Date   

Pressburg Jews in 1736/ town of Iyvesag/ unrecorded marriages #hungary

Mehadrin@...
 

I visited the main New York Public Library today and found various interesting
items.
1) The "Institut fur Judischen FamilienForschung" (Institute for Jewish Family
Research) was founded in Vienna in 1912 and remained in existence until Paul
Joseph Diamant (its leading figure) emigrated to Israel in 1932. A journal was
published in 1912-13 and again in 1917. It is exceedingly rare, and has never
been reprinted although an index (really just a reproduction of the tables of
contents) was published in the journal Der Schlussel in Vienna in 1970.
There is a lengthy article by Dr Bernard Wachstein, with full lists, of the
Jewish conscription census for Pressburg/Bratislava/Poszony >from the year
1736. He also discusses the important topic of where these Jews came from,
and which other communities supplied them with trade.
2) There is an important article by Dr. A. Freimann, the renowned
bibliographer of Frankfurt-am-Main, about Jewish family trees. Unfortunately,
that issue only covers up to the letter C---with the promise that the rest
would follow. But this is in the last publication of I.J.FF.... was it
finished in another publication...maybe? He also says that the first public
release of Jewish family trees was at an exhibition of them in the Royal
Albert Hall in London, catalogued by Lucien Wolf (I think in 1879).
3) Now a personal request for help. In the summer of 1774, my g-g-g-g-gf Rabbi
Leib Zwebner was ordained in Prague by the renowned Rabbi Yechezkel Landau
(known as the Noda BiYehudah). The document refers to him as coming "from
Hungary, >from the city of Sha'ag." My late father said that he thought the
town was really called Iyvesag, or something similar, but was known in the
Jewish dialect as Sha'ag. Does anyone know which city this is? Is it an old
name for some better known place.... the Hebrew text does describe it as a
city, rather than a small place.... Any ideas?
4) While talking to Ms. Fixler, the very helpful librarian at the Jewish
Division of the library, to whom I was introduced by the ever-resourceful and
well-connected Louis Schonfeld, she drew my attention to the fact that a
relative of hers had an unregistered marriage in 19th century Hungary. And
this was despite the fact that he was actually a government official!?!! In
the course of discussion we realised that he had evidently registered his
first marriage, but when his wife died and he remarried her younger
sister---it was not recorded, and hence her children bore her maiden name and
were recorded as born out of wedlock!
I suggested, and think I have heard talk of this before among experts, that in
there were several relatives who were sanctioned for marriage by Jewish law
but not by canon law. Examples include an uncle marrying his niece. In cases
when this occurred the marriage was celebrated privately with a Jewish
religious ceremony, but went unrecorded and children had to be registered
under the mother's maiden name. I wonder if church law in Hungary forbade
marrying two sisters, even if the first sister is no longer alive when the
second weds. Does anyone know... perhaps we have a matrimonial lawyer with
historical interests among our readers?
This might resolve some of our readers' questions.
Rabbi Avrohom Marmorstein
mehadrin@aol.com


Legal name change? #general

Shmuel and Shoshana Arnold <darnold@...>
 

Hi,

My great-grandfather's name was listed on his Certificate of Arrival (from
Russia) as being
Peisach Arschinow. However, on his Declaration of Intent, Petition of
Naturalization,Oath of Allegiance, etc.
it lists his name as Phillip Arshinoff.

The same is true of my great-grandmother. Her Certificate of Arrival (from
Russia) says Cirle Arschinow,
but all the other papers say Sylvia (or in some cases, Celia or Sillia). I
knew her briefly when
she was alive and everyone called her Sylvia.

So my question is, would they have had to undergo a legal name change to do
this? Or did they just anglicize
their names? Or perhaps both names were legal (ie. Peisach, obviously a
Hebrew name and Phillip being his
English name,etc.)?

If they did do a legal name change, where would I find these records?

Thanks.

