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Translation from Hebrew - two tombstones #general
Dear Genners,
I would like to ask for a translation >from Hebrew of the inscriptions on two tombstones that I´ve posted at ViewMate. File numbers are VM8360 and VM8361 for the following address: http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/toview.html You can go to the direct address: http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8360 http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8361 Please respond privately to me: aizim@... Thanks very much. Eliana AIZIM - >from Rio de Janeiro, Brazil Visit my GUREVICH photo album: http://www.geocities.com/elianaaizim/photo2.html Researching: AISEN, AIZEN, AISIN: Ukraine: Lugansk /Argentina / Brazil; GUREVICH: Ukraine: Yuzovka / USA / Brazil: Rio; VATNICK: Ukraine: Peschanka / Brazil: Rio; WHITE > VATNICK: Canada: Toronto AVERBUCH: Ukraine: Zhabokrich / Brazil: Colonia Quatro Irmaos, Baron Hirsch / Rio de Janeiro.
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Judith Romney Wegner
At 4:47 AM -0300 8/24/06, Eliana Aizim wrote:
Dear Genners,Once again, these two stones have features that are of general interest (and in one respect rather puzzling) so I am bringing these to the group's attention. Eliana states that these two ladies were (1) her greatgrandmother (who died on 18th Iyyar -- which is Lag Ba'Omer though the stone does not say so -- of the year 5713/1953) and (2) her grandmother's sister, in other words, Eliana's great-aunt (who died on 1st of Adar Sheni (i.e., Rosh Hodesh Adar Sheni) of the year 5719 = 1959) The inscriptions on these two stones identify the great-grandmother as Zlate bas Mosheh, "wife of the late R Fishel Averbach" and the great-aunt as Tovah "daughter of Fishel Averbach" and "wife of the late Fishel Neuberger." (No doubt the family took the unusual step of including the men's surnames in order to avoid confusion. This, by the way, is the first time I have seen the term ha-manoaH ("the late...") on a stone. Is this as rare as it strikes me -- or whether it was customary in particular communities? Both stones -- which incidentally have the clearest inscriptions I've ever seen! -- spell the surname AVERBACH, though Eliana gives the spelling as AVERBUCH) To me the most interesting -- and puzzling -- thing is that the great--grandmother Zlate is described as "ishah kesherah" (literally a "kosher" woman -- meaning a fitting or suitable woman ) -- which strikes me as a rather odd choice of adjective, while her great-aunt Tovah is described more normally as "ishah yesharah" (meaning "an upright woman"). I am wondering whether the adjective kesherah was selected deliberately for the great-grandmother -- or whether they had really intended to describe her as ishah yesharah but they wrote the yod very large -- which could have led the stone-mason to misread it as a kaf and to carve the adjective kesherah instead of the adjective yesharah! Can anyone shed light on why a family might actually describe a deceased member as ishah kesherah? Is it a technical term of some kind? Judith Romney Wegner
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Klausner
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----- Original Message -----
From: "Judith Romney Wegner" <jrw@...> To: "JewishGen Discussion Group" <jewishgen@...> Sent: Friday, August 25, 2006 5:15 PM Subject: Re: Translation >from Hebrew - two tombstones Can anyone shed light on why a family might> actually describe a deceased** Please have a look at JOWBR inscriptions and translations: tens of matzevot read Isha Kshera, along with other attributes, as Isha Hashuva, Isha Kvuda etc. We usually translate Isha Kshera = a decent woman, just as Isha Hashuva is translated: an esteemed woman (not an important woman). "wife of the late Fishel Neuberger." (No doubt** Also found at JOWBR: the term "hamanoah" as well as the surname of the deceased are used often. Best wishes and shavua tov, Yocheved Yocheved Klausner, Editor Sharsheret Hadorot (bilingual: Hebrew and English) Israel Genealogical Society (IGS) yklaus@... Visit our Website: www.isragen.org.il
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Mathilde Tagger <tagger@...>
Hi Judith Romney Wegner,
