I don't think she is mistaken because I have a friend who is named Menachem
HENCZEL in part after a grandfather who was Asher HENCZEL (and in fact has a
first cousin named Asher HENCZEL after the same grandfather). HENCZEL is an
unusual name and I have not come across it other than in this family (and I
wrote privately the original poster to see if they are related).
--
Cyndee Meystel
Chicago, IL

In a message dated 8/27/2006 5:47:30 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
cmeys@... writes:

< I don't think she is mistaken because I have a friend who is named
Menachem
HENCZEL in part after a grandfather who was Asher HENCZEL (and in fact has a
first cousin named Asher HENCZEL after the same grandfather). HENCZEL is an
unusual name and I have not come across it other than in this family (and I
wrote privately the original poster to see if they are related). >

==When in doubt
Shout it loud

==I don't know whether loudness helps much, but it always helps to let a
strange word, name or placename roll over your tongue a few times. Such a trick
will show that HENCZEL (is that a Slavic spelling) is likely to be a form of
the common German boy's name Haensel, diminutive of Hans, which is itself a
diminutive of Johannes, which is Yochanan in Hebrew.

==OK, dead end!

==Let's try again: HENCZEL -> Haensel -> Hansel -> ANSHEL which in turn is
a Jewish name related to the German ANSELM -- and is a kinnuy for ASHER.

==My mother used to spank me when I slurred my words. It didn't work. Now I
slur them for genealogical pleasure and for genealogical profit.

Michael Bernet, New York

At 8:48 PM +0000 8/27/06, Cyndee Meystel wrote:

* don't think she is mistaken because I have a friend who is named Menachem
HENCZEL in part after a grandfather who was Asher HENCZEL (and in fact has a
first cousin named Asher HENCZEL after the same grandfather). HENCZEL is an
unusual name and I have not come across it other than in this family

Dear Cyndee,

More precisely, it is not the actual name Henczel as such, but only
the spelling thereof, that is unusual -- or at least it is far
less common than the usual spelling -- Anschel or Anshel . But
Henczel and Anschel are really the same name -- just two different
ways of transliterating >from the Yiddish.

The Yiddish name Anshel is frequently coupled with the Hebrew name
Asher, because Anshel is a Yiddish diminutive of the Hebrew name.
Naming a child Asher-Anschel is precisely analogous to naming a
child Menahem-Mendel or Yakob-Koppel -- or many other similar
examples in which the Yiddish diminutive is hyphenated to the
original biblical Hebrew name. (Asher was one of the 12 sons of
Jacob.)

Judith Romney Wegner

In a message dated 8/28/2006 12:23:59 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
jrw@... writes:

<< > ,,,,HENCZEL (is that a Slavic spelling) is likely to be a form of

the common German boy's name Haensel, diminutive of Hans, which is itself a
diminutive of Johannes, which is Yochanan in Hebrew.

<< But surely Hans/Haensel is a name found only among German or Austrian
Jews, and scarcely prevalent in the East European background of the
Asher-Anshels we have been discussing? >>

==A perusal of Beider's Dictionary of Ashkenazi Given Names shows the vast
majority of the occurrence of the name Anshel etc is in Germanic countries.
There is nothing at all surprising in some Jews in Slavic countries picking up
a name like Hansl that was popular in Germanic countries, or of giving it a
Slavic spelling. Anyone come across American Jews named Ian, Patrick, Andrew,
Samantha, Krystal, or Cindi?

Michael Bernet, New York

At 6:15 PM -0400 8/27/06, MBernet@... wrote:

==Beider's index lists a number of variants on Hens, Henzl, Hentshl, etc.
and leads them all back to the entry for Yokhonen (Beider's preferred version
of Yochanan). Beider gives the derivation via Yohannes, Hans and Hensl.

==The more common derivative that Beider lists for Yochanan in Eastern
Europe is Janush, in various spellings.

All of the above is exactly what one would expect, since Hans is the
standard German nickname for Johannes, while Janus is the Czech form
of that name -- and the name "John" itself comes via German Johannes

from the original Hebrew Johannan.

Oddly, a dozen Johns in my own family were named for my ggf John
Marks , whose Hebrew name was not Yohannan but Ya'akov (Jacob).
He was named "John" on his English b.c.. -- despite the fact that the
true English equivalent of Jacob is not John but actually "James"
(derived via Giacomo >from Jacobus), History buffs will recall
that the supporters of the deposed King James II were known as
"Jacobites." So, go figure!

Judith Romney Wegner.

