Date   

Re: Unrecorded marriage (Shtille Chupa) #general

Barbara Sloan <bj1friends@...>
 

My grandfather had a civil marriage and probably a religious one with
my grandmother in Manhattan, NY in 1916.

After she died, he lived with another woman and called her his wife.
I doubt there was even a religious marriage. I don't know the reason
they didn't marry, but most likely it would have considered it a
common law marriage unless she had a legal marriage to someone else
whom I don't know about. This commenced around the mid to late 30s and
lasted until she died in the mid 50s.

Then he had a religious but not civil marriage to a third woman in the
late 50s or early 60s. They did not want to lose her Social Security
benefits >from her first husband.

After she died, he apparently married again, but I do not know if that
was a civil or religious marriage or both. This was about 1965.

All four of these occurred in Manhattan with the probable exception of
the second "marriage," which was in Brooklyn, NY.

I also had friend who did not marry until they decided he needed
health insurance coverage. He had a small business, while she worked
for the county. I didn't know they were married for years, since to
them it was a convenience, though they lived together until his death
about 10 years ago.

Yes, it happens in the United States.

Barbara Sloan
Conway, SC

MODERATOR NOTE: Please continue privately.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Unrecorded marriage (Shtille Chupa) #general

Barbara Sloan <bj1friends@...>
 

My grandfather had a civil marriage and probably a religious one with
my grandmother in Manhattan, NY in 1916.

After she died, he lived with another woman and called her his wife.
I doubt there was even a religious marriage. I don't know the reason
they didn't marry, but most likely it would have considered it a
common law marriage unless she had a legal marriage to someone else
whom I don't know about. This commenced around the mid to late 30s and
lasted until she died in the mid 50s.

Then he had a religious but not civil marriage to a third woman in the
late 50s or early 60s. They did not want to lose her Social Security
benefits >from her first husband.

After she died, he apparently married again, but I do not know if that
was a civil or religious marriage or both. This was about 1965.

All four of these occurred in Manhattan with the probable exception of
the second "marriage," which was in Brooklyn, NY.

I also had friend who did not marry until they decided he needed
health insurance coverage. He had a small business, while she worked
for the county. I didn't know they were married for years, since to
them it was a convenience, though they lived together until his death
about 10 years ago.

Yes, it happens in the United States.

Barbara Sloan
Conway, SC

MODERATOR NOTE: Please continue privately.


The titles of GenAmi 81, France #general

Micheline GUTMANN
 

Dear all, here are the titles of GenAmi, issue 81
- Simone VEIL, a long list of her ascendants until the first
Rabbis of France, including RASHI
- History of the ghetto of Venice, Ist chapter
- Francis WIENER de CROISSET and his descendants >from
Belgium to France and USA
- Marcelle CAHN, French cubist paintor, and her ascendancy
- Inge, >from Berlin to Gurs and then to Escondido
- Search of witnesses at the trial of JOINOVICI
- Our two members back >from Orlando

Micheline GUTMANN, GenAmi, Paris, France
Site web : www.genami.org


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen The titles of GenAmi 81, France #general

Micheline GUTMANN
 

Dear all, here are the titles of GenAmi, issue 81
- Simone VEIL, a long list of her ascendants until the first
Rabbis of France, including RASHI
- History of the ghetto of Venice, Ist chapter
- Francis WIENER de CROISSET and his descendants >from
Belgium to France and USA
- Marcelle CAHN, French cubist paintor, and her ascendancy
- Inge, >from Berlin to Gurs and then to Escondido
- Search of witnesses at the trial of JOINOVICI
- Our two members back >from Orlando

Micheline GUTMANN, GenAmi, Paris, France
Site web : www.genami.org


Re: Name of a shtetl in Ukraine #general

bette_sscf <bette_sscf@...>
 

Yael Polat in Israel wrote: << I have for the same person three different
names as a birth place: - Romanov - Nitzgoursa - Bolchi Nizgoura.
I cannot find the two last ones neither in JewishGen nor in Ukrainian maps,
in the vicinity of Romano/iv. Any ideas? The places' names are taken from
French documents.>>
---

Assuming that Nitzgoursa or Bolchi Nizgoura is located near Romaniv and
following my recommended search methodology for "Zausmer near Cracow" posted
three days ago, begin your search with the known locality.

