Date   
"Down Time" #germany

GerSig@...
 

MODERATOR ANNOUNCEMENT:

Messages posted to this Forum and sent to you >from GerSig are handled
by a computer called a "listserver". Like your own computers, our
listserver computer uses instructions contained in its "software" to
guide its operation.

The operating software for our listserver is provided by an entity
called "Lyris". Lyris is not Jewish and is not part of JewishGen.

Lyris will be out of service while its software is being updated from
10 a.m. Eastern USA time (NY time) until the update is finished
on Saturday, 7 September.

During the update, you will not be able to send messages to GerSig.
Membership functions such as subscribe, unsubscribe, and
modify subscriptions will also be out of service during the update.

My fellow GerSig Coordinators and moderators join me in wishing
all a happy, healthy and peaceful year.

John Paul Lowens Suburban NYC GerSig Moderator / Coordinator

German SIG #Germany "Down Time" #germany

GerSig@...
 

MODERATOR ANNOUNCEMENT:

Messages posted to this Forum and sent to you >from GerSig are handled
by a computer called a "listserver". Like your own computers, our
listserver computer uses instructions contained in its "software" to
guide its operation.

The operating software for our listserver is provided by an entity
called "Lyris". Lyris is not Jewish and is not part of JewishGen.

Lyris will be out of service while its software is being updated from
10 a.m. Eastern USA time (NY time) until the update is finished
on Saturday, 7 September.

During the update, you will not be able to send messages to GerSig.
Membership functions such as subscribe, unsubscribe, and
modify subscriptions will also be out of service during the update.

My fellow GerSig Coordinators and moderators join me in wishing
all a happy, healthy and peaceful year.

John Paul Lowens Suburban NYC GerSig Moderator / Coordinator

Re: Jews from Brailov (Brayliv, Brailiv) #ukraine

NFatouros@...
 

In a message dated 9/5/02 8:39:41 PM, Roslyn Patchi (spealla@...)
writes:


<< Does anyone out there have any information on this town? I am
researching my ROISMAN family who came >from Brailov before WWI.
>>

Brailov (Bralov, Brailow, Braylov) is southwest of Vinnitza and Kiev.
For its map coordinates Ms. Patchi should used the ShtetlSeeker at
Jewishgen. To my surprise, my usually trusty 1962 Columbia-Lippincott
Gazetteer has no entry for this town. I tried the Internet to no avail
although I found a number of people whose surname was or is Brailowsky
including the famous pianist Alexander Brailowsky. But then I tried the
new site:

http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com

and typed in "Brailov." A paragraph about the town appeared, which said
that its population in 1897 included 3,924 JEws.

But Gary Mokotoff and Sally Amdur Sack's "Where We Once Walked" does have
an entry which says that it had a population of 2,393 and gives various
references which should be consulted.

To find others researching this town in order to exchange family histories
or town information she should use Jewishgen's Family Finder and the
Discussion Group archives, for Jewishgen and the separate Discussion Group
Archives for Jewishgen's SIGs. Probably her using the "search this
website" box at Jewishgen's main page will turn up some more information.
This facility usually turns up cemetery descriptions and these
descriptions usually contain bits of history about particular towns.


Naomi Fatouros (nee FELDMAN)
Bloomington, Indiana
NFatouros@...

Researching: BELKOWSKY and BIELKOWSKY, Odessa and Berdichev;ROTHSTEIN,
Kremenchug; FELDMAN, Pinsk; SCHUTZ, RETTIG, WAHL, Shcherets; LEVY, Mulhouse;
SAS or SASS,Podwolochisk; RAPOPORT, Tarnopol, Korostyshev; BEHAM, Salok and
Kharkov; WOLPIANSKY, Ostryna.

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Re: Jews from Brailov (Brayliv, Brailiv) #ukraine

NFatouros@...
 

In a message dated 9/5/02 8:39:41 PM, Roslyn Patchi (spealla@...)
writes:


<< Does anyone out there have any information on this town? I am
researching my ROISMAN family who came >from Brailov before WWI.
>>

Brailov (Bralov, Brailow, Braylov) is southwest of Vinnitza and Kiev.
For its map coordinates Ms. Patchi should used the ShtetlSeeker at
Jewishgen. To my surprise, my usually trusty 1962 Columbia-Lippincott
Gazetteer has no entry for this town. I tried the Internet to no avail
although I found a number of people whose surname was or is Brailowsky
including the famous pianist Alexander Brailowsky. But then I tried the
new site:

http://www.jewishencyclopedia.com

and typed in "Brailov." A paragraph about the town appeared, which said
that its population in 1897 included 3,924 JEws.

