Translation of letters on a tombstone #general


Stan Goodman <SPAM_FOILER@...>
 

On Sat, 2 Dec 2006 16:11:37 UTC, annettes@frontiernet.net (Annette Stolberg)
wrote:

Genners,

I'm not sure the following is an old burial tradition in Israel, but
a son and father are buried in the same grave. We have been able to
translate most of the Hebrew regarding the father, with the
exception of four letters - Nun, Lamed, Vet and Ayin, with two small
marks after the Vet. These letters precede the day of the month and
the year.
The "two small marks" are the way an acronym is indicated in Hebrew. The
combination NUN LAMED BET " 'AYIN means "Niftar leveit 'olamo", which is a
more florid was to say "died"; the following date is, of course, when he
died.

Directly below the father's name, and indented, are the letters Zion
Vav Nun Zion , followed by habocher (the son) and the name of the
father. Nun, Lamed, Vet, Ayin, appear again, followed by
a numeral. The month is Heshvan, but it is preceded by Mem Resh. .
I assume that the four letters are ZAYIN VAV NUN ZAYIN, which is a surname,
"Zunz". "haBoh.er" does not mean "the son", but "the young man". It would be
so much easier to interpret this for you had you posted a picture of it on
ViewMate. As it is, I will leave it to others to speculate on why the
father's name comes after "haBoh.er", if indeed it does.

The name of the month is, in fact "Marh.eshvan"; this is a word that has
undergone some letter transpositions, which disguise its meaning as "Eighth
Month". "H.eshvan" is shortened, as often happens to long words and for the
same reasons. Well...it fits better on marquees.

Do the letters Nun, Lamed, Vet and Ayin represent a word, or are
they an acronym for an expression? Do Mem and Resh change the
meaning of the month of Heshvan?

Has anyone heard of the custom of burying a father and son in the
same grave site? I am not aware of this, if it was an old tradition
in the 1850's.
I have never heard of such a tradition, and doubt that there ever was one.
It would be reckless to speculate on what the stone actually says without
seeing it or a photograph of it.

Thank you,

Annette Stolberg
Rochester, NY
annettes@frontiernet.net
--
Stan Goodman, Qiryat Tiv'on, Israel

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Judith Romney Wegner
 

At 10:10 PM -0500 12/1/06, Annette Stolberg wrote:

The month is Heshvan, but it is preceded by Mem Resh. .
Do Mem and Resh change the meaning of the month of Heshvan?
No, they don't: the full name of the month is Marheshvan.

Actually that name seems to be the result of an error in
pronunciation and/or writing that developed at some point.
MarheshWan was originally WarheshMan -- but the vav and mem somehow
became transposed. In the original order, the letters vav-resh-het
shin-mem-nun means "eighth month" (W-R-H means month --being
basically the same root as the word Y-R-H meaning "moon")

Has anyone heard of the custom of burying a father and son in the
same grave site? I am not aware of this, if it was an old tradition
in the 1850's.
My husband's maternal grandfather was buried in Vienna in 1926 the
same grave as one of his daughters, who had unfortunately predeceased
him by one year. Multiple burials in one grave are permissible and
were not uncommon, especially where there were space constraints so
that the cemetery cannot be expanded to allow for additional graves.

Judith Romney Wegner


Annette Stolberg <annettes@...>
 

Genners,

I'm not sure the following is an old burial tradition in Israel, but
a son and father are buried in the same grave. We have been able to
translate most of the Hebrew regarding the father, with the
exception of four letters - Nun, Lamed, Vet and Ayin, with two small
marks after the Vet. These letters precede the day of the month and
the year.

Directly below the father's name, and indented, are the letters Zion
Vav Nun Zion , followed by habocher (the son) and the name of the
father. Nun, Lamed, Vet, Ayin, appear again, followed by
a numeral. The month is Heshvan, but it is preceded by Mem Resh. .

Do the letters Nun, Lamed, Vet and Ayin represent a word, or are
they an acronym for an expression? Do Mem and Resh change the
meaning of the month of Heshvan?

Has anyone heard of the custom of burying a father and son in the
same grave site? I am not aware of this, if it was an old tradition
in the 1850's.

Thank you,

Annette Stolberg
Rochester, NY
annettes@frontiernet.net

MODERATOR NOTE: You may have more success if you post a
picture of the stone to ViewMate, especially if the inscription is
less than completely clear. See

http://data.jewishgen.org/viewmate/

for further informaton.


tom klein <jewishgen@...>
 

To try to answer some of the questions:

1)nun-lamed-vet-ayin is an abbrevation for "went to his eternal
home" (died).

2) It probably says: vav-bet-nun-vav ("ubeno"), "and his son".

3) "Marheshvan" is another form for "Heshvan" and means exactly
the same thing. Its origin is a transposition of the letters for "eighth
month", although many Jewish glosses have been offered to explain
the "mar-" as if it came >from the Hebrew word for bitter.

4) I wouldn't know why a father and son would be buried together,
except to guess that the son, who apparently died young, predeceased
his mother, and she would be expected to remarry, if at all possible,
and may have been buried with her second husband.

....... Tom Klein, Toronto

Annette Stolberg <annettes@frontiernet.net> wrote:

I'm not sure the following is an old burial tradition in Israel, but
a son and father are buried in the same grave. We have been able to
translate most of the Hebrew regarding the father, with the
exception of four letters - Nun, Lamed, Vet and Ayin, with two small
marks after the Vet. These letters precede the day of the month and
the year.

Directly below the father's name, and indented, are the letters Zion
Vav Nun Zion , followed by habocher (the son) and the name of the
father. Nun, Lamed, Vet, Ayin, appear again, followed by
a numeral. The month is Heshvan, but it is preceded by Mem Resh. .

Do the letters Nun, Lamed, Vet and Ayin represent a word, or are
they an acronym for an expression? Do Mem and Resh change the
meaning of the month of Heshvan?

Has anyone heard of the custom of burying a father and son in the
same grave site? I am not aware of this, if it was an old tradition
in the 1850's.