JewishGen Communities < https://www.jewishgen.org/Communities/Search.asp >

Romaniv, Ukraine was Romanov in Novograd-Volynsky district, Volhynia
gubernia, Russia before WWI and in Zhitomir district, Ukraine SSR, Soviet
Union between the Wars; then it was Dzerzhinsk in Soviet Union and Ukraine.
Coordinates are 5009 2756. Alternate names: Romaniv [Ukr, since 2003],
Dzerzhyns'k [Ukr, 1933-2003], Romanov [Rus, Yid], Dzerzhinsk [Rus,
1933-2003], Romanow Wielki [Pol], Dsershinsk

A search for "Nitzgoursa" showing distance and direction >from 5009 2756
results include one significant Jewish community named Bolshiye Nizgortsy,
Ukraine located at 4953 2842, 38.7 miles ESE of Romaniv. Bolshiye Nizgortsy,
Ukraine was Bolshiye Nezgortzi in Berdischev district, Kiev gubernia, Russia
before WWI and in Zhitomir district, Ukraine SSR, Soviet Union between the
Wars; then it was Viliky Nyzgirtsi, Ukraine. Alternate names: Bol'shiye
Nizgortsy [Rus], Veliky Nyzgirtsi [Ukr], Nizgorce Wielki [Pol], Nizgurtzy
Bol'shiye, Velikiye Nizhgurtsy, Velyka Nyzhirci, Bolshiye Nezgortsi

Bette Stoop Mas
USA


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Name of a shtetl in Ukraine #general

bette_sscf <bette_sscf@...>
 

Yael Polat in Israel wrote: << I have for the same person three different
names as a birth place: - Romanov - Nitzgoursa - Bolchi Nizgoura.
I cannot find the two last ones neither in JewishGen nor in Ukrainian maps,
in the vicinity of Romano/iv. Any ideas? The places' names are taken from
French documents.>>
---

Assuming that Nitzgoursa or Bolchi Nizgoura is located near Romaniv and
following my recommended search methodology for "Zausmer near Cracow" posted
three days ago, begin your search with the known locality.

JewishGen Communities < https://www.jewishgen.org/Communities/Search.asp >

Romaniv, Ukraine was Romanov in Novograd-Volynsky district, Volhynia
gubernia, Russia before WWI and in Zhitomir district, Ukraine SSR, Soviet
Union between the Wars; then it was Dzerzhinsk in Soviet Union and Ukraine.
Coordinates are 5009 2756. Alternate names: Romaniv [Ukr, since 2003],
Dzerzhyns'k [Ukr, 1933-2003], Romanov [Rus, Yid], Dzerzhinsk [Rus,
1933-2003], Romanow Wielki [Pol], Dsershinsk

A search for "Nitzgoursa" showing distance and direction >from 5009 2756
results include one significant Jewish community named Bolshiye Nizgortsy,
Ukraine located at 4953 2842, 38.7 miles ESE of Romaniv. Bolshiye Nizgortsy,
Ukraine was Bolshiye Nezgortzi in Berdischev district, Kiev gubernia, Russia
before WWI and in Zhitomir district, Ukraine SSR, Soviet Union between the
Wars; then it was Viliky Nyzgirtsi, Ukraine. Alternate names: Bol'shiye
Nizgortsy [Rus], Veliky Nyzgirtsi [Ukr], Nizgorce Wielki [Pol], Nizgurtzy
Bol'shiye, Velikiye Nizhgurtsy, Velyka Nyzhirci, Bolshiye Nezgortsi

Bette Stoop Mas
USA


New and Updated Databases on IGRA's Website #general

Elena Bazes
 

The Israel Genealogy Research Association (IGRA) has just released new
and updated databases on its website. There are now over 1 million
records available in our databases. We want to thank the participating
archives and the many volunteers who have prepared these databases.
With each release we provide a variety of records to our collection.

A preview of the databases is available at

https://www.slideshare.net/igra3/igra-release-august-2017

Updated Databases

Voters' List -- Knesset Israel, 1936 1,145 listings

This list comes >from the Central Zionist Archives. The people
mentioned here were eligible (considered adults) to vote in the
Assembly of Representatives (of the Jewish community in British
controlled Palestine). The information includes the name of the father
and the locality and is in Hebrew. (No images are available.)

