Date   

Helen/Elke #belarus

Avrohom Krauss <avkrauss@...>
 

The name "Helen" is a good choice for "Elke", especially if your family
comes >from a vicinity (Eg. parts of Russian Poland) where the "H" sound
is dropped (like the Cockneys of England). Then, "Helen" is said like
"Ellen", which is similar enough to be used for "Elke".

BTW, much to my dismay, this accent transfered over to Israel, where
words with the letter "Heh" sound like written with an "Aleph". I find
myself engaged in a seemingly loosing battle correcting my kids about
this!

Avrohom Krauss
Telz-Stone Israel


Belarus SIG #Belarus Helen/Elke #belarus

Avrohom Krauss <avkrauss@...>
 

The name "Helen" is a good choice for "Elke", especially if your family
comes >from a vicinity (Eg. parts of Russian Poland) where the "H" sound
is dropped (like the Cockneys of England). Then, "Helen" is said like
"Ellen", which is similar enough to be used for "Elke".

BTW, much to my dismay, this accent transfered over to Israel, where
words with the letter "Heh" sound like written with an "Aleph". I find
myself engaged in a seemingly loosing battle correcting my kids about
this!

Avrohom Krauss
Telz-Stone Israel


Cuba--Cemetery (Havana/Guanabacoa) #general

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
 

In my effort to learn about my ALHADEF family in Cuba, I would like to
know what is printed on four tombstones for people whom I believe are
family members. I have found someone in Cuba who is willing to visit
the cemetery. I know that the cemetery is called "Cementerio Sefardi"
and that it is in a place near Havana called Guanabacoa. But now I
need to tell this person exactly where the cemetery is located!

Can anyone describe the location of the Cementerio Sefardi in
Havana/Guanabacoa?? Perhaps it is on or near some well-known street
or landmark?

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@mail.wittenberg.edu>

P.S. The tombstones I am looking for there are:

Ventura Alhadef Arrobas, 10 agosto 1952
Jacobo Altalef, 4 abril 1948, B-25-15
Rafael Alhadef Arrobas, 21 abril 1966, B-38-2
Fany Alhadef Avanda, 3 agosto 1983
_______________________________________
Toronto and New York: ENGLANDER.
Cuba: ALHADEFF and BENHAIM. Argentina: DE VIDAS.
Paris: FRESKO. Leipzig: KAZEZ
Florida: LEBOY. New Jersey: STRAUSBERG

MODERATOR NOTE: Perhaps when you get an address for the cemetery, you can
also pass it along to the IAJGS Cemetery Project at <Phrases1@aol.com>.


Re: Poor Jews'Temporary Shelter -England #general

Colin Plen
 

In England there was an establishment of Jews who had been there for many
years. As they saw what the Germans called the Ostjuden, the poor Jews from
the East, coming into the country they decided that numbers of this class
of Jew coming into England would lower them in the eyes of the English
gentiles. So they set up the refuge in order to care for the poor Jews and
get them out of the country as soon as possible. They were sent on to
America, South Africa, Australia, so as not to embarass themselves.
The Shelter was indeed a shelter and a tzedakah was performed but it was
done to hurry the embarassments out of the country.
Colin Plen
Jewish Genealogical Society Johannesburg


Greetings,
I was able to get information >from the site of the Poor Jews' Temporary
Shelter Database however there was no explanation what the Shelter did.
I'm interested in what kind of help the Shelter offered.
Thank you,
Marcia Indianer Meyers
marciarthur@msn.com


Records of WW I Servicemen from Pennsylvania #general

Elless <elless@...>
 

There have been a number of inquiries about the availability of records of
servicemen >from WW I. Does anyone know whether or not such records exist
for Pennsylvania? My father's brother, for whom I was named, was killed in
the Battle of the Meusse Argonne just days before the war ended. I am
trying to find information about him, but without some knowledge of his
unit, it doesn't seem to be possible.
Lewis Stein
Boynton Beach, FL


Congregation "Ahawath Chesed" #general

DOFRANK@...
 