Shoshana Silverstein Arnold

Researching:

SILVERSTEIN
ARSHINOFF (ARSCHINOW)
SHAHARBANI (SHARBANI)
ABD-AL NABI
JOSEPH
LEVY (Iraq/Iran)
COHEN (Iraq/Iran)


Hungary SIG #Hungary Pressburg Jews in 1736/ town of Iyvesag/ unrecorded marriages #hungary

Mehadrin@...
 

I visited the main New York Public Library today and found various interesting
items.
1) The "Institut fur Judischen FamilienForschung" (Institute for Jewish Family
Research) was founded in Vienna in 1912 and remained in existence until Paul
Joseph Diamant (its leading figure) emigrated to Israel in 1932. A journal was
published in 1912-13 and again in 1917. It is exceedingly rare, and has never
been reprinted although an index (really just a reproduction of the tables of
contents) was published in the journal Der Schlussel in Vienna in 1970.
There is a lengthy article by Dr Bernard Wachstein, with full lists, of the
Jewish conscription census for Pressburg/Bratislava/Poszony >from the year
1736. He also discusses the important topic of where these Jews came from,
and which other communities supplied them with trade.
2) There is an important article by Dr. A. Freimann, the renowned
bibliographer of Frankfurt-am-Main, about Jewish family trees. Unfortunately,
that issue only covers up to the letter C---with the promise that the rest
would follow. But this is in the last publication of I.J.FF.... was it
finished in another publication...maybe? He also says that the first public
release of Jewish family trees was at an exhibition of them in the Royal
Albert Hall in London, catalogued by Lucien Wolf (I think in 1879).
3) Now a personal request for help. In the summer of 1774, my g-g-g-g-gf Rabbi
Leib Zwebner was ordained in Prague by the renowned Rabbi Yechezkel Landau
(known as the Noda BiYehudah). The document refers to him as coming "from
Hungary, >from the city of Sha'ag." My late father said that he thought the
town was really called Iyvesag, or something similar, but was known in the
Jewish dialect as Sha'ag. Does anyone know which city this is? Is it an old
name for some better known place.... the Hebrew text does describe it as a
city, rather than a small place.... Any ideas?
4) While talking to Ms. Fixler, the very helpful librarian at the Jewish
Division of the library, to whom I was introduced by the ever-resourceful and
well-connected Louis Schonfeld, she drew my attention to the fact that a
relative of hers had an unregistered marriage in 19th century Hungary. And
this was despite the fact that he was actually a government official!?!! In
the course of discussion we realised that he had evidently registered his
first marriage, but when his wife died and he remarried her younger
sister---it was not recorded, and hence her children bore her maiden name and
were recorded as born out of wedlock!
I suggested, and think I have heard talk of this before among experts, that in
there were several relatives who were sanctioned for marriage by Jewish law
but not by canon law. Examples include an uncle marrying his niece. In cases
when this occurred the marriage was celebrated privately with a Jewish
religious ceremony, but went unrecorded and children had to be registered
under the mother's maiden name. I wonder if church law in Hungary forbade
marrying two sisters, even if the first sister is no longer alive when the
second weds. Does anyone know... perhaps we have a matrimonial lawyer with
historical interests among our readers?
This might resolve some of our readers' questions.
Rabbi Avrohom Marmorstein
mehadrin@aol.com


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Legal name change? #general

Shmuel and Shoshana Arnold <darnold@...>
 

Hi,

My great-grandfather's name was listed on his Certificate of Arrival (from
Russia) as being
Peisach Arschinow. However, on his Declaration of Intent, Petition of
Naturalization,Oath of Allegiance, etc.
it lists his name as Phillip Arshinoff.

The same is true of my great-grandmother. Her Certificate of Arrival (from
Russia) says Cirle Arschinow,
but all the other papers say Sylvia (or in some cases, Celia or Sillia). I
knew her briefly when
she was alive and everyone called her Sylvia.

So my question is, would they have had to undergo a legal name change to do
this? Or did they just anglicize
their names? Or perhaps both names were legal (ie. Peisach, obviously a
Hebrew name and Phillip being his
English name,etc.)?

If they did do a legal name change, where would I find these records?

Thanks.

