Date   

Re: Meaning of the word VEL #general

David Goldman <davic@...>
 

The overwhelming consensus of everyone responding to my posting is that VEL
means OR or AKA, as in Micha VEL Michael.
Thanks to everyone.

David Goldman
davic@erols.com

MODERATOR NOTE: Thread closed.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Meaning of the word VEL #general

David Goldman <davic@...>
 

The overwhelming consensus of everyone responding to my posting is that VEL
means OR or AKA, as in Micha VEL Michael.
Thanks to everyone.

David Goldman
davic@erols.com

MODERATOR NOTE: Thread closed.


What is VEL? #general

Lauren B. Davis (DDL OMNI) <lbd@...>
 

David Goldman wrote:

On a couple of occasions I have seen the word VEL between two names
originating in Poland. Does anyone know what this means?
Thanks,
This is my favorite question 8-)
"vel" is the latin word for "also known as" and indicates that
the person(s) in the record was known by more than one name.
It was more common in certain areas of Poland than others.
You must look at records for BOTH surnames. If the name you
are seeing is SMITH vel GREEN, you may also find records for
GREEN vel SMITH, just SMITH, and/or just GREEN. Not all branches
of the family may have used both surnames.

Look at the JewishGen infofile "Alternate Surnames in Russian
Poland." There was also an extensive article by the same name
in the summer 1996 issue of Avotaynu.

Lauren


Lauren B. Eisenberg Davis
merlyn@access.digex.net


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen What is VEL? #general

Lauren B. Davis (DDL OMNI) <lbd@...>
 

David Goldman wrote:

On a couple of occasions I have seen the word VEL between two names
originating in Poland. Does anyone know what this means?
Thanks,
This is my favorite question 8-)
"vel" is the latin word for "also known as" and indicates that
the person(s) in the record was known by more than one name.
It was more common in certain areas of Poland than others.
You must look at records for BOTH surnames. If the name you
are seeing is SMITH vel GREEN, you may also find records for
GREEN vel SMITH, just SMITH, and/or just GREEN. Not all branches
of the family may have used both surnames.

Look at the JewishGen infofile "Alternate Surnames in Russian
Poland." There was also an extensive article by the same name
in the summer 1996 issue of Avotaynu.

Lauren


Lauren B. Eisenberg Davis
merlyn@access.digex.net


Meaning of the word VEL #general

Judith Romney Wegner
 

Subject: What is VEL?
From: David Goldman
>
On a couple of occasions I have seen the word VEL between two names
originating in Poland. Does anyone know what this means?
Yes. It's Latin for "or"

The term VEL is quite often found in legal or quasi-legal documents --
both in England and Europe, because it is medieval legal Latin -- which was
used all over Europe in the middle Ages.

Thus, for instance: " Micha VEL Michael" would mean the person's name
was either Micha OR Michael.

Judith Romney Wegner
jrw@brown.edu


Re: What is VEL? #general

Warren Blatt <wblatt@...>
 

David Goldman <davic@pop.erols.com> wrote:

On a couple of occasions I have seen the word VEL between two names
originating in Poland. Does anyone know what this means?
"vel" is the Latin word meaning 'also known as'. It was used
between alternate surnames in Polish civil records.

See Chapter 1 of Beider's "A Dictionary of Jewish Surnames >from
the Kingdom of Poland", or see Lauren Davis' article "Alternate
Surnames in Russian Poland" in "Avotaynu", Summer 1996.

Warren

Warren Blatt
Boston, MA
<wblatt@jewishgen.org>


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Meaning of the word VEL #general

Judith Romney Wegner
 

Subject: What is VEL?
From: David Goldman
>
On a couple of occasions I have seen the word VEL between two names
originating in Poland. Does anyone know what this means?
Yes. It's Latin for "or"

The term VEL is quite often found in legal or quasi-legal documents --
both in England and Europe, because it is medieval legal Latin -- which was
used all over Europe in the middle Ages.

Thus, for instance: " Micha VEL Michael" would mean the person's name
was either Micha OR Michael.