Palestine Marriage/Divorce Certificates 5,006 listings

This addition is part of our ongoing project with the Israel State
Archives. Each certificate provides many details regarding the husband
and wife, their parents and -- in some instances -- the witnesses. The
certificates are primarily in Hebrew, but in some cases the names are
in English as well. It is possible to see the transcription of the
information on the spouse by doing a second search once you have the
name >from the certificate. (Images available.)

New Databases

HaShomer HaTzair Members in Galicia, 1919-1920 657 listings

This information comes >from the Archives at Givat Haviva. It is a
handwritten, alphabetical list in Latin characters. Alongside the name
is the city the person is from. (Images available.)

South Africans Fallen in Israel 1948-2010 87 listings

The information regarding the 87 people mentioned here is taken from
the Memorial in the Lavi Forest. In addition to the name, birth and
death dates are given when known. (No image are available.)

Members of the Histadrut HaMorim (Teacher's Union) 1945 3,819 listings

The information was located at the Tel Aviv University library and is
in Hebrew. The list mentions members according to city and school.
(Images available.)

Births to Cyprus Detainees, 1948-49 509 listings

In IGRA's continued cooperation with the JDC Archives we are able to
present this new database. >from 1946 until early 1949, the British
confined over 53,000 Jewish refugees not permitted to enter Palestine,
many of whom were Holocaust survivors, in detention camps on Cyprus.
These weekly lists document babies born to residents of the camps
during the period August 1948-February 1949. The lists record more
than 500 births and include date of birth, sex, mother's name, and
camp number. A link is provided on the detail page to the record on
the JDC Archive website. The lists are in English. (No images are
available.)

Hapoel Haifa Soccer Players 1955-2016 608 listings

These names represent players for Hapoel Haifa Soccer team over the
years and is available on the internet. The position played by each is
mentioned and sometimes a birth year is available. (No image are
available.)

Before viewing the databases, please register for free on the IGRA website:

http://genealogy.org.il/

To view the databases, go to http://genealogy.org.il/AID/index.php

Please note, images can be seen by paid IGRA members only. If you are
not an IGRA member, you will be able to see the transcriptions only.

Elena Biegel Bazes
IGRA Publicity Chairperson


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen New and Updated Databases on IGRA's Website #general

Elena Bazes
 

The Israel Genealogy Research Association (IGRA) has just released new
and updated databases on its website. There are now over 1 million
records available in our databases. We want to thank the participating
archives and the many volunteers who have prepared these databases.
With each release we provide a variety of records to our collection.

A preview of the databases is available at

https://www.slideshare.net/igra3/igra-release-august-2017

Updated Databases

Voters' List -- Knesset Israel, 1936 1,145 listings

This list comes >from the Central Zionist Archives. The people
mentioned here were eligible (considered adults) to vote in the
Assembly of Representatives (of the Jewish community in British
controlled Palestine). The information includes the name of the father
and the locality and is in Hebrew. (No images are available.)

Palestine Marriage/Divorce Certificates 5,006 listings

This addition is part of our ongoing project with the Israel State
Archives. Each certificate provides many details regarding the husband
and wife, their parents and -- in some instances -- the witnesses. The
certificates are primarily in Hebrew, but in some cases the names are
in English as well. It is possible to see the transcription of the
information on the spouse by doing a second search once you have the
name >from the certificate. (Images available.)

New Databases

HaShomer HaTzair Members in Galicia, 1919-1920 657 listings

This information comes >from the Archives at Givat Haviva. It is a
handwritten, alphabetical list in Latin characters. Alongside the name
is the city the person is from. (Images available.)

South Africans Fallen in Israel 1948-2010 87 listings

The information regarding the 87 people mentioned here is taken from
the Memorial in the Lavi Forest. In addition to the name, birth and
death dates are given when known. (No image are available.)

Members of the Histadrut HaMorim (Teacher's Union) 1945 3,819 listings

The information was located at the Tel Aviv University library and is
in Hebrew. The list mentions members according to city and school.
(Images available.)