Shoshana Silverstein Arnold

Researching:

SILVERSTEIN
ARSHINOFF (ARSCHINOW)
SHAHARBANI (SHARBANI)
ABD-AL NABI
JOSEPH
LEVY (Iraq/Iran)
COHEN (Iraq/Iran)


Records of the Baron De Hirsch Institute #general

Henry Wellisch <Henry_Wellisch@...>
 

I tried for some time to find the records of the Montreal office of
the Baron de Hirsch
Institute and eventually found out that these records were
microfilmed by the National Archives of Canada in Ottawa. I
requested the microfilms through the interlibrary loan and my local
public library and after 6 or 8 months 8 microfilms arrived at my
local library here in Toronto.
There was a lot of important information on them; long lists of
settlers in Hirsch and other places in Western Canada who had taken
out mortgages. There were reports on the terrible conditions in
Hirsch and letters >from many of the settlers asking for help. There
was also quite a bit of information on some of the Hirsch supported
settlements in Argentina. These microfilms are accessible through
the interlibrary loan >from the National Archives of Canada. I think
they have a website.
Henry Wellisch
JGS of Canada (Toronto)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Records of the Baron De Hirsch Institute #general

Henry Wellisch <Henry_Wellisch@...>
 

I tried for some time to find the records of the Montreal office of
the Baron de Hirsch
Institute and eventually found out that these records were
microfilmed by the National Archives of Canada in Ottawa. I
requested the microfilms through the interlibrary loan and my local
public library and after 6 or 8 months 8 microfilms arrived at my
local library here in Toronto.
There was a lot of important information on them; long lists of
settlers in Hirsch and other places in Western Canada who had taken
out mortgages. There were reports on the terrible conditions in
Hirsch and letters >from many of the settlers asking for help. There
was also quite a bit of information on some of the Hirsch supported
settlements in Argentina. These microfilms are accessible through
the interlibrary loan >from the National Archives of Canada. I think
they have a website.
Henry Wellisch
JGS of Canada (Toronto)


Re: A Threatening Letter #general

Steven Chall <steven.chall@...>
 

Several articles appeared in the newspaper this week regarding legal
issues as a result of the new privacy law which just took effect in
Europe. If you have any Europeans who are sensitive to having their data
included and want to avoid a lawsuit, regardless of where *you* live, you
would do well to limit disclosing too much data about them.

613 Steven Chall in Minneapolis, MN =[;-)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: A Threatening Letter #general

Steven Chall <steven.chall@...>
 

Several articles appeared in the newspaper this week regarding legal
issues as a result of the new privacy law which just took effect in
Europe. If you have any Europeans who are sensitive to having their data
included and want to avoid a lawsuit, regardless of where *you* live, you
would do well to limit disclosing too much data about them.

613 Steven Chall in Minneapolis, MN =[;-)


Baron de Hirsh #general

r feldman <medserv@...>
 

I want to thank all the people that sent me such helpful advice. Now I
know where to look I can really start on the trail of following my
GGrandfathers movements.

Thank you all again
Ron Feldman


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Baron de Hirsh #general

r feldman <medserv@...>
 

I want to thank all the people that sent me such helpful advice. Now I
know where to look I can really start on the trail of following my
GGrandfathers movements.

Thank you all again
Ron Feldman


JRI-Poland / Polish Archives project: Mlawa & Nowy Dwor branches #general

Stanley Diamond
 

Jewish Records Indexing - Poland is pleased to announce that work
is well under way in the indexing of the Jewish vital records for the
ten towns in the Mlawa branch of the Polish State Archvives which
have _not_ been microfilmed by the LDS (Mormons).

This indexing is part of the project announced at the Summer Seminar
in Los Angeles. For more details of the JRI-Poland / Polish State
Archives project, please read the announcement on the JRI-Poland
website: www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl and click on "press releases." For
a more detailed description of the project, click on "Presentation at
Seminar, Los Angeles, July 14, 1998."

News about the Mlawa Archives project
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Mlawa (100 km NW of Warsaw) branch has Jewish vital records
for the towns/years noted below. (The years indicated apply only to
non-microfilmed records which are being indexed as part of this
project.)

