Date   

Re: WERTHEIMER #unitedkingdom

Gunther Steinberg <Gunther-Steinberg-PV@...>
 

Gerard Marx asked about Wertheimer and a variant spelling, which was
answered very nicely by Judith Romney Wegner.

Indeed, the town of origin was frequently used as a last name when surname
adoption became obligatory at the turn or the 18th century (Austria earlier
than Germany and France).

If you look in Egmar Ruppert's data base on Jews >from Northern Germany, you
would find that there are five WERTHEIMER families listed >from the
following towns:
Peine, Wulfelade, Hannover, Heimarshausen and Hofgeismar, all starting in
1700 or 1770.
There is one WERTHEIM >from Breidenbach).

But the real origin may still have been WERTHEIM.
By example, one branch of the descendants of Simon >from Kassel (first
mentioned in 1549) took the name of the town where they had lived since
the early 1600s: WARBURG.

Gunther Steinberg
Portola Valley CA USA
mailto:Gunther-Steinberg-PV@worldnet.att.net

Gerard Marx wrote:

Is there a connection between the family names: WERTHEIMER and
WURTHEIMER ?
Previously posted answer to original message deleted.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen RE: WERTHEIMER #general

Gunther Steinberg <Gunther-Steinberg-PV@...>
 

Gerard Marx asked about Wertheimer and a variant spelling, which was
answered very nicely by Judith Romney Wegner.

Indeed, the town of origin was frequently used as a last name when surname
adoption became obligatory at the turn or the 18th century (Austria earlier
than Germany and France).

If you look in Egmar Ruppert's data base on Jews >from Northern Germany, you
would find that there are five WERTHEIMER families listed >from the
following towns:
Peine, Wulfelade, Hannover, Heimarshausen and Hofgeismar, all starting in
1700 or 1770.
There is one WERTHEIM >from Breidenbach).

But the real origin may still have been WERTHEIM.
By example, one branch of the descendants of Simon >from Kassel (first
mentioned in 1549) took the name of the town where they had lived since
the early 1600s: WARBURG.

Gunther Steinberg
Portola Valley CA USA
mailto:Gunther-Steinberg-PV@worldnet.att.net

Gerard Marx wrote:

Is there a connection between the family names: WERTHEIMER and
WURTHEIMER ?
Previously posted answer to original message deleted.


Searching BASSEIN #general

cbishoes <cbishoes@...>
 

I am researching my family >from Minsk, with the surname BASSEIN.
Has anybody run across this name?
Miriam Camitta


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Searching BASSEIN #general

cbishoes <cbishoes@...>
 

I am researching my family >from Minsk, with the surname BASSEIN.
Has anybody run across this name?
Miriam Camitta


eastern european maps and locating shtetls #general

Phyllis Kramer <phylliskramer1@...>
 

R Feldman has posted a common question
"Is there any place I can find a more general overview of Eastern Europe
with countries, regions and provinces for different periods of time,
especially if they are in maps."

I have found the local librarian very helpful; I've seen an historical
atlas which showed Eastern Europe as the borders changed. I actually
xeroxed about 6 maps >from an atlas showing Eastern Europe in the
16th/17th/18/19th and 20th centuries.....I found this to be very helpful.

At both annual Jewish Genealogy seminars, I have heard good lectures on
this very topic......it confuses many of us.

I have also had luck in searching out Jewish shtetls, by using the Family
finder.......I put in the shtetl name, "Any Country", and use the Soundex
button.........often I can locate a common Jewish shtetl by the sheer
numbers of researchers interested in that town.....then of course I must
corroborate the potential shtetl by looking at mapquest, checking the
nearest city etc.

