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Finding image on LDS microfilm from index #general


Harlan Weller
 

I located the attached index to a record on jewishgen and I wanted to look at the original document if possible.  The number 2205099 is hotlinked to an LDS microfilm, but I could not make sense of the other numbers.  Can these numbers be used to locate the image on the microfilm?  Or do I have to page through all the images on the microfilm?
Harlan Weller
harlan.weller@... 


Sally Bruckheimer
 

Since LDS Microfilms no longer exist, except maybe in SLC, the film numbers need to be deleted or changed to something else by Jewishgen. They were indeed the source of the information, but they aren't usable now. You might search by the subject for the digital version on familysearch.org. It may be available at your home, but more likely at a LDS library.

Sally Bruckheimer
Princeton, NJ 


Emily Garber
 

Harlan Weller posted:
"I located the attached index to a record on jewishgen and I wanted to look at the original document if possible.  The number 2205099 is hotlinked to an LDS microfilm, but I could not make sense of the other numbers.  Can these numbers be used to locate the image on the microfilm?  Or do I have to page through all the images on the microfilm?"

About three years ago I posted an article on my blog explaining how one gets from JewishGen's All Lithuania/Litvak SIG index to FamilySearch digitized film images. 
"FamilySearch, JewishGen, and Litvak SIG: What are They Hiding?" See, http://extrayad.blogspot.com/2017/06/familysearch-jewishgen-and-litvak-sig.html

Emily Garber
Phoenix, AZ


Emily Garber
 

Sally Bruckheimer wrote:
"Since LDS Microfilms no longer exist, except maybe in SLC, the film numbers need to be deleted or changed to something else by Jewishgen. They were indeed the source of the information, but they aren't usable now. You might search by the subject for the digital version on familysearch.org. It may be available at your home, but more likely at a LDS library."

Film numbers may still be used to search via the catalog. While FamilySearch has been digitizing old microfilm and assigning new digital numbers to those rolls, digitized collections and records may be located via either the original microfilm number or the digital number. As a matter of fact I just used an old film number this morning to locate a NYC marriage certificate.

Emily Garber


 

The links from JewishGen do take you to existing LDS microfilm scans on FamilySearch. I believe that the issue Harlan has is how to go from that link, which opens the entire film in a gallery view, and points to the first image. From there, getting to the particular image within that film is somewhat complicated, and varies between the different books/archives. But it rarely gives you the exact page/scan number so some amount of searching of the images is required, which in this case might involve some understanding of the language. I look at the Slovakian books all the time and that's a bit easier since at least the character set is Roman, languages German and Hungarian, not Cyrillic and Hebrew (Yiddish) as in the Lithuanian books.

Basically, what you have from the info in the right hand column is a link then item number - in this case, item 2. Scan through the gallery and look for the black header page that has a 2 on it - they are easy to see but you have to scroll a bit. There is a beginning and end marker for that item and each film might have several in total. The image number for Harlan's entry is not present (-) so you will have to search between those marker pages for the particular entry (about 5 per page in these books, some have more some less). I usually try to do this by date - find a date on an entry that is close, jump ahead a few (or many) pages, repeat.

Good luck.
--
Jeff Goldner
Researching Goldner, Singer, Neuman, Braun, Schwartz, Reichfeld (Hungary/Slovakia); Adler, Roth, Ader (Galicia); Soltz/Shultz (Vitebsk, maybe Lithuania)


Risa Heywood
 

I wrote an article on this very subject which should be coming out in the next issue of Avotaynu. I also may be giving an online demo on how to work with unindexed records like these on FamilySearch for the upcoming IAJGS Virtual Conference. During that demo, I'll show you rather than just tell you how to make use of these unindexed films.

To specifically answer Harlan's question:

The #2 in the right-hand column under the film number is the Item # on the microfilm. A film may contain only one item, part of an item or it may have multiple items. In your example, the fourth image on your film is the beginning of Item 1. Scroll down through the film until you see a similar image that contaIns the beginning of Item 2. The third button on the left menu (under the minus sign) lets you toggle between seeing one image and multiple images which makes scrolling easier.

In some cases, the image number is in the JewishGen index record, right under the Item # but it's not there in this case. But, there is a Record # in the next column to the left, F266. So the record you want should be on Film 2205099, Item 2, Record # 266. Page through a few frames in this item to see how the records are arranged. You can see that there are several records on a page and the Russian is on the left and Hebrew on the right. Either page through or guess how many frames to jump until you get to #266. It is at the bottom of the page on image 293.