But Gary Mokotoff and Sally Amdur Sack's "Where We Once Walked" does have
an entry which says that it had a population of 2,393 and gives various
references which should be consulted.

To find others researching this town in order to exchange family histories
or town information she should use Jewishgen's Family Finder and the
Discussion Group archives, for Jewishgen and the separate Discussion Group
Archives for Jewishgen's SIGs. Probably her using the "search this
website" box at Jewishgen's main page will turn up some more information.
This facility usually turns up cemetery descriptions and these
descriptions usually contain bits of history about particular towns.


Naomi Fatouros (nee FELDMAN)
Bloomington, Indiana
NFatouros@...

Researching: BELKOWSKY and BIELKOWSKY, Odessa and Berdichev;ROTHSTEIN,
Kremenchug; FELDMAN, Pinsk; SCHUTZ, RETTIG, WAHL, Shcherets; LEVY, Mulhouse;
SAS or SASS,Podwolochisk; RAPOPORT, Tarnopol, Korostyshev; BEHAM, Salok and
Kharkov; WOLPIANSKY, Ostryna.

Jews from Brailov #ukraine

anne silverstein <etothex01@...>
 

Roslyn Patchi asked, "Does anyone out there have any information on
this town? I am researching my ROISMAN family who came >from Brailov
before WWI."

There is testimony about a town of this name (in the Vinnitsa region)
in the famous "Black Book" edited by Ilya Ehrenburg and Vasily Grossman
that documents Nazi atrocities in the former Soviet Union. According
to the author of the piece on Brailov, of those who were not evacuated
before the Germans arrived, there were very few survivors -- under a
dozen.

Anne Silverstein
St. Louis, Missouri

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Jews from Brailov #ukraine

anne silverstein <etothex01@...>
 

Roslyn Patchi asked, "Does anyone out there have any information on
this town? I am researching my ROISMAN family who came >from Brailov
before WWI."

There is testimony about a town of this name (in the Vinnitsa region)
in the famous "Black Book" edited by Ilya Ehrenburg and Vasily Grossman
that documents Nazi atrocities in the former Soviet Union. According
to the author of the piece on Brailov, of those who were not evacuated
before the Germans arrived, there were very few survivors -- under a
dozen.

Anne Silverstein
St. Louis, Missouri

Ellis Island - new site #ukraine

FREYAB@...
 

Dear Genners,

Avotaynu just published a Special Edition of it's newsletter explaining
the problems and interim solution of the website. But, for real, the
basic program is up and running at:

http:/www. avotaynu.com/ellis.html

Thank you, Steve Morris and Gary Mokotoff.

Freya Blitstein Maslov
Morton Grove, IL

Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Ellis Island - new site #ukraine

FREYAB@...
 

Dear Genners,

Avotaynu just published a Special Edition of it's newsletter explaining
the problems and interim solution of the website. But, for real, the
basic program is up and running at:

http:/www. avotaynu.com/ellis.html

Thank you, Steve Morris and Gary Mokotoff.

Freya Blitstein Maslov
Morton Grove, IL

Re: Trepman, Trejbman, et al. #poland

Yitshaq Neiman <yneiman@...>
 

** Reply to message >from marciak <marciak@...> on Tue, 03 Sep 2002
14:11:03 -0400

I have been following this discussion of surnames/Soundex/pronunciation with
great interest. A year ago, I wrote a little tale about how my gfather
Pritikin (and his 4 brothers) magically became Pitkin somewhere between
Ekaterinoslav and Ellis Island. In Russia, they wouldn't have had much trouble
with Pritikin, I should think...and the story always was that the name got
changed at Ellis Island.
I received four or five replies >from genners, informing me I didn't know
what I was talking about. No names, they said, ever got changed at Ellis
Island. A Jewish urban myth, they insisted. The inspectors never heard a name
incorrectly because they only looked at the passport/papers!
And yet I keep hearing stories about names being changed, at or near Ellis
It is indeed one of the most popular of urban myths. That doesn't turn fiction
into fact.