We have in our possession, what seems to be a prayer book, written in German
& Hebrew, and which has been entered in the Library of Congress, Washington,
DC

The cover is in Hebrew and German, neither of which we read or understand.
The German is as follows:
GEBETE
fur ben
Offentlichen Gottesdienft
Der
Tempelgemeinde AHAWATH CHESED
georbnet von
Dr. A. HUEBSCH
Rabbiner berfelben
________________________________
New-York
Drud von L. G. Frant & Co., 687 Broadway
5632-1872

(This was very difficult to read and we hope we have included the proper
information.)

The opening left-hand page of the book is as follows:
GOTTESDIENFT
Sabbath und Feittage of (Feifttage)

The facing page reads as follows:

Entered according to Act of Congress, in the year 1872,
BY THE CONGREGATION "AHAWATH CHESED,"
In the Office of the Librarian of Congress,at Washington

If anyone is familiar with this prayer book or this congregation, please
contact me privately at dofrank@aol.com

Thanks

Don Frank
Lake Mary, FL (NE of Orlando)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Cuba--Cemetery (Havana/Guanabacoa) #general

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@...>
 

In my effort to learn about my ALHADEF family in Cuba, I would like to
know what is printed on four tombstones for people whom I believe are
family members. I have found someone in Cuba who is willing to visit
the cemetery. I know that the cemetery is called "Cementerio Sefardi"
and that it is in a place near Havana called Guanabacoa. But now I
need to tell this person exactly where the cemetery is located!

Can anyone describe the location of the Cementerio Sefardi in
Havana/Guanabacoa?? Perhaps it is on or near some well-known street
or landmark?

Daniel Kazez <dkazez@mail.wittenberg.edu>

P.S. The tombstones I am looking for there are:

Ventura Alhadef Arrobas, 10 agosto 1952
Jacobo Altalef, 4 abril 1948, B-25-15
Rafael Alhadef Arrobas, 21 abril 1966, B-38-2
Fany Alhadef Avanda, 3 agosto 1983
_______________________________________
Toronto and New York: ENGLANDER.
Cuba: ALHADEFF and BENHAIM. Argentina: DE VIDAS.
Paris: FRESKO. Leipzig: KAZEZ
Florida: LEBOY. New Jersey: STRAUSBERG

MODERATOR NOTE: Perhaps when you get an address for the cemetery, you can
also pass it along to the IAJGS Cemetery Project at <Phrases1@aol.com>.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Poor Jews'Temporary Shelter -England #general

Colin Plen
 

In England there was an establishment of Jews who had been there for many
years. As they saw what the Germans called the Ostjuden, the poor Jews from
the East, coming into the country they decided that numbers of this class
of Jew coming into England would lower them in the eyes of the English
gentiles. So they set up the refuge in order to care for the poor Jews and
get them out of the country as soon as possible. They were sent on to
America, South Africa, Australia, so as not to embarass themselves.
The Shelter was indeed a shelter and a tzedakah was performed but it was
done to hurry the embarassments out of the country.
Colin Plen
Jewish Genealogical Society Johannesburg


Greetings,
I was able to get information >from the site of the Poor Jews' Temporary
Shelter Database however there was no explanation what the Shelter did.
I'm interested in what kind of help the Shelter offered.
Thank you,
Marcia Indianer Meyers
marciarthur@msn.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Records of WW I Servicemen from Pennsylvania #general

Elless <elless@...>
 

There have been a number of inquiries about the availability of records of
servicemen >from WW I. Does anyone know whether or not such records exist
for Pennsylvania? My father's brother, for whom I was named, was killed in
the Battle of the Meusse Argonne just days before the war ended. I am
trying to find information about him, but without some knowledge of his
unit, it doesn't seem to be possible.
Lewis Stein
Boynton Beach, FL


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Congregation "Ahawath Chesed" #general

DOFRANK@...
 

