Date   

Dates on Certificates #general

Ben Saltman <bhsalt@...>
 

I have found numerous descrepancies some of which I expected. For
example, my grandmother told me that she lied about her age when she
arrived in this country. She was only 16 and claimed to be 19 in 1903.
She also lied about my mother's age so I expected this. What I didn't
expect was that my father lied about where he was born--not Los Angeles,
but most likely Chicago. For various reasons immigrants have lied, out of
fear, out of misunderstandings about what was expected of them. I do not
understand why my father lied about where he was born. Numerous
descrepancies appear on the death certificates for my family making it
difficult to determine when they came to this country. My paternal
grandmother's maiden name and my grandfather's mother's maiden name are
the same on their death certificates. Is there an error here, or were
they related?

All of this not only makes our research more intriguing, but sometimes
also reveals poignant, sometimes painful human circumstances. A relative
who died in 1919, I was told, was hospitalized coming home >from the war.
In obtaining his death certificate, I discovered he died in San Quentin
from cerebrospinal meningitis. He was nineteen years old and there for
only 40 days. Was he an inmate, or was the San Quentin hospital used for
contagious diseases? I am waiting to hear >from the Archives in
Sacramento. The reference librarian will research information relating to
California institutions--prisons, inmates, politicians,
etc.(916-653-7715).

As someone else has mentioned, there is no one left in my family to ask
anymore about what happened so here I am being a detective.

Helen Saltman
bhsalt@hooked.net

looking for: SALTZBERG--Chicago, Poland; SMIGELSKY--New Jersey, Poland;
BERGMAN--Malmo, Sweden; BERNHOLTZ, Poland; SALTMAN--Kryshopol


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Dates on Certificates #general

Ben Saltman <bhsalt@...>
 

I have found numerous descrepancies some of which I expected. For
example, my grandmother told me that she lied about her age when she
arrived in this country. She was only 16 and claimed to be 19 in 1903.
She also lied about my mother's age so I expected this. What I didn't
expect was that my father lied about where he was born--not Los Angeles,
but most likely Chicago. For various reasons immigrants have lied, out of
fear, out of misunderstandings about what was expected of them. I do not
understand why my father lied about where he was born. Numerous
descrepancies appear on the death certificates for my family making it
difficult to determine when they came to this country. My paternal
grandmother's maiden name and my grandfather's mother's maiden name are
the same on their death certificates. Is there an error here, or were
they related?

All of this not only makes our research more intriguing, but sometimes
also reveals poignant, sometimes painful human circumstances. A relative
who died in 1919, I was told, was hospitalized coming home >from the war.
In obtaining his death certificate, I discovered he died in San Quentin
from cerebrospinal meningitis. He was nineteen years old and there for
only 40 days. Was he an inmate, or was the San Quentin hospital used for
contagious diseases? I am waiting to hear >from the Archives in
Sacramento. The reference librarian will research information relating to
California institutions--prisons, inmates, politicians,
etc.(916-653-7715).

As someone else has mentioned, there is no one left in my family to ask
anymore about what happened so here I am being a detective.

Helen Saltman
bhsalt@hooked.net

looking for: SALTZBERG--Chicago, Poland; SMIGELSKY--New Jersey, Poland;
BERGMAN--Malmo, Sweden; BERNHOLTZ, Poland; SALTMAN--Kryshopol


Re: First Rymalower Y.M.B.A. #general

Brian Stern <BrianS@...>
 

I believe the town you are searching for is Grimaylov, found about 25 miles
se of Tarnopol in what was once Eastern Galicia and is now Ukraine.

Does anyone know if the use of 'First' in the names of lansmanshaftn or
burial societies was common and if it has any significance. I'm also
interested in a burial society called 'Erster Touster burial society',
First Touster burial society, and I'm wondering what the significance is of
the word First in the name.

Cheers,

Brian }:-{)}

Searching: AUERBACH HOCHMAN Touste, Ukr. ADLER, FISCH, Zholkva Ukr.


Latvia: A personal Journey Part III #general

Barbara Siegel <bsiegel@...>
 

"Where Once The Walked": A visit to my ancestral towns in Latvia after the
Paris 1997 Seminar.