Island, some changes subtle and some, not so. I imagine it's possible that an
inspector trying to read Cyrillic might resort to asking the new immigrant for
You are misinformed. The immigration official did not get the name >from the
passport, but >from the passenger manifest -- a document that was created by the
ship's purser or the shipping company to reflect who was on board.

Cyrillic has nothing to do with it; passenger manifests were written in Latin
characters, for many reasons, one of which was that most ships were German,
Dutch, English, French, etc.

his/her name, no? (And in the early years of the 20th C, Polish was also
written in the Cyrillic alphabet.)
Again, you are misinformed. Polish has never been written in Cyrillic
characters. What you have seen are documents written in Russian, concerning
life events that occured in parts of Poland that belonged to the Russian Empire.

And if the inspectors got the names >from the ship's manifest, even worse. I
don't suppose much attention was paid to details if you were going steerage and
one name was as good as another. It's probable that many many mistakes were
made.
Both my grandfathers retailed this story too, to explain why their respective
surnames were different >from the ones they were born with because of a whim of
an official at Ellis Island. They recited this tale because it amused them;
they never knew each other, so it was not a conspiracy. Only in the past four
years have I learned what the real reasons were -- that had nothing to do with
Ellis Island. Mistakes, of course, can always happen. But there is no way
whatever that ALL those Jews had their identities switched because of the
malice or indifference of a Civil Service employee, or even the execrable
handwriting of ships' pursers.

--
Yitshaq Neiman

Copies of Documents from Polish Archives (Sept. 3 Digest) #poland

Mel Sofian <msofian@...>
 

Mike: I think you missed the entire point of Marty Meyers' enquiry.
Many of us have used the procedure for ordering copies >from the various
branches of the PSA, and until recently (around March of this year) had
only small delays in receiving what we ordered.

Around March or April, an "official" notice was posted on this list and
JRI-PL to the effect that PSA was having some difficulty in redeeming
the cashiers' checks that came with the orders, and until that
difficulty was settled, orders on hand could not be filled (I don't
understand why existing orders had to be held up so long) and the list
was requested not to send any additional orders until word was given
that their problems had been solved.

I have had an order pending since March 19, and apparently quite a few
other people have been waiting (impatiently) to receive copies of
documents that would allow them to continue their genealogical research.
I also sent an enquiry about this to the JRI-PL List, which resulted in
a number of letters being received privately, expressing the same
frustrations.

Please, may we hear >from someone who can tell us what is happening, when
we can expect fulfillment of our present orders, and when everyone can
again submit requests for these precious documents.

Mel Sofian
Studio City, CA

Re: instructions and status of orders from PSA #general

Mark Halpern <willie46@...>
 

As Marty points out, the branch archives of the Polish State
Archives have had problems accepting bank drafts >from JRI-Poland
researchers. These branches have absorbed very high fees from
their local banks to process these US$ bank drafts. In some cases
the fees have been greater than the face amount of the draft.

As was announced at the Jewish Genealogy Confernce in Toronto
last month, JRI-Poland and the Polish State Archives are working
on a temporary system that will allow researchers to know the
cost of their records before they commit to an order. This system
is in the testing phase now and we expect the system to go live
and be announced shortly.

In addition to this temporary system

----- Original Message -----
Can anyone update us on the issue regarding orders of vital
records
from PSA in Poland? There was a problem with currency charges
that needed
to be resolved, I believe.

Is there a new procedure to order vital records? Should we use
the old
procedure?
Should we continue to wait?

Shana Tova,

Marty Meyers <meyers01@...>

New Instructions for ordering copies of records from the Polish State Archives #poland

Stanley Diamond
 

Dear Friends of Jewish Records Indexing - Poland:

As many of you who have tried to order record copies >from the
Polish State Archives (PSA) realize, it has been extremely difficult
to place such orders for the last few months because of pricing
changes taking place within the PSA order framework, as well
as bank charges and other problems faced by archives when
they try to cash checks sent by researchers with their orders.

In fact, JRI-Poland and the PSA had asked researchers to try to
hold their orders back while a new order system is being developed.
JRI-Poland and the PSA will be be meeting in Poland in October to
review the steps in implementing this new system. We hope to be
able to announce a specific time-table shortly after this meeting.
In the meantime, we have agreed upon a temporary system for
those of you who cannot wait a few more months to order copies
of records whose indices you have found in the JRI-Poland database.

