Sochocin data has just been added to the JRI-Poland database. The data added
represents the years 1850-1859. I expect that the 1826-1849 should be live
pretty soon too!

Many thanks to Shtetl CO-OP leader Lawrence Blum.

Hadassah Lipsius
Transliteration Coordinator
JRI-Poland

Sochocin data has just been added to the JRI-Poland database. The data added
represents the years 1850-1859. I expect that the 1826-1849 should be live
pretty soon too!

Many thanks to Shtetl CO-OP leader Lawrence Blum.

Hadassah Lipsius
Transliteration Coordinator
JRI-Poland

I have received several requests >from other users about my background to
see if it matches with theirs. My family tree is registered with Dorot in
Tel Aviv (do they have an email address?), the FamilyTreeMaker and Jewishgen.

My greatgrandfather, Philip Kravitz, emigrated to England in 1891 with all
his family, >from Sislewich in Belarus, close to Minsk. I assume that both
his father, Abraham, and his grandfather, Emmanuel, were dead. I have a
complete family tree >from Philip downwards.

Philip had a sister, Bella Kravetz, who married Jacob Halprin and they had
three sons and two daughters. By 1934 Jacob had died and one son, Benjamin,
lived in London, England. Bella and her other children still lived in
Warsaw. At some time later, some or all had emigrated to the USA. Ben, born
1871, used to claim a relationship to Danny Kaye and had a picture of a
"Dina" in his apartment whom he called his niece. Hence my recent request
to locate Dina Kaye.

Ben had three daughters and one Edith (Ida) married Henry Lister and lived
in Enfield, Middlesex, England. They had a daughter called Josephine. Edith
was born around 1910. I have not been able to trace them at all and wonder
if they have emigrated.

If any of this matches any other genealogists, I would be grateful if they
made contact.

David Kravitz

I have received several requests >from other users about my background to
see if it matches with theirs. My family tree is registered with Dorot in
Tel Aviv (do they have an email address?), the FamilyTreeMaker and Jewishgen.

My greatgrandfather, Philip Kravitz, emigrated to England in 1891 with all
his family, >from Sislewich in Belarus, close to Minsk. I assume that both
his father, Abraham, and his grandfather, Emmanuel, were dead. I have a
complete family tree >from Philip downwards.

Philip had a sister, Bella Kravetz, who married Jacob Halprin and they had
three sons and two daughters. By 1934 Jacob had died and one son, Benjamin,
lived in London, England. Bella and her other children still lived in
Warsaw. At some time later, some or all had emigrated to the USA. Ben, born
1871, used to claim a relationship to Danny Kaye and had a picture of a
"Dina" in his apartment whom he called his niece. Hence my recent request
to locate Dina Kaye.

Ben had three daughters and one Edith (Ida) married Henry Lister and lived
in Enfield, Middlesex, England. They had a daughter called Josephine. Edith
was born around 1910. I have not been able to trace them at all and wonder
if they have emigrated.

If any of this matches any other genealogists, I would be grateful if they
made contact.

David Kravitz

Larry Gaum wrote:

Barbara Khait wrote:

My grandfather, born in Minsk Gubernia ca. 1869, referred
to his prior citizenship on his naturalization papers as "Polish."

If your grandfather was born in 1869, Minsk Guberniya was
under Russian Tzarist control. He was Russian, despite the
information he gave for his naturalization papers.The final
partition of Poland took place in 1795, and up until 1921,
Poland ceased to exist.

I believe many residents (and others) called it "Russian Poland", as did
my ancestors.

//Corin Barsily Goodwin
Cupertino, CA USA

BARSILA/BARZILY/BARZILOV -- Russia; Scotland; NYC
BASOK/BARSACH -- Orsha (Mogilev), Belarus; Scotland; NYC; Rhode Island
BRAUN -- Hungary; NYC ...WEISS -- Hungary; NYC; Middlesex, NJ
DU BOFF/MISTROFF -- Gorodische (Baronovich), Belarus; NYC & Long Island
KANEFSKY and RIVKIN -- Elizabetgrod, Ukraine; NYC
SIGAAR -- Amsterdam ...VAN SANTEN -- Amsterdam; NYC

Larry Gaum wrote:

Barbara Khait wrote:

My grandfather, born in Minsk Gubernia ca. 1869, referred
to his prior citizenship on his naturalization papers as "Polish."