Births to Cyprus Detainees, 1948-49 509 listings

In IGRA's continued cooperation with the JDC Archives we are able to
present this new database. >from 1946 until early 1949, the British
confined over 53,000 Jewish refugees not permitted to enter Palestine,
many of whom were Holocaust survivors, in detention camps on Cyprus.
These weekly lists document babies born to residents of the camps
during the period August 1948-February 1949. The lists record more
than 500 births and include date of birth, sex, mother's name, and
camp number. A link is provided on the detail page to the record on
the JDC Archive website. The lists are in English. (No images are
available.)

Hapoel Haifa Soccer Players 1955-2016 608 listings

These names represent players for Hapoel Haifa Soccer team over the
years and is available on the internet. The position played by each is
mentioned and sometimes a birth year is available. (No image are
available.)

Before viewing the databases, please register for free on the IGRA website:

http://genealogy.org.il/

To view the databases, go to http://genealogy.org.il/AID/index.php

Please note, images can be seen by paid IGRA members only. If you are
not an IGRA member, you will be able to see the transcriptions only.

Elena Biegel Bazes
IGRA Publicity Chairperson


IAJGS Records Access Alert Postings August 2017 #general

Jan Meisels Allen
 

As mentioned previously, every month I post a listing of the IAJGS Records
Access Alert topics >from the previous month for you to see the variety of
issues.some were posted on this discussion group as they were final edicts,
but advocacy, and pending legislation and regulations- were not posted to
the discussion group-all postings are included below. Any postings that had
a time limit for access, such as free access that has expired are not
included below.

. FamilySearch Extends Deadline for Ordering Microfilms One Week to
September 7

. (Australia) National Library of Australia Electronic Collections Expand
Due to Change in Copyright Law

. (Canada) Library of Canada Provides 1921 Census Free On Website

. (France) French National Archives Changes Rules for Publishing Images of
Items They Hold

. (Israel) Controversy Over Access Now that the Israel State Archives are
Digitizing Their Archives

. (UK) Data Protection Laws To Be Overhauled

. (UK) More on Expected Data Protection Bill

. (UK) Northhamptonshire Records Office Establishes Bad Precedent-Charging
Readers for Access in Outside Hours

. (UK) Genealogists Win! Northamptonshire Archive Withdraws Charging for
Archives Access!

. (UK, Singapore, Malay Peninsula) Royal Commonwealth Society Collection
Launches New Digital Archive: Voices of Civilian Internment: WWll Singapore

. (US) Congressional Research Service--Legislation Introduced to Assure
Public Access to their Reports

. (US) Google Loses Another Court Decision on Sharing Consumer Data with the
Federal Government; Big Tech Firms' Challenges

. (US) Legislation In US Congress Regarding Email Privacy

. (US) National Archives Draft National Archives Strategic Plan--Public
Comments Invited

. (US) US Supreme Court Announces New Electronic Filing System Free to
Public

. (US) US Privacy Rights Group Files FTC Complaint About Google's Store
Sales Measurement

. (US-CA) Facebook Settles Class Action Suit for Sharing Personal Posting
Information with Third Parties; Google Class Action Affirmed For Sharing
Users Internet Search Terms

. (US-IL) Governor Sigs Bill Giving Released Prisoners Free Birth
Certificates

. (US-Maine) Proposed Rules on Late-File Applications for Certificate of
Marriage

. (US-MO) Law Permits Adoptees to Obtain Original Birth Certificates

. (US-PA) Public Figures Facebook Page Ruled Public Records

. (US-PA) Pennsylvania Supreme Court Issues New Public Policy for Appellate
and Trial Court Cases

. (US-WA) Updated Washington State Public Records Act and Proposed Rules

IAJGS has opened its Records Access Alerts to anyone who is interested.
This was announced previously. We now have subscribers >from many
genealogical organizations not previously able to subscribe. To be on top of
what is happening I encourage you to register for the Records Access Alerts
to receive the information in a timely manner. If you are interested in any
of the above items, please register for the IAJGS Records Access Alert and
look at them in the archives. To register for the IAJGS Records Access
Alert go to: http://lists.iajgs.org/mailman/listinfo/records-access-alerts
and follow the instructions to enter your email address, full name and which
genealogical organization you belong to-a society, SIG or a subscriber of
JewishGen, Avotaynu Online, Legal Genealogist etc. You will receive an
email response that you have to reply to, or the subscription will not be
finalized. The alerts are archived and once you register you may access the
archives at: http://lists.iajgs.org/mailman/private/records-access-alerts/.
The IAJGS Records Access Alert is not a daily announcement list. Depending
on what happens worldwide, there may be no postings for several days and
other times there may be several in one day.

