Question about New York City Marriage Records #records


David Levine
 

Hi everyone

I am new to NYC marriage records. I understand that not all records are online though a number of indexes are and that the coverage is not complete.
I also understand that you can order records here from the NYC Municipal Archive: 
https://www1.nyc.gov/site/records/historical-records/holdings.page

My Question is this. I have found an index ancestry for relatives:
https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/61406/images/47512_546381-01627?pId=6546128
Volume 11:



There are no other records that I can find for this Index entry online
What is the difference between a marriage certificate and a marriage license? 
And, is the information in the screenshot what I use to order the marriage certificate / license from the NYC Municipal Archive?

Many thanks
--
Best Regards,
David Levine
San Francisco, CA, USA

Researching: 
Weinstein -> Solotwina, Galicia | Frisch, Hilman, Jungerman, Schindler -> Rozniatow, Galicia | Golanski, Kramerofsky/Kromerovsky -> Kiev | Lefkowitz -> Petrikov, Belarus | Shub, Rosen Hlusk, Belarus | Levine, Weiner, Zamoshkin -> Slutsk, Belarus 


Diane Jacobs
 

David,
Having spent too many hours in the NYC
Municipal Archives, I can tell you that the
marriage cerificates are separate from Marriage licenses and applications. These two are bundled together and in the past, unless they have changed, you had to go in person to retrieve on microfilm these latter two documents.  The marriage certificate you could order by mail.  I would suggest you go to stevemorse.org   to find the marriage certificate number, date and borough , so you order it.  You can search by either bride or groom.

Good luck 
Diane Jacobs


On Mar 9, 2021, at 12:06 PM, David Levine <davidelevine@...> wrote:



Hi everyone

I am new to NYC marriage records. I understand that not all records are online though a number of indexes are and that the coverage is not complete.
I also understand that you can order records here from the NYC Municipal Archive: 
https://www1.nyc.gov/site/records/historical-records/holdings.page

My Question is this. I have found an index ancestry for relatives:
https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/61406/images/47512_546381-01627?pId=6546128
Volume 11:

<dummyfile.0.part>


There are no other records that I can find for this Index entry online
What is the difference between a marriage certificate and a marriage license? 
And, is the information in the screenshot what I use to order the marriage certificate / license from the NYC Municipal Archive?

Many thanks
--
Best Regards,
David Levine
San Francisco, CA, USA

Researching: 
Weinstein -> Solotwina, Galicia | Frisch, Hilman, Jungerman, Schindler -> Rozniatow, Galicia | Golanski, Kramerofsky/Kromerovsky -> Kiev | Lefkowitz -> Petrikov, Belarus | Shub, Rosen Hlusk, Belarus | Levine, Weiner, Zamoshkin -> Slutsk, Belarus 

--
Diane Jacobs, Somerset, New Jersey


pathetiq1@...
 

Hi David, 

The difference between a marriage license and a marriage certificate is that the license gives someone the permission to get married. Therefore,  the date  of issue of the license is not necessarily the same date that the wedding took place. 

As for the record you are looking for , the license was issued on  2 Oct 1916 but the wedding took place on 9 Nov 1916.

The document is available on familysearch.org (attached) 


Giannis Daropoulos 

Greece


Sally Bruckheimer
 

"What is the difference between a marriage certificate and a marriage license?"

A marriage certificate says he and she married on some date. That is all.

The record made for the license usually has their parents, addresses, where they were born, and whatever else (depending on the year). You ALWAYS want the record or license. I have a death certificate for my father (who died when I was little). It says he died on such a date. The Death Record or Certificate would have his wife's name, parents names, cause of death, where he lived, and where he died.  Same difference.

Sally Bruckheimer
Princeton, NJ


Rebecca Racer
 

I just went through this -ordering a historical marriage certificate. You can either fill out the paper form and mail it in to the Chambers St address or order it online here 
https://www1.nyc.gov/site/records/historical-records/order.page. Fee is $15 + $5 for letter of exemplification (if you need it for official use). When you go to this page you’re going to request a “marriage certificate or license” - same option. Since you have the certificate number it’s pretty easy to fill out the form. 

good luck!
rebecca Racer


murphy8@...
 

David;
You use the number that you had in the record to order.  I just received my parents information and there were 4 different items:  1. Marriage License 2.Affadavit for License to Marry, 3. Marriage Certificate and 4. Certificate of Consent.  This was quite a pleasant surprise! 

Robin August  
Researching:  Ogus > August, Kiev, Konotop, Vilna,  Kanower > Cohen, Matus, Pereaslav, Konotop, Rottenberg, Weinberger, Friedman, Sobel, Schreiber, Hungary/Slovakia


rich.meyersburg@...
 

In addition to the excellent explanations about the difference between a marriage certificate and a marriage license, there is one other major difference between a marriage license and a marriage certificate.   A marriage certificate means that the couple were actually married.  A marriage license does not.  So, it is possible that a marriage license was issued but the marriage never took place.

Rich Meyersburg
Laurel, MD


A. E. Jordan
 




-----Original Message-----
From: rich.meyersburg@...

In addition to the excellent explanations about the difference between a marriage certificate and a marriage license, there is one other major difference between a marriage license and a marriage certificate.   A marriage certificate means that the couple were actually married.  A marriage license does not.  So, it is possible that a marriage license was issued but the marriage never took place.