If your grandfather was born in 1869, Minsk Guberniya was
under Russian Tzarist control. He was Russian, despite the
information he gave for his naturalization papers.The final
partition of Poland took place in 1795, and up until 1921,
Poland ceased to exist.

I believe many residents (and others) called it "Russian Poland", as did
my ancestors.

//Corin Barsily Goodwin
Cupertino, CA USA

BARSILA/BARZILY/BARZILOV -- Russia; Scotland; NYC
BASOK/BARSACH -- Orsha (Mogilev), Belarus; Scotland; NYC; Rhode Island
BRAUN -- Hungary; NYC ...WEISS -- Hungary; NYC; Middlesex, NJ
DU BOFF/MISTROFF -- Gorodische (Baronovich), Belarus; NYC & Long Island
KANEFSKY and RIVKIN -- Elizabetgrod, Ukraine; NYC
SIGAAR -- Amsterdam ...VAN SANTEN -- Amsterdam; NYC

A similar discussion was held in this forum when the Family Tree
of The Jewish People was first announced. Specifically related
to issues of privacy of people still alive, the discussion
brought out several points, not the least of which "You can't
re-write history"

That someone was the child of a named person, grew up and
married, and had their own family.. cannot be changed. It is a
fact. But given the sensitivity of some people about their
ages, JewishGen came up with what we all believe is a
reasonable compromise.

For people born within the last 100 years where no death date is
shown, dates of birth and marriage would be removed. No message
lines which would show source data, social security numbers,
phone numbers and street address would be included.

Thus, we maintained the integrity of family relationships
without invasion of privacy. This might be a reasonable
solution to the problem being discussed. As genealogists what
we are really interested in is family connections....so why not
just leave it at that and not upset anyone by reporting their
personal data which has no bearing on the genealogy of the
family in the first place?

Carol Skydell
Chilmark MA

A similar discussion was held in this forum when the Family Tree
of The Jewish People was first announced. Specifically related
to issues of privacy of people still alive, the discussion
brought out several points, not the least of which "You can't
re-write history"

That someone was the child of a named person, grew up and
married, and had their own family.. cannot be changed. It is a
fact. But given the sensitivity of some people about their
ages, JewishGen came up with what we all believe is a
reasonable compromise.

For people born within the last 100 years where no death date is
shown, dates of birth and marriage would be removed. No message
lines which would show source data, social security numbers,
phone numbers and street address would be included.

Thus, we maintained the integrity of family relationships
without invasion of privacy. This might be a reasonable
solution to the problem being discussed. As genealogists what
we are really interested in is family connections....so why not
just leave it at that and not upset anyone by reporting their
personal data which has no bearing on the genealogy of the
family in the first place?

Carol Skydell
Chilmark MA

I suggest that the family tree include name,
birthday, and city. I delete ex-spouses'
names if people ask me to. Other than
that, only one name has been formally
hidded >from the tree: that of a murderer
now in jail.

It is, agree, quite a dilemma for us
family-tree writers!

Dan Kazez

I suggest that the family tree include name,
birthday, and city. I delete ex-spouses'
names if people ask me to. Other than
that, only one name has been formally
hidded >from the tree: that of a murderer
now in jail.

It is, agree, quite a dilemma for us
family-tree writers!

Dan Kazez

Subject: German names of Slovakia
From: melody gross <melody@gimby.save-net.co.il>
Date: Sat, 07 Nov 1998 10:16:16 +0200
X-Message-Number: 1



And--what are Uniats, a religion?

Uniats (Uniates) aka Greek Catholics aka Eastern Rite Catholics are
Catholics who follow (Christian) Orthodox ritual and practices, but
acknowledge the authority of the Pope. In pre WWI Hungary, most Ruthenes
(Ukrainians) were Uniates, as were some Slovaks (mostly in Saros & Zemplen
counties), some Romanians (mostly in Northern Transylvania), and some
Magyars. Historically, the Uniate movement (which also has adherents in
Eastern Galicia) date >from the Catholic Counter-Reformation of the 16th &
17th centuries.