Judith Romney Wegner
jrw@brown.edu


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: What is VEL? #general

Warren Blatt <wblatt@...>
 

David Goldman <davic@pop.erols.com> wrote:

On a couple of occasions I have seen the word VEL between two names
originating in Poland. Does anyone know what this means?
"vel" is the Latin word meaning 'also known as'. It was used
between alternate surnames in Polish civil records.

See Chapter 1 of Beider's "A Dictionary of Jewish Surnames >from
the Kingdom of Poland", or see Lauren Davis' article "Alternate
Surnames in Russian Poland" in "Avotaynu", Summer 1996.

Warren

Warren Blatt
Boston, MA
<wblatt@jewishgen.org>


In Polish, does b=p? #general

Lauren B. Davis (DDL OMNI) <lbd@...>
 

A.Sharon wrote:

David Price wrote:

Why is it that on one Polish record, a surname is listed as PRAVER and
on another as BRAVERMAN? When I enquire about PRAJS on soundex, why are
some of the names coming up FRYSZ, BRASZ, and BORUCH. Does the letter
'b' and 'f' sound like a 'p' in Polish?
Sometime in Polish, "d" does sound like "t" and "b" does sound like "p".
This is especially in a case when those letters are located in the
middle or at the end of a word.

But even with this phonetic explanation, I cannot figure out how Praver
was transformed to Braverman. There is a bit more than just p over b
transformation.
I believe the answer is that surnames were not as fixed nor as
important to Jews in that region at that time as we would like to
think. This is not at all unusual. I have found many such situations
in my research. You must broaden your views on the surnames you are
seeking in order to find as much information as possible.

It is fairly common to see variations on a root, such as GOLDT =
GOLDMAN = GOLDSZTAIN = GOLDSZMIDT = GOLDEN, etc. Also don't overlook
similar sounding names, such as WILLENSKI, WILKENSZTAIN, etc.
These are true examples >from the vital record registries of
the Kingdom of Poland.

For more information, see the JewishGen infofile "Alternate Surnames
in Russian Poland."

Lauren

Lauren B. Eisenberg Davis
merlyn@iamdigex.net

MODERATOR NOTE: Thread closed.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen In Polish, does b=p? #general

Lauren B. Davis (DDL OMNI) <lbd@...>
 

A.Sharon wrote:

David Price wrote:

Why is it that on one Polish record, a surname is listed as PRAVER and
on another as BRAVERMAN? When I enquire about PRAJS on soundex, why are
some of the names coming up FRYSZ, BRASZ, and BORUCH. Does the letter
'b' and 'f' sound like a 'p' in Polish?
Sometime in Polish, "d" does sound like "t" and "b" does sound like "p".
This is especially in a case when those letters are located in the
middle or at the end of a word.

But even with this phonetic explanation, I cannot figure out how Praver
was transformed to Braverman. There is a bit more than just p over b
transformation.
I believe the answer is that surnames were not as fixed nor as
important to Jews in that region at that time as we would like to
think. This is not at all unusual. I have found many such situations
in my research. You must broaden your views on the surnames you are
seeking in order to find as much information as possible.

It is fairly common to see variations on a root, such as GOLDT =
GOLDMAN = GOLDSZTAIN = GOLDSZMIDT = GOLDEN, etc. Also don't overlook
similar sounding names, such as WILLENSKI, WILKENSZTAIN, etc.
These are true examples >from the vital record registries of
the Kingdom of Poland.

For more information, see the JewishGen infofile "Alternate Surnames
in Russian Poland."

Lauren

Lauren B. Eisenberg Davis
merlyn@iamdigex.net

MODERATOR NOTE: Thread closed.


And I Can Still See Their Faces information #general

Arlene Weiss <Balbec@...>
 

I have been asked to give details for the exhibit "And I Can Still See
Their Faces" which is in Chicago.

The exhibit is at the Polish Museum in Chicago. The exhibit will run to
the end of February. The museum is at 984 Milwaukee Ave, phone:
312-384-3352. It is open daily 11-4 (no charge).