Rich Meyersburg
Laurel, MD
_._,_._,_


No this is incorrect. There are very few differences between the normal NYC marriage license and the marriage certiifcate. They asked the same set of questions. At times the clerk asked for more specifics for a date of birth versus just an age or year and also a city not just a country. But mostly the big difference is if the bride was very young because the license would require parential consent and if they admitted to having been married before the clerk asked for more details versus the mariage certificate.

The marrage license second or third page is for the person performing the marriage to fill in when they performed the ceremony. The same set of details about the ceremony are filled in on that page as it is on the marriage certificate.

It is possible that the licenses was taken out and not a ceremony but the license copy will show the details of the ceremony if the license was returned to the clerk.  Rarely you find licenses that are not on file with the clerk and then it is possibe the ceremony did not take place.

The license was also "portable" to use a 21st century term .... meaning you could get a NYC license and the ceremony could have been performed any where in the state. So the license form would tell you that too.

The best difference between the license is that the file goes past the end of the file for the certificates in NYC and licenses over 50 years of age are public record. When both exist comparing the two can sometimes also help with issues of marks that are blocking reading details or to try and dechiper hard to read handwriting.

Allan Jordan




A. E. Jordan
 

The license was issued first and as people said it was permission to marry. It was not mandatory but most people got it. Then they got married and both the license and the certificate were filled out with the details. The license went to the NYC Clerk and the marriage certificate went to the Health Department. Later i the 1930s the duplication went away but that does matter to you.

Both documents asked for the name, address, profession, age, place of birth, parent's name and place of birth and if it was the first marriage. The City Clerk doing the license asked for more specific answers sometimes and if either person admitted that they had been married before the clerk asked for etails, ie when and where they were divorced or if the prior spouse(s) was living or dead. Also if the bride was young the clerk asked for parential consent. Some of the license files have supporting documents attched if there was a divorce or a parential consent.

When the ceremony was performed the details were filled out and the witnesses signed the documents. Then they were returned to the two offices and now on microfilm.

You can order original copies from the NYC Municipal Archives but you pay for each separately. The certificates only are also at the LDS Family History Centers and some people have a trick to get them now by sitting in the parking lots.  The records are free at the LDS.

The LDS also has summariized a lot of them on FamilySearch.org but sometimes there are errors.

The licenses and the certificates are all indexed online at various pages.

Hope that helps. Questions please feel free to write back.

Allan Jordan



-----Original Message-----
From: David Levine <davidelevine@...>
To: main@...
Sent: Tue, Mar 9, 2021 11:59 am
Subject: [JewishGen.org] Question about New York City Marriage Records #records

Hi everyone

I am new to NYC marriage records. I understand that not all records are online though a number of indexes are and that the coverage is not complete.
I also understand that you can order records here from the NYC Municipal Archive: 
https://www1.nyc.gov/site/records/historical-records/holdings.page

My Question is this. I have found an index ancestry for relatives:
https://www.ancestry.com/imageviewer/collections/61406/images/47512_546381-01627?pId=6546128
Volume 11:


There are no other records that I can find for this Index entry online
What is the difference between a marriage certificate and a marriage license? 
And, is the information in the screenshot what I use to order the marriage certificate / license from the NYC Municipal Archive?

_._,_._,_


Richard Werbin
 

I have spent a lot of time at the Municipal Archives and have looked at both Marriage License Applications & Marriage Certificates.
The Archives have the Certificates only through about 1938. These have been digitized and you view them there on a PC.
They have the Licenses up to about 1948. These are only on microfilm.
The Certificates have 2 small pages: front & back.
The Licenses are 3 - 4 larger pages.
The last page of the License is usually a transcription of all the information on the certificate.
If it is not a first marriage, Licenses will also include the outcome of the first marriage (divorce, death, etc.)  & the name of the first spouse.

It is always better to get the License Application. It has more information than the certificate.
Also, if the handwriting is hard to read, the License may have the information both on page 1 & 2. That doubles your chance of reading correctly.
--
Richard Werbin    New York, New York     JGSNY Membership Vice President


Peter Cohen
 

This is huge. Last time I checked  (and it was not long ago), you could not view NYC vital records images on familysearch unless you were on the Family History Library network.  Apparently, now you can view them from home.
--
Peter Cohen
California


ELIAS SAVADA
 

You can NOT view the NYC vital records from home. You DO have to be on the FHL network. I was able to access from the parking lot a few days ago at the nearby center.

-----------------
Elias Savada
Bethesda MD

--
Elias Savada
Bethesda MD
esavada@...


pathetiq1@...
 



Unfortunately,  you,  still, cannot view them from home.  Very few are available for browsing. 
--
Giannis Daropoulos 

Greece


Peter Cohen
 

My apologies. I was thinking that the images above which Giannis Daropoulos posted, which he claimed were from familysearch was evidence that you could now download from familysearch. Perhaps you access it from Greece, but it doesn't look like you can do it from the US.
--
Peter Cohen
California


Sally Bruckheimer
 

"I can tell you that the
marriage cerificates are separate from Marriage licenses and applications. These two are bundled together and in the past, unless they have changed, you had to go in person to retrieve on microfilm these latter two documents.  The marriage certificate you could order by mail. "

Not true. I ordered marriage license applications and got them by mail (no index back then). In person is better, as I ordered Bernard Laguna and Rachel Lowenstein and got nothing; I went in person and found them right away: Bernard was Barnett and Rachel was Regina, but with the then odd Laguna, there was no question. People changed their names all the time, especially immigrants (which they were).

Sally Bruckheimer
Princeton, NJ