The pre WWI counties with especially large Jewish populations (Bereg, Ung &
Maramaros) also had large Uniate populations, mostly Ruthene.
Michael G. Hillinger
mhilling@shore.net

Subject: German names of Slovakia
From: melody gross <melody@gimby.save-net.co.il>
Date: Sat, 07 Nov 1998 10:16:16 +0200
X-Message-Number: 1



And--what are Uniats, a religion?

Uniats (Uniates) aka Greek Catholics aka Eastern Rite Catholics are
Catholics who follow (Christian) Orthodox ritual and practices, but
acknowledge the authority of the Pope. In pre WWI Hungary, most Ruthenes
(Ukrainians) were Uniates, as were some Slovaks (mostly in Saros & Zemplen
counties), some Romanians (mostly in Northern Transylvania), and some
Magyars. Historically, the Uniate movement (which also has adherents in
Eastern Galicia) date >from the Catholic Counter-Reformation of the 16th &
17th centuries.

The pre WWI counties with especially large Jewish populations (Bereg, Ung &
Maramaros) also had large Uniate populations, mostly Ruthene.
Michael G. Hillinger
mhilling@shore.net

Hi,
I know nothing about the family Hollander, but go to this site:
http://www.psk.co.at/report/index.html

It is the list of names for dormant accounts in Vienna. Go to "List of dormant
accounts,click it, go to alphabet "H", click it and scroll until you see
Hollander. There are two accounts with the Hungarian name "DEZSO" bet this was
a Hungarian Hollander living in Vienna or Hungary and depositing to this
account.
Eleanor Bien

Hi,
I know nothing about the family Hollander, but go to this site:
http://www.psk.co.at/report/index.html

It is the list of names for dormant accounts in Vienna. Go to "List of dormant
accounts,click it, go to alphabet "H", click it and scroll until you see
Hollander. There are two accounts with the Hungarian name "DEZSO" bet this was
a Hungarian Hollander living in Vienna or Hungary and depositing to this
account.
Eleanor Bien

Hello H-SIG

All messages posted to this list since July 1998 are now being
archived and are searchable online. >from JewishGen's homepage
http://www.jewishgen.org, click on Databases and then select
The JewishGen SIG Lists message Archive - 1998

Carol Skydell
JewishGen Operations

Hello H-SIG

All messages posted to this list since July 1998 are now being
archived and are searchable online. >from JewishGen's homepage
http://www.jewishgen.org, click on Databases and then select
The JewishGen SIG Lists message Archive - 1998

Carol Skydell
JewishGen Operations

I think I would object too if someone broadcast my address, telephone
number, and (in Britain) my National Insurance number, which is also used
by the Inland Revenue. I would not object if the person sending it out had
got my prior permission, preferably in writing. I certainly do not send out
to strangers any information about living people without the latter's
permission.

This is not only because of politeness and etiquette; nor is it a
reflection of the British obsesion with secrecy and privacy ('An
Englishman's home is his castle'); it is also to avoid attracting the
attention of conversionists and Holocaust-revisionists who send you their
material if they get hold of your address.

Harold Pollins

Oxford England

pollins@globalnet.co.uk

Further to Harold's note, in the UK tabloid Press phone numbers have been
printed of individuals with the implication that readers should phone the
individuals who have possibly done something to displease the newspaper.
There are always loonies or sad people who want to phone famous people for
innocent or malign reasons, so that it is fairly reasonable that the famous
person might wish to protect their privacy in this way. For that reason we
have postings in this group asking if we know how to contact this or that
famous actor. Whereas most of the postings are at the other end of the
scale most of the other postings are trying to locate a relative, ancestor
etc. Clearly actor X or actor Y is protecting their privacy. Now if you
were related to a famous actor, would you object if they requested that
their telephone number be withheld.

As to someone's date of birth I doubt that someone could prevent you
publishing this as the writer says this is a matter of public record. No
doubt you only have to give the source which is another publication or
public register and that would end the matter. Clearly the relative might
never speak to you again and might leave you out of their will. Presumably
you don't mind offending people when you decided to produce a family tree!

Clearly someone who makes such a big deal about "sensitive" information is
very sensitive about the information being published. I would have thought
that going over the top in this way would very much draw attention to their
sensitivity. It is clear that rich and powerful men often have more money
than sense. Most of us are not terribly keen on certain things affecting us
but we just have to grin and bear it.

