Date   

Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

David Lewin
 

Why are some people so concerned about the Mormon - now no longer
Church official practice - wish to baptize every one they can?
If I meet another human who has some peculiar belief and practice, I
know that this is his belief and practice and definitely not
mine. If he believes that he has baptized me, it is his belief,
not mine, I say let others believe what they wish. It is their
belief and their concern. Not mine!

We have so much to be grateful for to the Mormon people. We would
know next to nothing about - for example - East European Jewry. It
was the Mormons who spent their own time and money to record and make
available our heritage. Our leaders recorded the illustrious. The
Mormons recorded even the non-distinguished individuals

The Mormon Library - 4 buildings full of it !!! - is second to none
in records of our people. All they have is freely available and at
no financial charge to those who wish to avail themselves of it.

David Lewin
London


ViewMate translation request – Polish #translation

Kim Sheintal
 

Hi Everyone,   
 
I posted a three-page response from the State Archives in Mławas on ViewMate for which I need translation at the following:  
 
Please respond via the form provided on the ViewMate image page.  
Thank you.
Kimberly Sheintal
Sarasota, Florida


Re: Looking for Herman/Hyman Wayler on ships manifest #general #lithuania

Susan&David
 

Good work Barbara!!
Using your findings I located him on the Ancestry's NY arrival as Metel Waler and on the detained aliens list as Motel Weiler.

David Rosen
Boston, MA



On 10/28/2020 4:11 PM, Barbara Zimmer wrote:

How about this man in 1901. 

 

 Hamburg Passenger Lists, 1850-1934

 
 
Name: Motel Weiler
Gender: männlich (Male)
Ethnicity/Nationality: Russland (Russian)
Marital status: ledig (Single)
Departure Age: 21
Birth Date: abt 1881
Residence Place: Wilkomir
Departure Date: 15 Jan 1902
Departure Place: Hamburg, Deutschland (Germany)
Arrival Place: New York
Occupation: Händler
Ship Name: Barcelona
 


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Stephen Katz
 

With all due respect to Mr. Schoenberg -- and great deal is due ... I think of him whenever I gaze upon Adele Block-Bauer, now at the Neue Gallerie in NY -- it's a pretty tall statement to say that "all the best Jewish genealogists" use geni. I wonder what criteria he uses to evaluate Jewish genealogists and is certain that he's identified all the best ones. Apart from that, none of us critics of geni have suggested that, in doing genealogy, we seek to hide ourselves or our families. Our concern is that, in putting a family tree on a publicly-accessible internet site such as geni, we lose control over changes or additions that are are made. Our family trees are our work-product. In his blog post,, cited in his message,, Mr. Schoenberg argues in essence that genealogy is done more efficiently, and is more fun, when done with others. But I, and I daresay many other amateur Jewish genealogists, have no desire to expend time or energy dealing with, and potentially disputing with, everyone who makes erroneous and sometimes absurd changes or additions my tree. Heck, I couldn't  even get a close relative to correct wrong information she added! 
While some people may find that the advantages of doing "collaborative" genealogy via geni outweigh the disadvantages of that site, others such as myself reach the opposite cost-benefit conclusion. It seems to me that this matter is of such importance that geni should be up-front with potential users that putting a tree on geni results in a loss of control over its content. Instead, geni hides this within its "policies" verbiage.
I believe that one should be wary of commercial enterprises with stated ambitions to connect the world. Sounds somewhat megalomaniacical, doesn't it?

Stephen Katz
USA


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Eva Lawrence
 

All the letters complaining about Geni are writing of their past
experience. About a year ago it was acquired by My Heritage, and since
then I've found the
managers of people's data very approachable and helpful in correcting
mistakes I've pointed out to them, as well as mistakes I've made
myself.,
even though I only use the basic, free version. In contrast, Ancestry
has just asked me to approve a set of data from someone else's tree
which gave my
grandfather an extra name, a different wife but the correct dates and
children. The only options were:'yes' :' no' or 'maybe', none of which
fitted the bill..

Eva Lawrence
St Albans, UK
--
Eva Lawrence
St Albans, UK.


Re: Looking for help Zabokrich #ukraine

Marla Waltman
 

Hi Len,

I am the owner of the Zhabokrich KehilaLink on JewishGen. Four years ago I created the webpage, which covers a short history of the town, reminiscences of some people who lived there (including my grandmother Dora (Donya) Kravchek Waltman - 1898-1991), information about the cemetery, surnames of some of the families who lived in the town, Holocaust history, photographs I took when I visited the town in 2013, etc. If you haven't looked at it already, you can find the webpage at: https://kehilalinks.jewishgen.org/zhabokrich/index.asp. You might be interested in knowing that the town's name means "Frog's croak", which refers to the numerous frogs that lived in the large pond in the 'downtown'. My grandmother spoke of them often! 