The Szrensk and Zuromin records to be indexed include earlier
years _missed_ during the LDS filming.

Biezun: 1877 - 1896
Ciechanow: 1866 - 1896
Kucbork: 1866 - 1897
Mlawa: 1866-1898
Nowe Miasto: 1874 - 1897 (some years/types missing)
Plonsk: 1873 - 1895
Raciaz: 1876 - 1896
Radzanow: 1866 - 1894
Szrensk: 1840-1841, 1844, 1866-1895
Zuromin: 1826-1828, 1866-1895

The "Archive Coordinator" for Mlawa is Stan Zeidenberg of Toronto.
Watch for a post >from Stan Z. concerning help needed to complete
the work of indexing the above towns/records/years. As soon as
that has been done, the indices will be available to researchers
through the JRI-Poland database.

Now, for news of Nowy Dwor, the _next_ archives to be indexed.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jewish Records Indexing - Poland is asking for a volunteer or
volunteers to become the "Archive Coordinator(s)" for the Nowy Dwor
Archives indexing project. (Nowy Dwor is 25 km NW of Warsaw.)

The towns whose Jewish vital records registers are in Nowy Dwor
are listed below. Note, years in brackets refer to those records
which have _not_ been filmed by the LDS.

Czerwinsk: Records end in 1865 but a few years were not filmed by the LDS
Nowy Dwor (1824 - 1897)
Okuniew: Available records appear to have already been filmed by the LDS
Plonsk: May be duplicates of records in registers in Mlawa.
Radzymin (1829, 1863/1897)
Serock (1874 - 1896)
Sochocin (1880 - 1897)
Zakroczym (1877 - 1897)

The "Archive Coordinator" is responsible for finding, appointing and
working with "Town Leaders." Anyone interested in assuming the
responsibility of Nowy Dwor Archive Coordinator should respond to
me directly.

Town Leaders organize the project to index their town's records.
That means reaching out to all researchers with an interest in the
specific town. There is no data entry work by volunteers for this
project; all data entry is done by professionals in Poland. Town
leaders and their supporters will be eligible to receive the full
database of indices for their town!

Stanley Diamond
Coordinator, Jewish Records Indexing - Poland


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen JRI-Poland / Polish Archives project: Mlawa & Nowy Dwor branches #general

Stanley Diamond
 

Jewish Records Indexing - Poland is pleased to announce that work
is well under way in the indexing of the Jewish vital records for the
ten towns in the Mlawa branch of the Polish State Archvives which
have _not_ been microfilmed by the LDS (Mormons).

This indexing is part of the project announced at the Summer Seminar
in Los Angeles. For more details of the JRI-Poland / Polish State
Archives project, please read the announcement on the JRI-Poland
website: www.jewishgen.org/jri-pl and click on "press releases." For
a more detailed description of the project, click on "Presentation at
Seminar, Los Angeles, July 14, 1998."

News about the Mlawa Archives project
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The Mlawa (100 km NW of Warsaw) branch has Jewish vital records
for the towns/years noted below. (The years indicated apply only to
non-microfilmed records which are being indexed as part of this
project.)

The Szrensk and Zuromin records to be indexed include earlier
years _missed_ during the LDS filming.

Biezun: 1877 - 1896
Ciechanow: 1866 - 1896
Kucbork: 1866 - 1897
Mlawa: 1866-1898
Nowe Miasto: 1874 - 1897 (some years/types missing)
Plonsk: 1873 - 1895
Raciaz: 1876 - 1896
Radzanow: 1866 - 1894
Szrensk: 1840-1841, 1844, 1866-1895
Zuromin: 1826-1828, 1866-1895

The "Archive Coordinator" for Mlawa is Stan Zeidenberg of Toronto.
Watch for a post >from Stan Z. concerning help needed to complete
the work of indexing the above towns/records/years. As soon as
that has been done, the indices will be available to researchers
through the JRI-Poland database.

Now, for news of Nowy Dwor, the _next_ archives to be indexed.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jewish Records Indexing - Poland is asking for a volunteer or
volunteers to become the "Archive Coordinator(s)" for the Nowy Dwor
Archives indexing project. (Nowy Dwor is 25 km NW of Warsaw.)