We recognize that this interim system may seem complicated at
first. But please bear in mind that it is only temporary, and that it
will provide you with a way to obtain records before a new system
is in place.

Interim Procedure for Ordering Copies of Records
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
JRI-Poland has emphasized the importance of providing a method
for researchers to be able to place orders even before this new
system is instituted.. To enable researchers to order copies of
records in the meantime, the Polish State Archives has agreed
to implement an interim "Request for Quotation" system.

There are two ways to access the Request for Quotation
system instructions. You can go directly there at:
http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/psa/psainst.htm

In addition, JRI-Poland search results link you to the web page
for branch archive project under which the records of interest to
you were indexed. The Archive web page has a link to the instructions.

This interim procedure does NOT apply to Galician records
from the AGAD branch of the Polish State Archives. There
is already as special procedure in place for these records.

Researchers who placed orders *prior to the moratorium being
announced* on May 2nd, 2002, and who have not received their
copies should continue to follow the previously posted
instructions and contact Judy Baston at JRBaston@....

Best wishes to all for a healthy, happy and peaceful New Year.

Stanley Diamond
Project Coordinator, Jewish Records Indexing - Poland

JRI Poland #Poland Re: Trepman, Trejbman, et al. #poland

Yitshaq Neiman <yneiman@...>
 

** Reply to message >from marciak <marciak@...> on Tue, 03 Sep 2002
14:11:03 -0400

I have been following this discussion of surnames/Soundex/pronunciation with
great interest. A year ago, I wrote a little tale about how my gfather
Pritikin (and his 4 brothers) magically became Pitkin somewhere between
Ekaterinoslav and Ellis Island. In Russia, they wouldn't have had much trouble
with Pritikin, I should think...and the story always was that the name got
changed at Ellis Island.
I received four or five replies >from genners, informing me I didn't know
what I was talking about. No names, they said, ever got changed at Ellis
Island. A Jewish urban myth, they insisted. The inspectors never heard a name
incorrectly because they only looked at the passport/papers!
And yet I keep hearing stories about names being changed, at or near Ellis
It is indeed one of the most popular of urban myths. That doesn't turn fiction
into fact.

Island, some changes subtle and some, not so. I imagine it's possible that an
inspector trying to read Cyrillic might resort to asking the new immigrant for
You are misinformed. The immigration official did not get the name >from the
passport, but >from the passenger manifest -- a document that was created by the
ship's purser or the shipping company to reflect who was on board.

Cyrillic has nothing to do with it; passenger manifests were written in Latin
characters, for many reasons, one of which was that most ships were German,
Dutch, English, French, etc.

his/her name, no? (And in the early years of the 20th C, Polish was also
written in the Cyrillic alphabet.)
Again, you are misinformed. Polish has never been written in Cyrillic
characters. What you have seen are documents written in Russian, concerning
life events that occured in parts of Poland that belonged to the Russian Empire.

And if the inspectors got the names >from the ship's manifest, even worse. I
don't suppose much attention was paid to details if you were going steerage and
one name was as good as another. It's probable that many many mistakes were
made.
Both my grandfathers retailed this story too, to explain why their respective
surnames were different >from the ones they were born with because of a whim of
an official at Ellis Island. They recited this tale because it amused them;
they never knew each other, so it was not a conspiracy. Only in the past four
years have I learned what the real reasons were -- that had nothing to do with
Ellis Island. Mistakes, of course, can always happen. But there is no way
whatever that ALL those Jews had their identities switched because of the
malice or indifference of a Civil Service employee, or even the execrable
handwriting of ships' pursers.

--
Yitshaq Neiman

JRI Poland #Poland Copies of Documents from Polish Archives (Sept. 3 Digest) #poland

Mel Sofian <msofian@...>
 

Mike: I think you missed the entire point of Marty Meyers' enquiry.
Many of us have used the procedure for ordering copies >from the various
branches of the PSA, and until recently (around March of this year) had
only small delays in receiving what we ordered.

Around March or April, an "official" notice was posted on this list and
JRI-PL to the effect that PSA was having some difficulty in redeeming
the cashiers' checks that came with the orders, and until that
difficulty was settled, orders on hand could not be filled (I don't
understand why existing orders had to be held up so long) and the list
was requested not to send any additional orders until word was given
that their problems had been solved.

