrant to the U.S. returned to Poland:
Nathan Okon, a landsman of my grandparents, went back to Galicia (then
Poland) in the 1930s. He visited his hometown of Suchostaw and his wife's
nearby hometown. Happily for us, he filmed his trip, starting with the
crossAtlantic voyage and including much footage of the town and people of
the two shtetls. He left an incredibly valuable film for all of us. The film
was found by a cousin of mine and transferred to VHS and then donated to the
Museum in NYC.

The original question mentioned a photo taken in 1920. Going back to Poland
after WWI, when conditions there were so miserable, raises questions that no
one has addressed specifically so far.

Joan Baronberg, Denver, CO
FRIEDMAN, MESTER, WEISSER
Suchostaw, Slobodka bei Strusow, Ukraine


Going back to the old country #general

Arthur N. Feinberg <feinber2@...>
 

Just to weigh in on relatives going back to the old country to get married.
I had one who came to NY around 1868 as a small kid. I could find nothing
more on her until I saw her name on JRI Poland, marriages 1887 from
Suwalki, where I knew they lived. I assumed that she went back to get
herself a husband.

However, the right answer came up with better research. Turned out that the
person on the JRI Poland database was her first cousin, both of them named
after their maternal grandmother. As often happens, both cousins, girls,
had the same last name because their mothers married guys >from the same
family, not an uncommon occurrence in the days of matchmaking.

Arthur N. Feinberg
feinber2@ix.netcom.com


Russian Translation Help needed #ukraine

Sarah LM Christiansen <SarahLMC@...>
 

Dear Genners,

I have posted two files on viewmate for help translating >from Russian.
The first one has the names of three relatives of my grandmother (I
think) >from Kolonie L'vovo in the Ukraine. The second one is a Russian
document >from Poland (I will also be posting this message on the Warsaw
digest. I would appreciate any help that I can get.
Thank you very much.
Please reply privately.


http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=5731
http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=5732

Sarah L. M. Christiansen


German SIG #Germany Seeking misplaced STIEFEL family researcher #germany

erstiefel@...
 

While we were vacationing on the sunny island of Maui we received a message
on our laptop, inquiring about a STIEFEL.

Unfortunately, in transferring the message to our computer it got lost. I
would appreciate it if the person who wrote us us contact us again at
erstiefel@msn.com Thank you !

ERNEST R. STIEFEL, Seattle, Washington erstiefel@msn.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Immigrants from Poland who returned #general

Neiel and Joan Baronberg <njbaron@...>
 

One more reason an immigrant to the U.S. returned to Poland:
Nathan Okon, a landsman of my grandparents, went back to Galicia (then
Poland) in the 1930s. He visited his hometown of Suchostaw and his wife's
nearby hometown. Happily for us, he filmed his trip, starting with the
crossAtlantic voyage and including much footage of the town and people of
the two shtetls. He left an incredibly valuable film for all of us. The film
was found by a cousin of mine and transferred to VHS and then donated to the
Museum in NYC.

The original question mentioned a photo taken in 1920. Going back to Poland
after WWI, when conditions there were so miserable, raises questions that no
one has addressed specifically so far.

Joan Baronberg, Denver, CO
FRIEDMAN, MESTER, WEISSER
Suchostaw, Slobodka bei Strusow, Ukraine


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Going back to the old country #general

Arthur N. Feinberg <feinber2@...>
 

Just to weigh in on relatives going back to the old country to get married.
I had one who came to NY around 1868 as a small kid. I could find nothing
more on her until I saw her name on JRI Poland, marriages 1887 from
Suwalki, where I knew they lived. I assumed that she went back to get
herself a husband.

However, the right answer came up with better research. Turned out that the
person on the JRI Poland database was her first cousin, both of them named
after their maternal grandmother. As often happens, both cousins, girls,
had the same last name because their mothers married guys >from the same
family, not an uncommon occurrence in the days of matchmaking.

Arthur N. Feinberg
feinber2@ix.netcom.com


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Russian Translation Help needed #ukraine

Sarah LM Christiansen <SarahLMC@...>
 

Dear Genners,

I have posted two files on viewmate for help translating >from Russian.
The first one has the names of three relatives of my grandmother (I
think) >from Kolonie L'vovo in the Ukraine. The second one is a Russian
document >from Poland (I will also be posting this message on the Warsaw
digest. I would appreciate any help that I can get.
Thank you very much.
Please reply privately.


http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=5731
http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=5732

