Is it correct to
assume that one who pronounces Yiddish/Hebrew words in this manner has a
Chicago-area connection. I don't know, but I'd love to find out

Well, all my grandparents used the pronunciations you cited:

instead pronounced as "ie" (as in matzie,
challie shivie,
bubie, latkie, shiksie, pushkie, and kishkie). Yet there are other words
that seem to qualify, but for some reason, don't ("mitzvah,
mikvah, bimah,

except I never heard anyone "shivie." That word belonged to the second
group you list, which were pronounced as though they had the same vowel "i"
as in "his" in both syllables.

Now that I think about it, maybe they used the same "i" sound in all the
words. The "ie" could have been a trait of the second generation, who
didn't have Yiddish as a first language.

All my grandparents were Litvaks, one >from Lita, the others >from Grodno
Gubernia. Each of my mother's parents had siblings in Chicago. Does that
qualify as a Chicago connection?

Martin Miller in Syracuse, NY
mailto:millerm@mailbox.syr.edu
http://web.syr.edu/~millerm/index.htm

Is it correct to
assume that one who pronounces Yiddish/Hebrew words in this manner has a
Chicago-area connection. I don't know, but I'd love to find out

Well, all my grandparents used the pronunciations you cited:

instead pronounced as "ie" (as in matzie,
challie shivie,
bubie, latkie, shiksie, pushkie, and kishkie). Yet there are other words
that seem to qualify, but for some reason, don't ("mitzvah,
mikvah, bimah,

except I never heard anyone "shivie." That word belonged to the second
group you list, which were pronounced as though they had the same vowel "i"
as in "his" in both syllables.

Now that I think about it, maybe they used the same "i" sound in all the
words. The "ie" could have been a trait of the second generation, who
didn't have Yiddish as a first language.

All my grandparents were Litvaks, one >from Lita, the others >from Grodno
Gubernia. Each of my mother's parents had siblings in Chicago. Does that
qualify as a Chicago connection?

Martin Miller in Syracuse, NY
mailto:millerm@mailbox.syr.edu
http://web.syr.edu/~millerm/index.htm

Thank you to everyonbe who replied to my question and two 'professions'
Stryj and Drohovyse.
I realise my mistake.
Thanks again
Leslie Safran Barson

Thank you to everyonbe who replied to my question and two 'professions'
Stryj and Drohovyse.
I realise my mistake.
Thanks again
Leslie Safran Barson

I have been interested to read of the recent correspondence regarding
synagogues as repositories of genealogy information. Some years ago on a
family visit to the UK I was asked to look at a local synagogue's archives
which included their collection of ritual objects, textiles and written
material with a view to cataloguing them and later exhibiting them in an
exhibition to mark a forthcoming milestone in the synagogue's history.

I was able to able to examine the different places of storage and succeeded
in setting up a card index of all the various items, including archival
material and other objects. >from a point of view of genealogy, most of
the ritual items were engraved with an inscription. Textiles including ark
curtains and torah covers also contained an embroidered inscription.
Usually the inscription contained the name of the donor and in whose memory
it was given, often in Hebrew, sometimes also in English often with dates.
Sometimes an event was commemorated such as someone who was killed in the
first World War in a particular battle. Sometimes the donor would
indicate in the inscription their relationship to the person they were
commemorating, such as daughter in memory of her mother.

Of the written material, apart >from correspondence, committee notes etc.
there were Hashcaba Books which noted the forthcoming (Hebrew) date of the
anniversary of a death of a congregant (or family members). It was the
custom in this community to make a hashcaba for all deceased members of the
congregation each Shabbat afternoon for eleven months after their death,
and there was a special notebook in the Rabbi's seat in the synagogue,
recording this practice over a twenty year period. Offerings books >from
the Community's first years, for use in the Synagogue on Shabbat contained
an alphabetical list of worshippers with triangular indentations for
various amounts that were offered. A further group of offerings books
recorded the actual sums that had been received, in respect of different
mitzvoth/aliyot given.

A storage area revealed piles of old and torn books, many were prayerbooks
belonging to deceased congregants, usually inscribed both on the outer
cover and often written in the inner cover. Among these books there were
much archival material relating to the early years of the Congregation,
such as a printed dated booklet containing a list of congregation members

from the Synagogue's first years, with their addresses which had somehow

also found its way into this 'geniza' which I was lucky enough to add to
the archives, for when I went back some months later, the storage place was
empty. The Rabbi had taken the opportunity for a clear out and had buried
everything according to custom.

It's often struck me since, that synagogues can be a good source and
repository for hunting out genealogy information.

Rosemary Eshel
Israel
dreshel@internet-zahav.net

I have been interested to read of the recent correspondence regarding
synagogues as repositories of genealogy information. Some years ago on a
family visit to the UK I was asked to look at a local synagogue's archives
which included their collection of ritual objects, textiles and written
material with a view to cataloguing them and later exhibiting them in an
exhibition to mark a forthcoming milestone in the synagogue's history.