I have had an order pending since March 19, and apparently quite a few
other people have been waiting (impatiently) to receive copies of
documents that would allow them to continue their genealogical research.
I also sent an enquiry about this to the JRI-PL List, which resulted in
a number of letters being received privately, expressing the same
frustrations.

Please, may we hear >from someone who can tell us what is happening, when
we can expect fulfillment of our present orders, and when everyone can
again submit requests for these precious documents.

Mel Sofian
Studio City, CA

JRI Poland #Poland Re: instructions and status of orders from PSA #poland

Mark Halpern <willie46@...>
 

As Marty points out, the branch archives of the Polish State
Archives have had problems accepting bank drafts >from JRI-Poland
researchers. These branches have absorbed very high fees from
their local banks to process these US$ bank drafts. In some cases
the fees have been greater than the face amount of the draft.

As was announced at the Jewish Genealogy Confernce in Toronto
last month, JRI-Poland and the Polish State Archives are working
on a temporary system that will allow researchers to know the
cost of their records before they commit to an order. This system
is in the testing phase now and we expect the system to go live
and be announced shortly.

In addition to this temporary system

----- Original Message -----
Can anyone update us on the issue regarding orders of vital
records
from PSA in Poland? There was a problem with currency charges
that needed
to be resolved, I believe.

Is there a new procedure to order vital records? Should we use
the old
procedure?
Should we continue to wait?

Shana Tova,

Marty Meyers <meyers01@...>

JRI Poland #Poland New Instructions for ordering copies of records from the Polish State Archives #poland

Stanley Diamond
 

Dear Friends of Jewish Records Indexing - Poland:

As many of you who have tried to order record copies >from the
Polish State Archives (PSA) realize, it has been extremely difficult
to place such orders for the last few months because of pricing
changes taking place within the PSA order framework, as well
as bank charges and other problems faced by archives when
they try to cash checks sent by researchers with their orders.

In fact, JRI-Poland and the PSA had asked researchers to try to
hold their orders back while a new order system is being developed.
JRI-Poland and the PSA will be be meeting in Poland in October to
review the steps in implementing this new system. We hope to be
able to announce a specific time-table shortly after this meeting.
In the meantime, we have agreed upon a temporary system for
those of you who cannot wait a few more months to order copies
of records whose indices you have found in the JRI-Poland database.

We recognize that this interim system may seem complicated at
first. But please bear in mind that it is only temporary, and that it
will provide you with a way to obtain records before a new system
is in place.

Interim Procedure for Ordering Copies of Records
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
JRI-Poland has emphasized the importance of providing a method
for researchers to be able to place orders even before this new
system is instituted.. To enable researchers to order copies of
records in the meantime, the Polish State Archives has agreed
to implement an interim "Request for Quotation" system.

There are two ways to access the Request for Quotation
system instructions. You can go directly there at:
http://www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl/psa/psainst.htm

In addition, JRI-Poland search results link you to the web page
for branch archive project under which the records of interest to
you were indexed. The Archive web page has a link to the instructions.

This interim procedure does NOT apply to Galician records
from the AGAD branch of the Polish State Archives. There
is already as special procedure in place for these records.

Researchers who placed orders *prior to the moratorium being
announced* on May 2nd, 2002, and who have not received their
copies should continue to follow the previously posted
instructions and contact Judy Baston at JRBaston@....

Best wishes to all for a healthy, happy and peaceful New Year.

Stanley Diamond
Project Coordinator, Jewish Records Indexing - Poland

How to record persons with unknown names in gen. software #germany

Herbert J.Burgauer <herburgauer@...>
 

from Herbert J. Burgauer Ontario, Ohio
To the moderator and interested GerSigers.
Here is the requested summary of the replies I received to the
question I posted to the forum:
"I would be interested in hearing >from other GerSig members about
how they handle the entry of partial names in Genealogy software."

Thank you very much for the many different ways to solve this problem.
Using the Family Tree Maker program I will try the different ones to
find which suits me best.