And lastly, don't forget the Jewishgen Info Files.....the one on Russia is
particularly helpful.......I believe Warren Blatt wrote it. To send for
the index of info files......send a blank email message to:
index@mail.jewishgen.org

good luck
Phyllis Kramer

PhyllisKramer1@worldnet.att.net,
Wilton Conn and NYC ...... searching

KRAMER, WISNER >from Jasienica Rosielna, Poland
STECHER, TRACHMAN, FEIR/FEUER, KORNREICH (Zmigrod & Rymanow, Pol)
KANDEL, SCHIMMEL, SCHEINER, GREENBERG (Strzyzow & Dubiecko, Pol)
LINDNER, EICHEL, BERLIN, MAURER, MERL, WEICH (Rogatin & Bolechov, Ukr)
LINDNER, JONAS (Iasi, Romania)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen eastern european maps and locating shtetls #general

Phyllis Kramer <phylliskramer1@...>
 

R Feldman has posted a common question
"Is there any place I can find a more general overview of Eastern Europe
with countries, regions and provinces for different periods of time,
especially if they are in maps."

I have found the local librarian very helpful; I've seen an historical
atlas which showed Eastern Europe as the borders changed. I actually
xeroxed about 6 maps >from an atlas showing Eastern Europe in the
16th/17th/18/19th and 20th centuries.....I found this to be very helpful.

At both annual Jewish Genealogy seminars, I have heard good lectures on
this very topic......it confuses many of us.

I have also had luck in searching out Jewish shtetls, by using the Family
finder.......I put in the shtetl name, "Any Country", and use the Soundex
button.........often I can locate a common Jewish shtetl by the sheer
numbers of researchers interested in that town.....then of course I must
corroborate the potential shtetl by looking at mapquest, checking the
nearest city etc.

And lastly, don't forget the Jewishgen Info Files.....the one on Russia is
particularly helpful.......I believe Warren Blatt wrote it. To send for
the index of info files......send a blank email message to:
index@mail.jewishgen.org

good luck
Phyllis Kramer

PhyllisKramer1@worldnet.att.net,
Wilton Conn and NYC ...... searching

KRAMER, WISNER >from Jasienica Rosielna, Poland
STECHER, TRACHMAN, FEIR/FEUER, KORNREICH (Zmigrod & Rymanow, Pol)
KANDEL, SCHIMMEL, SCHEINER, GREENBERG (Strzyzow & Dubiecko, Pol)
LINDNER, EICHEL, BERLIN, MAURER, MERL, WEICH (Rogatin & Bolechov, Ukr)
LINDNER, JONAS (Iasi, Romania)


Re: Dryszczow, Dryshchuv, Poland #general

armata@...
 

In article <362D2020.F933CAC4@optimaepc.com>, sharon@optimaepc.com (Alexander Sharon) writes:

Does anyone know where I can find vital records for citizens of
Dryszczow (or Dryshchuv), Poland?...
Dryszczow [spell Dree shch uff] is correct, located SE >from Chelm, close to
Zamosc province. Nearest town, where information could be located is Chelm
or second choice - Zamosc.

Be sure you have the right Dryszczow --there are two other Dryszczows in
modern Ukraine that were formerly in Poland. Both are southeast of
Lviv, in former Berezany/Brzezany county (that Dryszczow had 95 Jews out of
a population of 960 before the war), and in Pidjahci/Podhajce county
(that one had 30 Jews out of a population of 1420 before the war). The
Ukrainian spelling of the villages is Dryshchiv, and they were in Austrian
Galicia before the war.

Joe Armata
armata@vms.cis.pitt.edu


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Dryszczow, Dryshchuv, Poland #general

armata@...
 

In article <362D2020.F933CAC4@optimaepc.com>, sharon@optimaepc.com (Alexander Sharon) writes:

Does anyone know where I can find vital records for citizens of
Dryszczow (or Dryshchuv), Poland?...
Dryszczow [spell Dree shch uff] is correct, located SE >from Chelm, close to
Zamosc province. Nearest town, where information could be located is Chelm
or second choice - Zamosc.

Be sure you have the right Dryszczow --there are two other Dryszczows in
modern Ukraine that were formerly in Poland. Both are southeast of
Lviv, in former Berezany/Brzezany county (that Dryszczow had 95 Jews out of
a population of 960 before the war), and in Pidjahci/Podhajce county
(that one had 30 Jews out of a population of 1420 before the war). The
Ukrainian spelling of the villages is Dryshchiv, and they were in Austrian
Galicia before the war.