We have in our possession, what seems to be a prayer book, written in German
& Hebrew, and which has been entered in the Library of Congress, Washington,
DC

The cover is in Hebrew and German, neither of which we read or understand.
The German is as follows:
GEBETE
fur ben
Offentlichen Gottesdienft
Der
Tempelgemeinde AHAWATH CHESED
georbnet von
Dr. A. HUEBSCH
Rabbiner berfelben
________________________________
New-York
Drud von L. G. Frant & Co., 687 Broadway
5632-1872

(This was very difficult to read and we hope we have included the proper
information.)

The opening left-hand page of the book is as follows:
GOTTESDIENFT
Sabbath und Feittage of (Feifttage)

The facing page reads as follows:

Entered according to Act of Congress, in the year 1872,
BY THE CONGREGATION "AHAWATH CHESED,"
In the Office of the Librarian of Congress,at Washington

If anyone is familiar with this prayer book or this congregation, please
contact me privately at dofrank@aol.com

Thanks

Don Frank
Lake Mary, FL (NE of Orlando)


Re: Sailing from the port of Trieste #ukraine

Jeffrey Knisbacher <jknisbac@...>
 

With regard to sailings >from Trieste (re the SADKOVSKY emigration by Mark
Tauger in yesterday's Digest), my maternal grandfather Solomon LEHMAN
(Schlojme LIMONCZYK, 1889-1972, >from Orinin, district of Kamenetz Podolsk,
Ukr) sailed >from Trieste on the Carpathia (the ship that rescued the
survivors of the Titanic) on 4 June 1913, arriving in NY on 23 June 1913.
Unfortunately, until I discovered the ship manifest at the National Archives
several years ago, no one in the family was aware of this. I assume my
grandfather knew the ship had been the one involved in the Titanic rescue,
but he, apparently, never spoke of it to his son or daughter, so we really
don't know. Nor do we know why or how he came to sail >from Trieste. Until
[Jerry's] posting, this is the first sailing >from Trieste I have come across.
Most were >from Amsterdam, Hamburg, Bremen, Southhampton, etc.--in our
family, at least. Jeff KNISBACHER, Owings Mills, MD
P.S. The Carpathia was sunk by a German u-boat in 1918.

Searching, Maternal: Kamenetz Podolsk (esp. Orinin) and environs in Russia and Romania for TISSENBAUM, LIMONCHIK/LIMONCIC/LEMONIC(K)/LIMONIC(K),
GELSTEIN/GOLDSTEIN, GIL(L)MAN/GEL(L)MAN, HETTLEMAN/GITELMAN, ROSENTHAL, YAGOLNITZER/JAGOLINZER/LINZER/YAGOL/YARNELL, ZIPPERMAN, BERG/BARG,
SEIDLER, TABACHNIK/TABACINIC/TABB/TABOR, TANNENBAUM, WAXMAN, GOIKHMAN/HOCHMAN, SEGAL, CHUC(H)ALTER/SCHULTER/SHOR(E)

[*Edited to 6 allowed lines of research surnames]

My maternal grandfather ( Sholem Asher SADKOVSKY when he left Russia,
Samuel SADOWSKY once he was settled in Brooklyn) abandoned the army and
left for the US in 1904 as well. He was >from Murafa (south of Vinnitsa)
in Podolia, and somehow found his way to Trieste to sail to NY. One
speaker at the JGS meeting two years ago in NY said that people
sometimes departed >from Trieste because it was cheaper, but I wonder if
there weren't other compelling reasons for this choice.