[MOD NOTE: Replies and comments by private Email only. Thanks to
Mr. Burgauer for this summary. Topic is closed.]

from Linda:
no first name, but surname and gender known: I enter either daughter or
son, if more than 1 I enter Son1, Son2 etc. If gender is not known I enter
Child1, Child2 etc.
first name but surname unknown: I use -?- for the surname, I use the
first name followed by parens that include where they belong - for
example; Zvi (son of Leon) -?- I do the same thing for a married woman
whose maiden surname is unknown; Sara (wife of Issac) -?-.
Using this method, I can see at a glance through my software's index who
belongs where and it also gives me a good idea of where I need to research
the most. If I have a family line with a lot of daughters/sons/child or a
lot of -?- then I know that this is a line that needs my attention.

From: Marvin Calo:
Last name known but not first name Unk Smith
First name known but not last name
Never happened to me except as Married name of wife known but not maiden
name Married name of wife known but not maiden name Mary Wife Of Sam Smith
I would be interested in your results.

From: Cary:
Last name known but not first name
Depending on gender I enter XY Smith (whatever the last name is) or XX
Smith in my genealogy software.
Married name of wife known but not maiden name
If it's a wife I just enter the first name. I haven't resolved yet what
to do about husbands.
First name known but not last name:
I don't enter any name in my genealogy program. I just make a note under
the notes section of my program.

From: Judy:
I use Family Tree Maker or FTM for entering my data. This program is
family based with a father and a mother on a group sheet style page.
I am currently working with over 100 files of the lineages of
the governors of the state of Michigan. I am putting the lineages
together into one large file. Many of the governors go back to
the same ancestors. One family had 7 governors in their lines.
The rules I have set up for the project are:
Last name known, no first name: ? Smith (space between ? and Smith)
First name known, no last name: Mary ? (space between Mary and ?)
Married name of wife known, but not Maiden:
This is the toughest, but since FTM is family based the married
surname is not entered for any woman. I would go with the Mary ? rule
above. Now if there are multiple marriages, I enter each one as a separate
spouse.
There are instances where I know neither name, but have a wedding date.
In such a case, the name is entered as ? ? (space between the ? marks)
The advantage to the above rules is that everyone is indexed correctly.
No Mary appears as a last name in the index. All the unknown names appear
first in the index. There seems to be no problem with the program in
having several people that are "? ?" as the relationship belongs to the
family.
The sources for the lineages vary a great deal. We have used county
histories, newspapers, vital records and whatever we can find.
Sometimes in merging files a name previously unknown will show up.
The rules I use if the spouse name is same or similar, dates are close,
parents and children names are the same, the person is the same and gets
the name. You also have to be willing to accept some variations in names
like Joanna/ Johanna. And even surnames vary between generations.
The son might be Barry with the father Berry. DeWolf goes on down to
Dolph over successive generations.
Within my own family files, I have not been so diligent in my rules. I
am not planning to publish them at present. They are works in progress.
I also spell out all location names. For instance, I spell out Michigan.
I looked many years for a person that supposedly when to "CA" .
It turns out this person did not go to California, but to Caledonia,
Michigan.
I do not include "Rev", "Dr." and other titles in the names. These go
in as AKA names. These can be printed, but keep the database index
looking clean. This includes Jr., Sr., and I, II and other designations.
These are AKA names as well.
Not all the members of the project agree. Some of them like to put
in underscores like "Mary __" for missing names. This is messy and are
replaced with a ? in the final project. It is hard to be consistent in
the number of underscores and the underscore sometimes disappear in the
reports. Some people just leave it as "Mary" and this really messes up the
index.

From: Sandi:
Examples: Last name known but not first name I use, Unknown Smith
First name known but not last name:
I only put this person's first name in the notes of his wife or close
relative until I can find his last name
Married name of wife known but not maiden name: I list her as Jette and
use her husbands last name until I can find her maiden name. Family Tree
Maker allows you to do this.

From: Miriam:
To answer your question on how to enter unknown first names or last names
or any partial info is quite easy. Just enter as much data as you have
available and place a question mark for unknown info. for example:
Name: ? Burgauer When you eventually receive the data you can erase the
question mark and fill in the correct spelling.

From: "Max":
I use UNKNOWNHUSBAND, UNKNOWNFATHER, etc. for first names and leave the
lastname blank until known.