Sarah L. M. Christiansen


Re: Immigrants from Poland Returning #general

Daniel Mendelsohn <damendel@...>
 

The question of immigrants who returned goes beyond people who went
back to the 'old country' either to find spouses or even simply to
visit their "old country." We take it so wholly for granted that the
move to America (or wherever) was such an improvement over the life in
the old country that we forget the subtle reality of the situation. (A
visit to the sites of the old shtetls can often correct this.) After
the death of my great-grandfather in 1912, his eldest son, aged 18, (my
grandfather's older brother) sailed >from his town of Bolechow (near
Lwow) to New York to begin the process of resettling the family in New
York; a year later, instead of sending for the rest of his family, he
sailed back to Poland. Why? He absolutely hated New York. It's
important to remember that many of these immigrants were, essentially,
country folk, and despite the various disadvantages of shtetl life,
these Jews lived in what we, today, would consider charming small
villages in terrifically picturesque locales--in this case, the
beautiful hills and forests and streams of the western Ukraine, leading
up to the Carpathian foothills, and area even today still dotted with
the many resort spas, with their 'healthful waters,' that were so
prized at the fin-de-siecle. They were, moreover, well established
socially and enjoyed the advantages of life in small towns where
everyone knew each other, and where they themselves were known to all.
Today we think of the progress to New York as so inevitable and
desirable that it's easy to forget that, for many of the immigrants,
the move away >from the towns where their families had lived for
generations was traumatic, and constituted leaving lovely country towns
for the filth, squalor, noise, and alien hubbub of a city in a country
where they didn't speak the language.

My great-uncle and his wife and four daughters were all killed by the
Germans and their Ukrainian collaborators between 1941 and 1943.

Daniel Mendelsohn
New York, NY
damendel@princeton.edu


searching town near Odessa #ukraine

Behrmanwax@...
 

I recently found my grandmother's ship records. The LERNER family left >from
Odessa in 1906 and 1907 (under the name STOLJAR - no idea why!). On the ship
records it says her father was born in Kamenka but naturalization says Ananiv,
her little sister in Odessa, but she and brother in Nowopolowka. This would
have to be near Odessa but I can find nothing similar in shtetl links. Any
clues?

Thanks,
Jeanne Behrman, Long Island,
(mailto:Behrmanwax@aol.com)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Immigrants from Poland Returning #general

Daniel Mendelsohn <damendel@...>
 

The question of immigrants who returned goes beyond people who went
back to the 'old country' either to find spouses or even simply to
visit their "old country." We take it so wholly for granted that the
move to America (or wherever) was such an improvement over the life in
the old country that we forget the subtle reality of the situation. (A
visit to the sites of the old shtetls can often correct this.) After
the death of my great-grandfather in 1912, his eldest son, aged 18, (my
grandfather's older brother) sailed >from his town of Bolechow (near
Lwow) to New York to begin the process of resettling the family in New
York; a year later, instead of sending for the rest of his family, he
sailed back to Poland. Why? He absolutely hated New York. It's
important to remember that many of these immigrants were, essentially,
country folk, and despite the various disadvantages of shtetl life,
these Jews lived in what we, today, would consider charming small
villages in terrifically picturesque locales--in this case, the
beautiful hills and forests and streams of the western Ukraine, leading
up to the Carpathian foothills, and area even today still dotted with
the many resort spas, with their 'healthful waters,' that were so
prized at the fin-de-siecle. They were, moreover, well established
socially and enjoyed the advantages of life in small towns where
everyone knew each other, and where they themselves were known to all.
Today we think of the progress to New York as so inevitable and
desirable that it's easy to forget that, for many of the immigrants,
the move away >from the towns where their families had lived for
generations was traumatic, and constituted leaving lovely country towns
for the filth, squalor, noise, and alien hubbub of a city in a country
where they didn't speak the language.

My great-uncle and his wife and four daughters were all killed by the
Germans and their Ukrainian collaborators between 1941 and 1943.

Daniel Mendelsohn
New York, NY
damendel@princeton.edu


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine searching town near Odessa #ukraine

Behrmanwax@...
 

I recently found my grandmother's ship records. The LERNER family left >from
Odessa in 1906 and 1907 (under the name STOLJAR - no idea why!). On the ship
records it says her father was born in Kamenka but naturalization says Ananiv,
her little sister in Odessa, but she and brother in Nowopolowka. This would
have to be near Odessa but I can find nothing similar in shtetl links. Any
clues?

Thanks,
Jeanne Behrman, Long Island,
(mailto:Behrmanwax@aol.com)


Re: Immigrants from Poland who returned #general

Peter Levene <peter@...>
 

My grandfather returned to Poland for a pretty unique reason - to get
divorced! His was an arranged marriage in Poland when he was 18 and he
couldn't stand his wife, "she vos so ugly". He ran away and came to England
where he met my grandmother, but couldn't marry her until he returned to
Poland to divorce his wife. He is described on his ketubah as a divorcee.
Peter Levene, England


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Immigrants from Poland who returned #general

Peter Levene <peter@...>
 

My grandfather returned to Poland for a pretty unique reason - to get
divorced! His was an arranged marriage in Poland when he was 18 and he
couldn't stand his wife, "she vos so ugly". He ran away and came to England
where he met my grandmother, but couldn't marry her until he returned to
Poland to divorce his wife. He is described on his ketubah as a divorcee.
Peter Levene, England


Immigrants from Poland who returned #general

Dov & Varda Epstein <yknow@...>
 

FrancineSMiller@aol.com wrote:
<Does anyone know if there were instances in which immigrants would leave
America only to return to Poland once more? For what reason would they have
done this? Unfortunately, many of them would later perish in the Shoah.>

My mpggf planned a return to his shtetl of Vasilishki, Belarus in 1914 to
visit his aging mother. For this purpose, he regrew the beard he'd shaved as
a new immigrant to the States. He didn't want to embarrass her or cause her
to believe he'd abandoned the ways of religion.