The towns whose Jewish vital records registers are in Nowy Dwor
are listed below. Note, years in brackets refer to those records
which have _not_ been filmed by the LDS.

Czerwinsk: Records end in 1865 but a few years were not filmed by the LDS
Nowy Dwor (1824 - 1897)
Okuniew: Available records appear to have already been filmed by the LDS
Plonsk: May be duplicates of records in registers in Mlawa.
Radzymin (1829, 1863/1897)
Serock (1874 - 1896)
Sochocin (1880 - 1897)
Zakroczym (1877 - 1897)

The "Archive Coordinator" is responsible for finding, appointing and
working with "Town Leaders." Anyone interested in assuming the
responsibility of Nowy Dwor Archive Coordinator should respond to
me directly.

Town Leaders organize the project to index their town's records.
That means reaching out to all researchers with an interest in the
specific town. There is no data entry work by volunteers for this
project; all data entry is done by professionals in Poland. Town
leaders and their supporters will be eligible to receive the full
database of indices for their town!

Stanley Diamond
Coordinator, Jewish Records Indexing - Poland


PEKAO = PKO? #general

Daniel Wagner <Cpwagner@...>
 

Irene Newhouse wrote:

there is a
service called PEKAO that will transfer dollars to Poland, they have
a website at something fairly obvious like www.pekao.com, though I
wouldn't swear to it. A web search should turn up the right URL if
that's not it, PEKAO being a rather unique string.
There is (was?) a Polish bank called PKO, which even has (had?) a
branch here in Israel. Possibly the same as PEKAO.

Daniel

______________
H Daniel Wagner
Rehovot, Israel


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen PEKAO = PKO? #general

Daniel Wagner <Cpwagner@...>
 

Irene Newhouse wrote:

there is a
service called PEKAO that will transfer dollars to Poland, they have
a website at something fairly obvious like www.pekao.com, though I
wouldn't swear to it. A web search should turn up the right URL if
that's not it, PEKAO being a rather unique string.
There is (was?) a Polish bank called PKO, which even has (had?) a
branch here in Israel. Possibly the same as PEKAO.

Daniel

______________
H Daniel Wagner
Rehovot, Israel


Re: Age discrepancy #general

eric adler <ea73@...>
 

Selma Ring Prager wrote:

"Is there any reason that immigrants would lower their actual age
on the ship manifest?"

My gggf lowered his age >from 62 to 55 on his ship manifest >from Hamburg
to New York City in 1906. We believe that this was because he feared
that immigration authorities would not have let him in, thinking he was
too old to make a living. Of course, some people may have just lied a
lot: his age varies and is understated on every document I've found,
except for the birth record.

Eric Adler
Hanau, Germany


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen RE: Age discrepancy #general

eric adler <ea73@...>
 

Selma Ring Prager wrote:

"Is there any reason that immigrants would lower their actual age
on the ship manifest?"

My gggf lowered his age >from 62 to 55 on his ship manifest >from Hamburg
to New York City in 1906. We believe that this was because he feared
that immigration authorities would not have let him in, thinking he was
too old to make a living. Of course, some people may have just lied a
lot: his age varies and is understated on every document I've found,
except for the birth record.

Eric Adler
Hanau, Germany


More Records Uncovered in Minsk Archive #belarus

David M. Fox <fox@...>
 

I just received the latest issue of "Avotaynu - the International
Review of Jewish Genealogy" (Vol XIV, Number 3, Fall 1998). There
are a number of very informative articles of interest to the Belarus
SIG members in this issue and I would strongly suggest you subscribe
to this publication if you have not done so already. In this message,
I will only talk about the article by Vlad Soshnikov titled "About
the Russian Archivist's Soul" and only the portion that deals with
the Belarus archives.