Take a look at the KehilaLink and then feel free to contact me about any questions you may have. I would be very happy to know if you could provide information about which of your ancestors lived in Zhabokrich and what you know about them. I would be happy to include your surnames and other information you have to the lists on the website. There are also some published works (a book and some articles) that have been published about Zhabokrich, that I provide information about on the KehilaLink.

Best wishes,
Marla Waltman
Zhabokrich and Kryzhopil KehilaLink leader
Toronto, ON, Canada
Searching: Ukraine: BEGLER, KRAFCHEK, SPEKTOR, WELTMAN
Poland: BALTMAN, BARAN,  LEWKOWICZ, ORGANEK/ORGANKIEWICZ/ORGANICK, USZEROWICZ
Belarus: KRAVCHICK


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Teewinot
 

On 10/28/2020 3:04 PM, Dan Bodenheimer wrote:

Bill, you wrote that someone, "told me his goal was to 'memorialize'
Holocaust victims." and that "this is a term used by the Mormon church
to designate a ceremony in which Jewish victims of the Holocaust are
baptized by the Mormon church."

I do not agree with your premise, as I have a goal of "Memorializing"
Holocaust victims so that they are never forgotten, so that we have
pictures of real people, and so that we all can see that relatives
linked to us were lost. All this makes it more real, and solidifies the
fact that this should Never Happen Again.  I use the term memorialize,
and it has nothing to do with the old LDS baptism issue from many years
ago, which they refer to as "posthumous baptisms" or "proxy baptisms",
not memorials

In accordance with a 1995 agreement, the LDS has removed more than
300,000 names of Jewish Holocaust victims from its databases, as well as
subsequently removing names later identified by Jewish groups in more
recent years (2012).

Additionally, MyHeritage is an Israeli company, headquartered in Or
Yehuda, Israel, and it owns and operates GENI.
FamilySearch is run by the LDS and Ancestry.com was a spin-off from that
and is headquartered in Utah.

Dan Bodenheimer
San Diego, California
I suggest you read the following article:

Mormons are baptizing Holocaust victims, Lubavitcher rebbe and relatives
of celebrities, researcher says
BY JOSEFIN DOLSTEN DECEMBER 22, 2017 2:56 PM

https://tinyurl.com/yyy7ehvy

They didn't stop.

Jeri Friedman
Port Saint Lucie, Florida

--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

lydgateaction@...
 

It depends, I guess, on what you mean by "genealogy". Some people think that it is somehow impressive to generate trees containing 50,000 people of variable accuracy with all of their 7th cousins.

So what? These are all a meaningless and uninteresting waste of time. At that level you might as well include everyone in the world.  

There are many many issues here that are beyond this thread, including the theft of data about people that are of no real possible interest to the people posting this stuff apart from a macho "big tree" mentality that actually conveys no insight at all. 

However I will mention one issue: you say somewhat disparagingly that "Sadly, some people think genealogy is about hiding yourself and your family." 
Firstly, 7th cousins are not "your family" in any meaningful sense (I have many tends of thousands of 7th cousins). But more importantly, not everyone lives in LA,CA. Sometimes posting tghis sort of information places people you really don't know at substantial risk, including risk of death right now.  

This is not what genealogy is about or should be about. It is bad genealogy. The real tools of genealogy are a note book and a pen and a young person willing to interview their grandparents for private family use. Not garbage and incorrect trees of my family generated by people I couldn't care less about. Geni is hardly the only perpetrator of this type of malfunction - Jewshgen has not exactly covered itself in glory in terms of non-correctable and stolen data. 

Dr Aubrey Blumsohn

Sheffield, UK


Re: Looking for Herman/Hyman Wayler on ships manifest #general #lithuania

Barbara Zimmer
 

How about this man in 1901. 

 

 Hamburg Passenger Lists, 1850-1934

 
 
Name: Motel Weiler
Gender: männlich (Male)
Ethnicity/Nationality: Russland (Russian)
Marital status: ledig (Single)
Departure Age: 21
Birth Date: abt 1881
Residence Place: Wilkomir
Departure Date: 15 Jan 1902
Departure Place: Hamburg, Deutschland (Germany)
Arrival Place: New York
Occupation: Händler
Ship Name: Barcelona
 


Blumenthal, Pritzwalk #scandinavia #germany

hanshugo.nilson@...
 