My ggparents' had a department store, and it was common for the immigrants
of the time to buy impressive suits to wear for travel back to the shtetl,
along with gifts for the folks back home. Visits back home were usually for
the purpose of showing off new-found prosperity.

One such sojourner became ill while visiting Moscow and by happenstance, the
doctor called in to treat him discovered he was >from Arnold Pennsylvania and
asked him if he knew my ggparents, who lived in nearby New Kensington. It
turned out that the doctor was my ggm's niece!

For more about my family, see:
http://www.shtetlinks.jewishgen.org/Lida-District/vas-yan.htm

Varda Epstein
Efrat
Israel


Starokonstantinov area research group #ukraine

jfa2000@...
 

Evan Fishman asked:
"Has anyone ever started such a SIG for Starokonstantinov, Volhynia, Ukraine and vicinity? I would
be interested in collaborating with others so that we can obtain records as
a group and thereby maximize effectiveness."

I would be interested in pooling research resources for the Starokonstantinov area
if we could gather several folks. I am researching FALIKMAN/FALIKMANN, STRUBCHEK,
BILICH, KAMENIR, KLEZ, KNOP, MUCHNIK, and GODL, >from Khizhniki, Lyubar and Yampol.
To date I have not seen these names among the Ukraine-sig postings.

One question, however: I recall being told that a fire in the Kamenetz-Podolsk
archives (if that's the correct location of the fire -- at any rate, it was a
central archive for the region) a couple of years ago destroyed many records
and closed the archives for an indefinite period. Am I remembering the correct
archives? and has research there remained severely impacted? Does anyone know
whether records for the Starokonstantinov area would be likely to be found in
other locations, and, if so, where and what types of records might be housed
outside the central archive? In other words, what is the state of archival
research in this area these days?

Jessica Falikman Attiyeh
San Diego, California
jfa2000@mymailstation.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Immigrants from Poland who returned #general

Dov & Varda Epstein <yknow@...>
 

FrancineSMiller@aol.com wrote:
<Does anyone know if there were instances in which immigrants would leave
America only to return to Poland once more? For what reason would they have
done this? Unfortunately, many of them would later perish in the Shoah.>

My mpggf planned a return to his shtetl of Vasilishki, Belarus in 1914 to
visit his aging mother. For this purpose, he regrew the beard he'd shaved as
a new immigrant to the States. He didn't want to embarrass her or cause her
to believe he'd abandoned the ways of religion.

My ggparents' had a department store, and it was common for the immigrants
of the time to buy impressive suits to wear for travel back to the shtetl,
along with gifts for the folks back home. Visits back home were usually for
the purpose of showing off new-found prosperity.

One such sojourner became ill while visiting Moscow and by happenstance, the
doctor called in to treat him discovered he was >from Arnold Pennsylvania and
asked him if he knew my ggparents, who lived in nearby New Kensington. It
turned out that the doctor was my ggm's niece!

For more about my family, see:
http://www.shtetlinks.jewishgen.org/Lida-District/vas-yan.htm

Varda Epstein
Efrat
Israel


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Starokonstantinov area research group #ukraine

jfa2000@...
 

Evan Fishman asked:
"Has anyone ever started such a SIG for Starokonstantinov, Volhynia, Ukraine and vicinity? I would
be interested in collaborating with others so that we can obtain records as
a group and thereby maximize effectiveness."

I would be interested in pooling research resources for the Starokonstantinov area
if we could gather several folks. I am researching FALIKMAN/FALIKMANN, STRUBCHEK,
BILICH, KAMENIR, KLEZ, KNOP, MUCHNIK, and GODL, >from Khizhniki, Lyubar and Yampol.
To date I have not seen these names among the Ukraine-sig postings.

One question, however: I recall being told that a fire in the Kamenetz-Podolsk
archives (if that's the correct location of the fire -- at any rate, it was a
central archive for the region) a couple of years ago destroyed many records
and closed the archives for an indefinite period. Am I remembering the correct
archives? and has research there remained severely impacted? Does anyone know
whether records for the Starokonstantinov area would be likely to be found in
other locations, and, if so, where and what types of records might be housed
outside the central archive? In other words, what is the state of archival
research in this area these days?

Jessica Falikman Attiyeh
San Diego, California
jfa2000@mymailstation.com