I was able to able to examine the different places of storage and succeeded
in setting up a card index of all the various items, including archival
material and other objects. >from a point of view of genealogy, most of
the ritual items were engraved with an inscription. Textiles including ark
curtains and torah covers also contained an embroidered inscription.
Usually the inscription contained the name of the donor and in whose memory
it was given, often in Hebrew, sometimes also in English often with dates.
Sometimes an event was commemorated such as someone who was killed in the
first World War in a particular battle. Sometimes the donor would
indicate in the inscription their relationship to the person they were
commemorating, such as daughter in memory of her mother.

Of the written material, apart >from correspondence, committee notes etc.
there were Hashcaba Books which noted the forthcoming (Hebrew) date of the
anniversary of a death of a congregant (or family members). It was the
custom in this community to make a hashcaba for all deceased members of the
congregation each Shabbat afternoon for eleven months after their death,
and there was a special notebook in the Rabbi's seat in the synagogue,
recording this practice over a twenty year period. Offerings books >from
the Community's first years, for use in the Synagogue on Shabbat contained
an alphabetical list of worshippers with triangular indentations for
various amounts that were offered. A further group of offerings books
recorded the actual sums that had been received, in respect of different
mitzvoth/aliyot given.

A storage area revealed piles of old and torn books, many were prayerbooks
belonging to deceased congregants, usually inscribed both on the outer
cover and often written in the inner cover. Among these books there were
much archival material relating to the early years of the Congregation,
such as a printed dated booklet containing a list of congregation members

from the Synagogue's first years, with their addresses which had somehow

also found its way into this 'geniza' which I was lucky enough to add to
the archives, for when I went back some months later, the storage place was
empty. The Rabbi had taken the opportunity for a clear out and had buried
everything according to custom.

It's often struck me since, that synagogues can be a good source and
repository for hunting out genealogy information.

Rosemary Eshel
Israel
dreshel@internet-zahav.net

Dear JewishGenners,

Does anybody have information about a town in Poland called Karolinow,
gubernia Radom, province Opatow ? My ancestor was born here, I can't
situate it on a map.

Thanks to all.

Bernard Sainquain France.

Dear JewishGenners,

Does anybody have information about a town in Poland called Karolinow,
gubernia Radom, province Opatow ? My ancestor was born here, I can't
situate it on a map.

Thanks to all.

Bernard Sainquain France.

In response to Anita Citron's posting, the conference
in London is not in June, it's scheduled for July 8-13, 2001, so
be sure to mark your calendar. Discounted airfares >from many cities
in the U.S. as well as abroad will be announced shortly.

For more information about "cities" via London go to

<http://www.jewishgen.org/ShtetlSchleppers>;

This site help you get to where you want to go. Cities, towns, shtetls
are all possible. Pricing will be available and online within the coming weeks.

Paul Ginsburg,
ShtetlSchleppers Project Manager
pginsburg@jewishgen.org

Hi Joel Nathan,
I am sorry that I can not help you , I wish you luck.
I just wanted to say there may be a mistake in your description. I believe
the camp you are referring to was Neustadt-Gleve ( not Gelbe).

Neustadt-Gleve was a satellite camp of Ravensbruk, many ( ?) women wound
up there after the death march and were liberated there. Among those women
was my mother in law, Sala Affenkraut. My mother in law was >from a small
shtetle called Radlow near Tarnow, >from the Ghetto she was sent to Plaszow
and then to Birkenau. It sounds like she was in the same place there as
your Chaya Rachel Herczl was. My mother in law said that for her Auschwitz
was not as bad as Neustadt-Gleve . In Auschwitz they were in a Model camp,
they had work and were given enough food to survive. In Neustadt-Gleve the
Germans simply tried to starve them to death until they were liberated in
May, 1945.

Sincerely yours,
David gurtler

David and Tina Gurtler
Jerusalem, Israel
gurtler@netvision.net.il

In response to Anita Citron's posting, the conference
in London is not in June, it's scheduled for July 8-13, 2001, so
be sure to mark your calendar. Discounted airfares >from many cities
in the U.S. as well as abroad will be announced shortly.

For more information about "cities" via London go to

<http://www.jewishgen.org/ShtetlSchleppers>;

This site help you get to where you want to go. Cities, towns, shtetls
are all possible. Pricing will be available and online within the coming weeks.

Paul Ginsburg,
ShtetlSchleppers Project Manager
pginsburg@jewishgen.org

Hi Joel Nathan,
I am sorry that I can not help you , I wish you luck.
I just wanted to say there may be a mistake in your description. I believe
the camp you are referring to was Neustadt-Gleve ( not Gelbe).

Neustadt-Gleve was a satellite camp of Ravensbruk, many ( ?) women wound
up there after the death march and were liberated there. Among those women
was my mother in law, Sala Affenkraut. My mother in law was >from a small
shtetle called Radlow near Tarnow, >from the Ghetto she was sent to Plaszow
and then to Birkenau. It sounds like she was in the same place there as
your Chaya Rachel Herczl was. My mother in law said that for her Auschwitz
was not as bad as Neustadt-Gleve . In Auschwitz they were in a Model camp,
they had work and were given enough food to survive. In Neustadt-Gleve the
Germans simply tried to starve them to death until they were liberated in
May, 1945.