Throughout my travels in Riga, Tukums, Ventspils, Pilten, Kuldiga, Liepaja,
and Grobin I attempted to make a video record of my experiences. In
capturing this on film there was a great deal of personal bias and
subjective editing. I was torn between trying to recreate a picture in my
mind's eye of what was in former years, and what was the reality today. I
probably erred in slighting the contemporary picture, e.g. omitting the
abacus on a store counter alongside more modern equipment. There was also
the problem of conserving batteries and making choices based on that
consideration. It probably would have been better to shoot more and edit
later, but the problem of film and battery economy plus the demands of
attention and energy made this difficult. These problems could be somewhat
resolved if 2 or more people were sharing the shooting and film recording.
Also, unlike many other travellers/researchers I did not program in many of
the Holocoust sites, mass graves etc.. This was for several reasons:1.)A
simple matter of time. My first priority was seeking information about my
ancestors which involved travelling to 6 towns, cemetery sites, town
museums, and archives. 2.)Even without any specific planning, evidences of
the Shoah are everywhere; destroyed or abandoned synagogues and cemeteries,
monuments to victims, museum displays, emptied ghettos, the towns with no or
just a scattering of Jews where there had been thriving Jewish communities.
The country is pretty much Judenrein with the exception of Riga. This was
emotionally profound and disturbing as it was. More would have been
excessively emotionally draining. Due to time restraints I had to make
choices- see the site of mass graves in Riga or the only functioning Jewish
school. I chose the school as an expression of our response to Hitler and
the Soviets. 3.) A Holocoust study is essentially another trip. I had a
different agenda.

Some social, economic and political observations re the contemporary Latvian
scene follow. I am not an historian of the region, nor an expert on the
political and social aspects of the country. My remarks are the result of
my personal observations,impressions, experiences, conversations over a
period of 6 days with 2 guides, and assorted personal encounters with
citizens and workers in the country. On the whole, people on the streets
seemed to be quite conservative. I saw no men with earrings or long hair.
Most seemed squeaky clean and neatly dressed. There weren't too many
laughing faces, and I was taken with the impression that people ofen seemed
rather grim. The streets were very clean, with barely any litter and
ubiquitous street sweepers with their long straw brooms. Latvians have a
love affair with American music. One hears it everywhere. In contrast to
this, they are now very nationalistic. Many prefer to speak Latvian, whereas
before Russian was the favored language. There is also a very strong
Germanic influence >from former times, and the German language is still
important. Families are small. Married couples tend to put off child bearing
or to have at the most only one child, a situation reflective of the
seriously depressed economic condition of the country. Decades of
Sovietization and communist government, and their subsequent withdrawal at
the beginning of he decade have left their mark. Latvians now experience
low wages, high prices, unemployment, and the withdrawal of formerly
subsidized services such as housing, health care, education etc.. There is
the very serious problem of pensioners who, under the Soviets, were able to
live on their small but then adequate pensions and are now often destitute.
A common sight on the streets of Riga is an elderly person standing for
hours with head bent down and holding out a small flat plate for coins.
Altho a sad commentary on contemporary Riga, I could never bring myself to
photograph these unfortunates.

To be continued.


Soc.Sec.Records #general

Arthur Blutstein <meandart@...>
 

I noted a reference to social security "applications" as a resource method.
Please, will some one explain the details of this process. I am only
familiar with SSDI. Thanks
Art


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: First Rymalower Y.M.B.A. #general

Brian Stern <BrianS@...>
 

I believe the town you are searching for is Grimaylov, found about 25 miles
se of Tarnopol in what was once Eastern Galicia and is now Ukraine.

Does anyone know if the use of 'First' in the names of lansmanshaftn or
burial societies was common and if it has any significance. I'm also
interested in a burial society called 'Erster Touster burial society',
First Touster burial society, and I'm wondering what the significance is of
the word First in the name.

Cheers,

Brian }:-{)}

Searching: AUERBACH HOCHMAN Touste, Ukr. ADLER, FISCH, Zholkva Ukr.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Latvia: A personal Journey Part III #general

Barbara Siegel <bsiegel@...>
 

"Where Once The Walked": A visit to my ancestral towns in Latvia after the
Paris 1997 Seminar.