I search information about Moritz BLUMENTHAL born 1835 May 16 in Pritzwalk, Brandenburg, Germany. He emigrated to Stockholm, Sweden c. 1855-60 where he obtained citizenship. He married 1877 a divorced Swedish woman, Anna Maria Natalia Wingstedt, nee Schönbeck, and had with her five children. He also adopted her three children of her earlier marriage. He died in Stockholm 1893 April 20. He seems to have been some sort of a businessman.
I have found three people named BLUMENTHAL born in Pritzwalk: Cäcile Blumenthal CHRON, b. 1818 March 24, d. 1909 Feb 14; her sister Johanna BLUMENTHAL b. 1821 Nov 16, d. 1900 Sep 1; and their father, Israel N. BLUMENTHAL d. in Pritzwalk 1854 Feb 24. The sisters could possibly be sisters (or cousins?) of Moritz. Hopefully somebody could give me some information about the Blumenthals in Pritzwalk.


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Max Heffler
 

Another analogy is Open Source source code. More eyes enables more defects to be found and corrected enhancing the security the code.

 

From: main@... [mailto:main@...] On Behalf Of E. Randol Schoenberg via groups.jewishgen.org
Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2020 2:07 PM
To: main@...
Subject: Re: [JewishGen.org] Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

 

I agree with Max.  Geni is by far the best tool we have for Jewish genealogy at the moment.  All of the best Jewish genealogists use it.  How do I know?  Because on Geni we can all see each other's work, correct mistakes and learn new information about resources in our areas of interest.  

Sadly, some people think genealogy is about hiding yourself and your family.  Nothing could be more wrong.  The more you share, the more you will learn.

As for Holocaust victims, we have on Geni various projects concerning the Holocaust, which are another great tool.  See the umbrella project at https://www.geni.com/projects/Holocaust-The-Final-Solution/10996

To learn more about why everyone should be using Geni for building their trees, please see my old blog at https://schoenblog.com/?p=712

Randy Schoenberg
Los Angeles, CA


--

Max Heffler
Houston, TX
max@...
HEFFLER(Ukraine)/TIRAS(Poland)/WASSEMAN(Lithuania)/MOORE(Poland)/ZLOT(Lithuania)
GORENSTEIN(Ukraine)/FLEISCHMAN(Latvia)/GOLDEN(Lithuania)


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Max Heffler
 

Nancy,

                Curators are more restricted now for private profiles.

 

From: main@... [mailto:main@...] On Behalf Of Nancy Reicher via groups.jewishgen.org
Sent: Wednesday, October 28, 2020 1:43 PM
To: main@...
Subject: Re: [JewishGen.org] Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

 

You may be the only honest on of all the curators, then maybe not. I know a curator and he has changed things on my verry small tree that I put up on Geni , when Geni was first alive. The things he has changed are all wrong. He refuses to do anything to help that situation. I am sorry I ever put tose two generations onto Geni. Now My trees, going back to the 1600s are all on my computers. They are shared with relatives only, and I do share very willingly.
--
Nancy L. Reicher
Kansas City MO


--

Max Heffler
Houston, TX
max@...
HEFFLER(Ukraine)/TIRAS(Poland)/WASSEMAN(Lithuania)/MOORE(Poland)/ZLOT(Lithuania)
GORENSTEIN(Ukraine)/FLEISCHMAN(Latvia)/GOLDEN(Lithuania)


Genealogy podcasts and webinars listed by JGS of Illinois #jgs-iajgs #announcements

Martin Fischer
 

The Jewish Genealogical Society of Illinois has posted an updated and improved list of links to informative genealogy podcasts and webinars atop their website's homepage at: https://jgsi.org/
Just look in the salmon-colored box headlined "Want to learn more about genealogy?" and click on "Free genealogy webinars and podcasts list.docx" to download the list to your computer. The document contains up-to-date links to access several useful collections of webinars and podcasts of interest to family historians. Many of the webinars focus on genealogy, while the podcasts are of more general genealogical interest. 

--
Martin Fischer
Vice President-Publicity
Jewish Genealogical Society of Illinois

JGSI website: https://jgsi.org


Re: Jewish Actors (Cohen) in England ca 1916 #unitedkingdom

mindyoc
 

Have you tried this site: http://www.museumoffamilyhistory.com/moyt/main.htm?
Mindy Yochelson


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

E. Randol Schoenberg
 

I agree with Max.  Geni is by far the best tool we have for Jewish genealogy at the moment.  All of the best Jewish genealogists use it.  How do I know?  Because on Geni we can all see each other's work, correct mistakes and learn new information about resources in our areas of interest.  