--
Risa Daitzman Heywood
Arizona, USA


David Oseas
 

Sally,

That isn't correct --  the Family History Library still uses both sets of numbers:  the old FHL microfilm ones, as well as the new DGS digital ones.  Entering either number in the FamilySearch catalog in the Film/Fiche Number field will take you to the digital images, if they exist.

Regards,
David Oseas


Russ Maurer
 

I agree with Risa that the record number is by far the easiest way to navigate to the right record. Keep in mind, though, that males and females are numbered separately. The reference to record F266 is to the numbers for females (M266 would be for a male). In the column for record number, there are two subcolumns as shown below. Numbers for females (женскаго) will always be found on the left and numbers for males (мужескаго) on the right. Risa has pointed to the correct (female) record 266; the incorrect (male) record 266 is on image 287.

Russ Maurer (Records Acquisition & Translation Coordinator for LitvakSIG, the source of this particular record)
Pepper Pike, OH


Sally Bruckheimer
 

Emily Garber wrote:"Film numbers may still be used to search via the catalog. While FamilySearch has been digitizing old microfilm and assigning new digital numbers to those rolls, digitized collections and records may be located via either the original microfilm number or the digital number. As a matter of fact I just used an old film number this morning to locate a NYC marriage certificate."

I want the Vaz Dias Collectie, which used to be 899932 and 899933 (I even remember the numbers), But they are not that any more. I am happy for you that NYC Marriage Records are still at the same number, but not everything is. And they aren't searchable by name either.

Sally Bruckheimer
Princeton, NJ


David Oseas
 

Sally,

I've researched through thousands of FamilySearch image collections since they started their digitization project and I've yet to encounter a single one where they've dropped the original film number.

As you can see from the attached screencap, the Collectie Vaz Diaz rolls are still listed in the catalog as 899932 and 899933.  The digitized images are restricted access, so can only be viewed at a Family History Center.

Regards,
David Oseas


paulaparadise@...
 

If you put the number you have in the FamilySearch Catalog under film  or Fiche search it will come up.  Click on the title of the film.  This film is ditigitzed.  You may need to sign in to see it.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/958868?availability=Family%20History%20Library


Eva Lawrence
 

While LDS microfilms are no longer available, many of the images have been put online under the same film number. You need to search for them by clicking on the Catalogue heading on the Familysearch website after logging in.. Some of the online films can then  be scrolled through immediately, but others are can now only be viewed on computers at LDS designated libraries due to privacy laws and copyright restrictions.set by other content providers  A get-around is to use a authorised computer to send a film to one's home email address  and view it at home.in one's own time.

Eva Lawrence
St Albans, UK.'


Stephen Weinstein
 

LVIA is the archive
728/4/373 are the Fond/List/Item
F266 means the 266th Female (males and females are numbered separately)
1897 is the year recorded
28/5/1897 is the date on the Julian calendar (16/5/1897 on our calendar)
43 is the age of the person

Stephen Weinstein
stephenweinstein@...
Camarillo, CA, USA


Moishe Miller
 

Hello,
 
Sally Bruckheimer indicates that the "Vaz Dias Collectie" used to be LDS Microfilm #'s 899932 and 899933. Searching for those numbers on FamilySearch, does seem to still show them as she describes:
 
  • Collectie Vaz Diaz; ondertrouw akten A-D 1600-1811; Film #899932, DGS 7989290
  • Collectie Vaz Diaz; notariele akten, enz. E-M; Film #899933, DGS 7989291
 
Moishe Miller
Brooklyn, NY


Harlan Weller
 

I wanted to thank all the individuals who responded to this request with helpful advice.  One person was able to find the record within the microfilm and I have posted it to Viewmate.  It is VM number 82668 (the record numbered 266 on the bottom of the page).
 
As I indicated on the Viewmate entry, I can make out most of the Hebrew side of the record (with the exception of the first word) and it matches information for the name of my great grand aunt and her father's name (Menachem Ber) ,  However, there are a lot more words on the Russian side of the record and I would appreciate any help in translating what is written there.  For example, does this show her husband's name or her mother's name?
 
I appreciate all the assistance that was provided by members of this group, as well as the unnamed indexer from Litvak SIG who made it possible to locate this record..
 
Harlan Weller    <harlan.weller@...>


Joel Ratner
 

Harlan,

The preface to her name on the record says "Kurenetzky meschanin" or "Kurenetzky bourgeois". Now you have a prior location if you didn't previously have this information. I hope this helps. Others will have to help with the column to the left of the names.

Joel Ratner
Former coordinator, LitvakSIG Vital Records Translation Project