Throughout my travels in Riga, Tukums, Ventspils, Pilten, Kuldiga, Liepaja,
and Grobin I attempted to make a video record of my experiences. In
capturing this on film there was a great deal of personal bias and
subjective editing. I was torn between trying to recreate a picture in my
mind's eye of what was in former years, and what was the reality today. I
probably erred in slighting the contemporary picture, e.g. omitting the
abacus on a store counter alongside more modern equipment. There was also
the problem of conserving batteries and making choices based on that
consideration. It probably would have been better to shoot more and edit
later, but the problem of film and battery economy plus the demands of
attention and energy made this difficult. These problems could be somewhat
resolved if 2 or more people were sharing the shooting and film recording.
Also, unlike many other travellers/researchers I did not program in many of
the Holocoust sites, mass graves etc.. This was for several reasons:1.)A
simple matter of time. My first priority was seeking information about my
ancestors which involved travelling to 6 towns, cemetery sites, town
museums, and archives. 2.)Even without any specific planning, evidences of
the Shoah are everywhere; destroyed or abandoned synagogues and cemeteries,
monuments to victims, museum displays, emptied ghettos, the towns with no or
just a scattering of Jews where there had been thriving Jewish communities.
The country is pretty much Judenrein with the exception of Riga. This was
emotionally profound and disturbing as it was. More would have been
excessively emotionally draining. Due to time restraints I had to make
choices- see the site of mass graves in Riga or the only functioning Jewish
school. I chose the school as an expression of our response to Hitler and
the Soviets. 3.) A Holocoust study is essentially another trip. I had a
different agenda.

Some social, economic and political observations re the contemporary Latvian
scene follow. I am not an historian of the region, nor an expert on the
political and social aspects of the country. My remarks are the result of
my personal observations,impressions, experiences, conversations over a
period of 6 days with 2 guides, and assorted personal encounters with
citizens and workers in the country. On the whole, people on the streets
seemed to be quite conservative. I saw no men with earrings or long hair.
Most seemed squeaky clean and neatly dressed. There weren't too many
laughing faces, and I was taken with the impression that people ofen seemed
rather grim. The streets were very clean, with barely any litter and
ubiquitous street sweepers with their long straw brooms. Latvians have a
love affair with American music. One hears it everywhere. In contrast to
this, they are now very nationalistic. Many prefer to speak Latvian, whereas
before Russian was the favored language. There is also a very strong
Germanic influence >from former times, and the German language is still
important. Families are small. Married couples tend to put off child bearing
or to have at the most only one child, a situation reflective of the
seriously depressed economic condition of the country. Decades of
Sovietization and communist government, and their subsequent withdrawal at
the beginning of he decade have left their mark. Latvians now experience
low wages, high prices, unemployment, and the withdrawal of formerly
subsidized services such as housing, health care, education etc.. There is
the very serious problem of pensioners who, under the Soviets, were able to
live on their small but then adequate pensions and are now often destitute.
A common sight on the streets of Riga is an elderly person standing for
hours with head bent down and holding out a small flat plate for coins.
Altho a sad commentary on contemporary Riga, I could never bring myself to
photograph these unfortunates.

To be continued.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Soc.Sec.Records #general

Arthur Blutstein <meandart@...>
 

I noted a reference to social security "applications" as a resource method.
Please, will some one explain the details of this process. I am only
familiar with SSDI. Thanks
Art


Date & Ages?! #general

David Edelman <pappapeach@...>
 

Dear All;
One thing to keep in mind, when there is a discrepancy in a persons
DOB:
In some countries, like Russia,there was a change in calender,
sometimes more then once. An individual born under the "old" calender,
when registering for say, a marrage licence, under the "new" calender,
depending on where they were on the issue of the change of calender, may
have stated one date or another.
When the person emigrates to a country with a "different" calender,
especially if they come with no proof of DOB, might now be listed as
another date.
In addition, when a baby is born at home, which was more common at
one time then today, no matter what calender system is being used,
sometimes due to the parents ignorence or plain forgetfulness, the true
date is not known, so they simply use the date of registration of birth,
which can be years later.
It is a problem similar to surnames and spelling of, they did not
become truely standard untill fairly recently.
Desperatly searching:
EDELMAN, STEIN, FEINSTEIN; Riga, Latvia.
DUNN, ALLEN, SOKOLOW; England and anywhere.
Ever greatfull,
David Edelman, San Francisco.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Date & Ages?! #general