You wrote: To me the most interesting -- and puzzling -- thing is that the great--grandmother Zlate is described as "ishah kesherah" (literally a "kosher" woman -- meaning a fitting or suitable woman ) -- which strikes me as a rather odd choice of adjective, while her great-aunt Tovah is described more normally as "ishah yesharah" (meaning "an upright woman"). I am wondering whether the adjective kesherah was selected deliberately for the great-grandmother -- or whether they had really intended to describe her as ishah yesharah but they wrote the yod very large -- which could have led the stone-mason to misread it as a kaf and to carve the adjective kesherah instead of the adjective yesharah! Can anyone shed light on why a family might actually describe a deceased member as ishah kesherah? Is it a technical term of some kind? ---------> Checking the book Helkat Mehokek written by Asher Leib Brisk and containing 8,000 tombstone inscriptions >from Mont of Olives Cemetery in Jerusalem (Years covered: 1740-1906), the tombstone inscriptions of women begin with ; Isha = Woman Isha Tsenu'a = Modest woman Eshet Hayil = Woman of valor Isha Hashuva = Esteemed woman Isha Keshera= Upright woman Isha Yekara= Cherished Woman Isha Yera'at H' = Woman fearing G-d Isha Kevuda = Respected woman Marat = Mrs. As you see, the adjectives used for describing the deceased woman are numerous and, as far as I understand it, the choice of that adjective is totally deliberate. By the way, all these adjectives are only used by Ashkenazi Jews. The Sephardic inscriptions of that period of time are more concise and usually the word "marat" for Mrs. is only preceeding the given name of the deceased woman. The book Helkat Mehokek has been indexed as of the 16 projects conducted in the frame of the 2004Jerusalem Conference by the Israel Genealogical Society. Go to: http://www.isragen.org.il/EIRI/surnames/index.html to check the surnames you are looking for. Thinking I have answered your question Shalom, Mathilde A.Tagger Israel Genealogical Society Jerusalem
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Judith Romney Wegner
At 8:53 PM +0200 8/26/06, Klausner wrote (in answer to my question):
Yocheved repliedCan anyone shed light on why a family might> actually describe a ** Please have a look at JOWBR inscriptions and translations: tensDear Yocheved, Many thanks for verifying that kesherah is an adjective quite commonly used to describe a deceased woman. Thanks also to Mathilde Tagger for the information she supplied. Since the word kasher literally means "fitting" or "suitable," does it use imply specifically that the departed woman had conducted herself "in a fitting/ seemly manner"? Also, do we find the adjective kasher used with equal frequency to described a deceased man? If the answer is yes -- end of story. But if the answer turns out to be no, I would wonder about the sociological significance of gender distinctions in adjectives used on tombstones to describe the departed. If it was especially praiseworthy for a woman (as opposed to a man) to conduct herself in a "fitting" or "seemly" manner, would this imply that she behaved modestly or unobtrusively -- in other words, that she "kept her place" in traditional Jewish culture? I went to the JOWBR site as advised , but --probably due to my being electronically challenged -- I could not figure out how to locate lists of adjectives used on stones. Perhaps Yocheved or Mathilde could tell us whether the adjectives found on men's stones are similar to or different >from the those found for women I would particularly like to know whether men are described as " ish kasher" as often as is the case for women. Judith Romney Wegner
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Talila Stan
Eliana Aizim aizim@... >from Rio de Janeiro, Brazil
wrote: I would like to ask for a translation >from Hebrew of the inscriptions on two tombstones that I´ve posted at ViewMate. http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8360 http://data.jewishgen.org/ViewMate/ALL/viewmateview.asp?key=8361 Here is the translation >from Hebrew - two tombstones A KOSHER WOMAN ZLATE daughter of R' MOSHE wife of the deceased FISHEL AWERBACH BORN TAF RESH LAMED GIMEL DIED 18 IYAR TAF SHIN YUD GIMEL (about 1953) LET HER SOUL BE IN THE PLACE OF LIFE A HONEST WOMAN TOVA daughter of R' FISHEL (AWERBACH) Wife of the deceased R' FISHEL NEYBERGER DIED 1 ADAR BET TAF SHIN YUD TET (about 1959) LET HER SOUL BE IN THE PLACE OF LIFE I hope it helps. Best wishes, Talila
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