"Gaditsch., Russia" #general


NFatouros@...
 

On June 6, 03 Mike Posnick (mpoz@...) wrote:

<<A relative's Petition for Naturalization recites his children's
birthplace as "Gaditch, Russia." I have been unable to locate the town.
Does anyone know where it is, possibly in the vicinity of Pinsk or Novyy
Sverzhen, Belarus, and its current name?>>

Despite Mr. Poznick belief that his relative' mystery town might be in
the vicinity of Pinsk or Novyy Sverzhen, I am suggesting that "Gaditch"
could be Hodiatch, also known as Gadac. But some other Jewihsgenner might
write to say that I should have sat on my hands rather than type this
response!

Hodiatch is east of Kiev and north of Polatava. Chester G. Cohen's
"Shtetl" Finder Gazetter has an entry for it, and so does "Where We Once
Walked" (WWOW). WWOW offers no information about Hodiatch (or Gadec) and
says only that it could not be found under the given spelling in the
gazetteers of the US Board on Geographic Naomes.

Mr. Posnick should try Jewishgen's ShtetlSeeker to see whether there are
closer matches, and also try to find his relative's ship manifest to see
how the EIDB volunteers spelled it in transcription and to see how the
mystery town was spelled on the manifest itself.


Naomi Fatouros (nee FELDMAN)
Bloomington, Indiana
NFatouros@...
Researching: BELKOWSKY and BIELKOWSKY, Odessa and Berdichev;ROTHSTEIN,
Kremenchug; FELDMAN, Pinsk; SCHUTZ, RETTIG, WAHL, Shcherets; LEVY,
Mulhouse; SAS or SASS,Podwolochisk; RAPOPORT, Tarnopol, Korostyshev;
BEHAM, Salok and Kharkov; WOLPIANSKY, Ostryna.

MODERATOR NOTE: The ShtetlSeeker can be searched at
<http://www.jewishgen.org/ShtetlSeeker/>.


Mike Posnick
 

I appreciate Naomi's response to my inquiry about "Gaditch," but I am not
a novice researcher. In addition, I looked at the sources Naomi mentions
in her reply, as well as several others, before posting my question. I
was hoping that someone else previously might have sought the same town
and was successful in identifying it.

Hodiatch or Gadac, more properly known as Gadyach, Ukraine, is the obvious
answer to my question. Sometimes, however, an answer is too obvious to be
believed. That is the case here.

My reason for doubting the obvious answer is that Gadyach simply is
located too far >from where this family's lore says they lived and in the
wrong direction. The parents are known to have been born in what is now
Novyy Sverzhen, Belarus. Other information >from the family indicates that
the children all were born in what is now Pinsk, Belarus. Pinsk is
located 95.6 miles SSW of Novyy Sverzhen. There are no known family
connections to any territory east of Kiev, which itself is located 263.2
miles SE of Novyy Sverzhen. Gadyach is located an additional 153.4 miles
E of Kiev!

I cannot categorically state that Gadyach is not the correct answer, but I
also am not prepared to accept it uncritically. Based upon what little I
do know and my experience as a researcher, I still would expect to find
that "Gaditch" is a place in the former Minsk, Grodno. or Volhynia
provinces, most likely a very small town in the vicinity of Pinsk.

Mike Posnick
Minneapolis, Minnesota
e-mail: mpoz@...

In her JewishGen message of 6/7/2003, Naomi Fatouros wrote:

Despite Mr. Poznick belief that his relative' mystery town might be in the
vicinity of Pinsk or Novyy Sverzhen, I am suggesting that "Gaditch" could
be Hodiatch, also known as Gadac. But some other Jewihsgenner might write
to say that I should have sat on my hands rather than type this response!

Hodiatch is east of Kiev and north of Polatava. Chester G. Cohen's
"Shtetl" Finder Gazetter has an entry for it, and so does "Where We Once
Walked"(WWOW). WWOW offers no information about Hodiatch (or Gadec) and
says only that it could not be found under the given spelling in the
gazetteers of the US Board on Geographic Naomes.

Mr. Posnick should try Jewishgen's ShtetlSeeker to see whether there
are closer matches, and also try to find his relative's ship manifest to
see how the EIDB volunteers spelled it in transcription and to see how
the mystery town was spelled on the manifest itself.


Mike Posnick
 

Sally,

Thanks for your message. I want to make sure that you and everyone else
understands that I have not rejected the opinions of the "experts" out of
hand. I have been aware of Gadyach >from the beginning of my research--
it's the readily apparent answer to my question. And I'm fully aware that
our ancestors moved around more than most people believe. If you will re-
read my last message on the subject, you will see that I merely am looking
to see whether there is a better answer.

My reason for questioning Gadyach is that it does not fit the other facts
of which I am aware. As I mentioned, the family lore is that the children
all were born in Pinsk. One of the first things a good researcher learns
is that there is an element of truth to most family stories. I can think
of no reason why the family would have said the children were born in
Pinsk if they actually were born in Gadyach, especially when the two towns
are so distant >from one another.

I also am aware of the places you suggest. I agree with you that one of
them well may be the town I am seeking. The correct answer, if one ever
is found, probably will be found in other family information that I have
yet to discover.

Let me emphasize that my purpose in submitting the question to the list
was not to obtain research help. I am perfectly capable as a researcher.
It was to determine whether anyone else previously had faced exactly the
same question, to learn how they resolved it, and to find out why they
resolved it in the manner they did.

Mike Posnick

In her JewishGen message of 6/8/2003, Sally M. Bruckheimer wrote:

Well, you have rejected the opinions of the experts, so let me see if I
can come up with and alternative location. I went into Shtetl Seeker and
found Novyy Sverzhen. Then I looked by location-for towns nearby.
Starting with G, there is a Gorodzey or Horodziej, 12.5 miles to the SW.
But starting with K is Khotishche-if 'Gaditsch' is there, I suggest that
it might be Khotishche, at 5407 2539, it is 63 miles away, but in the
general neighborhood, and it sounds like Gaditch.

But don't reject Gadyach out of hand. Naomi and Alexander have correctly
identified a lot of places which people couldn't find, and people moved
around a lot more than we think. In particular, there was a great
movement >from the NE Poland/Lithuania/Belarus region to Ukraine, so they
might have lived in one place and moved to another.


Sally M. Bruckheimer <sallybru@...>
 

Well, you have rejected the opinions of the experts, so let me see if I can
come up with and alternative location. I went into Shtetl Seeker and found
Novyy Sverzhen. Then I looked by location-for towns nearby. Starting with
G, there is a Gorodzey or Horodziej, 12.5 miles to the SW. But starting
with K is Khotishche-if 'Gaditsch' is there, I suggest that it might be
Khotishche, at 5407 2539, it is 63 miles away, but in the general
neighborhood, and it sounds like Gaditch.

But don't reject Gadyach out of hand. Naomi and Alexander have correctly
identified a lot of places which people couldn't find, and people moved
around a lot more than we think. In particular, there was a great movement
from the NE Poland/Lithuania/Belarus region to Ukraine, so they might have
lived in one place and moved to another.

Actually, what you need to do is look in a broad area to see what records
are available. Unfortunately, neither Belarus nor Ukraine has a lot of
available records, but check what is available.

Sally Bruckheimer
Harrison, NY