From: Chaim:
I simply enter a ? for the missing information
? /LastName/ FirstName /?/ ? /?/
(The '//' are how GEDCOMs represent last names, Family Tree Maker allows
you to use '//' to delineate a last name, especially when it may not be
recognized as such. (Where the last name may not be in the proper
location)

From: Alan:
A good question of yours regarding names. When one has to deal with
perhaps hundreds of names it is important to treat them in a consistent
manner. As such I have created standards for the way I enter data into my
system.
Below is an excerpt (>from those standards) relating to names:
Recording The Primary Name:
Following is the precedence of name sources to use when recording a
primary name:
The name used on a Birth Certificate, A name thought to have been given at
birth, The earliest name commonly used on official documents such as -
Passport, a Marriage Certificate, a Birth Certificate of that person's
children, etc.
- The name the person was commonly known by (given name or surname)
- Diminutives (for given names)
- Nicknames or affectionate names (for given names)
Always record all known given names or initials.
Record surnames using mixed case letters. Do not use just upper case.
Always record a value for the first given name. Use a "?" if unknown.
Always record a value for the surname. Use a "?" if unknown.
This could for example result in a name of "? ?".
Sometimes, one may be confronted by the situation where the spelling of the
surname on birth certificates may vary between siblings and also between
children and their father. Use your discretion in these cases. Record
any other surnames in the "also known as" (AKA) fields.

Enter the name as it would appear in the native language of the person
involved. Always use foreign language characters where required. If
necessary, record an English version of the name in the AKA field.

<herburgauer@...>

German SIG #Germany How to record persons with unknown names in gen. software #germany

Herbert J.Burgauer <herburgauer@...>
 

from Herbert J. Burgauer Ontario, Ohio
To the moderator and interested GerSigers.
Here is the requested summary of the replies I received to the
question I posted to the forum:
"I would be interested in hearing >from other GerSig members about
how they handle the entry of partial names in Genealogy software."

Thank you very much for the many different ways to solve this problem.
Using the Family Tree Maker program I will try the different ones to
find which suits me best.

[MOD NOTE: Replies and comments by private Email only. Thanks to
Mr. Burgauer for this summary. Topic is closed.]

from Linda:
no first name, but surname and gender known: I enter either daughter or
son, if more than 1 I enter Son1, Son2 etc. If gender is not known I enter
Child1, Child2 etc.
first name but surname unknown: I use -?- for the surname, I use the
first name followed by parens that include where they belong - for
example; Zvi (son of Leon) -?- I do the same thing for a married woman
whose maiden surname is unknown; Sara (wife of Issac) -?-.
Using this method, I can see at a glance through my software's index who
belongs where and it also gives me a good idea of where I need to research
the most. If I have a family line with a lot of daughters/sons/child or a
lot of -?- then I know that this is a line that needs my attention.

From: Marvin Calo:
Last name known but not first name Unk Smith
First name known but not last name
Never happened to me except as Married name of wife known but not maiden
name Married name of wife known but not maiden name Mary Wife Of Sam Smith
I would be interested in your results.

From: Cary:
Last name known but not first name
Depending on gender I enter XY Smith (whatever the last name is) or XX
Smith in my genealogy software.
Married name of wife known but not maiden name
If it's a wife I just enter the first name. I haven't resolved yet what
to do about husbands.
First name known but not last name:
I don't enter any name in my genealogy program. I just make a note under
the notes section of my program.

From: Judy:
I use Family Tree Maker or FTM for entering my data. This program is
family based with a father and a mother on a group sheet style page.
I am currently working with over 100 files of the lineages of
the governors of the state of Michigan. I am putting the lineages
together into one large file. Many of the governors go back to
the same ancestors. One family had 7 governors in their lines.
The rules I have set up for the project are:
Last name known, no first name: ? Smith (space between ? and Smith)
First name known, no last name: Mary ? (space between Mary and ?)
Married name of wife known, but not Maiden:
This is the toughest, but since FTM is family based the married
surname is not entered for any woman. I would go with the Mary ? rule
above. Now if there are multiple marriages, I enter each one as a separate
spouse.
There are instances where I know neither name, but have a wedding date.
In such a case, the name is entered as ? ? (space between the ? marks)
The advantage to the above rules is that everyone is indexed correctly.
No Mary appears as a last name in the index. All the unknown names appear
first in the index. There seems to be no problem with the program in
having several people that are "? ?" as the relationship belongs to the
family.
The sources for the lineages vary a great deal. We have used county
histories, newspapers, vital records and whatever we can find.
Sometimes in merging files a name previously unknown will show up.
The rules I use if the spouse name is same or similar, dates are close,
parents and children names are the same, the person is the same and gets
the name. You also have to be willing to accept some variations in names
like Joanna/ Johanna. And even surnames vary between generations.
The son might be Barry with the father Berry. DeWolf goes on down to
Dolph over successive generations.
Within my own family files, I have not been so diligent in my rules. I
am not planning to publish them at present. They are works in progress.
I also spell out all location names. For instance, I spell out Michigan.
I looked many years for a person that supposedly when to "CA" .
It turns out this person did not go to California, but to Caledonia,
Michigan.
I do not include "Rev", "Dr." and other titles in the names. These go
in as AKA names. These can be printed, but keep the database index
looking clean. This includes Jr., Sr., and I, II and other designations.
These are AKA names as well.
Not all the members of the project agree. Some of them like to put
in underscores like "Mary __" for missing names. This is messy and are
replaced with a ? in the final project. It is hard to be consistent in
the number of underscores and the underscore sometimes disappear in the
reports. Some people just leave it as "Mary" and this really messes up the
index.