These are listed alphabetically not chronologically. Each month the locales
covered differ.

Jan Meisels Allen
Chairperson, IAJGS Public Records Access Monitoring Committee


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen IAJGS Records Access Alert Postings August 2017 #general

Jan Meisels Allen
 

As mentioned previously, every month I post a listing of the IAJGS Records
Access Alert topics >from the previous month for you to see the variety of
issues.some were posted on this discussion group as they were final edicts,
but advocacy, and pending legislation and regulations- were not posted to
the discussion group-all postings are included below. Any postings that had
a time limit for access, such as free access that has expired are not
included below.

. FamilySearch Extends Deadline for Ordering Microfilms One Week to
September 7

. (Australia) National Library of Australia Electronic Collections Expand
Due to Change in Copyright Law

. (Canada) Library of Canada Provides 1921 Census Free On Website

. (France) French National Archives Changes Rules for Publishing Images of
Items They Hold

. (Israel) Controversy Over Access Now that the Israel State Archives are
Digitizing Their Archives

. (UK) Data Protection Laws To Be Overhauled

. (UK) More on Expected Data Protection Bill

. (UK) Northhamptonshire Records Office Establishes Bad Precedent-Charging
Readers for Access in Outside Hours

. (UK) Genealogists Win! Northamptonshire Archive Withdraws Charging for
Archives Access!

. (UK, Singapore, Malay Peninsula) Royal Commonwealth Society Collection
Launches New Digital Archive: Voices of Civilian Internment: WWll Singapore

. (US) Congressional Research Service--Legislation Introduced to Assure
Public Access to their Reports

. (US) Google Loses Another Court Decision on Sharing Consumer Data with the
Federal Government; Big Tech Firms' Challenges

. (US) Legislation In US Congress Regarding Email Privacy

. (US) National Archives Draft National Archives Strategic Plan--Public
Comments Invited

. (US) US Supreme Court Announces New Electronic Filing System Free to
Public

. (US) US Privacy Rights Group Files FTC Complaint About Google's Store
Sales Measurement

. (US-CA) Facebook Settles Class Action Suit for Sharing Personal Posting
Information with Third Parties; Google Class Action Affirmed For Sharing
Users Internet Search Terms

. (US-IL) Governor Sigs Bill Giving Released Prisoners Free Birth
Certificates

. (US-Maine) Proposed Rules on Late-File Applications for Certificate of
Marriage

. (US-MO) Law Permits Adoptees to Obtain Original Birth Certificates

. (US-PA) Public Figures Facebook Page Ruled Public Records

. (US-PA) Pennsylvania Supreme Court Issues New Public Policy for Appellate
and Trial Court Cases

. (US-WA) Updated Washington State Public Records Act and Proposed Rules

IAJGS has opened its Records Access Alerts to anyone who is interested.
This was announced previously. We now have subscribers >from many
genealogical organizations not previously able to subscribe. To be on top of
what is happening I encourage you to register for the Records Access Alerts
to receive the information in a timely manner. If you are interested in any
of the above items, please register for the IAJGS Records Access Alert and
look at them in the archives. To register for the IAJGS Records Access
Alert go to: http://lists.iajgs.org/mailman/listinfo/records-access-alerts
and follow the instructions to enter your email address, full name and which
genealogical organization you belong to-a society, SIG or a subscriber of
JewishGen, Avotaynu Online, Legal Genealogist etc. You will receive an
email response that you have to reply to, or the subscription will not be
finalized. The alerts are archived and once you register you may access the
archives at: http://lists.iajgs.org/mailman/private/records-access-alerts/.
The IAJGS Records Access Alert is not a daily announcement list. Depending
on what happens worldwide, there may be no postings for several days and
other times there may be several in one day.