In July 1998, while Mr. Soshnikov was doing some work in the Belarus
Natioanl Historical Archives in Misnsk, he discovered some new records
which have not been previously made known the the Jewish genealogy
community. Because of copywrite restrictions, I can not duplicate
the list, but will try and summarize what he found in some old big
volumes which only had a "general description" of the volumes. Amoung
the records that Mr. Soshnikov found in Collection #2151 of the
Mogilev Tresasury were Revision (census) Lists and alphabetical lists
of Jewish Town dwellers in a number of gubernia, districts, towns, and
shtetls:

Mogilev Gubernia
Bykhov District
Gomel District
Rossasny, Goretzky District
Liadny, Goretzky District
Kopys, Kopys District
Klimovitchi & nearby towns, Klimovitch District
Mogilev and Mogilev District
Shklov, Mogilev District
Dubrovka, Orsha District
Goretsky & Savsky, Orsha District
Dubrovensky, Orsha District
Liadny, Orsha district
Bayevsky & Rossasinsky, Orsha District
Rogatchev District
Cherikov, Krichev & Molostovitchi, Cherikov District
Mstislavl and Mstislavl District
Khoslavitchi, Mstislavl District
Monastyrschinsk, Mstislavl District
Kasimirova Sloboda, Mstislavl District
Tatarsk, Mstislavl District
Kadin, Mstislavl District
Shomov, Mstislavl District
Zakharin, Mstislavl District

While not all locations noted above have lists for all years, the
following years are represented:
1816
1831
1852
1858
1867-69
1873-79
1881-86


In addition to the above Mr. Soshnikov also found Collection #330
of the Minsk City Government for Town Dwellers. It contains a
family lsit of Jewish townswellers of Minsk in 1894 (884 families).
These names were translated >from Russian to English and appeared
in the RAGAS Report. If anyone has this Report, please contact me
via private e-mail.

A recent breakthrough in my own personal family research has
emphasized the importance of information that can be extracted
from the Revision Lists. This past week I received a translation
from the 1811 Minsk Revision LIst (this is one that has been filmed
by the Mormons) with the entries for one of my surnames (TSIVIN).
Although this Revision list only has males, it provided me with four new
generations that I was able to link to by previous research. I now have
the name of my ggggggg grandfather born about 1730. I would expect that
Revision Lists >from other years will provide additional names (male and
female)
to add to my tree.

As you can see >from this message and previous postings, more and more
records are being uncovered all the time. For those of you who have
reached a roadblock in your research, never give up the search!

David Fox
fox@erols.com
Arnold, MD
Belarus SIG Coordinator


Belarus SIG #Belarus More Records Uncovered in Minsk Archive #belarus

David M. Fox <fox@...>
 

I just received the latest issue of "Avotaynu - the International
Review of Jewish Genealogy" (Vol XIV, Number 3, Fall 1998). There
are a number of very informative articles of interest to the Belarus
SIG members in this issue and I would strongly suggest you subscribe
to this publication if you have not done so already. In this message,
I will only talk about the article by Vlad Soshnikov titled "About
the Russian Archivist's Soul" and only the portion that deals with
the Belarus archives.

In July 1998, while Mr. Soshnikov was doing some work in the Belarus
Natioanl Historical Archives in Misnsk, he discovered some new records
which have not been previously made known the the Jewish genealogy
community. Because of copywrite restrictions, I can not duplicate
the list, but will try and summarize what he found in some old big
volumes which only had a "general description" of the volumes. Amoung
the records that Mr. Soshnikov found in Collection #2151 of the
Mogilev Tresasury were Revision (census) Lists and alphabetical lists
of Jewish Town dwellers in a number of gubernia, districts, towns, and
shtetls:

Mogilev Gubernia
Bykhov District
Gomel District
Rossasny, Goretzky District
Liadny, Goretzky District
Kopys, Kopys District
Klimovitchi & nearby towns, Klimovitch District
Mogilev and Mogilev District
Shklov, Mogilev District
Dubrovka, Orsha District
Goretsky & Savsky, Orsha District
Dubrovensky, Orsha District
Liadny, Orsha district
Bayevsky & Rossasinsky, Orsha District
Rogatchev District
Cherikov, Krichev & Molostovitchi, Cherikov District
Mstislavl and Mstislavl District
Khoslavitchi, Mstislavl District
Monastyrschinsk, Mstislavl District
Kasimirova Sloboda, Mstislavl District
Tatarsk, Mstislavl District
Kadin, Mstislavl District
Shomov, Mstislavl District
Zakharin, Mstislavl District