David Edelman <pappapeach@...>
 

Dear All;
One thing to keep in mind, when there is a discrepancy in a persons
DOB:
In some countries, like Russia,there was a change in calender,
sometimes more then once. An individual born under the "old" calender,
when registering for say, a marrage licence, under the "new" calender,
depending on where they were on the issue of the change of calender, may
have stated one date or another.
When the person emigrates to a country with a "different" calender,
especially if they come with no proof of DOB, might now be listed as
another date.
In addition, when a baby is born at home, which was more common at
one time then today, no matter what calender system is being used,
sometimes due to the parents ignorence or plain forgetfulness, the true
date is not known, so they simply use the date of registration of birth,
which can be years later.
It is a problem similar to surnames and spelling of, they did not
become truely standard untill fairly recently.
Desperatly searching:
EDELMAN, STEIN, FEINSTEIN; Riga, Latvia.
DUNN, ALLEN, SOKOLOW; England and anywhere.
Ever greatfull,
David Edelman, San Francisco.


Re: Mogilev: PERCHERSKY #belarus

Dan Checkman <danc@...>
 

This is what Schelly found for me when I was requesting DUSKIN information
from Mogilev:
------------------
Dear Dan:
We are related to Rabbi DISKEN of Lupalov (just south of city of Mogilev,
now part of it). Family went to Detroit area, relatives still there.
let's see what the index says:
1870-77: DYSKIN Efroim DUSHKIN Elia DISKIN Afroim
1880: DISMAN Elia DISMAN Leiba DYSHKIN Afroim DUSHKIN Yankel
1882: DIKMAN Girsha
1883: DYSHKIN Afroim
1884-88 (computer glitch, run together): DUMSHIN Elia DYSMAN Meer
DISMAN Leiba, DUSHKIN Leiba DUSHKIN Yankel DUMCHIN Leiba DISMAN Leiba
DUMKIN Yankel
1890: DISMAN leiba
1891: DYSKIN Beniomin Dovid,
-----------------

Please let me know if any of the above names help at all. Also, remember
that the years are the years of birth for baby boys, while the names shown
are those of the fathers. For me, the closest thing I could find was that
my great-great-grandfather, Jacob DUSKIN whose Hebrew name was Yankel might
be the Yankel DUSHKIN above. The only son of his that I (or anyone else in
the family knows about) was Abe, and he was born in 1869 (in Nasservitz,
wherever that is), so the 1884-88 part would still be a mystery if it is
the same person. Anyhow, I hope this helps.

Dan Checkman,
New Orleans, LA

Myra S. Davis wrote:
Did youcome across the name of DVOSKIN?


Belarus SIG #Belarus RE: Mogilev: PERCHERSKY #belarus

Dan Checkman <danc@...>
 

This is what Schelly found for me when I was requesting DUSKIN information
from Mogilev:
------------------
Dear Dan:
We are related to Rabbi DISKEN of Lupalov (just south of city of Mogilev,
now part of it). Family went to Detroit area, relatives still there.
let's see what the index says:
1870-77: DYSKIN Efroim DUSHKIN Elia DISKIN Afroim
1880: DISMAN Elia DISMAN Leiba DYSHKIN Afroim DUSHKIN Yankel
1882: DIKMAN Girsha
1883: DYSHKIN Afroim
1884-88 (computer glitch, run together): DUMSHIN Elia DYSMAN Meer
DISMAN Leiba, DUSHKIN Leiba DUSHKIN Yankel DUMCHIN Leiba DISMAN Leiba
DUMKIN Yankel
1890: DISMAN leiba
1891: DYSKIN Beniomin Dovid,
-----------------

Please let me know if any of the above names help at all. Also, remember
that the years are the years of birth for baby boys, while the names shown
are those of the fathers. For me, the closest thing I could find was that
my great-great-grandfather, Jacob DUSKIN whose Hebrew name was Yankel might
be the Yankel DUSHKIN above. The only son of his that I (or anyone else in
the family knows about) was Abe, and he was born in 1869 (in Nasservitz,
wherever that is), so the 1884-88 part would still be a mystery if it is
the same person. Anyhow, I hope this helps.

Dan Checkman,
New Orleans, LA

Myra S. Davis wrote:
Did youcome across the name of DVOSKIN?


Re: Good old fashioned reasearch #general

Drew A. Techner <user102000@...>
 

In a recent posting. Mr. Gross advised members to avoid publishing their
surnames as a method of research. Bad advice. Because of the Holocaust,
etc. Jewish families have been broken up and records destroyed more so
than many other ethnic groups. For Jews, the method of posting surnames
is probably their best bet. I have been researching genealogy for seven
years. I married my thirteenth cousin. I have over 10,000 names in my
family database. Like many other genealogists I have done it all; court
records, national archives, Social Security applications, cemeteries,
DAR, etc. etc.