The exhibit is sponsored by the Shalom Foundation of Warsaw
shalom@shalom.org.pl

When I went Friday to see the exhibit I was the only one there.

Arlene Swartzberg Weiss
Chicago


Re: "And I Still See Their Faces " Polish Jewry Exhibit #general

salnmilt <salnmilt@...>
 

The location of the "And I Still See Their Faces" exhibit on Polish Jewry
is
Polish Museum of America
984 North Milwaukee Ave.(Corner of Milwaukee and Augusta Blvd.)
Hours: 11:00 A.M.-4:00 P.M., daily
Phone: 773-384-3352

The exhibit runs through February 28.

Background information on the exhibit can be found via the Holocaust
Memorial Center, West Bloomfeld, MI which hosted the exhibit previously.
The URL is http//holocaustcenter.com/news/sp98faces.shtml.
Hope this helps.

Sally Tofle
St. Louis, MO
From: <salnmilt@primary.net>

MODERATOR NOTE: Thread closed.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen And I Can Still See Their Faces information #general

Arlene Weiss <Balbec@...>
 

I have been asked to give details for the exhibit "And I Can Still See
Their Faces" which is in Chicago.

The exhibit is at the Polish Museum in Chicago. The exhibit will run to
the end of February. The museum is at 984 Milwaukee Ave, phone:
312-384-3352. It is open daily 11-4 (no charge).

The exhibit is sponsored by the Shalom Foundation of Warsaw
shalom@shalom.org.pl

When I went Friday to see the exhibit I was the only one there.

Arlene Swartzberg Weiss
Chicago


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: "And I Still See Their Faces " Polish Jewry Exhibit #general

salnmilt <salnmilt@...>
 

The location of the "And I Still See Their Faces" exhibit on Polish Jewry
is
Polish Museum of America
984 North Milwaukee Ave.(Corner of Milwaukee and Augusta Blvd.)
Hours: 11:00 A.M.-4:00 P.M., daily
Phone: 773-384-3352

The exhibit runs through February 28.

Background information on the exhibit can be found via the Holocaust
Memorial Center, West Bloomfeld, MI which hosted the exhibit previously.
The URL is http//holocaustcenter.com/news/sp98faces.shtml.
Hope this helps.

Sally Tofle
St. Louis, MO
From: <salnmilt@primary.net>

MODERATOR NOTE: Thread closed.


Re: And I still see their faces #general

Zvi Griliches <grilic@...>
 

This is a beautiful large format book, published in Warsaw, in 1996, by
the Shalom Foundation, ISBN 83-901016-03.

I got my copy >from Warsaw through a friend. The paperback version cost
about $50+. Perhaps they are selling it at the Chicago exhibit. It is
worth it.

Zvi Griliches
grilic@kuznets.harvard.edu
Cambridge, MA

MODERATOR NOTE: While Prof. Griliches has posted notice of this book
before, when it was first published, it relates to the current exhibit in
Chicago. As Prof. Griliches has no personal interest in the book, we have
allowed him to mention it again.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: And I still see their faces #general

Zvi Griliches <grilic@...>
 

This is a beautiful large format book, published in Warsaw, in 1996, by
the Shalom Foundation, ISBN 83-901016-03.

I got my copy >from Warsaw through a friend. The paperback version cost
about $50+. Perhaps they are selling it at the Chicago exhibit. It is
worth it.

Zvi Griliches
grilic@kuznets.harvard.edu
Cambridge, MA

MODERATOR NOTE: While Prof. Griliches has posted notice of this book
before, when it was first published, it relates to the current exhibit in
Chicago. As Prof. Griliches has no personal interest in the book, we have
allowed him to mention it again.


Czechoslovakia 1939-1942, Jewish Daily Life #general

Hnestor@...
 

