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Translation Help -- Yiddish or Hebrew #general


Klausner
 

There is no mystery at all:

a. It is not uncommon to have the surname of the person on the tombstone,
especially in the German speaking countries, but also in Poland.

b. The two lines below the surname are indeed Yiddish, with the name of the
Hebrew month in Hebrew, naturally:

1. Gestorben 15 tog = Died on the 15th day
2. In 'het' [abbreviation of hodesh] Heshvan 1930 = In the month of
Heshvan 1930

The date is 15 Heshvan 5691 = 6 November 1930

Best wishes to all, Yocheved

Yocheved Klausner, Editor
Sharsheret Hadorot (bilingual: Hebrew and English)
Israel Genealogical Society (IGS)

----- Original Message -----
From: Judith Romney Wegner
To: JewishGen Discussion Group
Sent: Tuesday, June 06, 2006 5:22 PM
Subject: Re: Translation Help -- Yiddish or Hebrew

...
Second, the stone has an interesting (and in one respect rather
puzzling) inscription. It is of course in Hebrew -- they normally are
-- except that this one happens to gives the man's surname, obviously
in Yiddish; it also gives the Yiddish word "gestorben" (meaning
"died") right before the date.
...
The date is a bit of a mystery; it says 15th of something or other
1930, but he month is blurred in this photograph and hard to read.
It looks like mem aleph bet, which could stand for the Hebrew month
Menahem-Av (which is the full name of the month of Av). If so, this
corresponded with August 9th in 1930. But the next line seems to
contradict that date, it appears to say 8th Heshvan (which
corresponded with 30th October in 1930). I can't explain this
discrepancy, does anyone have any ideas?


Robert Israel <israel@...>
 

Judith Romney Wegner <jrw@...> wrote:

At 8:40 PM -0700 6/5/06, Stewart Bernstein wrote:

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/toview.html

# VM 7930-Tombstone inscription, probably in Yiddishor Hebrew.
Inscription may have the name Niestempoweras part of the text.
The date is a bit of a mystery; it says 15th of something or other
1930, but he month is blurred in this photograph and hard to read.
It looks like mem aleph bet, which could stand for the Hebrew month
Menahem-Av (which is the full name of the month of Av). If so, this
corresponded with August 9th in 1930. But the next line seems to
contradict that date, it appears to say 8th Heshvan (which
corresponded with 30th October in 1930). I can't explain this
discrepancy, does anyone have any ideas?
It looks to me like "gestorben 15 tog in ch[odesh] Heshvan", i.e.
"died on the 15th day of the month of Heshvan".

Robert Israel
israel@...
Vancouver, BC, Canada


Stewart Bernstein <skbernst123@...>
 

I would appreciate translation help with two View-Mate
files.

The files may be viewd at:
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/toview.html

# VM 7930-Tombstone inscription, probably in Yiddish
or Hebrew. Inscription may have the name Niestempower
as part of the text.

# VM 7929-Back of post card >from Poland. I believe the
handwriting may be in Polish. It does not look like
Yiddish. The text may include the names Berl & Golda
Niestempower.

Please contact me directly at Skbernst123@....

I thank you in advance for your assistance.

Stewart Bernstein
Thousand Oaks, CA

Reseaching >from Pultusk & Przasnysk/Pruznitz, Poland:
Niestempower, Karsch, Kierszenbaum, Domb, Dronzek,
Zelkowitz, Zylberberg, Blinkitny, Eichler, Bernstein
(some Berns in the U.S./Chicago), Najman/Neuman

Researching >from Warka/Vurka, Poland:
Karczewa/Karchova, Goldstein(Stein in the U.S.)

MODERATOR NOTE: Searching list truncated at the allowed six lines.
The direct URLs of the ViewMate images are:
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=7929 and
http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=7930


Judith Romney Wegner
 

At 8:40 PM -0700 6/5/06, Stewart Bernstein wrote:

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/toview.html

# VM 7930-Tombstone inscription, probably in Yiddishor Hebrew.
Inscription may have the name Niestempoweras part of the text.

# VM 7929-Back of post card >from Poland. I believe the handwriting
may be in Polish. It does not look likeYiddish. The text may include
the names Berl & Golda Niestempower.
Dear Stewart:

This was very interesting so I am replying to the group at large.

First, you are correct that VM 7929 is written in a European
language (which I can't translate, but could be Polish). The reason
it "does not look like Yiddish" (as you put it) is because Yiddish
is traditionally written in Hebrew characters -- never in Latin
characters; transliteration into Latin alphabet letters is only a
modern concession for the benefit of those who have lost the ability
to readthe Hebrew alphabet.

Second, the stone has an interesting (and in one respect rather
puzzling) inscription. It is of course in Hebrew -- they normally are
-- except that this one happens to gives the man's surname, obviously
in Yiddish; it also gives the Yiddish word "gestorben" (meaning
"died") right before the date.

The first two lines are in Hebrew:
'eyneynu yor'dot mayim 'al petirat avinu ha-yaqar
"our eyes drip with water[i.e., tears] on the departure of our dear father"

The inscription does NOT mention either "Berl" or "Golda." In
fact it does not mention any woman at all, only the man who is buried
there. His Hebrew name was Gershon ben R. Abraham Lev Niestenfaver.
Note that the "R." stands for "Reb" -- which means simply "Mr." and
not "Rabbi" as people often mistakenly suppose. (The surname as
written looks more like Niestenfauver -- (with an "n" in the middle,
not an "m" -- and with a double "vav", which normally indicates a
consonantal "v" sound) (If you have European language documents
referring to this person, that will prsumably solve the
name-pronunciation for you. (But it definitely has an "n" in the
middle, not an "m.")

The date is a bit of a mystery; it says 15th of something or other
1930, but he month is blurred in this photograph and hard to read.
It looks like mem aleph bet, which could stand for the Hebrew month
Menahem-Av (which is the full name of the month of Av). If so, this
corresponded with August 9th in 1930. But the next line seems to
contradict that date, it appears to say 8th Heshvan (which
corresponded with 30th October in 1930). I can't explain this
discrepancy, does anyone have any ideas?

Finally the five large Hebrew letters at the bottom are a standard
abbreviation found on all traditional Jewish gravestones They stand
for the Hebrew words t'hi nafsho ts'rurah bi-tsror ha-hayyim, which
means "may his soul be bound up in the bond of [eternal] life."

I hope someone can solve the mystery of those two discrepant dates!

Judith Romney Wegner

MODERATOR NOTE: Ordinarily we ask for ViewMate responses to be sent privately,
but Dr Wegner has raised some points that public posting may help resolve.