Jerry Touger
Milton MA USA


Ukraine SIG #Ukraine Re: Sailing from the port of Trieste #ukraine

Jeffrey Knisbacher <jknisbac@...>
 

With regard to sailings >from Trieste (re the SADKOVSKY emigration by Mark
Tauger in yesterday's Digest), my maternal grandfather Solomon LEHMAN
(Schlojme LIMONCZYK, 1889-1972, >from Orinin, district of Kamenetz Podolsk,
Ukr) sailed >from Trieste on the Carpathia (the ship that rescued the
survivors of the Titanic) on 4 June 1913, arriving in NY on 23 June 1913.
Unfortunately, until I discovered the ship manifest at the National Archives
several years ago, no one in the family was aware of this. I assume my
grandfather knew the ship had been the one involved in the Titanic rescue,
but he, apparently, never spoke of it to his son or daughter, so we really
don't know. Nor do we know why or how he came to sail >from Trieste. Until
[Jerry's] posting, this is the first sailing >from Trieste I have come across.
Most were >from Amsterdam, Hamburg, Bremen, Southhampton, etc.--in our
family, at least. Jeff KNISBACHER, Owings Mills, MD
P.S. The Carpathia was sunk by a German u-boat in 1918.

Searching, Maternal: Kamenetz Podolsk (esp. Orinin) and environs in Russia and Romania for TISSENBAUM, LIMONCHIK/LIMONCIC/LEMONIC(K)/LIMONIC(K),
GELSTEIN/GOLDSTEIN, GIL(L)MAN/GEL(L)MAN, HETTLEMAN/GITELMAN, ROSENTHAL, YAGOLNITZER/JAGOLINZER/LINZER/YAGOL/YARNELL, ZIPPERMAN, BERG/BARG,
SEIDLER, TABACHNIK/TABACINIC/TABB/TABOR, TANNENBAUM, WAXMAN, GOIKHMAN/HOCHMAN, SEGAL, CHUC(H)ALTER/SCHULTER/SHOR(E)

[*Edited to 6 allowed lines of research surnames]

My maternal grandfather ( Sholem Asher SADKOVSKY when he left Russia,
Samuel SADOWSKY once he was settled in Brooklyn) abandoned the army and
left for the US in 1904 as well. He was >from Murafa (south of Vinnitsa)
in Podolia, and somehow found his way to Trieste to sail to NY. One
speaker at the JGS meeting two years ago in NY said that people
sometimes departed >from Trieste because it was cheaper, but I wonder if
there weren't other compelling reasons for this choice.

Jerry Touger
Milton MA USA


Relative Match or Y chromosome test #dna

Jill Rothwell <info@...>
 

Can the Relative Match or Y chromosome test be done on human hair, or does
this need to be >from a buccal smear. My father now recently deceased is the
last male of his line.
Many thanks on this.

Jill Rothwell


DNA Research #DNA Relative Match or Y chromosome test #dna

Jill Rothwell <info@...>
 

Can the Relative Match or Y chromosome test be done on human hair, or does
this need to be >from a buccal smear. My father now recently deceased is the
last male of his line.
Many thanks on this.

Jill Rothwell


Genealogy not Anthropology #dna

Bcg <bcg@...>
 

I would like to make a few brief comments to the genealogy group on this
subject.

First I completely agree with Chaim that the settling of Europe and
Russia took place by many migrating peoples and the belief
that there is a clean understanding of where a specific haplotype actually
originated is not firmly established.

Second This is a developing area of anthropology, is yet not ready
to be drawn on for definitive conclusions. One opinion on
the direction of a haplotypes movement does not settle the debate, and
bears precious little meaning for Jewish Genealogists and the goals that
this discussion group was established to answer. Our group discussion
would better be served by sticking to genealogy, our stated topic, rather
than anthropology.

Third Haplotype K refers to mutations that have
built up over time on the mtDNA sequence, which is a female passed marker,
not a Y or male marker per se, although, males do get the mtDNA >from their
mothers. At present, the databases of existing Jewish DNA are not
large enough to draw intelligent conclusions about Jewish
groups and their association with specific haplotypes. This is a problem
that Family Tree DNA is currently working on (see the next issue of Avotaynu
for details).

These developments in anthropology are interesting but I would ask that we
in this group refocus on questions of genealogy.