Sincerely yours,
David gurtler

David and Tina Gurtler
Jerusalem, Israel
gurtler@netvision.net.il

My contacts's name is Chaya Rachel Herczl (nee Rosenberg) and she is
asking for help to find a woman called "Taubie" >from Muncacz.

Chaya Rachel was born in 1929 in Tokai Hungary, and arrived at Birkenau
in May 1944.
She was in a lager. A woman by the name of Aliska was in charge of her
block.
The number tattooed on her arm is A6766. Taubi's number should be
similar. Chaya Rachel was among 20 girls chosen to go >from Birkenau to
Auschwitz every day.
They worked in the fields and in the gardens of the S.S. officers. Taubi
and Chaya Rachel were together. Taubie had had a younger sister who was
about Chaya Rachel's age. After they were separated, they "adopted" her.
She was about 2 years older than Chaya Rachel and was extremely good to
Chaya Rachel. They were both moved to Auschwitz and worked in the sewing
and mending section. They walked together in the "Death March" and stayed
together till they were liberated in Neustadt-Gelbe in May of 1945.

Chaya Rachel would very much like to meet her again, hear about her life
since they parted and thank her for her kindness. Taubie would be about 73
years old today.
Last point to note and which was omitted >from an earlier posting:
Taubi may have not even known that her name was Chaya and called her
only Rachel.

If anyone has any information which could help me or know where to turn
to get the right information, Chaya Rachel would be extremely grateful.
My name is
Joel Nathan
Melbourne

My contacts's name is Chaya Rachel Herczl (nee Rosenberg) and she is
asking for help to find a woman called "Taubie" >from Muncacz.

Chaya Rachel was born in 1929 in Tokai Hungary, and arrived at Birkenau
in May 1944.
She was in a lager. A woman by the name of Aliska was in charge of her
block.
The number tattooed on her arm is A6766. Taubi's number should be
similar. Chaya Rachel was among 20 girls chosen to go >from Birkenau to
Auschwitz every day.
They worked in the fields and in the gardens of the S.S. officers. Taubi
and Chaya Rachel were together. Taubie had had a younger sister who was
about Chaya Rachel's age. After they were separated, they "adopted" her.
She was about 2 years older than Chaya Rachel and was extremely good to
Chaya Rachel. They were both moved to Auschwitz and worked in the sewing
and mending section. They walked together in the "Death March" and stayed
together till they were liberated in Neustadt-Gelbe in May of 1945.

Chaya Rachel would very much like to meet her again, hear about her life
since they parted and thank her for her kindness. Taubie would be about 73
years old today.
Last point to note and which was omitted >from an earlier posting:
Taubi may have not even known that her name was Chaya and called her
only Rachel.

If anyone has any information which could help me or know where to turn
to get the right information, Chaya Rachel would be extremely grateful.
My name is
Joel Nathan
Melbourne

I have been successful in using the JRI - Poland indices for
identifying members of my ancestral family >from Plock. In fact, I have
successfully been able to trace my paternal grandmother's maternal
family as far back as 1800. However, my paternal grandfather's family
KIRSZTAJN, came from
Krosniewice and my paternal grandmother's paternal family KUTNOWSKI,
came >from Gostynin. Can you assist me in directing me to any records

from these towns and how I may obtain them? If none are currently

available to JRI - Poland, are there any plans to initiate a project for
Krosniewice/Kutno and/or Gostynin?
Sara Kirstein Scolnick
sara@sksandassociates.com

I am relatively new to this mailing list, and would appreciate any help in
finding information about a specific town in Poland, Zawercie.
Is there a way I can have access to any documents >from Zawercie? How do I go
about this?
Jacky.

I have been successful in using the JRI - Poland indices for
identifying members of my ancestral family >from Plock. In fact, I have
successfully been able to trace my paternal grandmother's maternal
family as far back as 1800. However, my paternal grandfather's family
KIRSZTAJN, came from
Krosniewice and my paternal grandmother's paternal family KUTNOWSKI,
came >from Gostynin. Can you assist me in directing me to any records

from these towns and how I may obtain them? If none are currently

available to JRI - Poland, are there any plans to initiate a project for
Krosniewice/Kutno and/or Gostynin?
Sara Kirstein Scolnick
sara@sksandassociates.com

I am relatively new to this mailing list, and would appreciate any help in
finding information about a specific town in Poland, Zawercie.
Is there a way I can have access to any documents >from Zawercie? How do I go
about this?
Jacky.

I recently came across the name of of Luba Friedman Tamshe, Khar-Saba,
Israel, listed as a Shoah survivor >from Shkudvil.
Does anyone know how I might be able to contact this person or her
family as I believe she and they be related.
Joel Nathan
Melbourne
Australia

I recently came across the name of of Luba Friedman Tamshe, Khar-Saba,
Israel, listed as a Shoah survivor >from Shkudvil.
Does anyone know how I might be able to contact this person or her
family as I believe she and they be related.
Joel Nathan
Melbourne
Australia