Joe Armata
armata@vms.cis.pitt.edu


*Re: Krosno,Galicia,Poland #general

Tom Venetianer <tom.vene@...>
 

Try this:
http://www.pgsa.org/galizien.htm
It contains data on Galicia. This is the site of the Polish-American
genealogical Society, quite interesting for those with ancestry in that
country.
Tom Venetianer

William Leibner wrote


Does anyone know whether there is a web site for this community and if
yes what is it's location. How does one go about setting up a site.Thank
you for your assistance.Mail your answer to Leibner@green.co.il or
this forum.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen *Re: Krosno,Galicia,Poland #general

Tom Venetianer <tom.vene@...>
 

Try this:
http://www.pgsa.org/galizien.htm
It contains data on Galicia. This is the site of the Polish-American
genealogical Society, quite interesting for those with ancestry in that
country.
Tom Venetianer

William Leibner wrote


Does anyone know whether there is a web site for this community and if
yes what is it's location. How does one go about setting up a site.Thank
you for your assistance.Mail your answer to Leibner@green.co.il or
this forum.


KIELCE LDS records #general

David Price <David_Price@...>
 

Are all the vital records for KIELCE on the LDS microfilms for KIELCE
after 1869 and on the LDS films for CHECINY before that year. Are any of
the CHECINY records on the mainly CHMIELNIK microfilms #1808864 and the
earlier made one.
David Price


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen KIELCE LDS records #general

David Price <David_Price@...>
 

Are all the vital records for KIELCE on the LDS microfilms for KIELCE
after 1869 and on the LDS films for CHECINY before that year. Are any of
the CHECINY records on the mainly CHMIELNIK microfilms #1808864 and the
earlier made one.
David Price


searching for POSNER #general

wazza <wazza@...>
 

Looking for family of Woolf POSNER, (b.London, England 1861), he is my great
Grandfather. His father was a Jacob POSNER born 1829 in Poland, exact
whereabouts unknown. Married a Therese (born 1831 also Poland somewhere.
Jacob and Therese had a family of 9 children, the 2 eldest were born in
Poland and the remainder born in England somewhere. According to a 1891
Census, he a tailor business in High Street kensington where they also
resided.

If anyone recognises these names or can offer some help I would be grateful.

Wayne B. Hodges


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen searching for POSNER #general

wazza <wazza@...>
 

Looking for family of Woolf POSNER, (b.London, England 1861), he is my great
Grandfather. His father was a Jacob POSNER born 1829 in Poland, exact
whereabouts unknown. Married a Therese (born 1831 also Poland somewhere.
Jacob and Therese had a family of 9 children, the 2 eldest were born in
Poland and the remainder born in England somewhere. According to a 1891
Census, he a tailor business in High Street kensington where they also
resided.

If anyone recognises these names or can offer some help I would be grateful.

Wayne B. Hodges


Uri and Shraga WERE Phoebuses! #general

Judith Romney Wegner
 

Warren Blatt claims that many of the Harkavy's "English" equivalents to
Yiddish names came right out of his head and bore no relationship to
real-life practices. However, Warren's list of examples >from Harkavy
contained at least one case (and perhaps more) of "one of these things is
not like the others." So which was the odd man (or odd men!) out?

Warren said: > for "Uri" and "Shraga", he [Harkavy] suggests "Phoebus"<

_In actual historical fact_ Uri and Shraga _are_ directly connected with
Phoebus. It was not uncommon in the middle ages for an Uri ora Shraga (both
names connote light or torch or flame or shining) to be called Phoebus
(meaning "Shining One"). There was a famous 18th-century printer of Hebrew
books called Uri Phoebus ben Aaron Ha-Levi). In time, Phoebus became
yiddishized to "Feibush/Feivish/Feivel." So "Shraga Feivel" -- a common
combination-- is simply a yiddish version of Shraga Phoebus.