I want to recommend a remarkable new book, "A Thousand Kisses", by Renata
POLT, published by the University of Alabama Press as part of their Judiac
Studies series. Call Number: DS135, C95, P65, 1999. ISBN: 0-8173-0930-6

Renata POLT, who escaped >from Czechoslovakia with her parents in 1937 when
she was 7 years old, has translated and edited the letters her grandmother
wrote >from Prague to her parents who went first to Switzerland, then to
Cuba, and later New York. In her letters Henriette Pollatschek provides a
detailed picture of the lives of Jews in Prague during the war years: the
evictions, the food shortages, the worries about livlihood, and the
increasing prohibitions and regulation as well as the brave and cheerful
attempts to maintain a normal life and bear the hardships. In her footnotes
Ms. POLT has tied in references to the historic events and crushing daily
pressures of the Nazi regime which systematically limited Jewish life prior
to orders for deportation.

Helen Nestor
Berkeley, CA

Researching:
DINKELSPIEL, HERZOG: Michelfeld, Baden, Germany
HABER, SCHWARZSCHILD: Richen, Baden
NORDLINGER: Niederseebach, Alsace and Kleinnordlingen, Bavaria
RAPHAEL: Inowraclaw, Prussia
PRAGER: Kleczew, Poland
SAALBURG, LANDSBURG: Posen, Prussia

MODERATOR NOTE: This is the one-time-only permitted notice of a new
resource.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Czechoslovakia 1939-1942, Jewish Daily Life #general

Hnestor@...
 

I want to recommend a remarkable new book, "A Thousand Kisses", by Renata
POLT, published by the University of Alabama Press as part of their Judiac
Studies series. Call Number: DS135, C95, P65, 1999. ISBN: 0-8173-0930-6

Renata POLT, who escaped >from Czechoslovakia with her parents in 1937 when
she was 7 years old, has translated and edited the letters her grandmother
wrote >from Prague to her parents who went first to Switzerland, then to
Cuba, and later New York. In her letters Henriette Pollatschek provides a
detailed picture of the lives of Jews in Prague during the war years: the
evictions, the food shortages, the worries about livlihood, and the
increasing prohibitions and regulation as well as the brave and cheerful
attempts to maintain a normal life and bear the hardships. In her footnotes
Ms. POLT has tied in references to the historic events and crushing daily
pressures of the Nazi regime which systematically limited Jewish life prior
to orders for deportation.

Helen Nestor
Berkeley, CA

Researching:
DINKELSPIEL, HERZOG: Michelfeld, Baden, Germany
HABER, SCHWARZSCHILD: Richen, Baden
NORDLINGER: Niederseebach, Alsace and Kleinnordlingen, Bavaria
RAPHAEL: Inowraclaw, Prussia
PRAGER: Kleczew, Poland
SAALBURG, LANDSBURG: Posen, Prussia

MODERATOR NOTE: This is the one-time-only permitted notice of a new
resource.


A Genealogical Question #general

Leonard Markowitz <priluki@...>
 

An interesting genealogical question came up the other day.

Consider a man who married and had two daughters and a son. The
wife and both daughters were murdered during a Pogrom. The son
survived.

The man marries again and has another son. The relationship between
the two sons would be that of half brothers. What would be the
relationship between the second son and the murdered daughters?
Since they died prior to the birth of the second son, would they
also be half sisters to the second son? What would the murdered
first wife of the father be to the second son? Would she be a
step-mother even if she perished before the birth of the second son?

My replies to these questions were immediate, but later I did have
some second thoughts.

Len Markowitz priluki@voicenet.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen A Genealogical Question #general

Leonard Markowitz <priluki@...>
 

An interesting genealogical question came up the other day.

Consider a man who married and had two daughters and a son. The
wife and both daughters were murdered during a Pogrom. The son
survived.

The man marries again and has another son. The relationship between
the two sons would be that of half brothers. What would be the
relationship between the second son and the murdered daughters?
Since they died prior to the birth of the second son, would they
also be half sisters to the second son? What would the murdered
first wife of the father be to the second son? Would she be a
step-mother even if she perished before the birth of the second son?

My replies to these questions were immediate, but later I did have
some second thoughts.

Len Markowitz priluki@voicenet.com