While not all locations noted above have lists for all years, the
following years are represented:
1816
1831
1852
1858
1867-69
1873-79
1881-86


In addition to the above Mr. Soshnikov also found Collection #330
of the Minsk City Government for Town Dwellers. It contains a
family lsit of Jewish townswellers of Minsk in 1894 (884 families).
These names were translated >from Russian to English and appeared
in the RAGAS Report. If anyone has this Report, please contact me
via private e-mail.

A recent breakthrough in my own personal family research has
emphasized the importance of information that can be extracted
from the Revision Lists. This past week I received a translation
from the 1811 Minsk Revision LIst (this is one that has been filmed
by the Mormons) with the entries for one of my surnames (TSIVIN).
Although this Revision list only has males, it provided me with four new
generations that I was able to link to by previous research. I now have
the name of my ggggggg grandfather born about 1730. I would expect that
Revision Lists >from other years will provide additional names (male and
female)
to add to my tree.

As you can see >from this message and previous postings, more and more
records are being uncovered all the time. For those of you who have
reached a roadblock in your research, never give up the search!

David Fox
fox@erols.com
Arnold, MD
Belarus SIG Coordinator


Mother's maiden family name #hungary

Touvia Goldstein <touviagoldstein@...>
 

Rabbi Marmorstein wrote:

< ...but went unrecorded and children had to be registered under the
mother's maiden name.>

As I consider the following information of a personal genealogical
experience pertinent to the list, permit me to post it:

Almost 20 years ago when I started my geneological research, as I am a
Levi, (Tribe alevi),I was only looking for Goldstein Leviim. This
almost axiomatic situation for me than, made disregard many elderly
people that I interviewed in the course of time as I did not continue
with them the investigation because they where not Leviim.

Some years ago I discoverd in a factual way a Goldstein beeing a Cohen
and then I found out the story that jewish mother's, for some reason
that I did not know, and now I find, eventually, the explaination in
Rabbi Marmorstein's post, why this happened.

Further more, also some years ago, I found out that I was not the
first born to my own parents. They never spoke of my elder brother z"l
that died when he was 4 months old. He is burried in the Kocise Jewish
Cemetary under the name of Hibshcman, my mother's maiden name, and not
Goldstein.My parents are first cousins as you can see it My Family Tree.

<http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Flats/1756/>

The Goldstein Cohen mentioned above,was the son of a Goldstein lady
married to a Cohen.

Touvia Goldstein
Kiryat Ono, ISRAEL




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Hungary SIG #Hungary Mother's maiden family name #hungary

Touvia Goldstein <touviagoldstein@...>
 

Rabbi Marmorstein wrote:

< ...but went unrecorded and children had to be registered under the
mother's maiden name.>

As I consider the following information of a personal genealogical
experience pertinent to the list, permit me to post it:

Almost 20 years ago when I started my geneological research, as I am a
Levi, (Tribe alevi),I was only looking for Goldstein Leviim. This
almost axiomatic situation for me than, made disregard many elderly
people that I interviewed in the course of time as I did not continue
with them the investigation because they where not Leviim.

Some years ago I discoverd in a factual way a Goldstein beeing a Cohen
and then I found out the story that jewish mother's, for some reason
that I did not know, and now I find, eventually, the explaination in
Rabbi Marmorstein's post, why this happened.

Further more, also some years ago, I found out that I was not the
first born to my own parents. They never spoke of my elder brother z"l
that died when he was 4 months old. He is burried in the Kocise Jewish
Cemetary under the name of Hibshcman, my mother's maiden name, and not
Goldstein.My parents are first cousins as you can see it My Family Tree.

<http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Flats/1756/>

The Goldstein Cohen mentioned above,was the son of a Goldstein lady
married to a Cohen.

Touvia Goldstein
Kiryat Ono, ISRAEL




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