Warren further stated:
In my study of Hebrew and English given names on over 10,000
tombstones in early 20th-century landsmanshaft cemeteries in
New York and Boston, NONE of these name pairs appeared!
Well, maybe no Shraga Phoebus as such , but I bet you found a few Shraga
Feivels -- which is really the same thing, as explained above.

Furthermore, the other examples >from Harkavy struck me as quite plausible
-- even if some took a little figuring out (for instance, Shprintza =
Hope because Shprintza is a yiddish form of Esperanza!) Almost all the
examples were girls' names. Unlike Jewish boys, who (no matter where they
were born) would usually receive a traditional Hebrew/Jewish name at the
bris, we find throughout Jewish history that girls born in countries where
Jews mixed with the population and spoke local languages (e.g. Greek or
Latin in the Hellenistic age, Arabic in the heyday of medieval Islam, and
Italian in the Renaissance) often have female names belonging to that
culture. A medieval Italian Ashkenazi could easily name his/her daughter
"Dulcia" to correspond with the Yiddish name Sissel; and as names often
get passed down the generations, I have actually met a Dulcie whose Jewish
name was Sissel! I think we should avoid focusing narrowly on the
practices of 19th- century East European Jewish immigrants, as though their
practices somehow represent the norm and all others are anomalies!

Judith Romney Wegner
jrw@brown.edu


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Uri and Shraga WERE Phoebuses! #general

Judith Romney Wegner
 

Warren Blatt claims that many of the Harkavy's "English" equivalents to
Yiddish names came right out of his head and bore no relationship to
real-life practices. However, Warren's list of examples >from Harkavy
contained at least one case (and perhaps more) of "one of these things is
not like the others." So which was the odd man (or odd men!) out?

Warren said: > for "Uri" and "Shraga", he [Harkavy] suggests "Phoebus"<

_In actual historical fact_ Uri and Shraga _are_ directly connected with
Phoebus. It was not uncommon in the middle ages for an Uri ora Shraga (both
names connote light or torch or flame or shining) to be called Phoebus
(meaning "Shining One"). There was a famous 18th-century printer of Hebrew
books called Uri Phoebus ben Aaron Ha-Levi). In time, Phoebus became
yiddishized to "Feibush/Feivish/Feivel." So "Shraga Feivel" -- a common
combination-- is simply a yiddish version of Shraga Phoebus.

Warren further stated:
In my study of Hebrew and English given names on over 10,000
tombstones in early 20th-century landsmanshaft cemeteries in
New York and Boston, NONE of these name pairs appeared!
Well, maybe no Shraga Phoebus as such , but I bet you found a few Shraga
Feivels -- which is really the same thing, as explained above.

Furthermore, the other examples >from Harkavy struck me as quite plausible
-- even if some took a little figuring out (for instance, Shprintza =
Hope because Shprintza is a yiddish form of Esperanza!) Almost all the
examples were girls' names. Unlike Jewish boys, who (no matter where they
were born) would usually receive a traditional Hebrew/Jewish name at the
bris, we find throughout Jewish history that girls born in countries where
Jews mixed with the population and spoke local languages (e.g. Greek or
Latin in the Hellenistic age, Arabic in the heyday of medieval Islam, and
Italian in the Renaissance) often have female names belonging to that
culture. A medieval Italian Ashkenazi could easily name his/her daughter
"Dulcia" to correspond with the Yiddish name Sissel; and as names often
get passed down the generations, I have actually met a Dulcie whose Jewish
name was Sissel! I think we should avoid focusing narrowly on the
practices of 19th- century East European Jewish immigrants, as though their
practices somehow represent the norm and all others are anomalies!

Judith Romney Wegner
jrw@brown.edu


Help with Records #lithuania

Wolinsky <wolinsky@...>
 

I have received a batch of documents >from the Kaunas Archives and hoped
more experienced folks could help me interpret some information in there:

--The research was on the Israel and Tumin families, of Slobodka and
Shrednik, respectively.
I noted that the same number was assigned to families >from 1834 through
1898. Such as #35 for the Israels.
But within the #35 in one case were people with apparently different last
names, such as Movsha SEGAL and his brother Borukh,.
Is it likely that the Segals are related to the Israels because they were
listed in that group?