MODERATOR'S NOTE: The bulk of this message has been deleted as it
is a duplication of a message posted October 5, 1998.


Searching: QUESADA #general

Michael Powers <mikcrmn@...>
 

Searching for my Jewish roots in Costa Rica, Central America for QUESADA
family who emigrated about 200 years ago. My grandfather, Daniel QUESADA,
was born in Costa Rica circa 1859. His wife, Maria Luisa ROJAS,
was also born in Costa Rica. My father, Luis QUESADA ROJAS, born in Costa
Rica about 1887, married to Trinidad HUERTAS AGUILAR.

Thanks for any help.
Carmen QUESADA HUERTAS (ok12900)


JGSSN-WEST OCTOBER 18TH MEETING #general

Sam & Charlotte <samchar@...>
 

Everyone is invited to attend our October 18th meeting which will be
held at the Sahara West Library, 9600 West Sahara, Las Vegas. The
meeting will begin at 1:00 PM and should be a very informative
afternoon. The program will be on "Using the National Archives" and our
speaker will be Ms. Ann Stearns who was a long time volunteer at the
National Archives and who worked on genealogical searches and material.

There will be a question and answer period immediately following the
program along with a problem solving session. For more information you
can call (702) 363-8230 during the day, and after 6:00 PM call (702)
871-9773. More information can be had via e-mail by writing to:
carmont7@juno.com. There will be a $3.00 fee for non-members, however
there is no fee for first time visitors.

Charlotte Showel
JGSSN-West Board of Directors
samchar@worldnet.att.net
Las Vegas, NV


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Re: Good old fashioned reasearch #general

Drew A. Techner <user102000@...>
 

In a recent posting. Mr. Gross advised members to avoid publishing their
surnames as a method of research. Bad advice. Because of the Holocaust,
etc. Jewish families have been broken up and records destroyed more so
than many other ethnic groups. For Jews, the method of posting surnames
is probably their best bet. I have been researching genealogy for seven
years. I married my thirteenth cousin. I have over 10,000 names in my
family database. Like many other genealogists I have done it all; court
records, national archives, Social Security applications, cemeteries,
DAR, etc. etc.

MODERATOR'S NOTE: The bulk of this message has been deleted as it
is a duplication of a message posted October 5, 1998.


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen Searching: QUESADA #general

Michael Powers <mikcrmn@...>
 

Searching for my Jewish roots in Costa Rica, Central America for QUESADA
family who emigrated about 200 years ago. My grandfather, Daniel QUESADA,
was born in Costa Rica circa 1859. His wife, Maria Luisa ROJAS,
was also born in Costa Rica. My father, Luis QUESADA ROJAS, born in Costa
Rica about 1887, married to Trinidad HUERTAS AGUILAR.

Thanks for any help.
Carmen QUESADA HUERTAS (ok12900)


JewishGen Discussion Group #JewishGen JGSSN-WEST OCTOBER 18TH MEETING #general

Sam & Charlotte <samchar@...>
 

Everyone is invited to attend our October 18th meeting which will be
held at the Sahara West Library, 9600 West Sahara, Las Vegas. The
meeting will begin at 1:00 PM and should be a very informative
afternoon. The program will be on "Using the National Archives" and our
speaker will be Ms. Ann Stearns who was a long time volunteer at the
National Archives and who worked on genealogical searches and material.

There will be a question and answer period immediately following the
program along with a problem solving session. For more information you
can call (702) 363-8230 during the day, and after 6:00 PM call (702)
871-9773. More information can be had via e-mail by writing to:
carmont7@juno.com. There will be a $3.00 fee for non-members, however
there is no fee for first time visitors.

Charlotte Showel
JGSSN-West Board of Directors
samchar@worldnet.att.net
Las Vegas, NV


Re: Port Klaipeda #lithuania

Ikesspot@...
 

Klaipeda, now in Lithuania, was once known as Memel. As such, it was in the
former East Prussia of Germany and was one of the 'targets' Hitler used in
justifying his eastward expansion.


Lithuania SIG #Lithuania Re: Port Klaipeda #lithuania

Ikesspot@...
 

Klaipeda, now in Lithuania, was once known as Memel. As such, it was in the
former East Prussia of Germany and was one of the 'targets' Hitler used in
justifying his eastward expansion.