These are listed alphabetically not chronologically. Each month the locales
covered differ.

Jan Meisels Allen
Chairperson, IAJGS Public Records Access Monitoring Committee


Re: Overseas non-residents on revision lists? #lithuania

Jonathan Alcantara <jalcantara@...>
 

Let me add to this >from my own experience with these documents.

While in many Revision Lists and Family Lists there are notations for
changes like "died", "missing", it also seems clear that there were
people who were listed without officials checking whether they were
actually present. Existing lists were sometimes just updated with the
appropriate increase in age.

These were not census records. My understanding is that these were
administrative exercises, with the original goal of tracking males
for taxation and conscription. Females were not always recorded. When
compiling a new one, the previous revision/family list may have been
cross-checked with other records such as births and deaths, but not
in all cases. People who were registered in other towns were
sometimes listed, with that registration noted. In other cases,
people who clearly lived in town (as seen >from birth records) but
were registered elsewhere were missed out. Sometimes people who were
registered but had moved away were listed as "missing" in one town,
and not recorded at all in the town where they actually had moved to
but not yet re-registered.

And when people emigrated, and many did so illegally, they would
remain registered, and could be listed as missing, or could simply be
listed with an updated age, so a researcher may get the false
impression they were present. In these cases, the official could not
have been checking the homes of these people, they simply "cut and
paste" >from the previous list. I have seen a number of examples of
that, to my recollection they are all after 1900. But I would posit
that there is no consistent rule for this. We also don't know about
the motivations for the officials - it may have been in their
interest, either financially, or for hiding the fact that
conscription-age men had secretly emigrated, to neglect to record
that those people had left the town. I have seen conscription lists
where they helpfully listed the conscriptee, his father and brothers,
leaving out the fact that all had emigrated earlier.

There was an actual Russian census, I believe in 1897, which looks
much more like a true census and tries to record all the people. I
have at least one family where the younger daughters all suddenly
appear on the 1897 census, although some of them would have been born
at the time of the preceding revision list, but do not show up.

I think the main point to take away >from the original question is
that a researcher should not treat the Family lists as if they were a
census. There were a number of motivations behind them, but
accurately recording the identity of all people in a given place was
not one of them. The presence of a name on a list does not mean that
person was there, and the absence >from a list does not mean he or she
was not there in that year. They are, like all the Litvak data,
simply another fragment of information that helps us piece together
the puzzle of the past.

Jonathan

At 12:53 2017-09-04, David Ellis djemkitso@verizon.net wrote:
Jules Feldman asks:

My suspicion is that the relevant official took a previous list and updated
the ages without checking who was present in the town.
What can the mavens tell us?

I may or may not be a maven, but my experience with revision lists from
Lithuania is that the officials did ask about people who were previously
recorded and not present, noting their current status, e.g. died,
conscripted, moved away. That may be why the census records were called
revision lists!


Lithuania SIG #Lithuania Re:Overseas non-residents on revision lists? #lithuania

Jonathan Alcantara <jalcantara@...>
 

Let me add to this >from my own experience with these documents.

While in many Revision Lists and Family Lists there are notations for
changes like "died", "missing", it also seems clear that there were
people who were listed without officials checking whether they were
actually present. Existing lists were sometimes just updated with the
appropriate increase in age.

These were not census records. My understanding is that these were
administrative exercises, with the original goal of tracking males
for taxation and conscription. Females were not always recorded. When
compiling a new one, the previous revision/family list may have been
cross-checked with other records such as births and deaths, but not
in all cases. People who were registered in other towns were
sometimes listed, with that registration noted. In other cases,
people who clearly lived in town (as seen >from birth records) but
were registered elsewhere were missed out. Sometimes people who were
registered but had moved away were listed as "missing" in one town,
and not recorded at all in the town where they actually had moved to
but not yet re-registered.

And when people emigrated, and many did so illegally, they would
remain registered, and could be listed as missing, or could simply be
listed with an updated age, so a researcher may get the false
impression they were present. In these cases, the official could not
have been checking the homes of these people, they simply "cut and
paste" >from the previous list. I have seen a number of examples of
that, to my recollection they are all after 1900. But I would posit
that there is no consistent rule for this. We also don't know about
the motivations for the officials - it may have been in their
interest, either financially, or for hiding the fact that
conscription-age men had secretly emigrated, to neglect to record
that those people had left the town. I have seen conscription lists
where they helpfully listed the conscriptee, his father and brothers,
leaving out the fact that all had emigrated earlier.