--In 1874, the revision list notes that Girsh Nison Israel lived in his own
wooden house. It gives a location of the 8th section in the 3rd district of
Kaunas. Do maps exist that would pinpoint that location? This is the only
record that notes a person's "own wooden house." What other housing
arrangements were there?
--It mentions that Girsh's father was Peres Israel, a shoemaker. Is Peres a
Hebrew or Yiddish name (a la Shimon Peres?)
--In 1852, the translation fails to list women's names >from the Tumin
family--though the women's names are listed elsewhere. COuld the translator
have overlooked this? Or women's names not taken down in 1852.
--Two family members were listed as "missing." E.G., Itsko Izrael who was
"39 in 1834, missing" in 1850. What does missing mean? Did they go
underground because of the draft? Or were they simply missing and presumed
dead? Any guesses?
--What is the Army Recruitment District List? Are these men eligible for
the military or men in the military?
Any help would be appreciated.

Anyone waiting for records might like to know that the search for these
records was started Dec. 19, 1997 and records were sent out Oct. 2, 1998.

Howard Wolinsky
Flossmoor, IL
searching for ISRAEL in Slobodka, TUMIN in SHrednik and SHRAGON/SRAGON in
Babtai and Kovno


Lithuania SIG #Lithuania Help with Records #lithuania

Wolinsky <wolinsky@...>
 

I have received a batch of documents >from the Kaunas Archives and hoped
more experienced folks could help me interpret some information in there:

--The research was on the Israel and Tumin families, of Slobodka and
Shrednik, respectively.
I noted that the same number was assigned to families >from 1834 through
1898. Such as #35 for the Israels.
But within the #35 in one case were people with apparently different last
names, such as Movsha SEGAL and his brother Borukh,.
Is it likely that the Segals are related to the Israels because they were
listed in that group?

--In 1874, the revision list notes that Girsh Nison Israel lived in his own
wooden house. It gives a location of the 8th section in the 3rd district of
Kaunas. Do maps exist that would pinpoint that location? This is the only
record that notes a person's "own wooden house." What other housing
arrangements were there?
--It mentions that Girsh's father was Peres Israel, a shoemaker. Is Peres a
Hebrew or Yiddish name (a la Shimon Peres?)
--In 1852, the translation fails to list women's names >from the Tumin
family--though the women's names are listed elsewhere. COuld the translator
have overlooked this? Or women's names not taken down in 1852.
--Two family members were listed as "missing." E.G., Itsko Izrael who was
"39 in 1834, missing" in 1850. What does missing mean? Did they go
underground because of the draft? Or were they simply missing and presumed
dead? Any guesses?
--What is the Army Recruitment District List? Are these men eligible for
the military or men in the military?
Any help would be appreciated.

Anyone waiting for records might like to know that the search for these
records was started Dec. 19, 1997 and records were sent out Oct. 2, 1998.

Howard Wolinsky
Flossmoor, IL
searching for ISRAEL in Slobodka, TUMIN in SHrednik and SHRAGON/SRAGON in
Babtai and Kovno


IMPORTANT - NEW BEEPER - EMAIL BEEPER NUMBER #lithuania

Harold Rhode <hrhode@...>
 

Effective immediately, I have a new beeper telephone number. In the US,
it is:

1-800-368-2018

If you wish to send me an email beeper message, type
3682018@skytel.com Then type your message. It will appear on my
beeper.


THanks,


Harold Rhode


Lithuania SIG #Lithuania IMPORTANT - NEW BEEPER - EMAIL BEEPER NUMBER #lithuania

Harold Rhode <hrhode@...>
 

Effective immediately, I have a new beeper telephone number. In the US,
it is:

1-800-368-2018

If you wish to send me an email beeper message, type
3682018@skytel.com Then type your message. It will appear on my
beeper.


THanks,


Harold Rhode