I think that there is another point that the detailed genealogical info
that we are talking about is often used by banks and the such like to check
the bona fides of a customer eg maiden name of mother and other such
information. It is not beyond the realms of imagination that this
information could be used to perpetrate a fraud.

I am glad to say that in my large family that there have been no problems
about the information contained in the family tree.

We produce in the printed document which is circulated within the family:

Full name
Name of spouse
Date of birth
Date of marriage
If appropriate, date of death
Different towns of residence
Names of children

There is little on here that someone could object. I believe that the tree
has been used by children in the family for school projects.

Clearly when more personal information such as address, telephone number is
contained on the tree there is much less that you can do with the tree.
Quite rightly I don't want everyone knowing my address and phone number
even though it is in the phonebook.

Nick

I think I would object too if someone broadcast my address, telephone
number, and (in Britain) my National Insurance number, which is also used
by the Inland Revenue. I would not object if the person sending it out had
got my prior permission, preferably in writing. I certainly do not send out
to strangers any information about living people without the latter's
permission.

This is not only because of politeness and etiquette; nor is it a
reflection of the British obsesion with secrecy and privacy ('An
Englishman's home is his castle'); it is also to avoid attracting the
attention of conversionists and Holocaust-revisionists who send you their
material if they get hold of your address.

Harold Pollins

Oxford England

pollins@globalnet.co.uk

Further to Harold's note, in the UK tabloid Press phone numbers have been
printed of individuals with the implication that readers should phone the
individuals who have possibly done something to displease the newspaper.
There are always loonies or sad people who want to phone famous people for
innocent or malign reasons, so that it is fairly reasonable that the famous
person might wish to protect their privacy in this way. For that reason we
have postings in this group asking if we know how to contact this or that
famous actor. Whereas most of the postings are at the other end of the
scale most of the other postings are trying to locate a relative, ancestor
etc. Clearly actor X or actor Y is protecting their privacy. Now if you
were related to a famous actor, would you object if they requested that
their telephone number be withheld.

As to someone's date of birth I doubt that someone could prevent you
publishing this as the writer says this is a matter of public record. No
doubt you only have to give the source which is another publication or
public register and that would end the matter. Clearly the relative might
never speak to you again and might leave you out of their will. Presumably
you don't mind offending people when you decided to produce a family tree!

Clearly someone who makes such a big deal about "sensitive" information is
very sensitive about the information being published. I would have thought
that going over the top in this way would very much draw attention to their
sensitivity. It is clear that rich and powerful men often have more money
than sense. Most of us are not terribly keen on certain things affecting us
but we just have to grin and bear it.

I think that there is another point that the detailed genealogical info
that we are talking about is often used by banks and the such like to check
the bona fides of a customer eg maiden name of mother and other such
information. It is not beyond the realms of imagination that this
information could be used to perpetrate a fraud.

I am glad to say that in my large family that there have been no problems
about the information contained in the family tree.

We produce in the printed document which is circulated within the family:

Full name
Name of spouse
Date of birth
Date of marriage
If appropriate, date of death
Different towns of residence
Names of children

There is little on here that someone could object. I believe that the tree
has been used by children in the family for school projects.

Clearly when more personal information such as address, telephone number is
contained on the tree there is much less that you can do with the tree.
Quite rightly I don't want everyone knowing my address and phone number
even though it is in the phonebook.

Nick

Citizens of the European Community should note the Data Protection Act
1998, effective on the mainland October 1998 and in the UK in 2Q99. It
deals with distribution of information outside the UK as well. The main
changes >from previous Acts is to expand data protection to pieces of paper
as well as computer storage. As a general rule, only distribute a limited
amount of data about a living person such as their place in a family tree.
Even this might need to be registered with the DP registrar. I will keep
you posted.

Citizens of the European Community should note the Data Protection Act
1998, effective on the mainland October 1998 and in the UK in 2Q99. It
deals with distribution of information outside the UK as well. The main
changes >from previous Acts is to expand data protection to pieces of paper
as well as computer storage. As a general rule, only distribute a limited
amount of data about a living person such as their place in a family tree.
Even this might need to be registered with the DP registrar. I will keep
you posted.