There was an actual Russian census, I believe in 1897, which looks
much more like a true census and tries to record all the people. I
have at least one family where the younger daughters all suddenly
appear on the 1897 census, although some of them would have been born
at the time of the preceding revision list, but do not show up.

I think the main point to take away >from the original question is
that a researcher should not treat the Family lists as if they were a
census. There were a number of motivations behind them, but
accurately recording the identity of all people in a given place was
not one of them. The presence of a name on a list does not mean that
person was there, and the absence >from a list does not mean he or she
was not there in that year. They are, like all the Litvak data,
simply another fragment of information that helps us piece together
the puzzle of the past.

Jonathan

At 12:53 2017-09-04, David Ellis djemkitso@verizon.net wrote:
Jules Feldman asks:

My suspicion is that the relevant official took a previous list and updated
the ages without checking who was present in the town.
What can the mavens tell us?

I may or may not be a maven, but my experience with revision lists from
Lithuania is that the officials did ask about people who were previously
recorded and not present, noting their current status, e.g. died,
conscripted, moved away. That may be why the census records were called
revision lists!


Revision Lists #lithuania

Matthew Klionsky <klionsky@...>
 

About listings on Revision Lists of people known to have moved away...

Did you check all the information fields on the list? Sometimes
there are notations, such as 'moved away' or 'died'. Such
annotations 'revise' the prior list with new information, and
clue the census-takers about whether (and where) to seek that
person when the next (future) revision rolls around.

Matt Klionsky
Chicago


Lithuania SIG #Lithuania Revision Lists #lithuania

Matthew Klionsky <klionsky@...>
 

About listings on Revision Lists of people known to have moved away...

Did you check all the information fields on the list? Sometimes
there are notations, such as 'moved away' or 'died'. Such
annotations 'revise' the prior list with new information, and
clue the census-takers about whether (and where) to seek that
person when the next (future) revision rolls around.

Matt Klionsky
Chicago


View Mate Translations - Russian #poland

Lois Jolson <lrjolson@...>
 

I am looking to translate the following:

http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM60081

http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM60080

http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM58947

All three are in Russian. I am particularly interested in full
names and dates as well as any occupations that are listed.
In the case of marriages, Names of parents would be exceptional!

Thank you so much for any help you can be in advance!

Lois Jolson


JRI Poland #Poland View Mate Translations - Russian #poland

Lois Jolson <lrjolson@...>
 

I am looking to translate the following:

http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM60081

http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM60080

http://www.jewishgen.org/viewmate/viewmateview.asp?key=VM58947

All three are in Russian. I am particularly interested in full
names and dates as well as any occupations that are listed.
In the case of marriages, Names of parents would be exceptional!

Thank you so much for any help you can be in advance!

Lois Jolson


Gary and Jeffory Jonsohn #southafrica

George Ryner <gwryner@...>
 

I am searching for Gary and Jefforie Jonsohn last believed to be in Port
Elizabeth. They are sons of my father cousin. I would grateful for any
information in regards to Rhee and their families.
Thanking everyone in advance.
George Ryner
gwryner@gmail.com


South Africa SIG #SouthAfrica Gary and Jeffory Jonsohn #southafrica

George Ryner <gwryner@...>
 

I am searching for Gary and Jefforie Jonsohn last believed to be in Port
Elizabeth. They are sons of my father cousin. I would grateful for any
information in regards to Rhee and their families.
Thanking everyone in advance.
George Ryner
gwryner@gmail.com


Johannesburg, Goldene Medina exhibition #southafrica

Saul Issroff
 

Johannesburg, Goldene Medina exhibition

https://youtu.be/G0ktDlQwqLU

Saul Issroff


South Africa SIG #SouthAfrica Johannesburg, Goldene Medina exhibition #southafrica

Saul Issroff
 

Johannesburg, Goldene Medina exhibition

https://youtu.be/G0ktDlQwqLU

Saul Issroff

49581 - 49600 of 658010