From: Sandi:
Examples: Last name known but not first name I use, Unknown Smith
First name known but not last name:
I only put this person's first name in the notes of his wife or close
relative until I can find his last name
Married name of wife known but not maiden name: I list her as Jette and
use her husbands last name until I can find her maiden name. Family Tree
Maker allows you to do this.

From: Miriam:
To answer your question on how to enter unknown first names or last names
or any partial info is quite easy. Just enter as much data as you have
available and place a question mark for unknown info. for example:
Name: ? Burgauer When you eventually receive the data you can erase the
question mark and fill in the correct spelling.

From: "Max":
I use UNKNOWNHUSBAND, UNKNOWNFATHER, etc. for first names and leave the
lastname blank until known.

From: Chaim:
I simply enter a ? for the missing information
? /LastName/ FirstName /?/ ? /?/
(The '//' are how GEDCOMs represent last names, Family Tree Maker allows
you to use '//' to delineate a last name, especially when it may not be
recognized as such. (Where the last name may not be in the proper
location)

From: Alan:
A good question of yours regarding names. When one has to deal with
perhaps hundreds of names it is important to treat them in a consistent
manner. As such I have created standards for the way I enter data into my
system.
Below is an excerpt (>from those standards) relating to names:
Recording The Primary Name:
Following is the precedence of name sources to use when recording a
primary name:
The name used on a Birth Certificate, A name thought to have been given at
birth, The earliest name commonly used on official documents such as -
Passport, a Marriage Certificate, a Birth Certificate of that person's
children, etc.
- The name the person was commonly known by (given name or surname)
- Diminutives (for given names)
- Nicknames or affectionate names (for given names)
Always record all known given names or initials.
Record surnames using mixed case letters. Do not use just upper case.
Always record a value for the first given name. Use a "?" if unknown.
Always record a value for the surname. Use a "?" if unknown.
This could for example result in a name of "? ?".
Sometimes, one may be confronted by the situation where the spelling of the
surname on birth certificates may vary between siblings and also between
children and their father. Use your discretion in these cases. Record
any other surnames in the "also known as" (AKA) fields.

Enter the name as it would appear in the native language of the person
involved. Always use foreign language characters where required. If
necessary, record an English version of the name in the AKA field.

<herburgauer@...>

Re: Talsi Jewish cemetery #courland #latvia

Martha Lev-Zion <martha@...>
 

Great, David!! So can we count on you to join our team of volunteers
to help with the databasing?

I want to take this opportunity to wish all of our Courlanders and
their families a wonderfully happy, healthy, fruitful and peaceful
new year. And shalom on clal yisrael!!

Martha

I am able to read and translate Hebrew, Yiddish and
German, so perhaps I can help in translations.
--
Martha Levinson Lev-Zion, PhD
President Latvia SIG

Courland SIG #Courland #Latvia Re: Talsi Jewish cemetery #courland #latvia

Martha Lev-Zion <martha@...>
 

Great, David!! So can we count on you to join our team of volunteers
to help with the databasing?

I want to take this opportunity to wish all of our Courlanders and
their families a wonderfully happy, healthy, fruitful and peaceful
new year. And shalom on clal yisrael!!

Martha

I am able to read and translate Hebrew, Yiddish and
German, so perhaps I can help in translations.
--
Martha Levinson Lev-Zion, PhD
President Latvia SIG