Sadly, some people think genealogy is about hiding yourself and your family.  Nothing could be more wrong.  The more you share, the more you will learn.

As for Holocaust victims, we have on Geni various projects concerning the Holocaust, which are another great tool.  See the umbrella project at https://www.geni.com/projects/Holocaust-The-Final-Solution/10996

To learn more about why everyone should be using Geni for building their trees, please see my old blog at https://schoenblog.com/?p=712

Randy Schoenberg
Los Angeles, CA


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Dan Bodenheimer
 

Bill, you wrote that someone, "told me his goal was to 'memorialize' Holocaust victims." and that "this is a term used by the Mormon church to designate a ceremony in which Jewish victims of the Holocaust are baptized by the Mormon church." 

I do not agree with your premise, as I have a goal of "Memorializing" Holocaust victims so that they are never forgotten, so that we have pictures of real people, and so that we all can see that relatives linked to us were lost. All this makes it more real, and solidifies the fact that this should Never Happen Again.  I use the term memorialize, and it has nothing to do with the old LDS baptism issue from many years ago, which they refer to as "posthumous baptisms" or "proxy baptisms", not memorials.    

In accordance with a 1995 agreement, the LDS has removed more than 300,000 names of Jewish Holocaust victims from its databases, as well as subsequently removing names later identified by Jewish groups in more recent years (2012). 

Additionally, MyHeritage is an Israeli company, headquartered in Or Yehuda, Israel, and it owns and operates GENI.   
FamilySearch is run by the LDS and Ancestry.com was a spin-off from that and is headquartered in Utah.  

Dan Bodenheimer
San Diego, California


criteria for inclusion of names to a residents db in pre-war Poland #holocaust #general #names

Avigdor Ben-Dov <avigdorbd@...>
 


I need to know what the boundaries are for inclusion of victims of the Holocaust in genealogical databases. While building a db of Jewish residents I cannot decide where to cut off the margins for inclusion. Starting only from the Yiskorbooks of a specific town, I compiled a list of residents but there seemed to me to be lacking others who came before. I therefore searched JewishGen for others born in the same town to add to my db. The problem arises whether those born within a range of 50 years (or more?) to the end of WW2 are reasonable to include or not? Someone born in the town in 1890, for example, would have been about age 49 in 1939 when Poland was invaded by the Germans and the Holocaust was clearly underway. This is certainly someone who should be present in the town during the occupation and most probably alive and well (for the time being!). But what about margins of error? Is there a cut-off year for assuming that someone was not alive or present during the period 1939-1945? Should a certain age group be excluded due to life expectancy? Is it better to err on the side of inclusion or exclusion?
Please send me or post your reasoned opinions. Thanks
Avigdor Ben-Dov
Jerusalem


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Nancy Reicher
 

You may be the only honest on of all the curators, then maybe not. I know a curator and he has changed things on my verry small tree that I put up on Geni , when Geni was first alive. The things he has changed are all wrong. He refuses to do anything to help that situation. I am sorry I ever put tose two generations onto Geni. Now My trees, going back to the 1600s are all on my computers. They are shared with relatives only, and I do share very willingly.
--
Nancy L. Reicher
Kansas City MO


Re: "Unehelichen"/Illegitimacy: applied to mother or child? #germany

Sally Bruckheimer
 

"it's quite likely that the records of Jewish births, like those of marriages and deaths, were reported and registered in the town's Kehilah, where Jewish records were kept".

Few Jewish groups kept records. A ketubah was the marriage contract, so the family had the record - no rabbi was needed (unless the government required one). Most Jewish communities were small enough that people knew who had a baby or who died. The only old communities that had records were Sephardi, who were more like Catholics in that regard. 

Jews moved around a lot, and were often expelled from a town or small area, so nobody would have wanted to carry records to remember their former neighbors.

Sally Bruckheimer
Princeton, NJ


Re: Geni Family Trees - Privacy and Baptism Concerns #general

Jx. Gx.
 

Bill,

Its unfortunate you had such a bad experience with Geni.  I never post my family tree on any site because once you do its tantamount to tacit acceptance for the site owners and anyone else with access to your tree to do with it as they please. In my experience with Geni, a woman researched my relatives and posted them on the Geni tree as her ancestors. When I questioned her about this she finally fessed up and agreed they weren't related to her. I asked her to remove them from her tree and never responded to me.  Send me a private message and I'll give you a suggestion of what you can do in your case.

Jeff Gee
Arizona, USA

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