Date
1 - 11 of 11
Yiddish pronunciation #general
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Martin Green <btestware@...>
Mishigina/mishugina is an example of the difference
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between Polish and Litvish, or Lithuanian Yiddish. Similarly, gekimmen/gekummen. Zug/zog is an example of the same thing...similarly, vus/vos and dus/dos. Another indicator, which you don't mention here, is ey/ay. For example, Polish would be "kayn", rhymes with "mine", and Litvish would be "keyn", rhymes with "pain". You might also note that as far as Yiddish pronunciation is concerned, "Lithuania" extends quite a long way, including all of White Russia. Martin Green
My wifes uncle sent me a list of Yiddish expressions that he remembersfrom his childhood in Londons East End. I am not an expert onYiddish dialect, nor do I speak more than a few words of Yiddish.
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Nachum <nachum@...>
My wifes uncle sent me a list of Yiddish expressions that he remembers
from his childhood in Londons East End. I am not an expert onYiddish dialect, nor do I speak more than a few words of Yiddish. Would it be possible to pinpoint an area of ones origins (in this case before London) based on pronunciation? I am choosing a couple of words >from the list my uncle-in-law sent me. mishigina (I would say mishugana) zug yur (my uncle-in-law says this means say yes, I would pronounce say as zag) A Chatima Tova to all JewishGenners and all Beit Yisrael, and TIA. Nachum Tuchman Tekoa, Israel
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Dr. Joseph M. Schwarcz, Dr. Ida C. Selavan <idayosef@...>
With only two examples the response must be, Southern Yiddish,
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i.e. Ukrainian and Romanian, which are basically the same. The technical name for this pronunciation is "Mome Tote Lushn" while the Northern, (Litvish) pronunciation is called "Tate Mame Loshn." Ida Selavan Schwarcz Arad, Israel Nachum wrote:
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Anne Bernhaut <annebernhaut@...>
Hi Nahum
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The couple of Yiddish words you mention, "mishigina" and "zug yur" (should be "yo") are pronunciations >from Polish Galicia, (former Austrian province till World War I). My parents are >from Chrzanow and Brzesko (first town is about 40km East of Krakow, and second town is about 80km west of Krakow) and they pronounced the words as you indicate. I would actually say the words are more: "meshigeneh" and "zug yoh". Let me know what you think. I speak Yiddish so I could help you with some of your questions. Shana Tova Anne Bernhaut Melbourne, Australia
----- Original Message -----
From: Nachum <nachum@avichai.org.il> To: JewishGen Discussion Group <jewishgen@lyris.jewishgen.org> Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2000 1:56 PM Subject: Yiddish pronunciation My wifes uncle sent me a list of Yiddish expressions that he remembersfrom his childhood in Londons East End. I am not an expert onYiddish dialect, nor do I speak more than a few words of Yiddish.
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Martin Green <btestware@...>
Ida Schwarcz wrote:
With only two examples the response must be, Southern Yiddish,Yes, the two examples given would be consistent with Romanian. However, you can't rule out Polish, which is quite similar. The most obvious way to distinguish between Polish and Romanian (South Russian) is the vowel shift on words like "shabbes", which becomes "shobbes" in Romanian Yiddish. Martin Green http://www.onforeignsoil.com
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mpfreed28315861@...
In article <00a901c02837$10414840$261e96d4@barak.net.il>,
"Nachum" <nachum@avichai.org.il> wrote: My wifes uncle sent me a list of Yiddish expressions that heremembers say asfrom his childhood in Londons East End. I am not an expert onYiddish dialect, nor do I speak more than a few words of Yiddish. zag)I would think they are of Polak (including Galitziane)provenance. However there was also a marked Dutch influence on much of the Yiddish spoken in the East End. I am of Litvak origins and the words in question I know as "meshugane" and "zog yoh". The differences between the various Yiddish dialects (there were four main ones)centred mainly on the vowels. Incidentally, I believe the Litvak pronunciation is the preferred pronunciation of Yiddish in academia. Murray Freedman
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Judith Romney Wegner
Ida Schwarcz wrote:That's interesting; "shobbes" also happens to be the Anglo-Jewish pronunciation! It rhymes with "lobbes" -- Anglo-Yiddish for "naughty boy" -- usually called a "mazzik" by American Jews). In fact, we had a naughty little song when I was a kid, which (sung to a well known Latino melody, I think) went like this: He is a lobbes -- he is a lobbes -- He takes the shikses /to the pictures/ on the shobbes! Not very p.c., admittedly -- but then none of us were, in those days! Judith Romney Wegner
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mpfreed28315861@...
In article < v03010d0db5fc56ca2813@[128.148.44.87]>,
Judith Romney Wegner < jrw@Brown.edu > wrote: That's interesting; "shobbes" also happens to be the Anglo-JewishCorrection: It was *an* but not *the* Anglo-Jewish pronunciation. It was always "shabbes" in the North and Scotland where Litvak immigrants predominated. It rhymes with "lobbes" -- Anglo-Yiddish for "naughty boy" -- usually called a "mazzik" by American Jews). In fact, we had anaughty little song when I was a kid, which (sung to a well known Latinomelody, I think) went like this:The rhyme that I remember went as follows:- The boy stood on the burning deck His father called him lobbes Because he wouldn't wash his dirty neck To go to shul on shabbes ! Murray Freedman
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Mike Glazer <glazer@...>
"Judith Romney Wegner" <jrw@Brown.edu> wrote in message
news:v03010d0db5fc56ca2813@[128.148.44.87]... boy"That's interesting; "shobbes" also happens to be the Anglo-Jewishpronunciation! It rhymes with "lobbes" -- Anglo-Yiddish for "naughty You might be interested to know that the word lobus (first letter pronounced rather like a "w") is Polish for an urchin. I guess this is where the Yiddish word comes from. Mike Glazer Oxford
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Jerzy Hubert <jzhubert@...>
Actually, in Polish, it spells "l/obuz" with a variation of "L" at the
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beginning (sounding like a W sound in English "one"), and with the letter "Z" at the end. I presume, sometimes "l/obuz" was similar in meaning to "batiar", which was very popular in Lwo'w (Lviv, Lemberg). However, I do not know if "batiar" had any Yiddish equivalent. J.Z.Hubert Jax.,Fl Mike Glazer wrote:
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Judith Romney Wegner
Judith wrote:
Murray replied:That's interesting; "shobbes" also happens to be the Anglo-Jewish Correction: It was *an* but not *the* Anglo-Jewish pronunciation. It wasAha! But the northern pronunciation ruins the rhyme -- unless Litvaks also pronounced "lobbes" as "labbes", of course! I suspect the rhyme must have originated in London! Thanks for reminding me of the burning deck ditty. And thanks also for the gently chiding reminder that "If you 'avn't been to Manchester you 'avn't lived!" We Londoners always were provincially-challenged! Judith Romney Wegner MODERATOR NOTE: Question has been answered. Thread is closed.
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