Judith Romney Wegner wrote: <I am personally interested in the
combination "Asher Anschel", because my father had an uncle Asher
ANGEL (ANGEL being an obviously anglicized surname) and I have always
assumed that there must have been an ancestor with the given names
Asher Anschel. If anyone out there is researching the surname ANGEL,
I'd like to know whether they have found that it did evolve from
Anschel.>

I am *not* personally researching the first name Angel or the surname
ANGEL but here are a few facts I can tell you about the name I have
gathered >from my research in the Habsburg Empire and London:

Just last week I discussed the first name transition:
Vogel>Vogele>Franziska>Fanny in the context of the Toleranz Patent of
Emperor Josef II and his widespread reforms in the Habsburg Empire. I
ended with the sentence "I believe [this name change] was largely
influenced by the Habsburgian/Germanic tradition. Once again, do not
forget the Habsburg Empire and its influence on European Jewry."

So here we go again: 'Angelus' was the official form stipulated for
Amschel by the Habsburg authorities in the 1780s. Hence the
transition to Angelus [anglicized to Angel] had taken place many
years before the widespread emigration to England [cf Vogele>Fanny] .


Angelus KAFKA/KAWKA, a relative of Franz KAFKA, was a first-born son
of Marcus. Angelus was born in 1791 in Wondrzichow, Prachiner Kreis
Bohemia. He was named after his grandfather, Amschel. Angelus was
Kreis Rabbiner of Klattau and Pilsen 1836 to 1870.

Nevertheless, Angelus was not a popular first name for Jews in
Bohemia and Moravia, who eventually formed the backbone of the
Viennese intelligentsia. There is only one Angelus amongst about
70,000 Austrian Jewish male burial records - Angelus MAYER born ca
1827 - presumably with a grandfather called Amschel. There are also
very few Amschel and Anschel; what happened to these names? One clue
is that there are many Anton in Vienna and, indeed, one *Anschel* has
the name *Anton* in brackets after his entry in the cemetery book.

re London: The legendary headmaster of the Jews' Free School was
Moses ANGEL [1819-1898]. He remained headmaster for 55 years. In this
case, I can tell Judith that his real name was Angel MOSES. His
father, Emanuel MOSES, was born Peterborough, Northants, UK. Angel
MOSES can clearly be seen in the 1841 census - teacher, born abt 1818
- but by the 1851 census he appears as Moses ANGEL, teacher of
languages. He also had a large family, and another son Moses ANGEL.

Moses & Rekebah {sic] ANGEL both 33; Emanuel M Angel 7; Hannah H
Angel 4; Moses C Angel 1; Godfrey L Angel 4 Mo; Rekebah appears in
later censuses as Rebecca - she was nee GODFREY.

So the family name ANGEL in England, for this famous family, was in
fact caused by an inversion of names. And we can probably assume that
Moses ANGEL's grandfather was called Amschel or variant.

There is another interesting example to be found in the 1881 census
of England and Wales: Leopold ANGEL, born abt 1828 in Vienna, living
at 516 Oxford St, London, a chaser in metal. I believe he is in fact
Lazar ASCHER born Vienna 22 Oct 1827 to Lazarus and Esther. He had
two sons Albert and Adolf [born London abt 1860] - Could Adolf be
identical to Asher, Judith's great-uncle, Asher ANGEL? Adolf would
not be a popular name in England after 1914 and Adolf may have
changed his first name to hide his Austrian Ancestry. Asher, the
original family name, would be an obvious choice.

Celia Male [U.K.]

At 6:15 PM -0400 8/27/06, MBernet@... wrote:

,,,,HENCZEL (is that a Slavic spelling) is likely to be a form of
the common German boy's name Haensel, diminutive of Hans, which is itself a
diminutive of Johannes, which is Yochanan in Hebrew.

But surely Hans/Haensel is a name found only among German or Austrian
Jews, and scarcely prevalent in the East European background of the
Asher-Anshels we have been discussing?

Judith Romney Wegner

At 6:15 PM -0400 8/27/06, MBernet@... wrote:

,,,,HENCZEL (is that a Slavic spelling?) is likely to be a form of
the common German boy's name Haensel, diminutive of Hans, which is itself a
diminutive of Johannes, which is Yochanan in Hebrew.

==My mother spanked me for being lazy, too. And it didn't help, either. I
still am. I neglected looking up HENCZEL in Beider's Dictionary of Ashkenazi
Given name.

==Beider's index lists a number of variants on Hens, Henzl, Hentshl, etc.
and leads them all back to the entry for Yokhnonen (Beider's preferred version
of Yochanan). Beider gives the derivation via Yohannes, Hans and Hensl.

==Beiders examples occasionally mention that the person's Hebrew name was
Chanan or Yochanan; Most of the citations for Jews named Hensel, Hendel etc.
are taken >from Germanic countries (including Austria and bohemia), with an
occasional Hungary, Yiddish attribution.

==Henczel does appear to be a Slavic variant spelling

==The more common derivative that Beider lists for Yochanan in Eastern
Euroipe is Janush, in various spellings.

Michael Bernet, New York