Bennett Greenspan FTDNA HOUSTON


MODERATOR'S NOTE: This list is about the ability to perform DNA testing
and the best test candidate. If you wish to continue the anthropological
merits feel free to do so privately. THIS THREAD IS ENDED!


DNA Research #DNA Genealogy not Anthropology #dna

Bcg <bcg@...>
 

I would like to make a few brief comments to the genealogy group on this
subject.

First I completely agree with Chaim that the settling of Europe and
Russia took place by many migrating peoples and the belief
that there is a clean understanding of where a specific haplotype actually
originated is not firmly established.

Second This is a developing area of anthropology, is yet not ready
to be drawn on for definitive conclusions. One opinion on
the direction of a haplotypes movement does not settle the debate, and
bears precious little meaning for Jewish Genealogists and the goals that
this discussion group was established to answer. Our group discussion
would better be served by sticking to genealogy, our stated topic, rather
than anthropology.

Third Haplotype K refers to mutations that have
built up over time on the mtDNA sequence, which is a female passed marker,
not a Y or male marker per se, although, males do get the mtDNA >from their
mothers. At present, the databases of existing Jewish DNA are not
large enough to draw intelligent conclusions about Jewish
groups and their association with specific haplotypes. This is a problem
that Family Tree DNA is currently working on (see the next issue of Avotaynu
for details).

These developments in anthropology are interesting but I would ask that we
in this group refocus on questions of genealogy.


Bennett Greenspan FTDNA HOUSTON


MODERATOR'S NOTE: This list is about the ability to perform DNA testing
and the best test candidate. If you wish to continue the anthropological
merits feel free to do so privately. THIS THREAD IS ENDED!


Re: Descent from Rashi #general

sallybru@...
 

There is no necessity of having 'uniform distribution' of marriages. Over
1000 years, no one remembers whether their 20th great grandfather was a
famous rabbi and that person will marry whomever the parent decides (with
arranged marriages).

What is important to remember is that our ancestors moved around a lot more
that we often think. My great great grandfather and his 2 known brothers
lived in 3 seperate shtetls, they were born somewhere else around Augustow,
Poland-a nephew was born in Marseille, France but came to the US >from the
Augustow region. In another line, my grandfather was >from Berdichev-his
brother was born in Odessa.

I am not unique in this. That is the reason JRI-PP is so successful. If you
have ever been to a genealogy conference, this is one of the main points of
some of the excellent talks!

Sally Bruckheimer
Buffalo, NY


ViewMate 440 #general

Klein Family <kleins4@...>
 

I have posted at ViewMate 440
(http://www.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/toview140.html#vm440) a birth record
of my gguncle. The record is >from Lodz in 1885 and is in Cyrillic
script. I would appreciate any efforts at translation of this record.
Jon Klein


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Descent from Rashi #general

sallybru@...
 

There is no necessity of having 'uniform distribution' of marriages. Over
1000 years, no one remembers whether their 20th great grandfather was a
famous rabbi and that person will marry whomever the parent decides (with
arranged marriages).

What is important to remember is that our ancestors moved around a lot more
that we often think. My great great grandfather and his 2 known brothers
lived in 3 seperate shtetls, they were born somewhere else around Augustow,
Poland-a nephew was born in Marseille, France but came to the US >from the
Augustow region. In another line, my grandfather was >from Berdichev-his
brother was born in Odessa.

I am not unique in this. That is the reason JRI-PP is so successful. If you
have ever been to a genealogy conference, this is one of the main points of
some of the excellent talks!

Sally Bruckheimer
Buffalo, NY


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen ViewMate 440 #general

Klein Family <kleins4@...>
 

I have posted at ViewMate 440
(http://www.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/toview140.html#vm440) a birth record
of my gguncle. The record is >from Lodz in 1885 and is in Cyrillic
script. I would appreciate any efforts at translation of this record.
Jon Klein